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Thread: I got citizenship

  1. #91
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    I did some research and I think I know why the RF migration officials want the statement showing renunciation of citizenship. Some countries, such as India, do not allow dual citizenship. India and Russia have an agreement showing an Indian can get Russian citizenship, after which he has a year to drop his Indian citizenship.

    To ensure this happens, the RF government gets renunciation statements from all applicants for citizenship. These could in theory be used later on to go back to someone from, say, India to compel someone to drop their other citizenship in the country where dual citizenship is not allowed.

    Even then, the document is toothless, but perhaps it gives comfort to the migration officials. Getting the statement from everyone is simply overkill.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by xt-tsi View Post
    I did some research and I think I know why the RF migration officials want the statement showing renunciation of citizenship. Some countries, such as India, do not allow dual citizenship. India and Russia have an agreement showing an Indian can get Russian citizenship, after which he has a year to drop his Indian citizenship.

    To ensure this happens, the RF government gets renunciation statements from all applicants for citizenship. These could in theory be used later on to go back to someone from, say, India to compel someone to drop their other citizenship in the country where dual citizenship is not allowed.

    Even then, the document is toothless, but perhaps it gives comfort to the migration officials. Getting the statement from everyone is simply overkill.


    Article 15 of the UN Charter states that no country can stop you from giving up you citizenship. Not that anyone has to pay attention to the lame UN.
    If you trust the government you obviously failed history class. " George Carlin"

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  4. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Wally View Post
    Article 15 of the UN Charter states that no country can stop you from giving up you citizenship. Not that anyone has to pay attention to the lame UN.
    Sorry to be picky Uncle Wally, but is it not the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, not the UN Charter itself? But definitely article 15:

    Article 15
    (1) Everyone has the right to a nationality.
    (2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his nationality nor denied the right to change his nationality.

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  6. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBear View Post
    Sorry to be picky Uncle Wally, but is it not the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, not the UN Charter itself? But definitely article 15:

    Article 15
    (1) Everyone has the right to a nationality.
    (2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his nationality nor denied the right to change his nationality.

    Yes you are probably right.
    If you trust the government you obviously failed history class. " George Carlin"

  7. #95
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    And yet...in practice, once someone takes on citizenship in a new country, that person is has to chose between citizenship in one country or another. Comments above might be correct, though; the RF government probably doesn't care.

    Attached an article I found about the refusal letter. It says that per RF law, this refusal statement is a formality because no one has to go to their embassy and apply to drop citizenship before applying for RF citizenship. This, of course, would be impossible because the applicant needs to have citizenship somewhere before applying for RF citizenship in the first place.

    The article makes a comment about the Ukraine. A Ukrainian citizen who is a fluent Russian speaker (meaning ethnically Russian) can get Russian citizenship through a simplified process. Ukraine law does not allow dual citizenship. As I understand this article, the Russian government sees the requirement for submitting this notarized refusal of citizenship as a way to make the process more convenient for people from the Ukraine applying for RF citizenship.

    So...it's simplified for applicants from the Ukraine but meaningless for most other applicants. Overkill!

    Also attached for everyone's reading pleasure is article 6 of the Russian code about dual citizenship.

    https://grazdanstvo-rf.ru/priobreten...razhdanstva-rf
    http://www.consultant.ru/document/co...43f0ab2fc3dfa/

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  9. #96
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    Dear friends,

    i just got the letter TODAY from мвд that i can go pick up my russian citizenship now after such a looooong painful process. Any one can tell me please when exact moment must i inform them about my second nationality, please kindly explain in full with much thanks. Cheers!!!

    Regards,

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  11. #97
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    I did it when I submitted the application for my internal RU passport. Not sure what the deadline is but I just got it out of the way, while in the form submitting mode. So as not to forget.

    Congratulations!

  12. #98
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    thank you.

  13. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by kimkiti View Post
    Dear friends,

    i just got the letter TODAY from мвд that i can go pick up my russian citizenship now after such a looooong painful process. Any one can tell me please when exact moment must i inform them about my second nationality, please kindly explain in full with much thanks. Cheers!!!

    Regards,
    Why would you need another?
    If you trust the government you obviously failed history class. " George Carlin"

  14. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Wally View Post
    Why would you need another?
    To not bother with visas .

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  16. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judge View Post
    To not bother with visas .
    That is often the most common explanation on why people want more than one nationality to choose from.
    But there are quite a few possible negative side effects of having more than one citizenship, for example, you entered a third country for which no visa is required or stamp in passports, you just walk in, and you encounter problems with the authorities, who are you? hint: you may not be allowed to choose which of your citizenship countries that should/can/may help you, and you may suddenly sit in shit for the neck.
    To choose to have more than one citizenship based on the freedom regarding visas is one of the more weak excuses, sorry, it is a lazy-mans excuses.

  17. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by kimkiti View Post
    Dear friends,

    i just got the letter TODAY from мвд that i can go pick up my russian citizenship now after such a looooong painful process. Any one can tell me please when exact moment must i inform them about my second nationality, please kindly explain in full with much thanks. Cheers!!!

    Regards,
    Congratulations! This law is actually intended for Russian citizens acquiring another citizenship. Since you are not acquiring another citizenship as a Russian citizenship, you do not need to inform them of any citizenship you previously acquired. This is the case, if you acquired Russian citizenship after August 4, 2014. You can read about it here: https://www.vestnik-migranta.ru/2017...sport.html?m=1

    There is an official response from ФМС there confirming this information that says:
    Обязанность подачи уведомления гражданами, приобретшими российское гражданство после 4 августа 2014 года и одновременно имеющими гражданство иностранного государства либо вид на жительство или иной документ, подтверждающий право постоянного проживания в иностранном государстве действующим законодательством Российской Федерации не предусмотрена.

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  19. #103
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    Here's another official explanation stating the same thing: https://vk.com/wall-80564827_632754

  20. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hans.KK View Post
    That is often the most common explanation on why people want more than one nationality to choose from.
    But there are quite a few possible negative side effects of having more than one citizenship, for example, you entered a third country for which no visa is required or stamp in passports, you just walk in, and you encounter problems with the authorities, who are you? hint: you may not be allowed to choose which of your citizenship countries that should/can/may help you, and you may suddenly sit in shit for the neck.
    To choose to have more than one citizenship based on the freedom regarding visas is one of the more weak excuses, sorry, it is a lazy-mans excuses.
    I would say, you are a citizen of the passport that you used to enter the country with.

    Having more than one passport does make life much more easier,especially if living in Russia and you often travel.

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  22. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judge View Post
    I would say, you are a citizen of the passport that you used to enter the country with.
    Agree, but is some country's you do not need to show up a passport when entering, so in case you have two passport in you pocket, witch of them did you use when entering?

    Having more than one passport does make life much more easier,especially if living in Russia and you often travel.
    Yes that can be true, but it may not be without complications in some rare cases. But the whole idea about citizenship is that you should only have one of them, the same goes for passports, but people are lazy and act accordingly to that and their own comfort right here and now.

    All I am trying to say is that those that want to have more than one passport should think very carefully about it, it may backfire to have more than one passport in some cases.

    Right now some people is standing somewhere in the worlds and would like to go home to the place where their passport fits, and those places do not want them back, those people with more than one citizenship (passport) may have one of their citizenship (passports) revoked. I know that this is an extreme case, but more light versions of problems by having more than one passport exist, it can go from being detained by the police for an extra identity control, over prison for shorter or longer periods, expulsion of a country can also be on the list.
    You can, with or without your own mistakes, come into trouble with more than one passport, difficulties that would not occur if you only had one passport.

    I know that it is very nice and easy when you travel between two country's often and they both require visa from each other citizens, then the travelling is so much more easy to deal with with two passports, but I am not talking about those cases, there is other cases where two passports on first glance is looking to be beneficial but can turn up to be a nightmare.

    There is some Russian citizens, boys, that is living outside Russia, when they visit Russia they use their Russian passport, and when they reach the age of around 17-18 years then they start to using visa's (using their other passport) when visiting Russia all just to escape the risk to be called in for army service, that is a risky game, and they only play this game because they have two passports.

    Two passports is not a definitive solution on that much, it may open up for more problems than it solves, so do your actions on a well-informed basis and remember to take the negative effects into the equation, thank you.

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