PDA

View Full Version : The civil war in Ukraine, series #3



Pages : [1] 2 3

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 11:55
Colleagues have sent one funny thing (first is debatable though):

1. Atheism is being finished with a first airplane turbulence.

2. Feminism is being finished with a first normal husband.

3. Ukropatriotism is being finished with a first conscription letter from military commissariat.

http://svpressa.ru/society/article/111503/ - the funny article about #3. People don't want to die for banderlogs interests.

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 12:20
Today, unexpectedly... :)
http://www.tvc.ru/news/show/id/60584

Yaks
02-02-2015, 14:38
and how many Russians try to escape military service? Very few Russians I know did military service, most got letters from their doctors to avoid it.

Armoured
02-02-2015, 14:51
Today, unexpectedly... :)
http://www.tvc.ru/news/show/id/60584

Of course, misses the point entirely. Here's the relevant text:
"And since Mr. Putin made this decision around Crimea and Ukraine - not because of some grand strategy, but essentially because he was caught off-balance by the protests in the Maidan and Yanukovych then fleeing after we had brokered a deal to transition power in Ukraine".

Since the reference is to the February 21 deal, Russia _also_ brokered the deal to transition power. (Since Poland, Germany and Russia are all on record as having signed this agreement, it's not even a secret).

And the reference is _not_ to what subsequently happened, but the agreement for Yanukovich to leave according to negotiated schedule. (Not to Yanu subsequently fleeing...)

Full text here:
http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2015/02/01/pres-obama-on-fareed-zakaria-gps-cnn-exclusive/

To misunderstand and misstate this quote so massively is nothing less than purposeful misinformation of the Russian public - well, your propaganda dollars/rubles at work.

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 15:01
and how many Russians try to escape military service? Very few Russians I know did military service, most got letters from their doctors to avoid it.
I think your comms circle was specific one ;) There is no somewhat "letters", only official medical military commission conclusions, which may release a person of 18-27 yo from military service. One can get it via... special ways... for sure. Previous years, till the half of 200x, indeed there was no enthusiasm regarding military service. But now it has changed. Not 193x situation, but better than before. Less and less conscripted, more and more contractors. Those who deny, usually are 10-15%.


well, your propaganda dollars/rubles at work.
Sure. And this is good and correct. :)

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 15:17
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54ccc3549a7947480fd701bc - 12th humanitarian convoy is back. OSCE reps were included for the border-to-Donetsk piece of route.

http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54cf60d39a79475a10a62986 - 13th convoy is being prepared.

http://kiev.unian.net/1039162-na-vyezde-v-kiev-usilyat-blokpostyi.html - block-posts at the entrance to Kiev will be fortified. "They've felt something..."(C)

Armoured
02-02-2015, 15:18
Sure. And this is good and correct. :)

In combination with this initiative, continuing to lie to the Russian public might just work:
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russia-cuts-price-of-vodka-amid-double-digit-inflation/515217.html

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 15:30
In combination with this initiative, continuing to lie to the Russian public might just work:
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russia-cuts-price-of-vodka-amid-double-digit-inflation/515217.html
Vodka with lemon? Never. :neiner:

Regarding lower limit of price, it is "bayan", at least one month old. One more evidence TMT is populated with slowpokes ;)

Armoured
02-02-2015, 18:53
Regarding lower limit of price, it is "bayan", at least one month old. One more evidence TMT is populated with slowpokes ;)

I have heard this discussed extensively on news radio in last few days, so it's not just Moscowtimes. There must be something new but I wasn't paying close attention. And I do remember it coming up a month or so ago too.

FatAndy
02-02-2015, 19:20
I have heard this discussed extensively on news radio in last few days, so it's not just Moscowtimes. There must be something new but I wasn't paying close attention. And I do remember it coming up a month or so ago too.
Anyway, as I buy vodka only 3-4 times per year (in contrary with ККЗ products), as a gift for foreign colleagues at exhibitions or conferences, it doesn't affect me so much to mention. Posol'skaya - is always Posol'skaya, even in Africa.

But the first reaction from our local liberal-progressive-democratic persons a month ago was exactly as yours. ;)

Uncle Wally
02-02-2015, 23:43
Funny how when the anti nazi pro Russian forces start to win the EU starts to cry. Well EU you picked your side now deal with it. Where were you when nazi broke the first agreement and attacked the democratically elected president and he had to get out for fear of his life? You should have condemned this illegal act but you didn't. Now you will lose Kiev too.

PJB
03-02-2015, 06:45
Funny how when the anti nazi pro Russian forces start to win the EU starts to cry. Well EU you picked your side now deal with it. Where were you when nazi broke the first agreement and attacked the democratically elected president and he had to get out for fear of his life? You should have condemned this illegal act but you didn't. Now you will lose Kiev too.

The only things Russia will "win" is an unstable border with a country full of people who hate Russia and will spend years fighting the rebels and anyone who helps them, a major part of the worlds investors running away from Russia and a loss of buyers for the oil and gas that Russia uses as a weapon to try and force their customers into compliance with Russian demands.

Tzushima
03-02-2015, 08:03
Who would win in a fight, 100 americans versus 100 russians? Why?:boxing:

Uncle Wally
03-02-2015, 10:04
Who would win in a fight, 100 americans versus 100 russians? Why?:boxing:



I think Russians because they are hungrier. It would make a great pay per view event!

Is bare handed or can they bring weapons to the party?

Armoured
03-02-2015, 10:13
Is bare handed or can they bring weapons to the party?

Only humanitarian assistance...

Tzushima
03-02-2015, 10:49
Is bare handed or can they bring weapons to the party?
If one side get weapons I guess the other side should to?

I leave it as an exercise to the reader

FatAndy
03-02-2015, 13:10
Who would win in a fight, 100 americans versus 100 russians? Why?:boxing:
Ours, because we'll send special group from the back to steal their foodpacks and toilet paper. Yankees can't fight w/o. :)


Only humanitarian assistance...
Even peaceful me, w/o spetsnaz trainings, know at least 3 ways to kill a human with a piece of dough. Imagine what trained one can do with a sledgehammer, a brick or a sack with cement. I don't speak about that powder for ceramic tiles seams. ;)

FatAndy
04-02-2015, 16:00
http://www.vz.ru/society/2015/2/4/727794.html - DNR/LNR have got the first Su-25 operating. Caught last year in July.

http://www.vz.ru/news/2015/2/3/727704.html - kindergarten blah-blah-blah of banderlogs about fails to catch Donetsk airport.

Russian Lad
04-02-2015, 16:18
Caught last year in July.

Of course, of course. Yawn.

FatAndy
04-02-2015, 21:09
Of course, of course. Yawn.
You've been there, on the airfield of Lugansk air navigation school? Pls tell me their standard airstrip friction coefficient? ;)

bydand
04-02-2015, 21:32
You've been there, on the airfield of Lugansk air navigation school? Pls tell me their standard airstrip friction coefficient? ;)

About 0.4 to 0.7 depending on weather/surface conditions. So what?
Pls tell me the standard kinetic friction.;)

FatAndy
04-02-2015, 22:42
About 0.4 to 0.7 depending on weather/surface conditions. So what?
Садись, двойка! © Your wife may translate it.

First, 0.05 up to 0.9 for concrete plates. Second, in 2014 the concrete plates on the airstrip were stolen, so they have non-qualified gravel pad now ;)

Alan65
05-02-2015, 08:41
Who would win in a fight, 100 americans versus 100 russians? Why?:boxing:

Wrong question, it should have been who would win a fight 100 Russians or 100 Afghanistans...i think we know the answer.

Tzushima
05-02-2015, 08:51
Wrong question, it should have been who would win a fight 100 Russians or 100 Afghanistans...i think we know the answer.

lol why would I ask if I already knew the answer :10189:

Uncle Wally
05-02-2015, 21:52
Wrong question, it should have been who would win a fight 100 Russians or 100 Afghanistans...i think we know the answer.



I think we know the answer if it were Americans too. But they were only there to take over the poppy fields.

TGP
06-02-2015, 11:56
Today, unexpectedly... :)
http://www.tvc.ru/news/show/id/60584

What's next? Revelations about the Boing?

FatAndy
06-02-2015, 12:25
What's next? Revelations about the Boing?
They're mysteriously silent about...

FatAndy
13-02-2015, 14:49
http://www.vz.ru/news/2015/2/13/729508.html - 6K of UkrowOrriors in the "pocket", Ilovaisk #2, but now looks like less corpses yet.

FatAndy
13-02-2015, 16:19
Unexpectedly... http://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/heres-the-ukrainian-delegation-that-gave-misleading-photos-t#.muJkmn2

FatAndy
13-02-2015, 18:16
RBC by Prohorov (C) has started to use correct colours... ;)

http://pics.v6.top.rbk.ru/v6_top_pics/media/img/9/46/754238382121469.jpg

fenrir
14-02-2015, 11:51
One of the weapons systems to be withdrawn from the rebel side according to the current ceasefire is the Tornado-S rocket system, a system ONLY Russia has (there is no export version). That tired old BS story of rebels 'liberating' weapons from Ukrainian army stores won't wash here. That was a heck of an oversight allowing the name of that weapon system to be put in the agreement both Moscow and the rebels agreed to.

FatAndy
14-02-2015, 12:06
Tornado-S is not yet in serial production and not yet taken on armament, in contrary with Tornado-G. ;)

fenrir
14-02-2015, 13:24
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/peace-agreement-proves-putin-lying-221700335.html

The article on yahoo is from the Fiscal Times and it says 9A52-4 Tornado-S.

FatAndy
14-02-2015, 13:34
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/peace-agreement-proves-putin-lying-221700335.html

The article on yahoo is from the Fiscal Times and it says 9A52-4 Tornado-S.
There is one old anecdote about "...then you tell too!"

Alan65
14-02-2015, 14:14
Tornado-S is not yet in serial production and not yet taken on armament, in contrary with Tornado-G. ;)

Hey...we have not seen Tolko here in a long time, whats happened to him.

Tzushima
14-02-2015, 14:30
Hey...we have not seen Tolko here in a long time, whats happened to him.

he's volunteering

Uncle Wally
14-02-2015, 23:20
he's volunteering



It's his job, that's what he does. He may be coming back soon, I hope. Tolka this shot's for you!

FatAndy
15-02-2015, 11:42
Hey...we have not seen Tolko here in a long time, whats happened to him.
Call to The Forest and ask ;)


he's volunteering
...sometimes.

Uncle Wally
15-02-2015, 14:21
Report of a Russian spy ship sitting 22 miles off Florida coast. A sub hunter.

Judge
15-02-2015, 18:24
350 representatives of the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE) will monitor the ceasefire in critical points - Debaltseve, Mariupol and the Donetsk Airport, according to the statement of Russia's envoy to the OSCE Andrei Kelin.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150215/1018298701.html#ixzz3RpN3UuX8

FatAndy
15-02-2015, 21:15
Report of a Russian spy ship sitting 22 miles off Florida coast. A sub hunter.
It is spying for Americans of Ukrainian origin, yep.

Alan65
18-02-2015, 00:14
A little piece from Judges favourite newspaper

http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/the-guardian-russia-shelled-ukrainians-from-within-its-own-territory-says-study-video-381006.html

Judge
18-02-2015, 09:37
A little piece from Judges favourite newspaper

http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/the-guardian-russia-shelled-ukrainians-from-within-its-own-territory-says-study-video-381006.html

kyiv post,first ever time I've opened it...

Uncle Wally
18-02-2015, 10:05
They have to use a photo of rebels shooting rockets from inside Ukraine because they got nothing to back up their claims.

Judge
18-02-2015, 10:33
They have to use a photo of rebels shooting rockets from inside Ukraine because they got nothing to back up their claims.

The only weapons expert in the article said,


Stephen Johnson, a weapons expert at the Cranfield Forensic Institute, part of the Defence Academy of the United Kingdom, said that the application of crater analysis techniques to satellite imagery was “highly experimental and prone to inaccuracy”.

Uncle Wally
18-02-2015, 11:50
The only weapons expert in the article said,



Umm, right.

Judge
18-02-2015, 12:46
Umm, right.

yeah, cos the article is by the one who 'team' did the investigation,who is an armchair online video so called expert who tried to put this together, the evidence is flimsy at best.....

Uncle Wally
18-02-2015, 15:36
Talking with a friend of mine last night and they told me that two Ukrainian they know got letters to come back to Ukraine because you're in the army now. One is a woman the other a 52 year old guy. Talk about scraping the bottom of the barrel.

AstarD
18-02-2015, 15:39
Talking with a friend of mine last night and they told me that two Ukrainian they know got letters to come back to Ukraine because you're in the army now. One is a woman the other a 52 year old guy. Talk about scraping the bottom of the barrel.Prove it.

fenrir
18-02-2015, 16:26
Prove it.

Wally don't do proof.

FatAndy
18-02-2015, 17:56
Prove it.
Why? For example, if they're doctors, they definitely have military medical specialisation, therefore they're military reservists till pension time/retirement, and may be conscripted at any moment. It was so in USSR, it is so now in RF and Ukraine. Sex doesn't matter.

Other categories see in Parashenko's "laws" about conscription - 3-rd or 4th wave he has now...

Uncle Wally
18-02-2015, 21:08
Why? For example, if they're doctors, they definitely have military medical specialisation, therefore they're military reservists till pension time/retirement, and may be conscripted at any moment. It was so in USSR, it is so now in RF and Ukraine. Sex doesn't matter.

Other categories see in Parashenko's "laws" about conscription - 3-rd or 4th wave he has now...



The woman was in the medical field the guy was to fight in the east.

Uncle Wally
19-02-2015, 01:03
Ukraine now calling for UN peacekeeping. This is after they lose another city and hundreds of soldiers surrendered.

Alan65
19-02-2015, 01:38
kyiv post,first ever time I've opened it...

Try the Granuaid which is what is goes to

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/feb/17/russia-shelled-ukrainians-from-within-its-own-territory-says-study

Anyway, we are now at war, bring your best men to Europe and we will send them home in bags

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 11:32
http://top.rbc.ru/politics/20/02/2015/54e6e3289a7947219a82b3ef - 15th humanitarian convoy has arrived to DNR/LNR
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54e6c6849a79476f4c271ccd - Ukrainian border guards didn't appear to check the convoy. Insha alla.

http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20150220/1048715415.html - Dutch, German and Danish military experts have conducted 3rd observation/inspection mission in Rostov region. Unexpectedly for "reputable independent Western media" - no military activity found which should be declared to OSCE. It was third mission for the year 2015 (two earlier ones were conducted by Ukrainian and Turkish military experts), and the last one, as every country can be inspected up to 3 times per year.


we are now at war, bring your best men to Europe and we will send them home in bags
Unfortunately for the moment oldie Europe is able only to yell, to put so called sanctions and to pee into pants. Insha alla.

Ouch! British lords are anal-ysing:
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201415/ldselect/ldeucom/115/115.pdf

fenrir
20-02-2015, 11:50
Unfortunately for the moment oldie Europe is able only to yell, to put so called sanctions and to pee into pants. Insha alla.


So-called sanctions? Food prices here have fallen between 2%-15% (depending on the food category) while they have risen in Russia by 15%-40%. 1/3 of Russians fear they will either lose their jobs or have their hours cut within the next 3 months, FSB is cutting personnel by 10%, reserves are being burnt like firewood, etc. etc.

And about peeing in their pants, your officials are so frightened of being cut off from SWIFT that they have threatened war over it. That's being scared and pissing your pants. Ditto the West sending arms to Ukraine.

AstarD
20-02-2015, 11:57
Why? For example, if they're doctors, they definitely have military medical specialisation, therefore they're military reservists till pension time/retirement, and may be conscripted at any moment. It was so in USSR, it is so now in RF and Ukraine. Sex doesn't matter.

Other categories see in Parashenko's "laws" about conscription - 3-rd or 4th wave he has now...WillyWally doesn't accept anecdotal evidence from other posters, why should we accept his?

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 12:36
why should we accept his?
You live in the free country, nobody can force you ;)


And about peeing in their pants, your officials are so frightened of being cut off from SWIFT that they have threatened war over it.

No. Just the "reply w/o limitations". The rest is your fear(s), invented by you personally or so called reputable independent Western media (C) ;).


Ditto the West sending arms to Ukraine.
:D Do it, DNR/LNR soldiers like gifts.

Uncle Wally
20-02-2015, 13:05
So-called sanctions? Food prices here have fallen between 2%-15% (depending on the food category) while they have risen in Russia by 15%-40%. 1/3 of Russians fear they will either lose their jobs or have their hours cut within the next 3 months, FSB is cutting personnel by 10%, reserves are being burnt like firewood, etc. etc.

And about peeing in their pants, your officials are so frightened of being cut off from SWIFT that they have threatened war over it. That's being scared and pissing your pants. Ditto the West sending arms to Ukraine.



I think you got that assbackwards. It was Brussels that was afraid to cut off Russia because Russia could just set up their own system and that would hurt SWIFT too much. You and people like AstarD Armored and Lad are blind to reality.

Uncle Wally
20-02-2015, 13:14
I read that the illustrious armed forces of Estonia will parade troops a mere 300 meters from the Russian border on the 24th February in celebration of their fax independents. I bet that stupid act should scare Putin away from every even thinking about an attack.

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 13:23
Brave UkrowOrriors run from Debal'tsevo pocket:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9yniv0-sak

Nobbynumbnuts
20-02-2015, 13:25
Brave UkrowOrriors run from Debal'tsevo pocket:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9yniv0-sak

..my first reaction was that someone is injured

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 13:53
..my first reaction was that someone is injured
Yes, but in reality has just fallen

Nobbynumbnuts
20-02-2015, 14:01
Yes, but in reality has just fallen

..he looks quite badly injured to me..

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 14:06
..he looks quite badly injured to me..
Did you try to fall down from 1.6 m height onto asphalt at 50 km/h? Moreover, I'd think he jumps back forward...

Nobbynumbnuts
20-02-2015, 14:12
Did you try to fall down from 1.6 m height onto asphalt at 50 km/h?........

At my age? ;)

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 14:19
At my age? ;)
No, generally in the past in your life?

FatAndy
20-02-2015, 16:44
That's all nonsense and you know it. The proof is that your government has threatened war over SWIFT. That telegraphs VERY clearly how SCARED they are of being cut off. No one makes threats like that if they are not scared sh-tless.
Pls continue, I like it... ;)

SchokoPedro rocks:
http://top.rbc.ru/politics/20/02/2015/54e733469a7947a5e2563e24

FatAndy
24-02-2015, 10:18
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54ebf7889a794701a38ed4dc - 16th humanitarian convoy is on the way from Noginsk regional centre of MChS to Rostov region.

http://top.rbc.ru/politics/23/02/2015/54eb8ee79a7947f104ad8363 - DNR/LNR have announced pull-out of heavy armaments from the border line between them and UkrowOrriors, since today.

http://top.rbc.ru/politics/24/02/2015/54ec847e9a7947547c932e19 - Normand 4 have decided to extend OSCE presence in the border zone, +50...150 ppl




Some posts about terrible future of damned aggressive Russia were moved there: http://www.expat.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=650104

Judge
24-02-2015, 21:51
We have the Germans and the French trying their best to glue a ceasefire together and now the UK is ready to send "military advisers to Ukraine"
http://gu.com/p/464yv

Cameron trying to show some balls on the international stage, is there by any chance an election soon?:rolleyes:

Alan65
25-02-2015, 09:17
No North Sea Conyoys to help you, no Molotov Ribbentrop pact etc

THis time you are on your own

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31610026


Once again Britain saves Europe from fascism.

Benedikt
25-02-2015, 09:58
Once again Britain saves Europe from fascism.[/QUOTE]

area well away from the conflict zone to provide medical, logistics, intelligence and infantry skills.

so they don't get their knickers wet or brown, should they have to be in /under REAL fire.....

(the part was copied from the link in the first post)

TolkoRaz
25-02-2015, 10:34
It is clear that the UKR Army is lacking in training. VVP got it right when he said 2 days ago that tractor drivers and miners had successfully defended the Donbass from the Ukrainian Army and Air Force :book:

rumple_stilskin
25-02-2015, 11:13
No North Sea Conyoys to help you, no Molotov Ribbentrop pact etc

THis time you are on your own

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31610026


Once again Britain saves Europe from fascism.

So the guy that spearheaded the bombing of Libya now has his sights set on the Ukraine. And you are celebrating this?

In case you hadn't noticed, Britain is not saving anyone from fascism but is in fact spreading fascism.

If Ukraine is buying weapons from UAE when they have no money, and the UK is sending advisers they are planning to restart the war at some point.
I thought the Minsk agreement was foreigners out?

USA/UK are not accepting defeat of the pro-US&UK troops too well.
Just like Vietnam, where the main reason they continued the war was to "not lose"

fenrir
25-02-2015, 11:55
So the guy that spearheaded the bombing of Libya now has his sights set on the Ukraine. And you are celebrating this?

In case you hadn't noticed, Britain is not saving anyone from fascism but is in fact spreading fascism.

If Ukraine is buying weapons from UAE when they have no money, and the UK is sending advisers they are planning to restart the war at some point.
I thought the Minsk agreement was foreigners out?

USA/UK are not accepting defeat of the pro-US&UK troops too well.
Just like Vietnam, where the main reason they continued the war was to "not lose"

How can you restart a war that hasn't finished yet? Separatist/Russian troops took two villages/towns outside Mauripol yesterday and bombarded the city. The war is continuing.

FatAndy
25-02-2015, 12:34
No North Sea Conyoys to help you, no Molotov Ribbentrop pact etc

THis time you are on your own

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31610026


Once again Britain saves Europe from fascism.
Do you mean these noble guys will immediately go to the side of DNR/LNR? Good then.

If not, are they insured and their families will have a pension from HM... well, if something happens?

Alan65
25-02-2015, 12:36
Once again Britain saves Europe from fascism.

area well away from the conflict zone to provide medical, logistics, intelligence and infantry skills.

so they don't get their knickers wet or brown, should they have to be in /under REAL fire.....

(the part was copied from the link in the first post)[/QUOTE]

Hey Ben, the Poles will be up for it next, then the Americans, then probably the Baltic states, the Danes, the Swedish....perhaps even the Austrians, once one country stands up to an aggressor nation......they all stand up....perhaps even the French.

I think it is Russ that will shit her knickers....perhaps the Chinese will help you.

FatAndy
25-02-2015, 12:42
It is clear that the UKR Army is lacking in training. VVP got it right when he said 2 days ago that tractor drivers and miners had successfully defended the Donbass from the Ukrainian Army and Air Force :book:
Former tractor drivers and miners, comrade ;)


Hey Ben, the Poles will be up for it next, then the Americans, then probably the Baltic states, the Danes, the Swedish....perhaps even the Austrians, once one country stands up to an aggressor nation......they all stand up....perhaps even the French.
Always welcome to Donbass.

Mines are deep there, no famous problem "where we'll bury you all? ;)

rumple_stilskin
25-02-2015, 12:54
Hey Ben, the Poles will be up for it next, then the Americans, then probably the Baltic states, the Danes, the Swedish....perhaps even the Austrians, once one country stands up to an aggressor nation......they all stand up....perhaps even the French.

The warmongers always try the same line, to frame the issue as "standing up to aggression". "Have some guts and not show weakness"

The people that oppose the warmongers do so because the purpose of the wars are morally bankrupt not because they oppose war in itself. It's always about some trade purposes(make some dosh) and never about the officially stated reasons that give a fig leaf of cover.

The goals to fight fascism or stand up to aggression are worthy goals and worth fighting for, unfortunately our glorious western leaders have no interest in such ideals - despite the words spoken by them.

Our glorious western leaders are merely shameless, brainwashed, greedy banker puppets.

Alan65
25-02-2015, 14:52
Former tractor drivers and miners, comrade ;)


Always welcome to Donbass.

Mines are deep there, no famous problem "where we'll bury you all? ;)

FatAndy and Tolko......the battle lines have been drawn, put your faith in the Ruble rather than the Euro, Sterling or US Dollar.....put your money where your mouth is.

FatAndy
25-02-2015, 15:08
FatAndy and Tolko......the battle lines have been drawn, put your faith in the Ruble rather than the Euro, Sterling or US Dollar.....put your money where your mouth is.
Thanks for the (non-requested) advice, comrade. :verycool: When needed, I'll revoke your wisdom. :whisper: And pls don't forget to recommend those "instructors" who go to battle lines to take a huge reserve of pampers... "for real men". ;)

bydand
25-02-2015, 20:49
The warmongers always try the same line, to frame the issue as "standing up to aggression". "Have some guts and not show weakness"

The people that oppose the warmongers do so because the purpose of the wars are morally bankrupt not because they oppose war in itself. It's always about some trade purposes(make some dosh) and never about the officially stated reasons that give a fig leaf of cover.

The goals to fight fascism or stand up to aggression are worthy goals and worth fighting for, unfortunately our glorious western leaders have no interest in such ideals - despite the words spoken by them.

Our glorious western leaders are merely shameless, brainwashed, greedy banker puppets.

rumple_stilskin,

Apparently Russia planned to take eastern Ukraine well before Yanukovich was even gone. The plan is going well.

You probably don't consider the New York Times as reliable, but they base this article on one by Новая Газета (not MSM), and I'm not sure what you think of them. It's rather incriminating. I wouldn't be surprised if Tolko Raz knew of the plan, as he seems to know next stop is Mariupol.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/26/world/europe/russia-ukraine-crimea-annexation.html?_r=0

Kremlin Was Advised to Annex Crimea Even Before Ukrainian Government’s Fall, Russian Paper Says


«Представляется правильным инициировать присоединение восточных областей Украины к России»
http://www.novayagazeta.ru/politics/67389.html


Where's the dosh?
The Kremlin played into the hands of the west?
Woe is Russia

Alan65
25-02-2015, 22:46
Thanks for the (non-requested) advice, comrade. :verycool: When needed, I'll revoke your wisdom. :whisper: And pls don't forget to recommend those "instructors" who go to battle lines to take a huge reserve of pampers... "for real men". ;)

Andrey...as I said, you Tolko, Judge etc, put your money where your mouth is .....i,e in Rubles....its all going quiet now...apart from Ben, I can admire Ben, okay a fool but at least he puts his money where his mouth is .....just shows you the truth about Austrians .

rumple_stilskin
25-02-2015, 22:48
Andrey...as I said, you Tolko, Judge etc, put your money where your mouth is .....i,e in Rubles....its all going quiet now...apart from Ben, I can admire Ben, okay a fool but at least he puts his money where his mouth is .....just shows you the truth about Austrians .

I have transferred all my cash to rubles :)

TolkoRaz
25-02-2015, 22:52
Its going well in the UKR:

Activists will likely continue to rally in Kyiv demanding the resignation of the head of the National Bank of Ukraine (NBU) Valeria Gontareva (Valeriya Hontareva) over the accelerated depreciation of the hryvnia (UAH) against the US dollar (USD) and new foreign exchange restrictions.

Several hundred protesters, including activists of the extremist Right Sector movement marched through Kyiv under the banner of the "March of Truth - March of the Right." Protest leaders have vowed to continue their demonstrations as they pressure the government and President Petro Poroshenko to introduce martial law, legalize volunteer batallions in the southeast of the country, and boost the process of lustration.

Demonstrators are also protesting the perceived failure of government operations in Debaltseve, where hundreds of government troops were surrounded by separatist militants and captured.

rumple_stilskin
25-02-2015, 22:59
Its going well in the UKR:

Activists will likely continue to rally in Kyiv demanding the resignation of the head of the National Bank of Ukraine (NBU) Valeria Gontareva (Valeriya Hontareva) over the accelerated depreciation of the hryvnia (UAH) against the US dollar (USD) and new foreign exchange restrictions.

Several hundred protesters, including activists of the extremist Right Sector movement marched through Kyiv under the banner of the "March of Truth - March of the Right." Protest leaders have vowed to continue their demonstrations as they pressure the government and President Petro Poroshenko to introduce martial law, legalize volunteer batallions in the southeast of the country, and boost the process of lustration.

Demonstrators are also protesting the perceived failure of government operations in Debaltseve, where hundreds of government troops were surrounded by separatist militants and captured.


They have started rationing in Kiev.

Since hyper inflation has taken hold, people were buying long shelf life food as a store of value, so there is a limit of how much cooking oil, suger, buckwheat etc you can buy.

Things have gone to the dogs

Uncle Wally
25-02-2015, 23:04
They have started rationing in Kiev.

Since hyper inflation has taken hold, people were buying long shelf life food as a store of value, so there is a limit of how much cooking oil, suger, buckwheat etc you can buy.

Things have gone to the dogs


Banks can no longer sell dollars too. Their currency is completely trashed.

rumple_stilskin
25-02-2015, 23:13
rumple_stilskin,

Apparently Russia planned to take eastern Ukraine well before Yanukovich was even gone.

what rubbish. Better strategy to leave donbass within Ukraine, so that they influence the elections there and keep Ukraine out of NATO.

Judge
25-02-2015, 23:25
Andrey...as I said, you Tolko, Judge etc, put your money where your mouth is .....i,e in Rubles....its all going quiet now...apart from Ben, I can admire Ben, okay a fool but at least he puts his money where his mouth is .....just shows you the truth about Austrians .

What are you rabbiting on about now, if you need to know, I get paid in rubles and spend in rubles ,reason for this is, I live in Russia. What concern is it of yours?

Russian Lad
25-02-2015, 23:38
I have transferred all my cash to rubles

Wow.:) It is like saying "I am planning to jump off a cliff tomorrow!":) Well, you either don't have any substantial money or you are a bit intellectually challenged if you do.:)


What are you rabbiting on about now, if you need to know, I get paid in rubles and spend in rubles ,reason for this is, I live in Russia. What concern is it of yours?

See above. Also, he is not asking how much you are making, which, indeed, would be rude, and it is a pretty legitimate and general question to ask each other what currency is the best (and the worst or just plain bad) to keep our savings in.
Besides, even the Russian government have acknowledged that the Russian population have sold truckloads of rubles and bought hard currency recently. Evidently, their "patriotism" ends miserably right where their wallets begin...:shhhhhh::piano:

bydand
26-02-2015, 00:06
what rubbish. Better strategy to leave donbass within Ukraine, so that they influence the elections there and keep Ukraine out of NATO.

Why rubbish? Could you please explain?

"The document’s authors made a significant error in determining the territories most ready to unite with the Russian regions: they name Crimea and Kharkiv region, considering Donetsk region, “Akhmetov’s empire”, less promising. Reality has altered these calculations. But in general, the scheme was implemented."



It is clear that the UKR Army is lacking in training. VVP got it right when he said 2 days ago that tractor drivers and miners had successfully defended the Donbass from the Ukrainian Army and Air Force :book:


Donetsk is in Donbass region, no?

FatAndy
26-02-2015, 12:35
«Представляется правильным инициировать присоединение восточных областей Украины к России»
http://www.novayagazeta.ru/politics/67389.html

Quoting NG is nearly the same as quoting MK or Daily Mail. They're so called "voice of non-system poposition". With corresponding sound and smell. Congratulations with such sources.:farout:

Regarding the "document" - visit politic-oriented forums in RF or UA - hundreds of such sheets guaranteed.

Thanks for a good mood for the morning, bydand. ;)

bydand
26-02-2015, 12:57
Quoting NG is nearly the same as quoting MK or Daily Mail. They're so called "voice of non-system poposition". With corresponding sound and smell. Congratulations with such sources.:farout:

Thanks for a good mood for the morning, bydand. ;)

You're welcome FA.

NG staff still a good source for Stone Crusher blood jelly eh?

FatAndy
26-02-2015, 15:25
NG staff still a good source for Stone Crusher blood jelly eh?
Not so good for the reason mentioned above, but rich, yep. Almost non-exhaustive one. :)

Fantastika
03-03-2015, 06:48
http://www.fairbrothers.com/expatphotos/PorkyinTank.jpg

Looks like Porky got himself some NATO toys.

Fantastika
04-03-2015, 05:55
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytSQ9vgc4nA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytSQ9vgc4nA)

Alan65
04-03-2015, 18:24
Not so good for the reason mentioned above, but rich, yep. Almost non-exhaustive one. :)

There has been a lot dead in a coal mine in Donestk today RIP to those involved.

On the attached video at 34 seconds, there is an insignia on the womans arm that мчс днр

Wondering what that means Donestk National Republic ???

Edit after watching a few more times it Says Donetks Peoples Republic

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 09:25
RIP. 33 dead, 9 to find.
Coal miner is the dangerous profession. My uncle used to work in the savior/emergency team in Donbass in 196x. 1M tons of coal = one dead.

TolkoRaz
05-03-2015, 10:33
RIP. 33 dead, 9 to find.
Coal miner is the dangerous profession. My uncle used to work in the savior/emergency team in Donbass in 196x. 1M tons of coal = one dead.

Comrade, How much does 1 ton of coal cost? How cheap is life in such a business?

Fantastika
05-03-2015, 10:41
Comrade, How much does 1 ton of coal cost? How cheap is life in such a business?

And there's the "black lung" malady the miners get, that also cheapens their lives.

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 10:45
16 tons and what ya get? Another year older and deeper in debt.

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 11:38
Comrade, How much does 1 ton of coal cost? How cheap is life in such a business?
No ideas. In USSR 25-50 rub it was, in RF ca 5k rub a couple of years ago, according to entornets. So 5B rub per life.

fenrir
05-03-2015, 12:26
An interesting article.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/03/04/a-stalemate-ukraine-can-win-russia-war-donetsk-donbass/

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 12:38
An interesting article.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/03/04/a-stalemate-ukraine-can-win-russia-war-donetsk-donbass/



Excuse me if I laugh.


That article is just a sales pitch for sending weapons to Ukraine. Which will just get more Ukrainians killed.

fenrir
05-03-2015, 12:43
Excuse me if I laugh.


That article is just a sales pitch for sending weapons to Ukraine. Which will just get more Ukrainians killed.

And more Russians. That's the point. Russia can't maintain the conflict forever. Afghanistan and Vietnam showed even superpowers have their limits. With proper training and equipment, Ukraine can outlast Russia.

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 13:16
An interesting article.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/03/04/a-stalemate-ukraine-can-win-russia-war-donetsk-donbass/
Written by Ukronazist from US for brainwashed Western sixpacks. My condolences with such sources, fenrir. Even Stratfor looks better. ;)


And more Russians.
They fight againist Nazism, as their grandpas did.


Russia can't maintain the conflict forever.
:D It's the dream of those who maintain your govt. Russia isn't the side of conflict, it was told many times. But we helped and will help healthy forces of Ukrainian society ((C) is mine). ;)


With proper training and equipment, Ukraine can outlast Russia.
Training won't help (there is the good Russian proerb - не в коня корм), equipment will be either sold or stolen, then sold. :applause:

Russian Lad
05-03-2015, 13:18
It's the dream of those who maintain your govt. Russia isn't the side of conflict, it was told many times.

So, there is nothing to worry about then. No Russian soldiers will be killed or mutilated in this civil war in Ukraine.


Training won't help (there is the good Russian proerb - не в коня корм), equipment will be either sold or stolen, then sold.

So, you feel some acute nationalistic supremacy over Ukrainians? Aren't you a Ukrainian yourself, at least partially? Is your корм в коня?:) Sometimes I don't really understand what you are driving at.

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 13:25
So, you feel some acute nationalistic supremacy over Ukrainians?
No :)


Aren't you a Ukrainian yourself, at least partially?
I'm proletary internationalist. ;)


Is your корм в коня?:)
Yes.


Sometimes I don't really understand what you are driving at.
And I don't feel some acute supremacy over you too. Only condolences. :11088:

Russian Lad
05-03-2015, 13:31
And I don't feel some acute supremacy over you too. Only condolences.

Well, if you believe your worldview is so much better/significantly more correct than mine that you feel obliged to offer condolences, then it means you feel acute superiority over me.:) I can understand that (but kindly see my signature), what I didn't quite understand, is how you manage to feel you are way superior over Ukrainians, while you are a Ukrainian yourself.:)

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 13:31
Bayan, but a good one.
Parashenko comes to hairstyling salon. Stylist starts to cut his hair and continuosly asks him - what's about Donbass? When the war at Donbass will be stopped? What do you plan to do with Donbass?
- Why you're so interested in Donbass? - asks Parashenko, being irritated.
- No interest at all, just with the word your hair is bristling, easier to cut...

TolkoRaz
05-03-2015, 16:05
I see that the US of A are sending 300 soldiers to Lvov / Lviv! :book:

What sort of message does that send to VVP?

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 16:16
What sort of message does that send to VVP?
Are they well insured? :suspect: Lvov is far enough from Donb**** but everything can happen at the civil war...

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 18:01
And more Russians. That's the point. Russia can't maintain the conflict forever. Afghanistan and Vietnam showed even superpowers have their limits. With proper training and equipment, Ukraine can outlast Russia.



Russia won't have too. Kiev could be taken in days. There are no caves to hide in.

Fantastika
05-03-2015, 18:34
US-NATO-EU is losing the moral high ground, as journalists leave their Kiev hotel rooms, venture into Donb**** and see the devastation.

Kiev doesn't have control over its own militias:

http://www.vox.com/2015/2/20/8072643/ukraine-volunteer-battalion-danger

Amnesty International is even looking into possible beheadings and other war crimes by Aidar Battalion and others:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/kiev-regime-battalion-is-beheading-donbass-hostages-just-like-isis/5429135

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 18:56
There are no caves to hide in.
There are, but a few :)

bydand
05-03-2015, 19:24
There are, but a few :)(caves)

The coal mines will have to suffice.

FatAndy
05-03-2015, 19:45
The coal mines will have to suffice.
None of them in Kiev region... ;) But there are some caves of monks.


Kiev doesn't have control over its own militias:

It is not "militias", stop PC. Retaliatory batallions. Some of them are financed by Igor Kolomoisky, Ukrainian oligarch, who was assigned as Dnepropetrovsk region governor.

AstarD
05-03-2015, 19:51
It is not "militias", stop PC. Retaliatory batallions. Some of them are financed by Igor Kolomoisky, Ukrainian oligarch, who was assigned as Dnepropetrovsk region governor.Stop the Russian paranoid propaganda. It's not "militias" or "retaliatory batallions", it's the regular Ukraine army.

Russian Lad
05-03-2015, 20:06
Stop the Russian paranoid propaganda. It's not "militias" or "retaliatory batallions", it's the regular Ukraine army.


AstarD, to be fair, FatAndy is partly right, there is no need to oversimplify the subject, for the sake of objectivity. There are the national guard battalions - Dnepr, Donb**** Azov and so forth. They are not 100% the same as the Ukr regular army, but they belong to the general chain of command (though sometimes this chain of command is a bit sketchy, it seems - but on the whole they seem to be under Kiev's control, otherwise even the current shaky peace would not be possible, for instance). I would not call them "retaliatory" though - that's a propaganda part, I agree. Andy is our fat little naughty propagandist here (I am saying it in a joking way, Andy, hope you don't take offence).:) :10293:
As to war crimes and so forth, I think there have been instances of war crimes on both sides of the confrontation. Well, usually (always?), all sorts of sad and sick things happen in a war.

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 20:24
(caves)

The coal mines will have to suffice.



Too dangerous. Or haven't you heard?

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 20:38
I see that the US of A are sending 300 soldiers to Lvov / Lviv! :book:

What sort of message does that send to VVP?




Ooo ooo pick me �� I know this one!

fenrir
05-03-2015, 20:57
Russia won't have too. Kiev could be taken in days. There are no caves to hide in.

No, just thousands and thousands of buildings. Don't you know anything about urban combat? Storming a major urban center is the last thing any army wants to do because it is extremely bloody for both sides.

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 21:11
No, just thousands and thousands of buildings. Don't you know anything about urban combat? Storming a major urban center is the last thing any army wants to do because it is extremely bloody for both sides.



All you have to do is cut off their supply of weapons which would be much easier than in Afghanistan. You assume that the whole of Ukraine will be against Russia and that would be a grave mistake, one America has already made in Ukraine.

fenrir
05-03-2015, 22:05
All you have to do is cut off their supply of weapons which would be much easier than in Afghanistan. You assume that the whole of Ukraine will be against Russia and that would be a grave mistake, one America has already made in Ukraine.

The further West Russia moves into Ukraine, the higher the percentage of the population is Ukrainian and they don't want to be under the control of Moscow.

Cut off the weapons? Your answer makes no sense. How would that help Russian forces to take Kiev 'in days?'

TolkoRaz
05-03-2015, 22:26
Stop the Russian paranoid propaganda. It's not "militias" or "retaliatory batallions", it's the regular Ukraine army.

For your education AstarD: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31657354

Uncle Wally
05-03-2015, 22:54
The further West Russia moves into Ukraine, the higher the percentage of the population is Ukrainian and they don't want to be under the control of Moscow.

Cut off the weapons? Your answer makes no sense. How would that help Russian forces to take Kiev 'in days?'


Russia will take Kiev in days and after that there will be very little partisan trouble which plagued America in Vietnam or Russia in Afghanistan.


I beg to differ with you on the farther west they go. Guns are not common in Ukraine and I really don't think they will come out with rocks in hand. Most people if they don't like Russia will run for Poland.


My grandfather came from Kiev to America in 1915, he always said he was Russian.

fenrir
05-03-2015, 23:05
Russia will take Kiev in days and after that there will be very little partisan trouble which plagued America in Vietnam or Russia in Afghanistan.


I beg to differ with you on the farther west they go. Guns are not common in Ukraine and I really don't think they will come out with rocks in hand. Most people if they don't like Russia will run for Poland.


My grandfather came from Kiev to America in 1915, he always said he was Russian.

As usual, you really don't know what you are talking about. The usual shoot-from-the-hip nonsense. Ukraine is a major arms producer and that doesn't include the weapons that are coming in from the outside.

Are you kidding about the partisans? Is your knowledge of history THAT defective? Read up on the subject instead of embarrassing yourself.

TolkoRaz
05-03-2015, 23:12
Russia will take Kiev in days and after that there will be very little partisan trouble which plagued America in Vietnam or Russia in Afghanistan.
.

Not many choke points, tower blocks, basements or alleyways etc in Vietnam or Afghan! ;) Well, actually, there are lots of choke points in Afghan, but certainly not many urban centres to fight house by house.

Uncle Wally, even with the might and superiority of the RF's Armed Forces, Kyiv is not at risk from conventional attack. That would be a step too far for VVP and would probably ignite War in Europe.

Activity will commence again at some stage in the South-East, Mariupol and up to the Eastern bank of the Dnepr will be the limit of offensive operations.

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 00:02
Mariupol and up to the Eastern bank of the Dnepr will be the limit of offensive operations.

Make up your mind - just some days ago you were very worried about the situation in Russia, now you want to go all the way to Dnepr.:) How much would the ruble cost in such a scenario, after the disconnection from SWIFT and other imminent sanctions?
You know what made me laugh today? Watching Medvedev scold his subordinates for not paying stipends to students at dozens of institutes and universities. In most of them the stipend is 1300-2500 rubles per month. It didn't sound like a superpower which is going to have its borders on Dnepr anytime soon.:)

TolkoRaz
06-03-2015, 00:22
Make up your mind - just some days ago you were very worried about the situation in Russia, now you want to go all the way to Dnepr.:) How much would the ruble cost in such a scenario, after the disconnection from SWIFT and other imminent sanctions?
You know what made me laugh today? Watching Medvedev scold his subbordinates for not paying stipends to students at dozens of institutes and universities. In most of them the stipend is 1300-2500 rubles per month. It didn't sound like a superpower which is going to have its borders on Dnepr anytime soon.:)

I have always assessed that the East Bank of the Dnepr would be as far as Separatists (& VVP) might go - it is a natural, good defensive and demographic boundary. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen, but the Dnepr will not be crossed Westwards.

bydand
06-03-2015, 00:31
Make up your mind - just some days ago you were very worried about the situation in Russia, now you want to go all the way to Dnepr.:)

He just watched "I am Russian Occupant".:)

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 00:38
I have always assessed that the East Bank of the Dnepr would be as far as Separatists (& VVP) might go - it is a natural, good defensive and demographic boundary. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen, but the Dnepr will not be crossed Westwards.

I understand that it was the initial plan for the blitzkrieg, but, as we have seen, there is the traditionally unforeseen inconvenience, widely spread under such circumstances if we take a cursory look at history books - the buggers are resisting the onslaught.:) In this civil war of course, let's not upset FatAndy. They haven't even taken most of the Lugansk region and quite a huge chunk of the Donetsk region, if you look at the map, so even calling those hmmm... republics LNR and DNR is a rape of the common sense and logic.

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 10:29
He just watched "I am Russian Occupant".:)
Just? It's bayan already, but good and correct one.


I understand that it was the initial plan for the blitzkrieg, but, as we have seen, there is the traditionally unforeseen inconvenience, widely spread under such circumstances if we take a cursory look at history books - the buggers are resisting the onslaught.:) In this civil war of course, let's not upset FatAndy. They haven't even taken most of the Lugansk region and quite a huge chunk of the Donetsk region, if you look at the map, so even calling those hmmm... republics LNR and DNR is a rape of the common sense and logic.
Your common sense, comrade. And your logic. ;) As "armchair general".


It didn't sound like a superpower which is going to have its borders on Dnepr anytime soon.:)
Will see :)

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 10:56
Your common sense, comrade. And your logic. As "armchair general".

You claim this map is wrong? If it is wrong, care to explain why and show us the correct map? I have to go by what is available in the news channels. It seems to be an official map though as of February 19, 2015. Kindly tell us if it is wrong and why (note the borders of the Donetsk and the Lugansk region, in yellow and blue respectively):

TolkoRaz
06-03-2015, 11:15
Courtesy of STRATFOR:

The US & Russia: Exercises & Venom

Three hundred U.S. paratroopers could soon be arriving in Lviv, western Ukraine, for training exercises with the Ukrainian army. The arrival of the troops, which was signaled several weeks ago and alluded to as recently as Monday by the commander of the U.S. 173rd Airborne Brigade — the unit that would supply the troops — would represent a significant event in the Ukraine crisis. No matter how few or what their mission, these are U.S. combat forces. The United States would at that point have taken the step of openly deploying combat forces in Ukraine, something that had not happened in some time, taking the U.S. relationship with Ukraine to a new level. It signals to the Russians that Ukraine, however informally, is now in a special relationship with the United States. At the same time, military exercises are taking place in the Black Sea involving a U.S. warship and cruiser and Romanian, Bulgarian and Turkish assets. It is a fairly routine exercise, but under these circumstances, what had been routine now takes on special meaning.

Russian forces are conducting exercises as well in southern Russia and the North Caucasus, including Armenia, Abkhazia and South Ossetia. As significant, the exercises extend to Crimea. They focus on air defense. Significantly, both NATO and the Russians are conducting exercises around the Baltics.

Armies exercise all the time, but context is everything. Before the Russo-Georgian war of 2008, the United States was exercising with Georgian forces while the Russians were conducting exercises just north of Georgia. The Americans went home when the exercise ended. The Russians stayed put: The exercise was the preface for the Russian move into Georgia. Similarly, what has been routine before now is not necessarily routine right now.

The United States has indicated it may introduce a small force into Ukraine. The Russians may easily view that as a preface to a larger force. According to Nikolai Patrushev, the head of the Russian Security Council: "The U.S. is funding political groups under the guise of promoting civil society, just as in the color revolutions in the former Soviet Union and the Arab world. At the same time, the U.S. is using the sanctions imposed over the conflict in Ukraine as a pretext to inflict economic pain and stoke discontent. It's clear that the White House has been counting on a sharp deterioration in Russians' standard of living, mass protests." Others in Russia are charging that the United States is trying to overthrow President Vladimir Putin, and some that the CIA murdered Russian opposition leader Boris Nemtsov to generate protests. Meanwhile, the assumption on the U.S. side is that Putin had Nemtsov murdered.

The atmosphere has become increasingly toxic. Under the circumstances, every military exercise must be taken seriously for its implications. U.S. exercises in Ukraine and the Black Sea can be viewed as the dress rehearsal for naval action and larger forces. On the American side, the emphasis on air defenses raises the possibility of a Russian move to the west. If the Russians were to attack Ukraine, and the Americans chose to resist, the primary means available would be air power designed to strike at armor concentrations. The Russian counter is not its own air force, which is limited, but rather its mobile and strategic surface-to-air missiles to deny aircraft access to the skies over the attackers. Therefore, of all the exercises to cause potential concern in the United States concerning Russian intentions, exercising this capability would raise the specter of a potential Russian invasion of Ukraine.

There is, of course, a certain hollowness to all this rhetoric and maneuvering. This is not 1980, with massive forces carefully trained and deployed on both sides. The United States is planning to send a battalion of paratroopers. That really isn't much. The Russian army is a shadow of the Soviet army, and its ability to move even with minimal resistance is limited.

At the same time, the rhetoric and the charges disproportionate to the forces available are still noteworthy. The head of the Russian Security Council has essentially accused the United States of trying to cripple the Russian Federation. The Americans are saying that the Russians have violated the territory of a sovereign state and must be repelled. And the death of Nemtsov has triggered charges against both the FSB and the CIA.

It is difficult to see how either side backs off its position; this has become an American-Russian confrontation. Both are increasingly locking themselves into a hostile posture. Neither is in a position to launch a war, but both are ultimately capable of waging one. We expected a new Cold War between the United States and Russia, but we are surprised at the speed and venom that is framing this confrontation. The force is not there to match the venom, but given the intensity, no one should be confident that the force will not be generated.

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 11:16
There is obvious schizophrenia in Ukrainian defensive ministry. They put вiйськовi пiдроздiли РФ to the map of (former?) territory of Ukraine, while their Generalstabfuehrer Muzhenko has claimed there are no of them. How comes? :)

tonytony
06-03-2015, 11:28
Stop the Russian paranoid propaganda. It's not "militias" or "retaliatory batallions", it's the regular Ukraine army.

For your education AstarD: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31657354



But surely that article you linked to says that it IS the regular Ukraine army - albeit supported by militia troops:-


This strategically important city is being defended not only by regular Ukrainian army troops but also by fighters who swear allegiance to the Azov Battalion.

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 11:31
while their Generalstabfuehrer Muzhenko has claimed there are no of them.

He literally said, when there were steps made in the direction of peace, "currently we are not fighting with the Russian regular army". The word "currently" opens up a lot of speculation opportunities. You are trying to play with words, Andy, that's all.
However, you didn't respond whether this map is correct or not (regarding the territories which are controlled by the sides). Why divert the attention to something else?:) Go ahead, deal with this question first.:)

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 11:55
No, it's Ukrainian side plays with words. Even Parashenko has appeared unable to give Russian foreign ministry copies of passports he shaked before EU. What says censor.net, comrade - has he bought leather shells at flea market in Kiev?

The map looks correct for the current moment... till the next command of Washingtonsky obkom. ;)

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 12:00
The map looks correct for the current moment...

So, then my assessment about the Donetsk and the Lugansk regions was correct as well.:) You seemed to have an issue with the statement, hence the map appeared.:)
As to who is really fighting there, well, you are entitled to your own view. Facts tell me your view is wrong. But you can continue believing in the unprecedented bravery and top-notch fighting skills of former miners and tractor drivers, I cannot really stop you from doing this, can I?:)

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 12:05
But surely that article you linked to says that it IS the regular Ukraine army - albeit supported by militia troops:-
Nobody says there is no regular army there. But in the most cases they don't show the passion to kill, characteristic for Ukronazists from retaliatory batallions.
That's why Parashenko and oligarchs prefer to supply retaliators with armaments, equipment, munition etc.


But you can continue believing in the unprecedented bravery and top-notch fighting skills of former miners and tractor drivers, I cannot really stop you from doing this, can I?:)
You can't, because it's true. And it's easy and pleasant to tell the truth. ;)

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 12:06
And it's easy and pleasant to tell the

lies.:) I believe the near future will show us who was right all along. We will not have to wait for long.

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 12:08
lies.:) I believe the near future will show us who was right all along. We will not have to wait for long.
Sure. :)

FatAndy
06-03-2015, 15:57
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/defence-secretary-announces-further-uk-support-to-ukrainian-armed-forces - it seems to me DNR/LNR will get some funny toys soon to "improve situational awareness on the ground". ...

Who wants, also browse ebay time to time ;)

TolkoRaz
06-03-2015, 16:04
Who wants, also browse ebay time to time ;)

:D

Russian Lad
06-03-2015, 16:12
it seems to me DNR/LNR will get some funny toys soon to "improve situational awareness on the ground". ...

Why do they need those toys? They have excellent Voentorg shops in Donetsk.

Fantastika
06-03-2015, 17:22
There is not much of a "regular" Ukraine army. Kiev does not control its own militias:

http://www.vox.com/2015/2/20/8072643/ukraine-volunteer-battalion-danger

http://www.globalresearch.ca/kiev-regime-battalion-is-beheading-donbass-hostages-just-like-isis/5429135

Dudayev Battalion, a fighting force of radical Islamists, uses ISIS tactics in Ukraine:

http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2015/03/05/isis-in-ukraine/

What's it like to hate your country so much you support terrorists and barbarians?

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 10:19
So, then my assessment about the Donetsk and the Lugansk regions was correct as well.:) You seemed to have an issue with the statement, hence the map appeared.:)
As to who is really fighting there, well, you are entitled to your own view. Facts tell me your view is wrong. But you can continue believing in the unprecedented bravery and top-notch fighting skills of former miners and tractor drivers, I cannot really stop you from doing this, can I?:)



You don't know what the "facts" are. There is no way you could. A fact to you is anything the US or Ukrainian government says. That's not facts.

fenrir
07-03-2015, 11:41
You don't know what the "facts" are. There is no way you could. A fact to you is anything the US or Ukrainian government says. That's not facts.

The EXACT thing applies to you. You swallow the Kremlin line blindly and absolutely.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 11:51
A fact to you is anything the US or Ukrainian government says. That's not facts.

Why, I take nothing for granted. I do see some mistakes the Ukrainian government is making. Some are rather serious. For instance:
1) If I was the Ukr president, I would surely make Russian the second state language, a very long time ago. Just because all citizens know it and speak it. It is the BIGGEST mistake that they haven't done it. If you look at history, for instance, the GB and the US have the same language, but it didn't stop the US from fighting for independence. So, if the Ukr government passed such a law, it would only strengthen their position. They have to separate the history and the language. And proclaim it officially. Not doing this was stupid. There are many Russian language speakers (for whom Russian is their language #1) who are fighting in Donb**** even their minister of internal affairs, Avakov, speaks Russian instead of Ukrainian - it would be VERY logical to make Russian their second state language.
2) The second mistake, at least under Yuschenko, was making Bandera a national hero. This was repealed afterwards, but now there is some glorification going on. I find this mistake much less serious than the first one though, just because most Ukrainians don't care about this and the radical parties have a very small support there.

As to the US, I find their approach to this crisis in Ukraine surprisingly balanced. A rare case I cannot criticize them for anything. I was expecting something stupid on their part, like a full-fledged military support of Ukraine from the very beginning of this mess, I am glad they have had wisdom to abstain from it.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 12:18
Now it is Wally's turn to criticize the Kremlin, lol.:) Wally, the ball is on your side of the field. Care playing or you are willing to admit defeat?:)

:shhhhhh::piano:

FatAndy
07-03-2015, 14:02
and the radical parties have a very small support there
8))) 29 deputies in Rada. (22 radical party + 6 from Tyagnibok + 1 pravosek). Of 447 totally.
~6.5%

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 14:05
8))) 29 deputies in Rada. (22 radical party + 6 from Tyagnibok + 1 pravosek). Of 447 totally.
~6.5%

So, it is very little. Our Zhirik, who thinks burning Kiev with napalm is a good idea, has about the same support or even more. That's why I said it is a minor mistake, because of these two reasons.

FatAndy
07-03-2015, 14:15
So, it is very little. Our Zhirik, who thinks burning Kiev with napalm is a good idea, has about the same support or even more. That's why I said it is a minor mistake, because of these two reasons.
The question is not qty but organisation and discipline. If you have a time, try to analyse how they were voting.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 14:37
The question is not qty but organisation and discipline. If you have a time, try to analyse how they were voting.

Andy, your belief that there is fascism in Ukraine is a bit naive and childish. Nationalists were used, maybe. But just as Russia's nationalists were used in Donbass. I didn't see those 500K Ukrainians zigheiling en masse on Maidan - I saw them mostly with Ukrainian and the EU flags. Even the mainstream Russian TV channels have been predominantly silent regarding fascism in Ukraine recently - even they have realized this story line is ridiculous and hardly plausible (they have found new, more subtle ways to fool the audience though). This fascism line was used here in Russia mainly to attract Russian nationalists there - volunteers - allegedly to fight Ukrainian fascists. They were used, that's all - in the war in Donbass (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyK8u8zHszc). I am not saying there are no fascists in Ukraine - but it doesn't seem to be the country's predominant ideology.
This region is used/will be used as a leverage against the whole Ukraine, at least for some time.
Other than that, ultra-nationalistic groups seem to exist both in Russia and in Ukraine. And in all countries of the world.

FatAndy
07-03-2015, 18:32
:emote_popcorn:

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 21:31
The EXACT thing applies to you. You swallow the Kremlin line blindly and absolutely.



I don't listen to the Kremlin! I only read what Americans are saying but I can read between the lines. It's you who want to swallow dick because you're too afraid to sacrifice comfort for what is good for humanity. You would sell your brother for a little piece of the pie. Unlike you I have the balls to stand up for myself and I have suffered for what I believe in. Your just sit back and let terror reign because now it's easier for you. You're a f@cking coward! Willing to join fascist so you can at least get some crumbs. Fu#king man up and take control of your life you f@cking follower. Sitting there cheering on the hateful you think you're someone. You're nothing but a wimp hiding hoping to satisfy one of your warped fantasies. You're a wuss.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 21:39
It's you who want to swallow dick because you're too afraid to sacrifice comfort for what is good for humanity.

Wally, I am not getting one thing - why are you not in Donbass trenches yet, obviously preferring the company of nubile, orgasm-rich women to the hard job of saving the humanity. Please elucidate us on this apparent lapse of logic (decency?) on your part.:)
And I find your rhetoric a bit harsh now.:) It must be one of those ruthless hangovers.

penka
07-03-2015, 21:47
Wally, I am not getting one thing - why are you not in Donbass trenches yet, obviously preferring the company of nubile, orgasm-rich women to the hard job of saving the humanity. Please elucidate us on this apparent lapse of logic (decency?) on your part.:)
And I find your rhetoric a bit harsh now.:) It must be one of those ruthless hangovers.

Are you that mysoginic?:) Dead sin, little boy! Mama approves?
Decency is not your strongest point:)

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 21:51
Are you that mysoginic? Dead sin, little boy! Mama approves?
Decency is not your strongest point

It is rude and impolite to interrupt two talking gentlemen, lady.:) I gotta teach you some manners.:)
But answering your question - why, I love women, but less than myself - it is true. Not as much as Wally does, but he is the champion, I don't even pretend I have his womanizing capacities (and maybe even skills!). However, I am not sure what made you ask what you asked - I do admire Wally's sexual achievements and bedtime prowess, he is the undisputed master here in everything p'ssy-related.

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 21:57
Wally, I am not getting one thing - why are you not in Donbass trenches yet, obviously preferring the company of nubile, orgasm-rich women to the hard job of saving the humanity. Please elucidate us on this apparent lapse of logic (decency?) on your part.:)
And I find your rhetoric a bit harsh now.:) It must be one of those ruthless hangovers.


Oh yes I forgot only you can be indecent. Right now I'll let the younger more healthy men take care of it but if I am needed I won't hesitate to give my life. Unlike you I joined the army when I was young and never backed down. Unlike you I put my heart on display in front of thousands and didn't worry about being judged or excepting my punishment, you want to fight? Come on, I am not afraid. I am not selfish and I wish good and justice for all. You bend over for a buck.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 22:06
Oh yes I forgot only you can be indecent. Right now I'll let the younger more healthy men take care of it but if I am needed I won't hesitate to give my life. Unlike you I joined the army when I was young and never backed down. Unlike you I put my heart on display in front of thousands and didn't worry about being judged or excepting my punishment, you want to fight? Come on, I am not afraid. I am not selfish and I wish good and justice for all. You bend over for a buck.

Fight? No, I don't want to fight.:) I want you to make history and save humankind! And to overcome the hangover too.:)

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 22:10
It is rude and impolite to interrupt two talking gentlemen, lady.:) I gotta teach you some manners.:)
But answering your question - why, I love women, but less than myself - it is true. Not as much as Wally does, but he is the champion, I don't even pretend I have his womanizing capacities (and maybe even skills!). However, I am not sure what made you ask what you asked - I do admire Wally's sexual achievements and bedtime prowess, he is the undisputed master here in everything p'ssy-related.


Who do you think you are? You have no manners, you're going to teach her? She's got more class than you'll ever have. You're just angry because the only sex you can get has to be paid for and you're so greedy it pains you, so you have to put women down to feel good about yourself.

fenrir
07-03-2015, 22:10
I don't listen to the Kremlin! I only read what Americans are saying but I can read between the lines. It's you who want to swallow dick because you're too afraid to sacrifice comfort for what is good for humanity. You would sell your brother for a little piece of the pie. Unlike you I have the balls to stand up for myself and I have suffered for what I believe in. Your just sit back and let terror reign because now it's easier for you. You're a f@cking coward! Willing to join fascist so you can at least get some crumbs. Fu#king man up and take control of your life you f@cking follower. Sitting there cheering on the hateful you think you're someone. You're nothing but a wimp hiding hoping to satisfy one of your warped fantasies. You're a wuss.

I'm responsible for the terror in the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine? It is YOU who support the terrorists there. Btw, you don't even know what fascists are. Look up the definition of the word fascist and you will see that Putin fits the definition better than any other leader in Europe.

Regarding cowardice, until you go and fight in Eastern Ukraine, you have no standing to call anyone that. Put your a-s where your mouth is and stop playing the 'hero in your own mind' game.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 22:16
because the only sex you can get has to be paid for

Only if you say so.:)

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 22:20
I'm responsible for the terror in the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine? It is YOU who support the terrorists there. Btw, you don't even know what fascists are. Look up the definition of the word fascist and you will see that Putin fits the definition better than any other leader in Europe.

Regarding cowardice, until you go and fight in Eastern Ukraine, you have no standing to call anyone that. Put your a-s where your mouth is and stop playing the 'hero in your own mind' game.



There is no terror in Crimea because Putin made sure there wouldn't be. I put my life on the line when I joined the army. Have you? I don't think so. I was and am willing to stand up for what is right.

Like you understand who fascists are. Check out corporate America and get back to me.

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 22:22
Fight? No, I don't want to fight.:) I want you to make history and save humankind! And to overcome the hangover too.:)



Yeah just what I thought girly man. Happy girly mans day to you.

TolkoRaz
07-03-2015, 22:33
Yeah just what I thought girly man. Happy girly mans day to you.

Uncle Wally, the way you are going, I am surprised you have not wished RusskiLad: С ВОСЬМЫМ МАРТА! ;)

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 22:35
Uncle Wally, the way you are going, I am surprised you have not wished RusskiLad: С ВОСЬМЫМ МАРТА! ;)



I wanted to but I didn't want to insult women.

fenrir
07-03-2015, 22:38
There is no terror in Crimea because Putin made sure there wouldn't be. I put my life on the line when I joined the army. Have you? I don't think so. I was and am willing to stand up for what is right.

Like you understand who fascists are. Check out corporate America and get back to me.

Sure there is: against the local Ukrainians and Tatars. Your denial is further evidence of your towing the Kremlin line.

About military and other types of service: You know nothing about me and my past. That's because I don't mouth off about things to try and impress people like you do. Frankly, most of your stories are less than believable. Your tooth, for example. It is far more probable that you lost it falling over in a drunken stupor than that B-movie fight scene you described.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 23:00
Yeah just what I thought girly man. Happy girly mans day to you.

My idea of fun doesn't include fighting senile, uneducated foreign alcoholics, I do hope for your kind understanding.:) Besides, you have been issuing real life threats here, as I understand it is prohibited? For the record of FatAndy: he started the name-calling, I suspect it is a hangover. Are you still a moderator or what?:)

fenrir
07-03-2015, 23:01
Ooops. Lots to look at here, including the Crimea.

http://www.hrw.org/europecentral-asia/russia

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 23:05
Sure there is: against the local Ukrainians and Tatars. Your denial is further evidence of your towing the Kremlin line.

About military and other types of service: You know nothing about me and my past. That's because I don't mouth off about things to try and impress people like you do. Frankly, most of your stories are less than believable. Your tooth, for example. It is far more probable that you lost it falling over in a drunken stupor than that B-movie fight scene you described.



No you don't talk because you can't back it up.

TolkoRaz
07-03-2015, 23:07
There is no terror in Crimea because Putin made sure there wouldn't be

Plenty of terror in Kharkiv, Kyiv and elsewhere that is not under RF or separatist control! :10310:

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 23:11
My idea of fun doesn't include fighting senile, uneducated foreign alcoholics, I do hope for your kind understanding.:) Besides, you have been issuing real life threats here, as I understand it is prohibited? For the record of FatAndy: he started the name-calling, I suspect it is a hangover. Are you still a moderator or what?:)



Whiny drama queen. I just called you a girly man and you get all frightened. What do you think calling me names all the time is? Maybe if you didn't have to resort to insults people wouldn't insult you. But you're too educated to think of that.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 23:12
I just called you a girly man and you get all frightened. What do you think calling me names all the time is?

I didn't mean so much me as Fenrir. A quote for FatAndy, so that we don't forget:


It's you who want to swallow dick because you're too afraid to sacrifice comfort for what is good for humanity. You would sell your brother for a little piece of the pie. Unlike you I have the balls to stand up for myself and I have suffered for what I believe in. Your just sit back and let terror reign because now it's easier for you. You're a f@cking coward! Willing to join fascist so you can at least get some crumbs. Fu#king man up and take control of your life you f@cking follower. Sitting there cheering on the hateful you think you're someone. You're nothing but a wimp hiding hoping to satisfy one of your warped fantasies. You're a wuss.

I have kindly highlighted the offensive words and phrases in bold.:) See, Wally, we are trying to have a meaningful, intellectual debate here, but you sort of get in the way and begin using the street language to offend other posters. I think the time is ripe for you to adjourn back to the street you emerged from, but it is up to our esteemed moderators here, of course. On one hand, they share your warped views, but on the other hand - there are their own procedures they should follow.:) Up to them.:) I think you have gone a bit far today.

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 23:18
I didn't mean so much me as Fenrir. A quote for FatAndy, so that we don't forget:



I have kindly highlighted the offensive words and phrases in bold.:)



So why are you talking about fighting? Nobody asked you.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 23:23
Post #161, Wally, Page 11:

you want to fight? Come on, I am not afraid.

fenrir
07-03-2015, 23:34
No you don't talk because you can't back it up.

No, you have it all wrong. People who blab off about their 'past' on open media are either trying to impress others (the majority) or are being exceptionally unprofessional.

What backing up of your BS stories have you provided? You keep flapping your jaws but all there is is hot air. Heck, even FA and Tolko tolerate you because you are a useful ***** nothing else.

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 23:40
Indeed, I do remember MrZuzzo boasting, for instance, but he was kind enough to support his claims with pictures of himself and with articles about his achievements.:) I sort of miss him here, hope he is doing ok. It would be interesting to hear his opinion about this year's developments. He used to be such a fan of today's Russia, but then he got disillusioned.:)

Carl
07-03-2015, 23:41
Rent must be due.. Willy postin' up a storm!:11033:

Uncle Wally
07-03-2015, 23:44
No, you have it all wrong. People who blab off about their 'past' on open media are either trying to impress others (the majority) or are being exceptionally unprofessional.

What backing up of your BS stories have you provided? You keep flapping your jaws but all there is is hot air. Heck, even FA and Tolko tolerate you because you are a useful ***** nothing else.



Unlike you I have posted a lot about me. Where I came from, where I've been. I have posted my photos of me and my father, videos of mine and where I will perform. I'll be on the first channel in a few weeks to talk about me and why I don't like America. You have posted nothing about yourself. Unlike you people here have met me and want to meet me.

TolkoRaz
07-03-2015, 23:44
Indeed, I do remember MrZuzzo boasting, for instance, but he was kind enough to support his claims with pictures of himself and with articles about his achievements.:) I sort of miss him here, hope he is doing ok. It would be interesting to hear his opinion about this year's developments. He used to be such a fan of today's Russia, but then he got disillusioned.:)

Mr Z is happily married and having a 'blast'! :tv:

Carl
07-03-2015, 23:45
Heck, even FA and Tolko tolerate you because you are a useful ***** nothing else.

You could of also used "useful tool"...:rofl:

Russian Lad
07-03-2015, 23:49
I'll be on the first channel in a few weeks to talk about me and why I don't like America.

So, you have secretly followed my advice and applied?:) Where is my cut?:) Wally an American dissident. #2 after Snowden in Mother Russia!
- Hello, dear viewers, this is Wally, he hates America. Wally, do you hate America?
- You f'cking bet, blah-blah-blah
- See, dear viewers, all Americans hate America, even the ones who live in Russia. Our next topic: why the North Korea is attractive for tourists - much more than Italy. In-depth analysis and an interview with Pung-Chung-Sung, a local journalist who also hates America. America is evil. Thank you for watching.

Carl
07-03-2015, 23:49
Unlike you people here have met me and want to meet me.

Who is it that wants to meet you Willy?

fenrir
07-03-2015, 23:54
Unlike you I have posted a lot about me. Where I came from, where I've been. I have posted my photos of me and my father, videos of mine and where I will perform. I'll be on the first channel in a few weeks to talk about me and why I don't like America. You have posted nothing about yourself. Unlike you people here have met me and want to meet me.

You are just after your 15 minutes of fame. Real men don't feel a need to brag or show off. It's always the insecure ones who do. Ask any psychologist. Btw, where are your videos of your military service, your so-called fight and your preparations to be the new Rambo in Eastern Ukraine?

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 00:00
Who is it that wants to meet you Willy?



Your sister Carl.

Judge
08-03-2015, 00:01
I didn't mean so much me as Fenrir. A quote for FatAndy, so that we don't forget:



I have kindly highlighted the offensive words and phrases in bold.:) See, Wally, we are trying to have a meaningful, intellectual debate here, but you sort of get in the way and begin using the street language to offend other posters. I think the time is ripe for you to adjourn back to the street you emerged from, but it is up to our esteemed moderators here, of course. On one hand, they share your warped views, but on the other hand - there are their own procedures they should follow.:) Up to them.:) I think you have gone a bit far today.

You would make life easier for us if you reported the post instead of quoting it...
you never quote the name which allows us to go straight to the quoted post,it's harder to find.

Is it like gloves off cos it's Saturday night:boxing:

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 00:07
You are just after your 15 minutes of fame. Real men don't feel a need to brag or show off. It's always the insecure ones who do. Ask any psychologist. Btw, where are your videos of your military service, your so-called fight and your preparations to be the new Rambo in Eastern Ukraine?



You first pipsqueak, post your photo. Tell us where you're from and what you have done.

Carl
08-03-2015, 00:07
You are just after your 15 minutes of fame. Real men don't feel a need to brag or show off. It's always the insecure ones who do. Ask any psychologist. Btw, where are your videos of your military service, your so-called fight and your preparations to be the new Rambo in Eastern Ukraine?

Come on fenrir, don't you know who you're dealing with? A veritable Renaissance man is Willy! Let's see...he makes 6000 euro a day, has numerous #1 hits across the globe, can make a woman strip off her panties with one wink of his eye, hangs out with billionaires, fights like the devil, gonna be on Pervi channel soon, is a financial genius (it was just a mere year ago that he was more or less pan-handling. Look where he's at now!), one of the top drummers in the world, can party for days on end, f*ck for 24 hours straight, drink just about anyone under the table, and is a great humanitarian! (Did I forget anything?) You can only wish you were as cool as sir Willy! Bow Down!!

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 00:09
You would make life easier for us if you reported the post instead of quoting it...
you never quote the name which allows us to go straight to the quoted post,it's harder to find.

Post #157, page 11. I didn't report on it only because I was letting Fenrir do the honors.:)


Is it like gloves off cos it's Saturday night

I would say it is more like Wally is drunk again (or suffering from a hangover) and foul-mouthing other members again, as you can well see.


he makes 6000 euro a day

More like an hour. That's his fee for one song, and it takes him like an hour (or two hours max) to write a good hit.

Carl
08-03-2015, 00:12
Your sister Carl.

So, basically you make this Sh*t up..As I suspected. I don't have a sister!! :rofl:

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 00:13
Come on fenrir, don't you know who you're dealing with? A veritable Renaissance man is Willy! Let's see...he makes 6000 euro a day, has numerous #1 hits across the globe, can make a woman strip off her panties with one wink of his eye, hangs out with billionaires, fights like the devil, gonna be on Pervi channel soon, is a financial genius (it was just a mere year ago that he was more or less pan-handling. Look where he's at now!), one of the top drummers in the world, can party for days on end, f*ck for 24 hours straight, drink just about anyone under the table, and is a great humanitarian! (Did I forget anything?) You can only wish you were as cool as sir Willy! Bow Down!!



Close but you embellish it a little to much.

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 00:17
Post #157, page 11. I didn't report on it only I was letting Fenrir do the honors.:)



I would say it is more like Wally is drunk again (or suffering from a hangover) and foul-mouthing other members again, as you can well see.



More like an hour. That's his fee for one song, and it takes him like an hour (or two hours max) to write a good hit.



Foul mouth? What were you just saying to a lady? You forget how you write and insults you post. If someone post the slightest thing you cry but you can dish it out.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 00:27
Foul mouth? What were you just saying to a lady? You forget how you write and insults you post. If someone post the slightest thing you cry but you can dish it out.

I never insult, I only return insults (and it is only because I am forced to do it, since you keep insulting people and are never banned, just because the moderators here use you as a tool to muddy up the waters). I do resort to subtle innuendos (look this word up in a dictionary) on occasion.:)

Judge
08-03-2015, 00:50
Can we get back to the topic of Ukraine,

The cease fire seems to be holding,the pullback of heavy weapons from both sides seems to be complete.?

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 00:54
Can we get back to the topic of Ukraine,

The cease fire seems to be holding,the pullback of heavy weapons from both sides seems to be complete.?


Why such a sudden loss of interest to the topic "Wally"? You seemed to be interested just a few minutes ago.
Wally knows it all about Ukraine, ask him.:)


Wally has certainly earned an unlimited time ban just tonight. Not even in the "sin bin" yet.

What good are rules if they're not (or selectively) enforced.

Indeed. You are only encouraging him with your tacit moderator support, he is becoming more furious and malicious each day. I am learning some new curse words in English from him every now and then, but it is hardly a consolation.:rolleyes:

Judge
08-03-2015, 00:59
Wally has certainly earned an unlimited time ban just tonight. Not even in the "sin bin" yet.

What good are rules if they're not (or selectively) enforced.:eh:

getting called a "wuss" and a "wimp " isn't all that insulting, ok,can be edited out and pm or infraction given, but unlimited ban for a couple of soft insults, it's Saturday night,I guess a few drinks have been downed. ..

Judge
08-03-2015, 01:12
Why such a sudden loss of interest to the topic "Wally"? You seemed to be interested just a few minutes ago.
Wally knows it all about Ukraine, ask him.:)


No real interest at all, just pointing out to you that it's better to report a post than to quote it and comment on it......now if the op is to be deleted then lots of others too...like the last 20 or so post, which is a bit of a downer cos we wouldn't have learnt about Wally's up and coming TV appearance.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 01:17
No real interest at all, just pointing out to you that it's better to report a post than to quote it and comment on it...

I was reporting some of his posts before, to no avail. Continue to use him, I don't mind, in a sense. He is an excellent backdrop for my posts - those who are just reading without posting (the majority) will understand my views better this way. His sleezy watering hole language is a bit irritating on occasion, that's all. And, as I understand, it is against your rules. Again, I cannot really stop you guys if you feel violating them is a great idea. :rolleyes:

Now back to Ukraine.


The cease fire seems to be holding,the pullback of heavy weapons from both sides seems to be complete.?

I would give a 50% chance the hostilities are going resume in the spring. I hope not, but those former tractor drivers and miners may harbor entirely different views.

Judge
08-03-2015, 01:23
I was reporting some of his posts before, to no avail. Continue to use him, I don't mind, in a sense. He is an excellent backdrop for my posts - those who are just reading without posting (the majority) will understand my views better this way. His sleezy watering hole language is a bit irritating on occasion, that's all. And, as I understand, it is against your rules. Again, I cannot really stop you guys if you feel violating them is a great idea. :rolleyes:

I thought you said you had him on ignore...

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 01:26
I thought you said you had him on ignore...

I can still read him when I am not logged in and when he is quoted by others.

Judge
08-03-2015, 01:31
Now back to Ukraine.



I would give a 50% chance the hostilities will resume in the spring. I hope not, but the tractory drivers and the miners may fancy other ideas.


Both sides want the cease fire to hold, it's in their best interest.


I can still read him when I am not logged in and when he is quoted by others.

Never log out , click the option, keep me logged in..Can't help with a post being quoted, maybe there's a way around it,will check one day. .

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 08:17
getting called a "wuss" and a "wimp " isn't all that insulting, ok,can be edited out and pm or infraction given, but unlimited ban for a couple of soft insults, it's Saturday night,I guess a few drinks have been downed. ..



Not only Saturday night but Women's day to boot! You think I ain't gonna drink to that?

Hostilities will continue in Ukraine because America wants it. Three hundred US paratroopers just enter Ukraine to "train" Ukrainian troops. That's how it all starts isn't it? First economic sanctions, send in military advisors, false flag operation then full blown war.

fenrir
08-03-2015, 09:26
Not only Saturday night but Women's day to boot! You think I ain't gonna drink to that?

Hostilities will continue in Ukraine because America wants it. Three hundred US paratroopers just enter Ukraine to "train" Ukrainian troops. That's how it all starts isn't it? First economic sanctions, send in military advisors, false flag operation then full blown war.

Oh pooh, pooh. 300 US paratroopers who will be used as trainers, not combat troops vs. 12,000 Russian regulars and all their tanks and artillery helping the terrorists. Not a single American soldier has fired a single bullet in the last year in this conflict but the Russian forces have buckets of blood on their hands. And you claim to be a humanitarian.

bydand
08-03-2015, 09:53
Not only Saturday night but Women's day to boot! You think I ain't gonna drink to that?



I'm sure you will! Good time to put your obnoxious, off topic, trolling self into the Sin-Bin until you de-tox. Prevent you from dragging this forum to your level yet another day.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 10:47
until you de-tox

Does it ever happen? Most likely he posts only when under the influence of severe hangover, one cannot post a lot when dead drunk, I assume.:7525:

bydand
08-03-2015, 11:16
Does it ever happen? Most likely he posts only when under the influence of severe hangover, one cannot post a lot when dead drunk, I assume.:7525:

Well, after 300-500ml a day, it would take about three months to de-tox. Then Wally could perhaps finagle (swallow dick in Wally's terminology) his way back in, like Willy did to "become" Wally.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 11:21
like Willy did to "become" Wally.

Willy must have been drinking less, even he was less obnoxious (that was back in the times when the forum rules were observed and he was banned for insults). Wonder how the transformation happened. Maybe like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFLQS12z8K4

TolkoRaz
08-03-2015, 11:47
Trolling is defined as posting deliberately provocative content on the forum with the sole intention of causing maximum disruption and argument.


Are you sure it is Uncle Wally's sole intention to cause maximum disruption?

I do not think so - he is merely posting what he genuinely thinks and believes.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 12:03
he is merely posting what he genuinely thinks and believes.

Well, there are certain rules he has been repeatedly breaking. For instance, most of us don't fart in the presence of nice-looking (and even ugly) ladies, even if we genuinely want to fart and to relieve our burdened stomachs. We usually don't piss in public for the same stupid reason.

TolkoRaz
08-03-2015, 12:17
We usually don't piss in public for the same stupid reason.

Where are your manners, RL? ;)

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 12:42
Where are your manners, RL?

I used the word "usually" to include all possible scenarios for all the posters here.:)

TolkoRaz
08-03-2015, 12:43
Why the emphasis on maximum disruption?

I did not write the rules, but the key word as I read & understand the rules is maximum.

When it is perceived that anybody who reaches that 'maximum' threshold, I am sure that they will be disciplined accordingly.

As far as I view some of these posts and threads to which you refer, there is a small group of Users who feed off one another - it is very similar to Russian Bear Baiting.

As such, I do not see that Uncle Wally as the only person who is possibly bordering on causing 'maximum' disruption.

Where would the Forum be without lively posters such as Uncle Wally and others - If you do not like, or even disagree with what they type, then hit that 'Ignore' button! :11033:

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 13:08
When it is perceived that anybody who reaches that 'maximum' threshold, I am sure that they will be disciplined accordingly.

So, if I go around here telling other posters they are sucking d'ck and have sold their brother for a dollar because they are wimps and wuss, it will be ok for you, the maximum threshold will remain somewhere above that? What would be the maximum threshold then?
What you propose should be included in the Rules then: If a poster uses profanity when speaking to you, please kindly note that profanity is allowed on the forum, just use the Ignore button.

bydand
08-03-2015, 13:13
I did not write the rules, but the key word as I read & understand the rules is maximum.

The key word as I read and understand the rules is disruption.

When it is perceived that anybody who reaches that 'maximum' threshold, I am sure that they will be disciplined accordingly.

As far as I view some of these posts and threads to which you refer, there is a small group of Users who feed off one another - it is very similar to Russian
Bear Baiting.

Like you baited Astar with your question concerning her former husband or husband (which I finally managed to get deleted)?*

As such, I do not see that Uncle Wally as the only person who is possibly bordering on causing 'maximum' disruption.

Where would the Forum be without lively posters such as Uncle Wally and others - If you do not like, or even disagree with what they type, then hit that 'Ignore' button! :11033:

As RL noted "ignore" does not work on quoted posts. Anyway, I don't ignore anyone, but rather respond (as opposed to react).


*By the way, is that what you did to your ex-wife?

FatAndy
08-03-2015, 13:22
Comrades, please, closer to Ukraine and civil war. Or at least to terrorists so beloved by fenrir.

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 13:28
Oh pooh, pooh. 300 US paratroopers who will be used as trainers, not combat troops vs. 12,000 Russian regulars and all their tanks and artillery helping the terrorists. Not a single American soldier has fired a single bullet in the last year in this conflict but the Russian forces have buckets of blood on their hands. And you claim to be a humanitarian.



You have proof Russian troops have fired any shots? Wow 12,000 huh? Very hard to hide that many could you show some proof?

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 13:30
Does it ever happen? Most likely he posts only when under the influence of severe hangover, one cannot post a lot when dead drunk, I assume.:7525:



Nope not hungover at all! I never get dead drunk, that is only in your wild imagination.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 13:32
could you show some proof?

There are literally thousands of clips on youtube and in Internet in general regarding the subject. Thousands. One cannot make so many fakes. You have opted to be blind and deaf - it is your choice.


Nope not hungover at all! I never get dead drunk, that is only in you wild imagination.

You said your daily take is 500 grams of vodka - that's a whole bottle. What, no hangover after that? Come on, I used to drink heavily for many years. There is hangover after 500 grams. Of course it is less than after 1000 grams.
One of my former drinking buddies died 3 days ago. He never complained about his health, but used to drink regularly. He was found right beside his block of apartments - instant death, the heart problem. He was only 36. So, I would strongly suggest you quit the habit.

Carl
08-03-2015, 13:33
I think others have been reprimanded, put in the Sin-Bin, or banned, for the same or less.

Yes, but the others don't post for the "Man".. If this token ban lasts long, Willy's gonna be in deep doo doo..Unless of course they pay his rent and buy his vodka as well, which isn't intirely behind the rely of possibilities. I'm sure good ol' Willy will be back very soon. They'll just have a little talk with him, telling to continue with the party rhetoric but try to stay within the bounds of believability. Do you suppose the founding member "stepping back" and Willy's posting with impunity are a coincidence? I suspect we will see one of the more, umm Ruski, moderators here start to push his weigh around this site more then he already does. It's been a nice ride, but it looks like this forum has has been 'nationalized' to used as a propaganda tool for the powers that be... I'm actually a bit surprised it took this long tho.

TolkoRaz
08-03-2015, 13:35
Yes bydand, you are quite correct; she was deleted! :10310:

FatAndy
08-03-2015, 13:40
You have proof Russian troops have fired any shots? Wow 12,000 huh? Very hard to hide that many could you show some proof?
Fenrir reads and listens to Vicky and Phil. They know better, as they smoke the same weed, supplied to both DoS and Pentagon, it gives a very realistic pictures. Who is the supplier, i wanna try too ;)


Yes bydand, you are quite correct; she was deleted! :10310:
No, it would be non-humane. Everyone must continue to suffer. :)

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 13:41
They'll just have a little talk with him, telling to continue with the party rhetoric but try to stay within the bounds of believability. Do you suppose the founding member "stepping back" and Willy's posting with impunity are a coincidence? I suspect we will see one of the more, umm Ruski, moderators here start to push his weigh around this site more then he already does. It's been a nice ride, but it looks like this forum has has been 'nationalized' to used as a propaganda tool for the powers that be... I'm actually a bit surprised it took this long tho.

I agree, Carl. But it is quite symptomatic that they could find only Wally - an uneducated American with a serious drinking problem. Whatever the initial intentions were - he is only doing more damage to the "party line". I would fire him.:)

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 13:47
I did not write the rules, but the key word as I read & understand the rules is maximum.

When it is perceived that anybody who reaches that 'maximum' threshold, I am sure that they will be disciplined accordingly.

As far as I view some of these posts and threads to which you refer, there is a small group of Users who feed off one another - it is very similar to Russian Bear Baiting.

As such, I do not see that Uncle Wally as the only person who is possibly bordering on causing 'maximum' disruption.

Where would the Forum be without lively posters such as Uncle Wally and others - If you do not like, or even disagree with what they type, then hit that 'Ignore' button! :11033:



Yes you are very right. Some think it's ok to call people "crazy" a "loon" alcoholic and make snide comments just trying to bait others. RL and others are just trying to silence any voice that doesn't say something they like. I think too many people are rude here.

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 13:49
I agree, Carl. But it is quite symptomatic that they could find only Wally - an uneducated American with a serious drinking problem. Whatever the initial intentions were - he is only doing more damage to the "party line". I would fire him.:)



How do you know I have a "serious drinking problem"? Fact is you don't.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 13:54
How do you know I have a "serious drinking problem"? Fact is you don't.

True, we don't know it for sure. But I know for sure that you are uneducated (the content and the style/grammar of your posts tell me that) and that (most likely) you work as a drummer. Usually many of such people are heavy drinkers and/or even use drugs.

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 13:55
Anyways it seems that US general Breedlove has been lying about the situation in Ukraine and now Europeans are getting tired of it and think that America is doing more harm than good. Ignoring peace deals and pushing for more sanctions.

Carl
08-03-2015, 13:57
Yes, but the others don't post for the "Man".. If this token ban lasts long, Willy's gonna be in deep doo doo..Unless of course they pay his rent and buy his vodka as well, which isn't intirely behind the rely of possibilities. I'm sure good ol' Willy will be back very soon. They'll just have a little talk with him, telling to continue with the party rhetoric but try to stay within the bounds of believability. Do you suppose the founding member "stepping back" and Willy's posting with impunity are a coincidence? I suspect we will see one of the more, umm Ruski, moderators here start to push his weigh around this site more then he already does. It's been a nice ride, but it looks like this forum has has been 'nationalized' to used as a propaganda tool for the powers that be... I'm actually a bit surprised it took this long tho.

Oh sh*t! My bad, I thought the resedent pay per poster had revived a time out!! Seems I was incorrect! I should have known better..

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 14:06
Oh sh*t! My bad, I thought the resedent pay per poster had revived a time out!! Seems I was incorrect! I should have known better..

Yes, the bureau seems to continue as usual.:) Wonder how much he is paid per post. How much per post, Wally?:) Don't be shy, everyone here knows you would not be wasting your time here free of charge, with such a relentless intensity. Is it a pay-per-post remuneration or you receive the bounty in some other form?


Anyways it seems that US general Breedlove has been lying about the situation in Ukraine and now Europeans are getting tired of it and think that America is doing more harm than good. Ignoring peace deals and pushing for more sanctions.

How much for this post, for instance? 20 rubles? A bit more? A bit less? I would not pay a copeck.:)

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 14:06
True, we don't know it for sure. But I know for sure that you are uneducated (the content and the style/grammar of your posts tell me that) and that (most likely) you work as a drummer. Usually many of such people are heavy drinkers and/or even use drugs.



Sorry I did work as a drummer but now I'm retired and only write songs. I started drinking two years ago because of a girl I fell in love was alcoholic and after living with her for a few months found it easier to just drink with her. Before this I drank very little and preferred weed. I can drink everyday now but if I have something to do I don't, like when I write songs I won't drink. I can control myself because I was a professional musician and you don't go far if you don't have control because you are always around drinks and drugs and there is a time and a place for that. Tonight I will take my girlfriend out again ( last night I took her out for pizza) and there will be alcohol and fun!!!!

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 14:09
Yes, the bureau seems to continue as usual.:) Wonder how much he is paid per post. How much per post, Wally?:) Don't be shy, everyone here knows you would not be wasting your time here free of charge. Is it a pay-per-post remuneration or you receive the bounty in some other form?



I'm just bored sitting at home looking around the net but it's all for free. Unlike you I like Russia and have many many friends. Nobody needs to pay me for sticking up for my friends.

Russian Lad
08-03-2015, 14:11
like when I write songs I won't drink.

Calling posts on expatru here "songs" is a bit of an exaggeration, Wally, don't you think so?:) :rofl::D:question:


I'm just bored sitting at home looking around the net but it's all for free.

Ok.:)

Uncle Wally
08-03-2015, 14:15
There are literally thousands of clips on youtube and in Internet in general regarding the subject. Thousands. One cannot make so many fakes. You have opted to be blind and deaf - it is your choice.



You said your daily take is 500 grams of vodka - that's a whole bottle. What, no hangover after that? Come on, I used to drink heavily for many years. There is hangover after 500 grams. Of course it is less than after 1000 grams.
One of my former drinking buddies died 3 days ago. He never complained about his health, but used to drink regularly. He was found right beside his block of apartments - instant death, the heart problem. He was only 36. So, I would strongly suggest you quit the habit.



You see the difference is I'll start at 16:00 17:00 and finish at 23 or24:00 and I eat very well. It's not how much you drink but the level of alcohol in your blood.

bydand
09-03-2015, 22:07
Vladimir Putin has admitted for the first time that the plan to annex Crimea was ordered weeks before the referendum on self-determination.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31796226

Over 6000 dead since. To save Yanukovich? Glupast.

Uncle Wally
09-03-2015, 23:00
Vladimir Putin has admitted for the first time that the plan to annex Crimea was ordered weeks before the referendum on self-determination.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31796226

Over 6000 dead since. To save Yanukovich? Glupast.



No it wasn't to save Yankovich, he was saved before that was he? It was the way Ukrainians were acting and what their new illegal government was doing that made him realize he had to do something to help Russians living there.

bydand
09-03-2015, 23:08
No it wasn't to save Yankovich, he was saved before that was he? It was the way Ukrainians were acting and what their new illegal government was doing that made him realize he had to do something to help Russians living there.

From the link:
Speaking in a forthcoming Russian TV documentary, Mr Putin said a meeting with officials had been held on 22-23 February to plan the rescue of Ukraine's deposed president.

"I invited the leaders of our special services and the defence ministry to the Kremlin and set them the task of saving the life of the president of Ukraine, who would simply have been liquidated," he said.



Maybe you should read the link before commenting.

Uncle Wally
09-03-2015, 23:28
From the link:
Speaking in a forthcoming Russian TV documentary, Mr Putin said a meeting with officials had been held on 22-23 February to plan the rescue of Ukraine's deposed president.

"I invited the leaders of our special services and the defence ministry to the Kremlin and set them the task of saving the life of the president of Ukraine, who would simply have been liquidated," he said.



Maybe you should read the link before commenting.



I read that earlier today. If you remember that's the day the Olympics ended and Russia knew what was going to happen. It was at the end of that meeting that Putin said to look into taking Crimea.

Russian Lad
09-03-2015, 23:39
Maybe you should read the link before commenting.

I seriously doubt he reads anything but the titles, in many cases.:) Well, maybe a paragraph or two. Uneducated people have a very limited reading capacity - it he sets at it, it can take such a person like an hour to read a relatively small article. Wally has typing skills though, it is a rather encouraging fact, if we don't pay attention to his style and his grammar. And his content, for that matter.:)

bydand
10-03-2015, 00:00
It was the way Ukrainians were acting and what their new illegal government was doing that made him realize he had to do something to help Russians living there.

Most, if not all, the (now dead) Russians living there would still be alive without that "help".

Uncle Wally
10-03-2015, 00:08
Most, if not all, the (now dead) Russians living there would still be alive without that "help".



Like the ones in Odessa right?

bydand
10-03-2015, 00:14
Like the ones in Odessa right?

How many of them were Russians? Reason enough to get 6000 more people killed you think? Out of principle? Politicians don't care about people, or principles, though they pretend very well.

Uncle Wally
10-03-2015, 00:43
How many of them were Russians? Reason enough to get 6000 more people killed you think? Out of principle? Politicians don't care about people, or principles, though they pretend very well.



Ukraine didn't have to bomb the east! It was their choice and a bad choice at that. That 6000 figure includes mostly Ukrainian troops though some believe that Ukraine is drastically understating their troop losses. People in the east only protested like they did in Kiev. It was the idiots America put in charge that are mostly responsible for this war.

bydand
10-03-2015, 00:49
It was the idiots America put in charge that are mostly responsible for this war.

No, it was the idiot the Kremlin put in charge that started the mess.

27745

Uncle Wally
10-03-2015, 00:54
No, it was the idiot the Kremlin put in charge that started the mess.

27745



The Kremlin didn't put anyone in charge! The Ukrainian people voted and picked a president. Even the EU said the election was fair at the time. The people in Ukraine got tired of the thieves they have had for the last 25 years and it seems nothing has changed.

bydand
10-03-2015, 00:59
The Kremlin didn't put anyone in charge!

To your thinking.

Uncle Wally
10-03-2015, 01:02
To your thinking.



To the EU's thinking, what were they doing making a deal with Ukraine for if the president was under Putin's thumb? Think a little will ya?

Judge
10-03-2015, 01:03
Even the Germans are getting annoyed with the warmongers,



The Minsk cease-fire wasn't holding perfectly, but it was holding.

On that same day, General Philip Breedlove, the top NATO commander in Europe, stepped before the press in Washington. Putin, the 59-year-old said, had once again "upped the ante" in eastern Ukraine -- with "well over a thousand combat vehicles, Russian combat forces, some of their most sophisticated air defense, battalions of artillery" having been sent to the Donbass. "What is clear," Breedlove said, "is that right now, it is not getting better. It is getting worse every day."

German leaders in Berlin were stunned. They didn't understand what Breedlove was talking about. And it wasn't the first time. Once again, the German government, supported by intelligence gathered by the Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND), Germany's foreign intelligence agency, did not share the view of NATO's Supreme Allied Commander Europe (SACEUR).



http://m.spiegel.de/international/world/a-1022193.html#spRedirectedFrom=www&referrrer=https://www.google.ru/

bydand
10-03-2015, 01:13
To the EU's thinking, what were they doing making a deal with Ukraine for if the president was under Putin's thumb? Think a little will ya?

Yanukovich didn't take the deal because he was under Putin's thumb. 15 billion in promised aid. You should try thinking, more than just a little.