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Benedikt
16-12-2018, 18:44
time for a change anyway if it was like that. are they upset because they can not control everything and everybody anymore?
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/under-management-russia-now-runs-063017124.html

Uncle Wally
16-12-2018, 22:37
time for a change anyway if it was like that. are they upset because they can not control everything and everybody anymore?
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/under-management-russia-now-runs-063017124.html



Does the author of this "article? Know that Russia is not part if OPIC? I even think Iran has had enough and wants to quit. Why should any smaller countries care about Saudi Arabia not being able to bomb women and children in Yemen, or spread their religion?

Judge
17-12-2018, 00:57
Does the author of this "article? Know that Russia is not part if OPIC? I even think Iran has had enough and wants to quit. Why should any smaller countries care about Saudi Arabia not being able to bomb women and children in Yemen, or spread their religion?

It's a good article, it shows Russia's power play inside OPEC.

Talk abour making yourself at home,



But when Russian Energy Minister Alexander Novak arrived Friday morning, he moved in to the office of OPEC’s Secretary General. If ever there was a symbol of OPEC’s demise, it was this. He then summoned first Iran’s oil minister, then Saudi Arabia’s, for about 45 minutes each. Two hours later, the group reached a deal. And Iran, Libya and Venezuela got their exemptions, even if they didn’t appear in the final communiqué.


And then there is this



Handing control of OPEC decision making to the Kremlin has come at a high cost for the group, and most particularly for its smaller members

This of course isn't in America's interest, The KSA - Russia pact is annoying America.

TolkoRaz
17-12-2018, 09:42
Does the author of this "article? Know that Russia is not part if OPIC? I even think Iran has had enough and wants to quit. Why should any smaller countries care about Saudi Arabia not being able to bomb women and children in Yemen, or spread their religion?

Correct

https://www.opec.org/opec_web/en/about_us/25.htm

I seem to recall that Qatar is also considering leaving OPEC.

TolkoRaz
17-12-2018, 09:43
It's a good article, it shows Russia's power play inside OPEC.

Talk abour making yourself at home,





And then there is this




This of course isn't in America's interest, The KSA - Russia pact is annoying America.

Hence Trump's 'friendly' stance with regards to the brutal murder of Khashoggi.............!

Judge
17-12-2018, 12:56
Correct

https://www.opec.org/opec_web/en/about_us/25.htm

I seem to recall that Qatar is also considering leaving OPEC.



The author of the article knows Russia isn't a member, maybe Wally didn't read it all..

With Qatar leaving, will Iran or Iraq be next.

Judge
17-12-2018, 12:58
Hence Trump's 'friendly' stance with regards to the brutal murder of Khashoggi.............!

There could be a connection the US putting pressure on KSA cos of their friendship with Russia.

Yeah, we are seeing divisions all over the place, a US and KSA plays into Russia's hands.

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 14:20
32769

Here is a flow chart to help you understand Judge.

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 14:23
Correct

https://www.opec.org/opec_web/en/about_us/25.htm

I seem to recall that Qatar is also considering leaving OPEC.


Yes they are and I just read investing $20 dollars in the US energy business.

Judge
17-12-2018, 14:31
32769

Here is a flow chart to help you understand Judge.

For Russia , I end up at ''Harass economically until friendly'' you can start at Dictator or Democracy.:big-grin:

Ignatius
17-12-2018, 16:10
time for a change anyway if it was like that. are they upset because they can not control everything and everybody anymore?
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/under-management-russia-now-runs-063017124.html

Since the US is now the number one producer of crude oil in the world I doubt it cares about either Opec or Russia.

Judge
17-12-2018, 16:54
Since the US is now the number one producer of crude oil in the world I doubt it cares about either Opec or Russia.

Disagree , Trump does, he was on a twitter rampage before the last meeting.

When the day comes for the US to be self sufficient ,not relying on oil imports, then the US might not care...
If Russia and the KSA cuts say a million barrels between them, prices could easily top $100 , sending US car lovers crazy and Trump into a meltdown.

Ignatius
17-12-2018, 17:49
Disagree , Trump does, he was on a twitter rampage before the last meeting.

When the day comes for the US to be self sufficient ,not relying on oil imports, then the US might not care...
If Russia and the KSA cuts say a million barrels between them, prices could easily top $100 , sending US car lovers crazy and Trump into a meltdown.

Actually, it's more complex than that and not exactly how petrol prices work. 1st, US is practically energy independent (95%) but most economists think this is a VERY bad idea. US problems reside in consumption not production. It produces more than any other nation in the world and does so many times more efficiently. Ask Gazprom about that. A once proud company, Gazprom is worth less 60B today. Haha. ) Additionally, US companies profit greatly from Russian oil and gas, not the other way around. Lots of US oil companies in Russia (Halliburton, Schlumberger, fracking consultants/patents, Exxon, etc...) Not many if any Russian oil companies operate in the US because they can't succeed in competitive markets where there's no Kremlin to baby them.

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 17:55
Actually, it's more complex than that and not exactly how petrol prices work. 1st, US is practically energy independent (95%) but most economists think this is a VERY bad idea. US problems reside in consumption not production. It produces more than any other nation in the world and does so many times more efficiently. Ask Gazprom about that. A once proud company, Gazprom is worth less 60B today. Haha. ) Additionally, US companies profit greatly from Russian oil and gas, not the other way around. Lots of US oil companies in Russia (Halliburton, Schlumberger, fracking consultants/patents, Exxon, etc...) Not many if any Russian oil companies operate in the US because they can't succeed in competitive markets where there's no Kremlin to baby them.



I guess you never heard of fraking and how much it cost.


What is "competition" if the US has to harass the EU to buy more expensive gas from them instead of cheaper Russian gas?

Ignatius
17-12-2018, 17:58
My favorite quote:
Gazprom in 2007
“We will reach a $1-trillion market capitalisation in a period of seven to 10 years,” deputy chief executive officer Alexander Medvedev, 51, said in a Moscow interview on April 6. “We’d like to be the most valued and most capitalised company in the world.

Per Open Society statististics:
Gazprom Market Cap on December 17, 2018: 56B USD
Exxon Market Cap on December 17, 2018: 310B USD

:laughing:

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 19:25
My favorite quote:
Gazprom in 2007
“We will reach a $1-trillion market capitalisation in a period of seven to 10 years,” deputy chief executive officer Alexander Medvedev, 51, said in a Moscow interview on April 6. “We’d like to be the most valued and most capitalised company in the world.

Per Open Society statististics:
Gazprom Market Cap on December 17, 2018: 56B USD
Exxon Market Cap on December 17, 2018: 310B USD

:laughing:




No link? Not true.

Judge
17-12-2018, 19:28
Actually, it's more complex than that and not exactly how petrol prices work. 1st, US is practically energy independent (95%) but most economists think this is a VERY bad idea. US problems reside in consumption not production. It produces more than any other nation in the world and does so many times more efficiently. Ask Gazprom about that. A once proud company, Gazprom is worth less 60B today. Haha. ) Additionally, US companies profit greatly from Russian oil and gas, not the other way around. Lots of US oil companies in Russia (Halliburton, Schlumberger, fracking consultants/patents, Exxon, etc...) Not many if any Russian oil companies operate in the US because they can't succeed in competitive markets where there's no Kremlin to baby them.

Sure, it's more complex, however, your average guy on the street filling up is car and seeing gas prices rocketing cares about his/her pocket, then the US starts to wobble, if US leaders want to keep their jobs, there are two things you shouldn't increase, taxes and gas at the pump stations.
If gas prices went that high, the US would have its own yellow vest protest.:big-grin:

If oil prices sky rocket, Trump will lose next election, if oil prices crash, then the frackers( mass unemployment) go bust, which could lead to the banks that lent them billions going bust too.

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 19:28
How can a company with $316 in assets be worth so little?

https://www.forbes.com/companies/gazprom/#1ced58cf7ec8

Uncle Wally
17-12-2018, 20:04
Sure, it's more complex, however, your average guy on the street filling up is car and seeing gas prices rocketing cares about his/her pocket, then the US starts to wobble, if US leaders want to keep their jobs, there are two things you shouldn't increase, taxes and gas at the pump stations.
If gas prices went that high, the US would have its own yellow vest protest.:big-grin:

If oil prices sky rocket, Trump will lose next election, if oil prices crash, then the frackers( mass unemployment) go bust, which could lead to the banks that lent them billions going bust too.



Gazprom is a different animal. One it is mostly state owned, something that would never happen in the good old USA. You know where people have to drink lead poison water, but privatizing water is a good thing, just like the largest prison system. Gee I wonder why the US has the largest prison population on Earth? It couldn't be profits, could it? Forbes left out the many other things Gazprom owns, like TV stations and the fact that Russia (Gazprom) subsidizes electricity for millions of Russians.

I got into an argument about poor Russia spending so little on defense. I pointed out that all weapons makers are state owned and that in Russia war is not a "for profit business".

Alan65
17-12-2018, 23:44
Sure, it's more complex, however, your average guy on the street filling up is car and seeing gas prices rocketing cares about his/her pocket, then the US starts to wobble, if US leaders want to keep their jobs, there are two things you shouldn't increase, taxes and gas at the pump stations.
If gas prices went that high, the US would have its own yellow vest protest.:big-grin:

If oil prices sky rocket, Trump will lose next election, if oil prices crash, then the frackers( mass unemployment) go bust, which could lead to the banks that lent them billions going bust too.

Make of this what you will

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/16/divestment-fossil-fuel-industry-trillions-dollars-investments-carbon?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

And before Ben pipes up with his annual "we will turn the gas off", go for it as I have yet to use gas central heating yet, everything is electric heaters which all comes from renewable sources.

Judge
18-12-2018, 00:31
Make of this what you will

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/16/divestment-fossil-fuel-industry-trillions-dollars-investments-carbon?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

And before Ben pipes up with his annual "we will turn the gas off", go for it as I have yet to use gas central heating yet, everything is electric heaters which all comes from renewable sources.

The UK better play nice with Russia this year, it was Russian LNG that saved UK "s Christmas and New Years.

Alan65
18-12-2018, 00:45
The UK better play nice with Russia this year, it was Russian LNG that saved UK "s Christmas and New Years.

Yeah...and you won WW2 single handed

Judge
18-12-2018, 09:37
Yeah...and you won WW2 single handed

Many historians would agree with what you just wrote; however, that topic is usually discussed closer to May 9th.


Back to gas,
An oldish article, but shows how Russia is helping out the UK.
Its also likes to highlight how Brits are sending money to Kremlin.:smile:



Half of Britain’s imports of liquefied natural gas so far this year have come from Russia, illustrating how UK households have started sending more money to Moscow after Vladimir Putin made boosting exports of the super-cooled fuel a priority.


https://www.ft.com/content/62856154-26b1-11e8-b27e-cc62a39d57a0

There's nothing wrong with buying cheap gas, hopefully cheaper bills for the hard hit locals, it might get even harder after Brexit, best keep on friendly terms with Russia.