PDA

View Full Version : VV was als also working for the STASI in Dresden?



Benedikt
11-12-2018, 04:48
https://www.bild.de/bild-plus/politik/inland/politik-inland/als-kgb-spion-in-dresden-putins-geheimer-stasi-ausweis-entdeckt-58947862,view=conversionToLogin.bild.html

unfortunately to read the whole article one has to be a subscriber to the rag. anyone has another link?

Armoured
11-12-2018, 12:27
https://www.bild.de/bild-plus/politik/inland/politik-inland/als-kgb-spion-in-dresden-putins-geheimer-stasi-ausweis-entdeckt-58947862,view=conversionToLogin.bild.html

unfortunately to read the whole article one has to be a subscriber to the rag. anyone has another link?

No big deal, was given a courtesy document, likely to allow him as a member of a friendly service access to buildings and meetings without hassles. Also to avoid embarrassment for police and others should they stop someone important.

Brits and Aussies probably do same for Americans, for example.

The only embarrassing bits here are for the Germans. Acc to reports they either only just found the docs (ie bad files) and/or leaked to press. Both are not good signs. (of course gov't may have wanted to leak it)

TolkoRaz
11-12-2018, 17:50
https://www.bild.de/bild-plus/politik/inland/politik-inland/als-kgb-spion-in-dresden-putins-geheimer-stasi-ausweis-entdeckt-58947862,view=conversionToLogin.bild.html

unfortunately to read the whole article one has to be a subscriber to the rag. anyone has another link?

I have not had time to read the article, but your title suggests that VVP worked for the MfS!

On the contrary, the host country's intelligence service, the Ministerium für Staatssicherheit, despite being the 'hosts' worked very much to the KGB and took orders from MSC centre.............

Whilst in the DDR, all formally accredited operational KGB and GRU officers carried the required papers to evade detention by the Police (VoPo & BePo etc) and to allow unhindered access to buildings and closed zones etc.

Of note, East German MfS offices serving in the Soviet Union, specifically in MSC's KGB HQ or in one of the main Directorates, including at the KGB training academies, did not have the same reciprocal status, privileges or permissions afforded to them................

TolkoRaz
11-12-2018, 22:49
VVP has not aged 1 year! :)

32762 32763

Benedikt
12-12-2018, 05:52
On the contrary, the host country's intelligence service, the Ministerium für Staatssicherheit, despite being the 'hosts' worked very much to the KGB and took orders from MSC centre.............

from most of the things that I was watching on youtube about the years past I had little or no idea. Either because I was too young, or had not lived there. But to me, it looks that the whole DDR - leadership- had to jump when the - Kremlin- said so. And they could not evven ask how high, because they would be told in time. And since you know more about thes things, your comment and explainations are appreciated. I was looking around and nowhere on the net it was explained like that. That it was most probably a - courtesy - document. a permanent -propusk-, without being actually or actively involved in the day to say work of the Stasi.

by the way, in today's BILD the article is -free- and they give the same explanations, that it was most probably a courtesy document. one like many others also had. no big thing also.somethign that must have been around since many years. why just bring it now? Mutti Merkel is gone, maybe to carry on with the thought to the new Kanzler, VV is bad, Russia is bad, sunctions must stay there for sure and all that crap? Politics are a funny thing. And so is the timing and make up of the BILD.

FatAndy
12-12-2018, 10:16
31.12.1985 - Happy New Year gift? :)

Benedikt
12-12-2018, 12:33
31.12.1985 - Happy New Year gift? :)

better late than never?

Armoured
12-12-2018, 13:15
A question on this: I've not seen the full document, but I don't see any line identifying the name of the document, his position, or affiliation (service). Just the issuing office (Dresden) and rank.

To me, that makes it pretty obvious this is a courtesy document or propusk or just an id document (udostoverenie). Granted, this is from the Stasi, so likely enough on its own to scare off traffic police or other nosy types.

Obviously there's an index number that may give special access, or possibly the type of card (colour and other) may make it clear.

But any claim about employment is silly, and shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that the security service gave such docs to 'friendly service members.'

BTW, at least some press stories I've seen are describing it neutrally (quoting German historians and the like) saying just this, it would allow him to enter Stasi offices.

TolkoRaz
12-12-2018, 14:23
A question on this: I've not seen the full document, but I don't see any line identifying the name of the document, his position, or affiliation (service). Just the issuing office (Dresden) and rank.

To me, that makes it pretty obvious this is a courtesy document or propusk or just an id document (udostoverenie). Granted, this is from the Stasi, so likely enough on its own to scare off traffic police or other nosy types.

Obviously there's an index number that may give special access, or possibly the type of card (colour and other) may make it clear.

But any claim about employment is silly, and shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that the security service gave such docs to 'friendly service members.'

BTW, at least some press stories I've seen are describing it neutrally (quoting German historians and the like) saying just this, it would allow him to enter Stasi offices.

Precisely!

TolkoRaz
12-12-2018, 14:27
Stamped ID card confirming the minimum of years service in the DDR and co-operation / liaison with the MfS...........

32765

Uncle Wally
12-12-2018, 14:41
Stamped ID card confirming the minimum of years service in the DDR and co-operation / liaison with the MfS...........

32765



Is that your own one?

Armoured
12-12-2018, 15:09
The little quarterly stamps are quite intricate. Logic clear, workable low-tech implementation.

Armoured
12-12-2018, 15:12
What's with the gap in 1986?

Russian Lad
12-12-2018, 16:55
Agree with Armoured, no big deal here. There are many other big deals about this guy elsewhere though...

TolkoRaz
12-12-2018, 22:15
The little quarterly stamps are quite intricate. Logic clear, workable low-tech implementation.

Did you never visit the DDR?

TolkoRaz
12-12-2018, 22:16
What's with the gap in 1986?

Back in MSC on a long course? ;)