choosing to build a house on plot of land, Ruza, west of Moscow.

[johnsimpson]

On the topic of a Russian stove. Quote: Here is a traditional Russian stove, it's made of bricks, and it's an oven, a cooking stove, a heater for the whole house and... a bed, as you can climb on the stove (on the back side) and sleep on the top (it's warm but not hot up there, the perfect bed when it's in the middle of the Russian winter).

http://youtu.be/Ta8jUejeqDI

[johnsimpson]

In my browsing I had to to share this video as I enjoyed watching. Most certainly in Russian climate it is good to have a Russian stove especially if you are surrounded by forest. http://youtu.be/r_TO30jzyUA

[FatAndy]

it's made of bricks

Special bricks, comrade. Полнотелый печной кирпич

[johnsimpson]

After all the costing of a possible house built in Ruza we I ended up buying a dacha about three hundred Km east of Moscow. Ivanova region, Privolzhsky district, village Nogino (10 km from the town of Ples) The village is located on the shore of a large lake and is surrounded by forest. It has gas, electricity, a Russian stove, a well, 15 sotkas of land. At 800,000 roubles I have enough left in my budget for improvements. We hope to have the official registration this week when we will move in for a while.

I'd love to hear anyone else's experience of living in a dacha. Here is a picture of it. dom-nogino-550047972-1.jpg
And the floor plan. domplan.jpg

[Armoured]

After all the costing of a possible house built in Ruza we I ended up buying a dacha about three hundred Km east of Moscow. Ivanova region, Privolzhsky district, village Nogino (10 km from the town of Ples) The village is located on the shore of a large lake and is surrounded by forest. It has gas, electricity, a Russian stove, a well, 15 sotkas of land. At 800,000 roubles I have enough left in my budget for improvements. We hope to have the official registration this week when we will move in for a while.

I'd love to hear anyone else's experience of living in a dacha. Here is a picture of it.

Congrats! Frankly I think that's likely a way better solution for a first house. There are always things to fix/improve in any house, and learning by doing - and learning from the mistakes of others - is way less of a challenge than building a place from scratch (unless of course budget is unlimited). I just heard from a neighbour the figure of a million rubles just to get gas hooked up - not counting the paperwork headache. Another acquaintance in Moscow oblast recently got hooked up "for free" (they have lots of kids and a disabled foster child, anyway some kind of social program) - let's just say their stories about the physical and bureaucratic process are frightening, and it still wasn't 'free.'

I don't have too many comments on the house itself - looks pretty basic and simple which is probably good to start. You don't say much about what the equipment and set-up is like apart from having a traditional Russian stove. Overall thought: at some point you're going to figure out that you want some renovations done, and possibly large enough that you'll need someplace else to live while the work is being done. Anyway, my view is if it's in living condition, live there first for a while, figure out what priorities you have, and take time to look into what the options are.

Some specific thoughts/questions:
-how old is the place?
-get some tools. Hope you're handy.
-Internet?
-it looks like the attic is most likely a cold attic, i.e. not meant to be used or heated. In terms of insulation and general warmth/comfort, the single biggest (and relatively easy) improvement that can be done is to properly seal the roof/attic juncture so that no airflow up to attic from living space, and then add extra insulation on the floor of the attic. If the sealing is done properly, you can use simple rockwool rolls. For this, more is better. Insulation of walls and changing windows etc is more complex and expensive - but heat rises so the attic isnualtion is the easiest.
-Russian stove (and in general): be careful about air in use and get a carbon monoxide detector or three. Also fire safety. Test the stove carefully - and ideally get it checked. Obviously quesiton of how well it's been maintained and in what condition. Oh - to use any stove/fireplace properly, you need dry (i.e. aged) wood. If there isn't a decent store of wood there already, get wood in now (it's still somewhat late for ideal use this winter but four or five months aged is better than nothing). Standard is to get a cubic metre of split birch dumped and you stack it yourself or pay a bit extra - everyone says their wood is dry and they are all liars (it may not be 'wet' but zero chance it's well aged).
-Gas heat - presume a boiler with rads? May want to check about how/whether to use antifreeze in the rads system. Frozen rads and pipes are very bad and expensive to fix. Not all gas boilers will continue to work properly without electricity, and it's not unheard of for them to stop working for other reasons.
-Septic/wastewater? Keep in mind there are pretty strict regs about what types of systems can be used near any kind of body of water. You may be grandfathered in if existing system, but typically any modifications mean it has to be upgraded to current regulations.
-15 sotkas - very nice. Do yourself a favour and budget for some yard work / general help. Not that most of this stuff is very hard but it can be time consuming and you may as well offload the gruntwork and leave yourself the more pleasant stuff.
-Water - worth getting the water tested. Basically though you'll probably want to budget for a water filtration system. They're pretty standard and not too expensive. Drinking water filter system after that system, i.e. the main 'salt' cleaning system is not for drinking water (not necessarily unsafe but most people want drinking water filtered for that purpose).

As for living at dacha: we're closer to Moscow and not here full time (although much of time). I don't know how comparable, will mostly depend on level of services and all that out there. I understand Ples is fairly developed and a nice place, but it's pretty much a fact that it's going to be different than Moscow. Even where we are, complaints are rampant about medical services, feckless and incompetent local admin, road and electricity etc outages (which while not that bad are still noticeably worse). Oh, garbage collection is a big issue, as is just plain litter and tendency for illegal dumping of trash. Neighbours make a difference - in both good and bad senses. Every nieghbourhood and village has drunks and people to watch out for. Some places have a crime problem - whether real thieves or random smash and grab drunks. Some will suggest a dog is the only practical approach, I don't know.

[FatAndy]

Regarding crime problem, mentioned by Armoured, I'd recommend to look at nearest neighbours (fence to fence and backyard to backyard) and try to establish good relations with them (though w/o too much familiarity) - having respect from them may help a lot.

[johnsimpson]

Thanks for a most informative post, much appreciated. Yes it's liveable traditional dacha style will know more when I visit and hopefully stay a while sometime this week as I wait for confirmed documents. The house already has gas, but will need some attention from a gas fitter for central heating. My wife informs me of a packaged service we will use that will cover running water, sewerage, etc. How old is it? The advert said built 1970, but no, it was built 1920 by the sellers grandfather. Surprisingly the wood and paintwork looks in good condition, no peeling or rotten on first short visit. Just faded, and could do with a coat of paint outside and varnish in the interior. Could look rather nice as a traditional styled dacha brightly coloured with the decorative fretwork in a contrast white surrounding the windows etc. Internet, not cable but using a wireless provider there shouldn't be a problem. They say fast enough due to smaller traffic using it. I'll certainly check for insulation including the attic. The sellers did make a fire in the stove the day before we arrived, and by the next day long after the fire had died off the house was actually warm and cosy as the oven retained the heat. The house will be left with furnishing and tools and we have our own as we currently use our own local allotment. We will have a stock of wood to start off with and will probably need more if staying through winter. Here's another view of the house. dom3.jpg There is a large barn attached at the back, not included in the floor plan. Useful for storage and keeping those logs dry etc.

[Armoured]

Looks lovely.

All comments and suggestions from those (incl me) who haven't seen it firsthand should be taken with a grain of salt, of course.

I'm most curious what this package for sewerage water gas could be.

What's the electrics like? I'd assume you'll have to upgrade whatever's there, i.e. if it hasn't been redone recently. The older-style is still pretty common here and not great for safety.

[Armoured]

I had a random thought - I have sometimes found these older houses with (by modern standards) small and less numerous windows to be rather dark. Usual solution has been to put in large, cumbersome light fixtures with many bulbs - even so, ends up being bright near the light fixtures but uneven, also because usually electricity was sometimes only wired to a few places in each room. Now though they have these LED lighting strips that don't take much power and can be placed unobtrusively in odd places, for indirect light under/behind things, etc.

Be sure to get instruction on how to properly use the Russian stove. Some of them have quite specific ways they have to be operated, with most direct draft open when lighting a fire, then diverted to a system of baffles once the fire is hot and clean (to absorb the heat in the masonry by maximum exposure), and then closed/diverted again once the fire is down. Anyway each one can be different.

I think there are also recommended ways for the wood - apart from dry wood (of course) but in general the idea is to have periodic short but hot fires (not necessarily large but hot and quick), which overall would mean relatively finely split wood. I've seen some used by people who seemed to be using what I'd think of as almost just kindling, lots and lots of very small pieces. Nothing like sticking an unsplit log per the visual image of say sherlock standing by the large open fireplace with large long logs burning slowly in the background. That said I've never spent lengths of time in a place heated mostly by pechka in very cold weather. Smaller pieces of wood means more air exposure means burns faster and hotter.

(As I understand it the very hot fire with the diversion to the baffled system works with relatively little build up of tar and creosote and the like in those complicated masonry baffles; screw that up by burning too low or diverting to the baffles at wrong time and all that stuff builds up and both starts to destroy the masonry - acidic I suppose - and also raises risk of eventual creosote fire, which can be very dangerous)

[johnsimpson]

As you can see from the picture there are a lot of windows compared to your typical traditional dacha. And yes we have plans to improve the electrical wiring to modern standards. Yes, there has been a manual written up for us of which my wife is translating for me. Not only that, due to the work I do editing my wife's translations, Russian to English, I have taken an interest Russian culture and traditional way of living, especially in the use of a Russian stove which brought my attention to this dacha in the first place. In regards to wood it is best to use what is locally available and whatever is in supply, using for example the birch bark to start off the fire and quarter split the logs. Here is an interesting video about firing up a Russian stove, by a Swede in cold Russia. Enjoyable viewing.

[johnsimpson]

This is the link that attracted me to the dacha in the first place. Unfortunately al the pictures have gone now as it is sold. http://ivanovo.cian.ru/sale/suburban/189022256/
Here's what I saved. dom6.jpg

[Armoured]

That is more Windows than usual. Still in winter it's never enough.

[johnsimpson]

We will be taking a three hour trip by train to Ivanovo from Moscow on Friday, then onto Ples (beside the Volga) close to where the dacha is. So we will know better after that. Gas as I said, not a major expense as it is already available, and ready to have a gas cooker boiler installed. Electricity wiring probably needs improvement as a washing machine is essential to us and as my sons say a TV with computer games is a must. All must be safe as we leave the place from time to time. But we did observe a kettle and a hotplate stove working, and has two fridges, lighting in the rooms also working, as well as a strimmer available powered for use. Estimated the lot another 800,000 roubles for sewerage, running water and gas, let's say 100,000 would be OK in all. Yes, we will have the electricity checked, wife is already worried about it as the owners left last week leaving the fridges functioning. That seems to worry her a lot. In regards the package, more details later.

[Armoured]

What's a strimmer?

You have boys? If they're old enough to play video games, they're old enough to cut wood.

Unfortunately also old enough to find porn on their own.

[johnsimpson]

it cuts grass but not a lawn mower. It cuts overgrowth.

Yes one grown up, 22 and one 13 years old. One good reason we won't live permanently due to schooling. Hopefully they will help, although the young is spoilt. Good at school, though. Clever boy.