Why is Abortion Wrong? Or Not?

[TheInterocitor]

https://www.wistv.com/2021/01/21/sc-...rape-incest-2/

If passed, the bill would ban abortions in the state after a heartbeat can be detected, which usually happens between six to eight weeks. At that point, the fetus is a separate, living, human being. Obviously, Leftist corrupt courts will shoot it down. And the so-called "conservative" Supreme Court has proven (I reference the 3 Trump appointees here) by their reprehensible conduct during the aftermath of the fraudulent election, that they are frightened, spineless cowards.

One thing that is "wrong":

A: If the woman chooses to have the baby, the man is obligated to provide financial support for the next 18 years, regardless of whether or not he is involved in the raising of the child.
B: If the woman chooses to abort, the father has no say in that "choice."

In other words, the mother has the choice, the father does not have a "choice."

Just another sledgehammer of the Left to destroy the last remaining foundation of Western Civilization - The Family.

To me, abortion destroys the dignity of human beings, especially the dignity of a woman.

[rusmeister]

Before anyone says anything, the question must be asked first, what EXACTLY IS abortion? What is being done, exactly, and to what?

That is the question the Left fears above all, and wants us not to think about it. They wish to change the subject to anything else - population control, women in hard situations, anything - only not for us to ask what it is and look with our eyes at exactly what is being done.

To do that forces a unilateral answer which is unanswerable (though sufficiently wicked people will say that what they desire justifies any action whatsoever).

We now have the technology to look at what had become hard for some to see fifty years ago. Ultrasound and MRI technology enable us to see and observe the living being growing inside the mother, and even to observe what abortion does to it. Again, the Left seeks to censor that knowledge from us, banning videos showing hard scientific facts plainly visible to the naked eye.

[TheInterocitor]

The most basic drive, common to all life, is, well, to live. To survive.

To quote the guy in Jurassic Park: "Life...finds a way." To survive. Survival is the most basic principle of existence, of life

If man interferes with Mother Nature, then man interferes with the dynamic principle of existence, with Life itself.

To attempt to rein in life, then "legalized abortion" would soon become "mandated abortion" and leads to other atrocities like eugenics and ethnic cleansing

[Hans.KK]

A toast to the good old Republican BS.

[Uncle Wally]

A toast to the good old Republican BS.

I'm not a Republican but I may tend to have some conservative opinions but conservatives wouldn't agree with many of my beliefs. But I don't like abortion, it shouldn't be made easier you know, like getting a tooth pulled. It's sick what goes on in America. Aborting kids that still come out alive and keeping them alive until they can find someone who needs organs. Funny how leftist talk about respect of life and humans then think nothing of abortion. Have you ever noticed that all the people who are for abortion have already been born?

[rusmeister]

A toast to the good old Republican BS.

Wow! What a thoughtful refutation! This clearly shows my words to be nonsense. :eyeroll:

Seriously, why refute? That requires intellectual energy. Denial is as easy as Luke Skywalker on Bespin. No thinking required.

Oh, and I am not a Republican, either.

[Hans.KK]

But I don't like abortion, it shouldn't be made easier you know, like getting a tooth pulled.

It is not just like getting a tooth pulled, first of all the health risk is much greater, serious complication can arise, and it is not an easy decision to go that route, and after the event there can come a lot of doubt about if it was the right decision.

It's sick what goes on in America. Aborting kids that still come out alive and keeping them alive until they can find someone who needs organs.

Interesting, have not heard that one before, source to future info on that?

Funny how leftist talk about respect of life and humans then think nothing of abortion.

Is it wrong to respect a women's right to choose for her own life? Everything bad about abortion is sole on her, it is not on you as a man, your ride was/is free.
But we all know that men knows better what is best for women., or is it more like: Men knows better what is best for men that women does with their life, to be a hardworking, faithful and beloved wife/servant/slave.

Have you ever noticed that all the people who are for abortion have already been born?

And we are some that should had been an abortion, but because it was illegal at that point in time we were born, was it good? in some cases it went on ok, in others is was a disaster. It is not about being for or against abortion, abortion can be an option to choose if all other options had failed, one option is that men are responsible when they want to have sex, if they were some abortions could had been avoided.
Of course there are other cases where abortion can be the only right choice if the women want to have it, but it has to be the women's choice, not the man.

[Hans.KK]

Oh, and I am not a Republican, either.

But you were called to react anyway?
And now you will giver us a long lecture on "The right to life"?
I can give you the short one: A free women have the full right to make her own decisions about her own life. And a life is not a life before it is born, an abortion is not the killing of life.
The good old Republican patriarchal BS is a thing of the dark past when women was men's slaves.

[xp@]

But you were called to react anyway?
And now you will giver us a long lecture on "The right to life"?
I can give you the short one: A free women have the full right to make her own decisions about her own life. And a life is not a life before it is born, an abortion is not the killing of life.
The good old Republican patriarchal BS is a thing of the dark past when women was men's slaves.

California Supreme Court allows murder charge against woman who used meth and had stillborn fetus

https://ktla.com/news/california/cal...illborn-fetus/

[Uncle Wally]

It is not just like getting a tooth pulled, first of all the health risk is much greater, serious complication can arise, and it is not an easy decision to go that route, and after the event there can come a lot of doubt about if it was the right decision.


Interesting, have not heard that one before, source to future info on that?


Is it wrong to respect a women's right to choose for her own life? Everything bad about abortion is sole on her, it is not on you as a man, your ride was/is free.
But we all know that men knows better what is best for women., or is it more like: Men knows better what is best for men that women does with their life, to be a hardworking, faithful and beloved wife/servant/slave.


And we are some that should had been an abortion, but because it was illegal at that point in time we were born, was it good? in some cases it went on ok, in others is was a disaster. It is not about being for or against abortion, abortion can be an option to choose if all other options had failed, one option is that men are responsible when they want to have sex, if they were some abortions could had been avoided.
Of course there are other cases where abortion can be the only right choice if the women want to have it, but it has to be the women's choice, not the man.

Some women think it's nothing at all and have multiple abortions. Planned Parenthood doesn't question women, they just do it. I'm not sure they tell women about the risks. If you don't want to have children don't have sex or find a better method. There is a thing called birth control.

About the babies being kept alive I will get back to you, busy now but I remember reading about it a year or to ago, I forgot which state it was in but they wanted to change the laws. Planned Parenthood was caught sell body parts years ago.

[Hans.KK]

Some women think it's nothing at all and have multiple abortions.

And that is not your problem, you have nothing to say about that, it is not your life, mind your own business.

Planned Parenthood doesn't question women, they just do it.

So why questioning abortion?

I'm not sure they tell women about the risks.

You can make rules/laws about that, mandatory advisory before an abortion (even info about alternatives to abortion), no problem, but I am sure that you have to be informed about the risk of any kind of surgery, but I could be wrong?

If you don't want to have children don't have sex or find a better method. There is a thing called birth control.

And if we return to the real world, you know shit happens.

About the babies being kept alive I will get back to you, busy now but I remember reading about it a year or to ago, I forgot which state it was in but they wanted to change the laws. Planned Parenthood was caught sell body parts years ago.

Thank you.

[rusmeister]

But you were called to react anyway?
And now you will giver us a long lecture on "The right to life"?
I can give you the short one: A free women have the full right to make her own decisions about her own life. And a life is not a life before it is born, an abortion is not the killing of life.
The good old Republican patriarchal BS is a thing of the dark past when women was men's slaves.

Your view is false and irrational and a justification of murder. My niece was forced to give birth at 5 months gestation. The twins turned out to be living beings/ They were alive, Hans. To deny that is simply insane.

We both agree that a woman has a right to her own life. We disagree only in that she has no right to end the life of the living being inside of her, whose heart is not hers, whose brain is not hers, whose fingers and toes are not hers. Any ultrasound or MRI will show your claim to be false. Better to retract it now than be made to look stupid in the face of video evidence that the baby is in fact alive.

Indeed, it is the position of the slave owner to say that a woman has a right over the life of an already-living baby, to decide whether this living human child will live or die. THAT is the position of the slave holder.

Pregnancy is ot a thing that happens to people in their sleep, despite the deceptive use of the verb "to sleep with someone". The general rule is, of one does not wish to be carrying a baby, then do not engage in the baby-making act. That may be unpleasant for the hedonist to hear, who thinks that all of his desires should be instantly gratifiable on demand. Hearing a demand that he exercise self-control, and show responsibility by taking up fatherhood should he bring about a child, is too much for the irresponsible hedonist, who wants to be free to go out to nightclubs and cinemas at will without responsibility. In fact, he is willing to murder to filch the pleasure belonging to the sexual act, and then try to erase its natural consequence.

As to situations where a woman is forced, well, a rapist was frequently introduced to the hangman's noose. It is the irresponsible and fugitive men who should be punished, not innocent, living children.

You can't escape the fact that the baby in the womb is alive, and that you have to kill it to stop it from living, something that he or she is already doing. If you try to deny it, any number of MRI's will show up such foolishness. Concede the point, and let's move on to what actions can be taken that are moral.

[Hans.KK]

Your view is false and irrational and a justification of murder.

No, your point of view is false.

My niece was forced to give birth at 5 months gestation. The twins turned out to be living beings/ They were alive, Hans. To deny that is simply insane.

Have I denied that? when did I do so?
You are first alive after you are born, literally released from your mother so to speak.
Btw. I was born around that time frame too, to dark, I had to get out, the Doctors used the next 8 month or so, to keep me artificially alive before I could handle the world on my own. And yet I think that it was wrong to keep me alive for so long just because they could. If a newborn is not strong enough to live on it's own for an extended period of time it is best, for the human race, that this gen-collection is taking out of circulation, you know Darwin.

We both agree that a woman has a right to her own life.

Yes.

We disagree only in that she has no right to end the life of the living being inside of her, whose heart is not hers, whose brain is not hers, whose fingers and toes are not hers.

That life you talk about had not yet started, it first starts after the fetus is released from the mother and breathes on its own.

Any ultrasound or MRI will show your claim to be false. Better to retract it now than be made to look stupid in the face of video evidence that the baby is in fact alive.

At this point in time the fetus is just a part of the mother, that is all.
And I have properly seen more screen view of alive stuff than you have, I have repaired a few ultrasound devices in my time, and these devices is not made to show the happy parents their coming child, they are for medical purposes, but some operators had found out that this is a pretty good marketing to show to parents.

The general rule is, of one does not wish to be carrying a baby, then do not engage in the baby-making act.

Please return from paradise, this is earth and humans are fallible and do stupid things now and then, it is called to be alive.

That may be unpleasant for the hedonist to hear, who thinks that all of his desires should be instantly gratifiable on demand. Hearing a demand that he exercise self-control, and show responsibility by taking up fatherhood should he bring about a child, is too much for the irresponsible hedonist, who wants to be free to go out to nightclubs and cinemas at will without responsibility. In fact, he is willing to murder to filch the pleasure belonging to the sexual act, and then try to erase its natural consequence.

He? To the best of my knowledge it is the women that is having the abortion, or as you enjoy to call it "the killing".

As to situations where a woman is forced, well, a rapist was frequently introduced to the hangman's noose. It is the irresponsible and fugitive men who should be punished, not innocent, living children.

You are clearly living in the stone age, please return, and adapt, to 2021.

You can't escape the fact that the baby in the womb is alive, and that you have to kill it to stop it from living, something that he or she is already doing.

The thing is not alive on its own, it is a part of the mother.

If you try to deny it, any number of MRI's will show up such foolishness.

Concede the point, and let's move on to what actions can be taken that are moral.

Your moral or mine? Mine is founded in reality, yours are an utopian illusion based on man rules over women just because the man knows what is best for women.

[rusmeister]

I’m not going to argue with willful foolishness. A person who does not want to know the truth cannot know it. But those with eyes to see can see it.
https://youtu.be/eOqZtkfLCkI

[rusmeister]

I don’t see an option to put a video directly in the post. For some reason, the button that I think is supposed to be for video insertion (between the mail and image buttons) is greyed out.

But at any rate, here is more visual evidence that no words can refute:
https://youtu.be/WH9ZJu4wRUE

It’s science. The idea that babies in the womb are not alive is anti-science and (bad) wishful thinking. The truth is the truth. If we have done evil out of ignorance, the right thing to do is not pretend that it was not evil, but to be sorry and repent - a change of heart and mind.

Abby Johnson did it. She was the head of a Planned Parenthood clinic and oversaw at least 22,000 abortions. Now she is PP’s Enemy #1. The truth makes her incredibly dangerous to their mega-billion-dollar business padded heavily by government funding, all dependent on the lie that abortion is not murder. Now she is a happy mother of some seven or eight kids (including a couple by adoption, I think).

It’s no use, Hans. The videos show the lie of what you are uselessly trying to defend.