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Thread: Thank you

  1. #1
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    Thank you

    for closing my thread about terrorist strategies, there are whole books written about that but this cannot be discussed on a public forum

    once again not because of the mods but because of users too blind (especially foreigners with, i suppose, no knowledge of russia) to take a fact in an objective manner, analyse and discuss it

    they have to put their bloody bigot moral in that

    sorry if i find shocking that the cecenians who fled Budannovsk to reach Daghestan took in between the hostages 16 journalists and (listen listen) 9 Duma representatives

    this put 9/11 to shame

    then i just asked russians which one of those terrorist attacks shocked them more and this is a legitimate question in fact one guy reply and that was a good start...

    disappointed

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    It is the way you wrote that was shocking: Trying to make a "top 10" of the last terrorist attacks in Russia! No attack is more "shocking" than another, both killed civilians, including old people and kids.

    Formulate differently and for sure people will discuss about it. And I will also, for sure!

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    Terrorism as vogue

    dear Sal,
    I dont know if you mean me with the foreigners with no knowledge of Russia (in fact I have already some experience and knowledge), but sincerely I will tell you once again that I did not agree with the form you offered your thread. I do fully agree with guest, that a different formula might have been understood on a different, more positive way.
    As I come from a country which is suffering one kind of terrorism, I feel that citizens of other countries with the same problem (i.e. Russia) may react on a very sensitive way. I can discuss with you about the reasons why a group or whatever decides to go underground to fight for their rights or values, but I will never discuss about the strategical value of terrorist actions, because I dont see any value in them.

    Hope you dont missunderstand me this time - enjoy your week

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    Guest is usually a very sharp-tongued individual who hates bigots so wonder why it is taking few wrong words that way. disappointing.

    Jumatre, I am sorry but i do not want to discuss if checenyans were right or wrong because to me it is clear their action was wrong

    i want to discuss what terrorist attacks has been the most cleverly planned and denote the highest degree of intelligence



    i realy wonder and maybe russians can reply:
    how those people managed to reach Daghestan and escape? how they took 9duma repr?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SalTheReturn View Post
    Guest is usually a very sharp-tongued individual who hates bigots so wonder why it is taking few wrong words that way. disappointing.

    Jumatre, I am sorry but i do not want to discuss if checenyans were right or wrong because to me it is clear their action was wrong

    i want to discuss what terrorist attacks has been the most cleverly planned and denote the highest degree of intelligence



    i realy wonder and maybe russians can reply:
    how those people managed to reach Daghestan and escape? how they took 9duma repr?
    You´re right Sal. These attacks are happening and should be discussed. But not like this.

    I believe you made an honest mistake. I hope you didn´t intend to start playing games. The word "impressive" sent the thread in a direction you perhaps hadn´t planned. It has two meanings. After describing terrorist attacks like this, the topic could no longer be discussed in an objective way.

    As a foreigner you gotta show more respect and sensitivity. Otherwise you just create chaos and stir up hate. Surely you understand this. If not, time to learn it now please!


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    PJW i agree with you and guest 100%
    unfortunatly i tend to think that Sal intended to ceate conflict, as is his nature to do so

    Quote Originally Posted by pjw View Post
    You´re right Sal. These attacks are happening and should be discussed. But not like this.

    I believe you made an honest mistake. I hope you didn´t intend to start playing games. The word "impressive" sent the thread in a direction you perhaps hadn´t planned. It has two meanings. After describing terrorist attacks like this, the topic could no longer be discussed in an objective way.

    As a foreigner you gotta show more respect and sensitivity. Otherwise you just create chaos and stir up hate. Surely you understand this. If not, time to learn it now please!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Clean32 View Post
    PJW i agree with you and guest 100%
    unfortunatly i tend to think that Sal intended to ceate conflict, as is his nature to do so
    Clean you love history and you have always seemed very prepared on that.
    History can also imply the strategical analysis of a fact.
    You know I am not here to joy because people got killed.

    Can you believe these people took 9duma repr and made it to Daghestan?
    And in Daghestan apparently they were welcomed as national heroes.

    I also like to know about dictators.
    Kapuscinsky (greatest polish journalist ever) portrays Stalin as a sort of genius being able to discuss about everything, linguistic, agrarial sciences, etc...
    he says that dictators have always boasted enormous cleverness, what a shame they were clever in the wrong way.

    My favourite living dictator is currently KimJong: 20.000dvds whilst north korean people are starving.

    It is also interesting how dictators end up being actually respected by large share of their citizens.

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    Terrorist attacks

    Quote Originally Posted by SalTheReturn View Post

    i want to discuss what terrorist attacks has been the most cleverly planned and denote the highest degree of intelligence
    Sal, if you ask or wish to discuss the most cleverly planned terrorist attack but with the lowest degree of intelligence, I would tip on the US Invasion of Iraq...

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    What you have now posted has no relationship to your first sick post.

    But to answer this post it’s quite simple

    1 create fear, to achieve unity
    2 create hardship to achieve jealousness
    3 provide savour

    than say how great we all are,
    It hasn’t changed since Babylonian times



    Quote Originally Posted by SalTheReturn View Post
    Clean you love history and you have always seemed very prepared on that.
    History can also imply the strategical analysis of a fact.
    You know I am not here to joy because people got killed.

    Can you believe these people took 9duma repr and made it to Daghestan?
    And in Daghestan apparently they were welcomed as national heroes.

    I also like to know about dictators.
    Kapuscinsky (greatest polish journalist ever) portrays Stalin as a sort of genius being able to discuss about everything, linguistic, agrarial sciences, etc...
    he says that dictators have always boasted enormous cleverness, what a shame they were clever in the wrong way.

    My favourite living dictator is currently KimJong: 20.000dvds whilst north korean people are starving.

    It is also interesting how dictators end up being actually respected by large share of their citizens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jumatre View Post
    Sal, if you ask or wish to discuss the most cleverly planned terrorist attack but with the lowest degree of intelligence, I would tip on the US Invasion of Iraq...

    Well, it HAD TO BE DONE. Maybe differently, but it is always easy to say this AFTER. And I really think we can say "thank you" to Bush to have done the dirty job.

    Strange that I say this, right? But this opinion is shared by a lot of RF officials, and not the smallest.

    _

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guest View Post
    Well, it HAD TO BE DONE. Maybe differently, but it is always easy to say this AFTER. And I really think we can say "thank you" to Bush to have done the dirty job.

    Strange that I say this, right? But this opinion is shared by a lot of RF officials, and not the smallest.

    _
    There is nothing to argue about... you feel the obligation to say "thank you, Mr. Bush", but I never heard that "a lot of RF officials (and not the smallest!!!!)" shared this opinion.
    I am sure you are in possession of all the documentation stating that even Mr. Putin was calling Mr. Bush expressing his gratitude, but it is hard to believe.
    Nevertheless in my modest opinion this was, and still is, some kind of state terror... And of course we will not discuss about intelligence...

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    Bush and Putin are sharing a few global views on the "general threats" of today's world, and are probably the only Presidents to really understand where the real danger today is.

    There are the official statements, and there is the job that is done, for example through exchanges between the intelligence services. The real position of countries should be seen here and not in the UNO talks.



    Quote Originally Posted by jumatre View Post
    There is nothing to argue about... you feel the obligation to say "thank you, Mr. Bush", but I never heard that "a lot of RF officials (and not the smallest!!!!)" shared this opinion.
    I am sure you are in possession of all the documentation stating that even Mr. Putin was calling Mr. Bush expressing his gratitude, but it is hard to believe.
    Nevertheless in my modest opinion this was, and still is, some kind of state terror... And of course we will not discuss about intelligence...

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    I accept your point of view, but cannot share it - of course governments (not single persons) must share global views. In case of Iraq I must say that the exchange of intelligence between the services was either very poor or the services themselves were not very intelligent...
    Now that everybody knows for sure that there was no reason for the terrorist attack on Iraq, we must ask ourselves in whose hands we are depositing our hope - Russia? yes - a strong and self confident president has "created" a strong and self-confident nation, but USA? a weak and not very intelligent president, driven by industrial and economical gurus has created a lot of trouble and antipathy against himself and his nation. This might be the difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guest View Post
    Well, it HAD TO BE DONE. Maybe differently, but it is always easy to say this AFTER. And I really think we can say "thank you" to Bush to have done the dirty job.

    Strange that I say this, right? But this opinion is shared by a lot of RF officials, and not the smallest.

    _
    That's what I was talking about in my last message on that closed thread.

    If Bush won't stop them in Iraq and Afganistan when they're still weak enough to be terminated, then sooner or later they'll capture all the world coz all they can do is borning millions of children and arming them with AK-47 and explosive belts u know.

    I think that Sal's only mistake is making a "TOP 10". But he don't try to justify all these bustards u know, so don't punch him so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jumatre View Post
    I accept your point of view, but cannot share it - of course governments (not single persons) must share global views. In case of Iraq I must say that the exchange of intelligence between the services was either very poor or the services themselves were not very intelligent...
    Well, apart playing on the word "intelligence", I can tell you that the "services" exchanged lots of informations, much more really that it would have been if they would have followed the "official positions" of both countries.



    Quote Originally Posted by jumatre View Post
    Now that everybody knows for sure that there was no reason for the terrorist attack on Iraq, we must ask ourselves in whose hands we are depositing our hope - Russia? yes - a strong and self confident president has "created" a strong and self-confident nation, but USA? a weak and not very intelligent president, driven by industrial and economical gurus has created a lot of trouble and antipathy against himself and his nation. This might be the difference.

    I don't share your expression "terrorist attack on Iraq". It was a war, not a terrorist attack. Terrorists target innocent people, they generally donot attack the army, police etc. Too dangerous! They prefer send washed-brain people to make them explode among civilians, and it is what we see today in Iraq - But NOT from the US side!

    The US made of course civilian deads, as during all wars. The difference is that US army tried to limit the civilian deaths, as the terrorist at the opposite try to make the maximum civilian deaths.

    Now, you are right to say that the result of this war is that the USA got a negative opinion quite everywhere. But do you think it is a real problem for the USA? Taking hard measures usually do NOT make you popular! And despite all what can be read here and there, the US are still the first power in the world, INCLUDING on the economical aspect. Their debt? Yes, and what? Of course better to live without debt, but who does apart Russia?! The USD loss? That is a good thing for the US exportations, at least for now! Look at the bad face of EU leaders when they speak about the "strength" of EVRO!

    About antipathy against Bush, you know I am not sure that he wouldn't be re-elected if he could run the race once more! Anyway US presidents are always 50/50, so there are quite always often a majority unhappy of them. And once more, hard decisions never make people popular, at least in the very short time when they TAKE the decisions.

    I am Russian, and of course in case of a major "problem" with the US, I will support my country. NO doubt about it. But that doesn't make me an automatic "anti-american", and if necessary I would fight against the USA but would respect them in the same time.

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