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FatAndy
24-10-2014, 18:11
http://www.interfax.ru/russia/403487

System administrator of extremist website of Imarat Kavkaz has got penalty of 90K rub and 4 years of imprisonment general regime colony.

Freedom of speech under a threat!!! :devilish:

Uncle Wally
24-10-2014, 18:29
Great another thread to expose US evil. Searching youtube as I write.

FatAndy
19-11-2014, 12:41
http://top.rbc.ru/society/19/11/2014/546c5974cbb20f6338b415e9 - the Victory of Democracy over the bloody rotten regime!!!

McD on Pushka is back!

Terminator-I'll be back - YouTube

FatAndy
24-11-2014, 13:32
Murmansk habitants, pls park your submarines in designated places only, otherwise evacuators do their job!

http://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10368259_10206183958337435_1794801986636076008_n.jpg?oh=c31129d573207faeed64b675017ef03a&oe=55123596&__gda__=1423192699_21fae788e9e3580f9f3baeb73fe32475

TolkoRaz
24-11-2014, 17:38
Just checked out of my hotel as Tony Bliar checked in - another former leader of a Western corrupt regime!

Had to relocate to Dubai to escape him! ;)

Russian Lad
24-11-2014, 18:06
Searching youtube as I write.

Sh;t. Nooooo, have mercy, not another music clip.

FatAndy
24-11-2014, 18:17
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54733660cbb20f0816f1710d - South Stream , sea bottom part, construction to start 15th Dec. :rasta:

FatAndy
24-11-2014, 18:18
another former leader of a Western corrupt regime!
Sic transit Gloria Mundi :)

Russian Lad
24-11-2014, 19:23
South Stream , sea bottom part, construction to start 15th Dec.

It is against the current EU sanctions policy. Frankly, they will be idiots if they allow this project to continue, it is quite clear what purpose it really serves.

FatAndy
24-11-2014, 21:55
It is against the current EU sanctions policy.
Nam po... erh... who cares about current puppet behaviour of EU? Do you remember Carbo and his thoughts about North Stream? :)


Frankly, they will be idiots
Maybe they will... or maybe not.


it is quite clear what purpose it really serves.
Building infrastructure for instant, uninterruptible supply and bypassing current dependence from maidowns/Ukronazis in transit. Quite clear, indeed. :idea:

Uncle Wally
24-11-2014, 22:10
It is against the current EU sanctions policy. Frankly, they will be idiots if they allow this project to continue, it is quite clear what purpose it really serves.




They're idiots if they don't!

France Just Agreed A Deadline To Deliver That Warship To Russia

French industrial group DCNS charged with delivering two
Mistral-class helicopter carriers to Russia has agreed a new deadline of November 27th to hand over the first ship, according to Russian media reports.

The deal, which is worth some 1.2 billion, appeared to run aground over Russia's part in the ongoing Ukraine crisis. However, independent Russian news service Interfax reports a military-diplomatic source as saying that a deal has now been struck for the Vladivostok to sail out of Saint-Nazaire shipyard and arrive at its new home of Kronstadt by Friday.



Read more: http://uk.businessinsider.com/the-french-company-responsible-for-delivering-the-mistral-warship-to-russia-has-agreed-a-final-deadline-2014-11#ixzz3K0yIYbcQ

Russian Lad
24-11-2014, 23:01
Well, if I was the EU I would absolutely try to minimize my dependence on the Russian gas and other energy-carriers supplies. Forever. And I would be trying very hard. It is clear as day that strategically (aka long term) he wants to restore the Soviet Union (in its borders, surely not ideologically), would not mind taking Serbia, and will use gas and other natural resources as economic weapons. In Europe, doubt many leaders are fooled at the moment. It should be nipped in the bud.
It plays well into the hands of the US energy companies, I have to admit, but Russia didn't leave Europe a choice. It has to defend its energy security and its borders. Most of them have zero trust in Russia now, and I don't blame them.

Armoured
24-11-2014, 23:20
I know you mean this as a joke thread, Andy, but I am hearing a lot of stories like this one - kids taking it out on other kids. I'm using a public one - but I've heard about a dozen similar stories.

http://www.echo.msk.ru/blog/aiderm/1443332-echo/


Но, видно, мы уже совсем чокнулись от ненависти, массово. И в наш сумасшедший ад ведем за собой детей.

Well done.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 08:49
I know you mean this as a joke thread, Andy, but I am hearing a lot of stories like this one - kids taking it out on other kids. I'm using a public one - but I've heard about a dozen similar stories.

http://www.echo.msk.ru/blog/aiderm/1443332-echo/



Well done.
Aider Muzhdabaev again? :)

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 10:17
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/547427eacbb20f3bf7724613 - "Alexander Nevsky" strategic submarine to perform the next test launch of Bulava missile around 28-30 Nov.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 11:12
Aider Muzhdabaev again? :)

What do you mean? Is there something questionable about his piece? Or him as an author or source

If what you meant is did I get my other info from him, no, these are personal stories I have heard from friends about incidents in their own kids' schools (all local). Roughly equally disturbing.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 11:44
What do you mean? Is there something questionable about his piece? Or him as an author or source

It's all about "agenda" (C) ;)


these are personal stories I have heard from friends
Have you heard smth alike personally? :rolleyes:

Armoured
25-11-2014, 11:54
It's all about "agenda" (C) ;)

Ah. And therefore the facts are questionable?


Have you heard smth alike personally? :rolleyes:

Yes. Directly from children. Telling me what happened at their school. Some understood exactly what was going on, others did not and just were telling me what happened.

No discernible agenda.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 12:36
Ah. And therefore the facts are questionable?
Facts - no, if they are facts, not agenda. Don't trust journalists, they lie cheap, it is usual state and modus vivendi.


Yes. Directly from children. Telling me what happened at their school. Some understood exactly what was going on, others did not and just were telling me what happened.
And what happened at their school? Who is responsible for that?

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 12:43
http://top.rbc.ru/politics/25/11/2014/547447a1cbb20f88f1e6c793 - the big press conference of Darkest Lord to take place 18th Dec.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 13:03
Facts - no, if they are facts, not agenda. Don't trust journalists, they lie cheap, it is usual state and modus vivendi.

And what happened at their school? Who is responsible for that?

Since I have some personal experience, I don't see any reason to doubt the factual side. And apart from what I've heard from kids, also from several parents.

What happened? Multiple cases of kids getting picked on for 'nationality', with language and terminology borrowing directly from the ongoing information war. (Note: all kids that grew up here with Russian as native language)

Some in presence of teachers, some not. Some even in cl**** most not.

Who's responsible? I don't know. Too easy to blame teachers or parents, in my view, although I'm not saying blameless.

Overall, just making the point that the nasty propaganda is filtering down to children - they absorb what's going on around them and repeat and even amplify it.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 13:38
just making the point that the nasty propaganda is filtering down to children - they absorb what's going on around them and repeat and even amplify it.
It was, it is, it will be. Nothing changed. :whisper: Put common sense into children - they'll continue you forth into future.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 13:42
It was, it is, it will be. Nothing changed. :whisper:

Sorry, that's a glib response that is absolutely not true. There was nothing like this two years ago.

It is a new development and a direct result of the very nasty propaganda.

And directly affecting kids.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 13:46
There was nothing like this two years ago.
There was something else. As I told you, everything in the world is propaganda.


It is a new development
...from your point of view - maybe.


It And directly affecting kids.
Maybe yes, although I didn't hear it en masse. See about common sense above.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 13:53
There was something else. As I told you, everything in the world is propaganda.

...from your point of view - maybe.

Maybe yes, although I didn't hear it en masse. See about common sense above.

See point repeated multiple times about people like you denying or ignoring evidence that contradicts the line they're pushing.

You have no disagreement with the journalist's facts - you just dismiss it because an 'agenda.'

Clearly you have the agenda.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 14:36
Clearly you have the agenda.
Sure. It is called common sense.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 14:46
Sure. It is called common sense.

I think if you get it direct from government or Rossiya Segodnya you're supposed to capitalize it.

You could call it the Common Sense Revolution.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 14:48
I think if you get it direct from government or Rossiya Segodnya you're supposed to capitalize it.
Is it a TV or radio program?


You could call it the Common Sense Revolution.
Would be good if Revolution, not Perevorot.

Suuryaa
25-11-2014, 14:53
Overall, just making the point that the nasty propaganda is filtering down to children - they absorb what's going on around them and repeat and even amplify it.

This is what happens if you watch TV. I think it's especially important to not have it at home if you have kids.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 14:57
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54744c46cbb20fd8728bcae6 - The Darkest Lord has signed the law with stricter administrative responsibility of RF political parties financing. It is forbidden for foreign states, international social organisations and NGOs-"foreign agents" plus RF legal entities with more than 30% of foreign capital.
20K to 1M rub penalties, depending on private person or legal entity violates the law.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 15:04
Is it a TV or radio program?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rossiya_Segodnya

[QUOTE=Suuryaa;1374799]This is what happens if you watch TV. I think it's especially important to not have it at home if you have kids.

Well, not my case. But it's a fact that people with kids do have TVs.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 15:10
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rossiya_Segodnya
Russia Today! OMG... I never heard the name in Russian, my bad. :11088:

Armoured
25-11-2014, 15:29
Russia Today! OMG... I never heard the name in Russian, my bad. :11088:

Actually it's a different entity - as I understand it, it's the 'holding' or group that includes the old RIA-Novosti and some other things, as well as RT.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 15:34
Actually it's a different entity - as I understand it, it's the 'holding' or group that includes the old RIA-Novosti and some other things, as well as RT.
Let it be, anyway I don't watch usual TV already 18th year.

Armoured
25-11-2014, 16:05
Let it be, anyway I don't watch usual TV already 18th year.

Yes, but it's much broader than that now - RIA Novosti, Voice of Russia, and a new internet thingy, Sputnik. So you likely are getting it, even if not through TV.

FatAndy
25-11-2014, 17:05
Sputnik was the search engine by Rostelecom or alike, and I heard there were some talks about doing a kind of Internet broadcast platform based on RT, RIA and smth else with the same name, but it won't be too fast.

FatAndy
01-12-2014, 19:29
http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20141201/1035880929.html - dozens of thousands of soldiers in Central military district will be participating in military trainings in 2015.
Center-2015 and Shield (together with Belorussia) are biggest ones/
For the whole year there will be ~4000 trainings, including tank biathlon, navy and air trainings with neighbour states ;)

TolkoRaz
01-12-2014, 19:40
http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20141201/1035880929.html - dozens of thousands of soldiers in Central military district will be participating in military trainings in 2015.
Center-2015 and Shield (together with Belorussia) are biggest ones/
For the whole year there will be ~4000 trainings, including tank biathlon, navy and air trainings with neighbour states ;)

Any chance of them becoming lost or going on vacation? ;)

FatAndy
01-12-2014, 19:42
Any chance of them becoming lost or going on vacation? ;)
You know, this GLONASS sometimes... :whisper:

Judge
01-12-2014, 22:15
Andy, looks like we could be adding one more rule to the forum rules...:cold:

Draft Bill Wants to Restrict Entry for Foreigners Who 'Offend' Russia

Russian lawmakers have drafted a vaguely worded bill allowing the country to deny entry to foreigners who have "offended" the state or its citizens, in a move that could give Moscow greater power to shut its borders to critics of the Kremlin.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/draft-bill-wants-to-restrict-entry-for-foreigners-who-offend-russia/512008.html

Uncle Wally
02-12-2014, 00:48
Andy, looks like we could be adding one more rule to the forum rules...:cold:

Draft Bill Wants to Restrict Entry for Foreigners Who 'Offend' Russia

Russian lawmakers have drafted a vaguely worded bill allowing the country to deny entry to foreigners who have "offended" the state or its citizens, in a move that could give Moscow greater power to shut its borders to critics of the Kremlin.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/draft-bill-wants-to-restrict-entry-for-foreigners-who-offend-russia/512008.html


Looks like other forums in Moscow will have start watching what they let people/Russian haters post. It would really be too bad if they rounded them all up and throw them all out of Russia and shut their site down

FatAndy
02-12-2014, 20:30
We stand for constructive critics and self critics. :verycool:

No need to pedal or take too seriously doubtful initiatives of some deputates. ;)

Armoured
02-12-2014, 20:38
No need to pedal or take too seriously doubtful initiatives of some deputates. ;)

Or Wally.

Russian Lad
02-12-2014, 20:42
Draft Bill Wants to Restrict Entry for Foreigners Who 'Offend' Russia

Russian lawmakers have drafted a vaguely worded bill allowing the country to deny entry to foreigners who have "offended" the state or its citizens, in a move that could give Moscow greater power to shut its borders to critics of the Kremlin.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/a...ia/512008.html

What's the practical use? They can criticize the Kremlin from a distance. Then they need to ban Internet, access to Western media in any form, including the paper format, and put the border under the iron padlock. People like me, there are millions out there with similar views even if their 86% support polls are correct.
I have a better idea. BAN EVERYTHING. If they ban everything, they will have no risks.
However, it is empty threats, since it is neototalitarism here. Their children are still abroad, just as their villas and even bank accounts, regardless of what BS they cater on TV to the hoi polloi. They still want to be buying Western cars and using Western resorts and services.

Suuryaa
02-12-2014, 20:53
They still want to be buying Western cars and using Western resorts and services.

Yes, that's funny.

Fantastika
03-12-2014, 05:33
What's the practical use? They can criticize the Kremlin from a distance. Then they need to ban Internet, access to Western media in any form, including the paper format, and put the border under the iron padlock. People like me, there are millions out there with similar views even if their 86% support polls are correct.
I have a better idea. BAN EVERYTHING.

The US already tried that. So far it's not working very good. 3 million in prison, millions more being tracked through parole or probation, monitored. 500,000 pages of tax, healthcare and political election regulations of which everyone has broken a few at one time, so the government can pick and choose who to prosecute.

FatAndy
03-12-2014, 08:53
Yes, that's funny.
This is quite logic. Use what is useful and ban what is harmful. :cool:

FatAndy
03-12-2014, 14:40
Meanwhile...

http://www.interfax.ru/russia/410752 - РВСН chief commander reports, 16 more MIRV Ярс (aka РС-24, Тополь family carriers), 4*150-300 kT each, 11000 km distance, to get into combat duty till 31 Dec 2014.

Aggressive imperialistic NATO block classifies them as SS-27 mod 2.

FatAndy
03-12-2014, 18:05
http://www.unian.net/politics/1017042-v-sevastopole-ukrainskih-boevyih-delfinov-zastavili-rabotat-na-rossiyskuyu-armiyu.html - damned totalitarian putinists-militarists have forced Ukrainian combat dolphins to serve in RF army!!! :jawdrop:

Where is Greenpeace???

FatAndy
08-12-2014, 14:41
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54858765cbb20f2d3a5cd87a - Ministry of communications haven't included Dozhd' (TV Rain) into broadcasting package for Krym and Sevastopol.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10202062701168468&set=a.1159697852022.19416.1815078645&type=1&theater - here Natalia Sindeeva, CEO of Dozhd', whines that they're "not enough socially responsible" and can't keep advertising on air.

At the same time, Dozhd' is invited to the meeting/interview with Medved 10th Dec:
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/54858f78cbb20f898dfc2570 - together with other channels.

FatAndy
08-12-2014, 18:12
http://www.thr.ru/news/5622/ - the Eye of Sauron will be switched on in Moscow.

Russian Lad
08-12-2014, 18:17
Why not the Eye of Stalin? It would make you more happy, I reckon.

FatAndy
08-12-2014, 18:59
Why not the Eye of Stalin? It would make you more happy, I reckon.
Sauron is quite OK. :smokin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYKxHIQrhYY

Russian Lad
08-12-2014, 20:02
Sauron is quite OK.

You are getting too soft around the edges. The crusher must be accumulating dust and getting covered with cobwebs.

FatAndy
09-12-2014, 10:26
Air defense forces of RF celebrate 100 years anniversary today.

SAM (surface-air missile) complex S-300 was temporarily placed near the theatre of Soviet Army at Suvorovskaya sq. BBC of course has immediately reported:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/russian/rolling_news/2014/12/141208_rn_s_300_moscow_anniversary :)


Maidown news have immediately reposted, even with photo, but have lost one zero in abbreviation:
http://www.depo.ua/rus/life/v-tsentre-moskvy-ustanovili-zenitno-raketnyy-kompleks-08122014135700
:rofl:

FatAndy
09-12-2014, 10:32
The crusher must be accumulating dust and getting covered with cobwebs.
No, it is being washed daily with that sacred blood of victims of the bloody rotten regime. Thanks for your concern though.

TolkoRaz
09-12-2014, 10:35
Air defense forces of RF celebrate 100 years anniversary today.

SAM (surface-air missile) complex S-300 was temporarily placed near the theatre of Soviet Army at Suvorovskaya sq. BBC of course has immediately reported:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/russian/rolling_news/2014/12/141208_rn_s_300_moscow_anniversary :)


Maidown news have immediately reposted, even with photo:
http://www.depo.ua/rus/life/v-tsentre-moskvy-ustanovili-zenitno-raketnyy-kompleks-08122014135700
:rofl:

It is a shame that what they have posted as photos is not a S-300 Air Defence missile! What they have posted is a SS series strategic Nuclear missile (ICBM)!

The image below is the mobile S-300 PMU varient used by the PVO! ;)

FatAndy
09-12-2014, 10:44
It is a shame that what they have posted as photos is not a S-300 Air Defemce missile! What they have posted is a SSseries strategic Nuclear missile (ICBM)!
I know, my father sometimes was bringing home Р-16У when served RVSN ! :cool:

TolkoRaz
09-12-2014, 11:00
I know, my father sometimes was bringing home Р-16У when served RVSN ! :cool:

Did you live in the silo? ;)

FatAndy
09-12-2014, 11:27
Did you live in the silo? ;)
It's a military secret! :shhhhhh:

FatAndy
17-12-2014, 17:51
German parliament guy has died...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/vladimir-putin/11296768/Was-German-MP-killed-by-Russia.html

:10293:

FatAndy
18-12-2014, 13:01
Damned watchdogs of bloody rotten regime repress poor ppl.
Погоня за УАЗом. Неожиданная концовка - смотреть до конца))) - YouTube

;)

FatAndy
22-12-2014, 13:11
"The St.Petersburg Times" is over.

http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/5497d9c69a79470cbca029dd

https://twitter.com/SimonOstrovsky

Alan65
24-12-2014, 22:52
http://www.noradsanta.org/

Please don't shoot him down

FatAndy
25-12-2014, 09:00
Already.
http://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/t31.0-8/10848967_493654710774566_5172388802409339632_o.jpg

Yaks
25-12-2014, 09:27
too late..

http://dailycurrant.com/2014/12/24/russia-shoots-down-santas-sleigh-near-north-pole/

FatAndy
26-12-2014, 12:54
http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/549d1ed09a7947736580642f - RF railway-based strategic missiles (codename Barguzin) to revive and put on combat duty after 2018, says "military industry source" (C). Up to 5 missile regiments (each regiment historically had 12 missiles, in the end of 198x).

http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/549d25df9a794775979561d3 - mobile ground based strategic missile РС-24 Yars with 4 warheads was tested today at Plesetsk military cosmodrome. Targets at Kura polygon (Kamchatka peninsula) reached successfully.

Russian Lad
26-12-2014, 13:39
RF railway-based strategic missiles (codename Barguzin) to revive and put on combat duty after 2018, says "military industry source" (C). Up to 5 missile regiments (each regiment historically had 12 missiles, in the end of 198x).

http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/549d25df9a794775979561d3 - mobile ground based strategic missile РС-24 Yars with 4 warheads was tested today at Plesetsk military cosmodrome. Targets at Kura polygon (Kamchatka peninsula) reached successfully.

There is a big problem with all that. Say, for instance, you cannot feed your children with missiles. Even you cannot eat or shag missiles, neither can I - Wally may try though. USSR had way more missiles and, for all intents and purposes, increased military spendings only precipitated its demise. So it eludes me why the "patriots" like you are happy about more missiles, especially given the fact that the West has missiles as well and it is not like we are gaining anything with more missiles. 2000 nukes is not enough for you? It is just money wasted. Well, maybe the whole purpose of this is to screw your brains and pump you up with more "patriotism". In this case they are succeeding I guess. But again, only to the point when the hoi polloi have nothing to feed their children with and realize they cannot feed them with missiles, - on a train, under the ground, on the surface or in the water.
As to the Saint Pete Times closure - it is a real shame. I earned 30 dollars there once through an advertisement:). It was a one minute translation job. I am sure it will re-open after we have a new country here.

FatAndy
26-12-2014, 14:13
There is a big problem with all that.
Absolutely no problems. Only tasks.


Say, for instance, you cannot feed your children with missiles.
:agree:


why the "patriots" like you are happy about more missiles
Why more? Instead. ;)


As to the Saint Pete Times closure - it is a real shame.
No, just invisible hand of The Market.


I am sure it will re-open after we have a new country here.
Maybe.

expat2013
06-01-2015, 09:03
Any predictions for 2015.... any turn for the better? The French president is supporting the easing or lifting of sanctions. How likely is this?

And what about oil? Iv'e read they can even go lower, but also that they could rise in 2-3 months. In this case , will the economy recover some? What about the ruble? Will it strengthen?

SV1973a
06-01-2015, 10:50
Any predictions for 2015.... any turn for the better? The French president is supporting the easing or lifting of sanctions. How likely is this?

And what about oil? Iv'e read they can even go lower, but also that they could rise in 2-3 months. In this case , will the economy recover some? What about the ruble? Will it strengthen?

Turn for the worse I think. If France wants to lift sanctions, then why don`t they do so ? They are still an independent country aren`t they?
I think for the short term future oil will continue to drop, but eventually it will go up again. It won`t be enough for Russian economy to recover, because basically there is nothing in Russian economy except natural resources like oil.
Ruble won`t strengthen either. Steady decline...

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 11:18
Steady decline...

In the best case scenario. Abrupt deterioration is also possible. 50-50.

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 11:47
The currencies are on the move. Euro - 74 already. As I understand, the big players, including the CB, are taking a rest till 12th. I am under the impression they may have to end their holidays abruptly... It doesn't look good at all. It looks like a war zone.

Armoured
06-01-2015, 11:54
Oil yesterday was at about $50 (from what I heard on radio). Many markets being hammered, especially those with strong oil links, like Canada. And Canada's 'dependence' on oil is a fraction of Russia's.

If oil stays down like this or goes further, Russian markets will have a painful open next week.

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 12:07
http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

Alan65
06-01-2015, 14:52
The currencies are on the move. Euro - 74 already. As I understand, the big players, including the CB, are taking a rest till 12th. I am under the impression they may have to end their holidays abruptly... It doesn't look good at all. It looks like a war zone.

Some more good news today, the ruble plunged further so more Rubles income from selling oil, am I learning :happymad:

Yaks
06-01-2015, 15:01
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/some-traders-are-betting-on-20-oil-2015-01-05?dist=beforebell

TolkoRaz
06-01-2015, 15:17
The Saudis are laughing, as are the Kuwaitis whilst the US of A is suffering along with the shale project.

Venezuela is soon to go bankrupt.....................

The House of Saud & Kuwait etc will massively benefit in the long term.

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 15:36
whilst the US of A is suffering along with the shale project.

Yes, the average American is suffering from decreasing fuel prices. If they travel to Russia they will also suffer:

Gotta love that exchange rate [Eurotrip] - YouTube

Tolko, I have a new avatar for you:

Yaks
06-01-2015, 16:06
" Every day, American motorists are saving $630 million on gasoline compared with what they paid at June prices, and they would get a $230 billion windfall if prices were to stay this low for a year."


"At current prices, the annual revenue of OPEC members would shrink by $590 billion, money that will instead stay within the borders of the worlds biggest oil importers, led by the United States, China and Japan.

"The size of the global economy will easily be between 0.5 percent and 1.0 percent higher as a result of the decline in oil prices, wrote Andrew Kenningham, senior global economist for London-based Capital Economics.

The 40 percent drop in the price of the international benchmark Brent-grade crude oil over the past five months will reduce annual revenue to oil producers worldwide by a whopping $1.5 trillion."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/as-oil-prices-plunge-wide-ranging-effects-for-consumers-and-the-global-economy/2014/12/01/904984b2-7971-11e4-9a27-6fdbc612bff8_story.html

snowdrift
06-01-2015, 16:20
Russian Lad

http://ivarfjeld.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/facts-homeless-la.jpg

http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/163632-me-0128-homeless1.jpg

http://growabrain.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/09/02/homeless_los_angeles.png

http://streetmedicine.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/reporting-on-health-photo.jpg

Yaks
06-01-2015, 16:22
where would you rather be homeless?

snowdrift
06-01-2015, 16:25
Yaks

I wouldn`t like to be homeless. But if so, I think somewhere in the UK or Germany where it would be possible scrounge off their Social services as many people actually do even without being homeless.

TolkoRaz
06-01-2015, 16:26
Russian Lad

http://ivarfjeld.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/facts-homeless-la.jpg

http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/163632-me-0128-homeless1.jpg

http://growabrain.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/09/02/homeless_los_angeles.png

http://streetmedicine.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/reporting-on-health-photo.jpg

Skid Row, Los Angeles and San Francisco :10310:

snowdrift
06-01-2015, 16:27
Skid Row, Los Angeles and San Francisco

Not only there. Kansas included :rolleyes:

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 16:29
Skid Row, Los Angeles and San Francisco
Not only there. Kansas included

National traitors! You should be dreaming about being homeless in Vorkuta, Magadan or Solekamsk.

Yaks
06-01-2015, 16:30
Yaks

I wouldn`t like to be homeless. But if so, I think somewhere in the UK or Germany where it would be possible scrounge off their Social services as many people actually do even without being homeless.

it is quite true that it is better in the uk or europe as a safety net than the US. but people are generally homeless due to mental illness and even with tonnes of help available they don't always take it. The US has soup kitchens, church groups such as the salvation army that specialise in helping the homeless and various other schemes. There is homelessness in every country, regardless of what services are available. but at least in some countries those services do exist.

TolkoRaz
06-01-2015, 16:31
Not only there. Kansas included :rolleyes:

Actually, San Diego, California! ;)

snowdrift
06-01-2015, 16:31
Russian Lad

Lets stay positive :) And, my troll, stop distorting my words. I said nothing about my dreams.

TolkoRaz

no, one of the photos was tagged "Kansas".

Yaks


There is homelessness in every country, regardless of what services are available.

I totally agree. So, ask that troll "Lad" why he posted those pictures in this topic.

TolkoRaz
06-01-2015, 16:32
You should be dreaming about being homeless in Vorkuta, Magadan or Solekamsk.

Why should I dream about being homeless? :confused:

Do you enjoy being homeless and unemployed? :tv:

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 16:37
There is homelessness in every country, regardless of what services are available.
I totally agree. So, ask that troll "Lad" why he posted those pictures in this topic.

The pics I posted are not about homeless people.

snowdrift
06-01-2015, 16:46
The pics I posted are not about homeless people.

So, they are about oil prices and dollars? You are so funny indeed)

tvadim133
06-01-2015, 22:00
2015 - there is a bad forecast indeed during 7-8 months, then all will be stabilized (I am not speaking about Russia only but about the global economy).

First of all European zone will suffer more incl. Russia and CIS (all reasons are taken into account including political).

In my (global) company we foresee minus 12% of "Growth" in EU and the same will be in Russia. (-20% +).

Rubles: too late to buy USD or Euro (though I would buy smth still), but in 12 months the rate can come back to 50 rubles per 1 euro, so if you have your "long ruble account", I would not do anything.

Good news: in Russia it is not the first and the last crisis. We have a good immune system (I mean, people have).

P.S. Let's check my preview in one year :) I am interested in that as well.

Russian Lad
06-01-2015, 22:53
Let's check my preview in one year

A lot of optimism based on nothing, - well, basically on the assumption that the Russians are a special race or some such bs. Better read the story about Cain and Abel.


Cain and Abel
4 Adam[a] made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, “With the help of the Lord I have brought forth[c] a man.” 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.

Now Abel kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil. 3 In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord. 4 And Abel also brought an offering—fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering, 5 but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.

6 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? 7 If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.”

8 Now Cain said to his brother Abel, “Let’s go out to the field.”[d] While they were in the field, Cain attacked his brother Abel and killed him.

9 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Where is your brother Abel?”

“I don’t know,” he replied. “Am I my brother’s keeper?”

10 [B]The Lord said, “What have you done? Listen! Your brother’s blood cries out to me from the ground. 11 Now you are under a curse and driven from the ground, which opened its mouth to receive your brother’s blood from your hand. 12 When you work the ground, it will no longer yield its crops for you. You will be a restless wanderer on the earth.”

tvadim133
07-01-2015, 01:02
"Based on nothing"

If you have another preview based on "anything", you can share, but do not just say "based on nothing" to other people's opinion.

"BS about Russians' special race"

Where have you read that in my post?

I just wrote that with a sense of humour, not available for other probably. :)

"The story abut Cain and Abel"

to copy past and to post smth from worldwide literature is a good way to participate in the discussion indeed.

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 01:07
If you have another preview based on "anything", you can share, but do not just say "based on nothing" to other people's opinion.

I can list like ten-twenty reasons why it will get worse and maybe critically worse, but am too lazy to repeat myself. It is all in my previous posts.
Unlike you, I cannot give a single reason why it should get better, unless Russia changes its current course (which it seems unwilling to do). Seriously, I have tried hard, and see no single reason for improvement or even for staying at the current level. Not a single one. Even if the oil prices bounce to like 60-70 and stay there by the end of this year. The EU is like 15 times stronger than Russia in economic terms, and the EU can be helped by the US, Canada, etc. By contrast, I am 100% sure China will just watch Russia sink and rub hands in glee.


I just wrote that with a sense of humour, not available for other probably.

Yes, I definitely missed the humor.

Suuryaa
07-01-2015, 11:59
"Based on nothing"

If you have another preview based on "anything", you can share, but do not just say "based on nothing" to other people's opinion.

"BS about Russians' special race"

Where have you read that in my post?

I just wrote that with a sense of humour, not available for other probably. :)

"The story abut Cain and Abel"

to copy past and to post smth from worldwide literature is a good way to participate in the discussion indeed.

Don't pay attention to RL, he's become a troll. On my ignore list for this reason.

fenrir
07-01-2015, 12:20
More bad news for the Russian economy.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30707638

Judge
07-01-2015, 14:37
Don't pay attention to RL, he's become a troll. On my ignore list for this reason.

That's a shame cos you wouldn't get to read comedy gems like this.


The EU is like 15 times stronger than Russia in economic terms

Judge
07-01-2015, 14:39
More bad news for the Russian economy.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30707638

Then maybe it's a blessing in disguise that the ruble is weaker cos the main contributors to the Kremlin's coffers are the oil and gas compaies that get paid in $$ and euros...

Yaks
07-01-2015, 14:44
That's a shame cos you wouldn't get to read comedy gems like this.

Judge,

GDP of European Union is 17 trillion, Russia is 2 before sanctions. it was doing well before that, rising from 1.3 trillion in 2007. so 15 times is not far off the mark.

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 14:44
Don't pay attention to RL, he's become a troll. On my ignore list for this reason.

Well, live like an ostrich with your head in the sand if you want. Everyone makes his choice in this life.


Then maybe it's a blessing in disguise that the ruble is weaker cos the main contributors to the Kremlin's coffers are the oil and gas compaies that get paid in $$ and euros...

Why do you think they have spent billions USD to support it and jumped to raise the CB rate (at night) to 17%? Following your logic, 1 dollar=150-200 rubles is much better than the current rate.

Judge
07-01-2015, 15:04
Judge,

GDP of European Union is 17 trillion, Russia is 2 before sanctions. it was doing well before that, rising from 1.3 trillion in 2007. so 15 times is not far off the mark.

Sure on paper sounds stornger, but the EU is nearly falling apart, weak euro,heading for recession,a country or two might leave soon, Iceland doesn't want join,it's not all roses on the otherside ...the EU economy doesn't sound that strong to me...
The only way for the EU(and Russia too) to get back on its feet is to lift the sanctions off Russia and start trading like it was before....

Judge
07-01-2015, 15:09
Why do you think they have spent billions USD to support it and jumped to raise the CB rate (at night) to 17%? Following your logic, 1 dollar=150-200 rubles is much better than the current rate.

They can't let it crash and burn,panic will kick in, run on banks and the whole economy will collpase,the CBR are using the funds for what they were set up to do,to help the economy when needed..
If the ruble was 1 dollar=150-200, then goods from abroad would be too expensive, gotta have a balance and for now it's kinda off balance but not by too much...can't have the ruble become worthless..

Yaks
07-01-2015, 15:09
Sure on paper sounds stornger, but the EU is nearly falling apart, weak euro,heading for recession,a country or two might leave soon, Iceland doesn't want join,it's not all roses on the otherside ...

As compared to Russia? She is in much worse shape than the EU. The EU can always just print money and export out and often has debt denominated in Euro. Russia can't do that.

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 15:12
They can't let it crash and burn,panic will kick in, run on banks and the whole economy will collpase


Now we are talking. In my book, it has already collapsed and keeps crashing, and the panick has already begun.

Judge
07-01-2015, 15:21
Now we are talking. In my book, it has already collapsed and keeps crashing, and the panick has already begun.

There is no panic,that's really been interesting, no panic really, no run on banks, some changed money, but nothing really to report about(only in western media, who want to shit stir), many would have wanted to see a real panic, but for now, Russians have been calm...


In my book it just wobbled a little, ok more than just a little,what happened a few weeks ago caught some by surprise.....this is ok when you have control over your own currency,unlike EU countries,look at Greece, they had to go with the begging bowl for a bail out, over 250bn euros....

Judge
07-01-2015, 15:25
As compared to Russia? She is in much worse shape than the EU. The EU can always just print money and export out and often has debt denominated in Euro. Russia can't do that.

Can't Russia also print money?..... and what is the EU exporting, goods like cars, clothes and so on.. Russia export gas to keep them warm and for their factories to work, things that are needed for these goods, they both need each other...
True,Russia companies debt is in euros and $, some western bankers are having sleepless nights worrying about Russian companies paying their debts...

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 15:28
no run on banks

How do you know? The CB has reported the population have bought billions of USD and EUR, even Nabiulina has used the word "panic". The fact that bank runs are not broadcast on federal channels doesn't mean they are not happening.

Yaks
07-01-2015, 15:49
Can't Russia also print money?..... and what is the EU exporting, goods like cars, clothes and so on.. Russia export gas to keep them warm and for their factories to work, things that are needed for these goods, they both need each other...
True,Russia companies debt is in euros and $, some western bankers are having sleepless nights worrying about Russian companies paying their debts...

Russia printing money does nothing-debts are in foreign currencies and devaluing the rouble does nothing to increase Russian competitiveness when almost all it exports is oil/gas and minerals which are priced in dollars.

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 16:07
Can't Russia also print money?.

Judge, I think you need to do some reading on how the CB operates, on how it is related to the Federal Reserve and so forth. It is just a friendly advice.

Judge
07-01-2015, 16:13
Judge, I think you need to do some reading on how the CB operates, on how it is related to the Federal Reserve and so forth. It is just a friendly advice.

Please enlighten me, I remember you saying before that the Fed bank controls the CBR...

Russian Lad
07-01-2015, 16:19
Please enlighten me, I remember you saying before that the Fed bank controls the CBR...

Yes, the CB is tied to the FR, indirectly. They can print only as many rubles as Russia earns by selling goods for hard currencies. If the CB prints more, inflation will hit Russia. Sometimes they do print a bit more, hence the inflation rates. In this respect, a weaker ruble does nothing positive at all - you still depend on your hard currencies revenues. It is a good smokescreen for a while - the population can be paid the same rubles amounts as before, the budget is sort of balanced in rubles, but it is only to the point when the actual inflation hits the Russian market. To avoid this, they may need to freeze prices on certain goods, request the sales chains to abstain from drastic price increases, subsidize some branches. But it creates a bubble that is bound to burst down the road.
That's why the decreased oil prices hit the economy - less hard currency, less ruble printing capacity. If more rubles are printed - higher inflation. It is a really vicious vortex.
Let Yak and others correct me if I am wrong on something here.

Russian Lad
09-01-2015, 20:16
Brent - 49.43, WTI - 47.70. Hohoho.

indigo111
10-01-2015, 16:10
I read yesterday one smart russian financial guy - he is predicting the meltdown in 6 months - when huge russian companies will stop selling currency they involuntarily sell now

bydand
10-01-2015, 17:02
I read yesterday one smart russian financial guy - he is predicting the meltdown in 6 months - when huge russian companies will stop selling currency they involuntarily sell now

Would you please provide a link, if possible, to what you read. I'm interested.

Judge
12-01-2015, 13:04
Just read this in The Guardian ,some truth in in.

One of Saudi Arabias richest businessmen has warned that oil prices will keep falling unless producers rein in supplies.

Prince Alwaleed bin Talal told USA Today that:

If supply stays where it is, and demand remains weak, you better believe it is gonna go down more. But if some supply is taken off the market, and theres some growth in demand, prices may go up. But Im sure were never going to see $100 anymore. I said a year ago, the price of oil above $100 is artificial. Its not correct.

He also dismissed the theory that the West is attacking Russia via the oil price as baloney and rubbish:

Im telling you, theres no way Saudis will do this. Because Saudi Arabia is hurting as much as Russia, period. Now, we dont show it because of our big reserves. But Ill tell you Saudi Arabia and Russia are in bed together here. And both are being hurt simultaneously.

Russian Lad
12-01-2015, 14:26
And both are being hurt simultaneously.

A weak consolation to the deeply affected and immensely suffering russkie narod. Besides, if it is true and there is no scheming and dealing between the Saudis and the US, it shows how blind, irresponsible and unprofessional the Russian leaders have been to have wasted such a golden opportunity with high oil prices to really develop the country's industries, science and so forth.

okiey
13-01-2015, 14:27
Devaluing the ruble reduces costs !

Its increasing the competitiveness of Russian steel makers, which had been struggling in recent years.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2015-01-12/ruble-rout-exposes-india-s-steelmakers-to-russia-threat.html


Russia printing money does nothing-debts are in foreign currencies and devaluing the rouble does nothing to increase Russian competitiveness when almost all it exports is oil/gas and minerals which are priced in dollars.

Russian Lad
13-01-2015, 14:37
Devaluing the ruble reduces costs !

Go tell this to our local Tajik janitors.:) They have left.:coffee: And I would rather scratch my unemployed arse till Kingdom come than work as a street sweeper for 15K rubles. Or to my sister who cannot afford foreign travels anymore and cannot buy a nice car now she has been dreaming about for many years. Her life lies in shambles, in economic terms. She is counting every copeck now to be able to buy food and to afford some relatively stylish Chinese clothes. Besides, volatility is also creating serious issues.
On a side note, I bet you are getting paid in dollars or euros, otherwise you would not say the intellectually challenged thing I have quoted. Well, here is the news for you - most Russians are still paid in rubles, and their salaries mostly haven't changed since the time one euro cost 43 rubles instead of today's 77.
It is good for me personally, though - right now I am paying my programmer less than 6 euros per hour (in rubles), it used to be 11 euros. But I do realize it is not that great for him.

Armoured
13-01-2015, 14:47
Devaluing the ruble reduces costs !

As far as I can tell, ruble has collapsed compared to... the Nigerian Naira, which would also be oil-dependent, yes?

http://www.freecurrencyrates.com/exchange-rate-history/RUB-NGN/2014

okiey
13-01-2015, 15:14
As far as I can tell, ruble has collapsed compared to... the Nigerian Naira, which would also be oil-dependent, yes?

http://www.freecurrencyrates.com/exchange-rate-history/RUB-NGN/2014

I am not an expert on the specifics of the Nigerian economy, but I doubt it has much in common with Russia's. Its oil/gas output is also substantially lower than Russia's plus it does not have to contend with sanctions, so I am not sure if we are comparing apples with apples here.

okiey
13-01-2015, 15:17
Nope, I get paid in rubles unfortunately.



Go tell this to our local Tajik janitors.:) They have left.:coffee: And I would rather scratch my unemployed arse till Kingdom come than work as a street sweeper for 15K rubles. Or to my sister who cannot afford foreign travels anymore and cannot buy a nice car now she has been dreaming about for many years. Her life lies in shambles, in economic terms. She is counting every copeck now to be able to buy food and to afford some relatively stylish Chinese clothes. Besides, volatility is also creating serious issues.
On a side note, I bet you are getting paid in dollars or euros, otherwise you would not say the intellectually challenged thing I have quoted. Well, here is the news for you - most Russians are still paid in rubles, and their salaries mostly haven't changed since the time one euro cost 43 rubles instead of today's 77.
It is good for me personally, though - right now I am paying my programmer less than 6 euros per hour (in rubles), it used to be 11 euros. But I do realize it is not that great for him.

Russian Lad
13-01-2015, 15:26
Nope, I get paid in rubles unfortunately.

Then your joy about the fallen ruble sounds rather masochistic.:)

Armoured
13-01-2015, 15:27
I am not an expert on the specifics of the Nigerian economy, but I doubt it has much in common with Russia's. Its oil/gas output is also substantially lower than Russia's plus it does not have to contend with sanctions, so I am not sure if we are comparing apples with apples here.

I'm not an expert on it either, but oil exports are about 20% of GDP from a quick look at OPEC site. I think that's roughly - roughly - comparable to Russia's.

Oil is almost all of Nigeria's exports though.

Anyway, I would have thought oil price hit would have been comparable for Nigeria's currency. But a very superficial glance at the situation.

Uncle Wally
13-01-2015, 16:04
Go tell this to our local Tajik janitors.:) They have left.:coffee: And I would rather scratch my unemployed arse till Kingdom come than work as a street sweeper for 15K rubles. Or to my sister who cannot afford foreign travels anymore and cannot buy a nice car now she has been dreaming about for many years. Her life lies in shambles, in economic terms. She is counting every copeck now to be able to buy food and to afford some relatively stylish Chinese clothes. Besides, volatility is also creating serious issues.
On a side note, I bet you are getting paid in dollars or euros, otherwise you would not say the intellectually challenged thing I have quoted. Well, here is the news for you - most Russians are still paid in rubles, and their salaries mostly haven't changed since the time one euro cost 43 rubles instead of today's 77.
It is good for me personally, though - right now I am paying my programmer less than 6 euros per hour (in rubles), it used to be 11 euros. But I do realize it is not that great for him.



And now it takes your programmer two hours to do what he used to do in one. You end up paying 1 euro more per hour.

Russian Lad
13-01-2015, 16:17
And now it takes your programmer two hours to do what he used to do in one. You end up paying 1 euro more per hour.

Don't worry, Wally, I keep the tab under control. Why don't you count your money?:)

americaninmoscow
13-01-2015, 16:22
he is predicting the meltdown in 6 months - when huge russian companies will stop selling currency they involuntarily sell now

I was reading something the other day that suggested something similar, yet completely opposite.

The Russian economy will continue to deteriorate for the next sixth months, at which point in time, it will start to recover as the economy starts to diversify and as Russia's new found best-friend relationship with China starts to take effect.

AstarD
13-01-2015, 16:23
I'd like to know how it will pay for that diversification.

bydand
13-01-2015, 17:02
I think this article explains well, oil prices fundamental effect on some different countries.

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/understanding-oils-decline-alkarim-shamsy

fenrir
13-01-2015, 19:21
http://peakoil.com/publicpolicy/why-europe-no-longer-fears-the-russian-gasman

Of course, Wally will counter with how two people losing their jobs at McDonald's has more economic impact on the US economy than what is happening to Russia with oil and gas.

Judge
13-01-2015, 19:37
http://peakoil.com/publicpolicy/why-europe-no-longer-fears-the-russian-gasman

Of course, Wally will counter with how two people losing their jobs at McDonald's has more economic impact on the US economy than what is happening to Russia with oil and gas.

It was interesting to read the comments to that article.....

Alan65
13-01-2015, 19:48
As far as I can tell, ruble has collapsed compared to... the Nigerian Naira, which would also be oil-dependent, yes?

http://www.freecurrencyrates.com/exchange-rate-history/RUB-NGN/2014

The Ruble has collapsed compared to just about every currency, look at the Thai Baht, the Turkish Lira and whatever currency Egypt uses.

The Thai baht used to be 1 to 1, now is is something like 1 to 1.5.

Uncle Wally
14-01-2015, 01:32
http://peakoil.com/publicpolicy/why-europe-no-longer-fears-the-russian-gasman

Of course, Wally will counter with how two people losing their jobs at McDonald's has more economic impact on the US economy than what is happening to Russia with oil and gas.



It's what's not happening to Russia's hold on the gas pipelines that says the EU still needs Russia's friendship. Nothing is happening anyway and it may not happen. So?

Carl
14-01-2015, 09:36
Nothing is happening anyway and it may not happen. So?

..but we're still heading for war. Right?

fenrir
14-01-2015, 12:19
http://news.yahoo.com/russia-says-inflation-could-reach-17-2015-074402010.html

What happened to all that 'sanctions can't hurt us' tripe and 'inflation won't increase' garbage?

Uncle Wally
14-01-2015, 12:39
..but we're still heading for war. Right?


If you haven't noticed we are at war.

Armoured
14-01-2015, 12:50
It was interesting to read the comments to that article.....

For example? I took a look and they all seemed to be the same things you read whenever the Rossiya Vpered Flying Internet Attack Monkeys squad is deployed.

Sort of like Wally, but better English.

fenrir
14-01-2015, 12:57
If you haven't noticed we are at war.

Excuses, excuses. Why hasn't the dollar collapsed? Why isn't everyone paying for everything in gold?

Uncle Wally
14-01-2015, 13:07
Excuses, excuses. Why hasn't the dollar collapsed? Why isn't everyone paying for everything in gold?



You have ask yourself why is so much gold being bought?

Judge
14-01-2015, 13:14
For example? I took a look and they all seemed to be the same things you read whenever the Rossiya Vpered Flying Internet Attack Monkeys squad is deployed.

Sort of like Wally, but better English.

There are even more comments than yesterday,thanks for making me look again, more comments agreeing the article is more or less nonsense. ...and comments that it's just propaganda from the other side...good to see others aren't fooled easily. ...


One decent truth comment. .



Writer of this article is absolutely clueless. Liberalization of the EU gas market did nothing to provide more gas. Meanwhile, North Sea gas production that provides about 40% of EU gas is set drop by about half by 2030. The fiasco in Ukraine is causing Russia to reorient its focus on selling gas to Asia and the EU is only able to secure small crumbs such as 10 bcm per year from Azerbaijan.

I think the EU will become the Nr.1 customer for more expensive LNG and as it will take a big bite out of an already stagnated economy, the EU will look back with nostalgia at the time when it used to have a decent relationship with Russia.

And another,worth checking the source..


7:42 am

The Economist, sponsored by GE… the MSM Iron Curtain’s best example of propaganda.

Nothing has changed in the EU. Putin still holds the economy of the EU in his hands and can strangle it anytime he wants to, and will for years to come no matter what any propaganda rag prints.

Matt24
14-01-2015, 13:17
You have ask yourself why is so much gold being bought?

the bigger more important question is why is so little copper is being bought, copper lost 9% in trading on Shanghai yesterday, that's suggesting a hugely grim outlook for manufacturing industry around the globe, and retail - Gold is so last thursday dear, governments with populist manifestos dabble to be seen and private investors with limited access and a cunning plan, (same dudes usually have a master plan to predict roulette), move the stuff around a bit, but copper is more your fundamental test, and the test results are looking pretty poorly

Judge
14-01-2015, 13:34
You have ask yourself why is so much gold being bought?

people stocking up for rainy days

Just read that gold was at a 3 month high.....

AstarD
14-01-2015, 13:48
What can you buy with gold?

Judge
14-01-2015, 13:58
What can you buy with gold?

First you need to cash in and then buy whatever ......


Some tips for you gold lovers..

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/10-tips-selling-gold-cash/story?id=14356892

Carl
14-01-2015, 14:17
If you haven't noticed we are at war.

Who are you at war with?

Armoured
14-01-2015, 14:43
Who are you at war with?

Wally has always been at war with EastAsia.

Armoured
14-01-2015, 15:20
Government ministers and e.g. head of Sberbank being exceptionally negative on Russian economy today.

Gref warns of 'massive' banking crisis, etc.

Seems to me they are a fair bit more realistic than the Pollyannas on this board.

Alan65
14-01-2015, 20:14
Well every month I exchange 360 to rubles, I I did that on Saturday, got circa 32,000, if I would have done it today I would have got circa 36, 000 .

In my reckoning, that is about 10% in 5 days

No crisis

tonytony
14-01-2015, 20:42
Well every month I exchange 360 to rubles, I I did that on Saturday, got circa 32,000, if I would have done it today I would have got circa 36, 000 .

In my reckoning, that is about 10% in 5 days

No crisis


Yes, I just noticed that it's hit 100 to the pound again. It was down about 94 to the pound last week.

I still subconsciously convert a lot of things back to sterling and now it's nice and simple. 1,000 rouble note = 10 note

Russian Lad
14-01-2015, 20:57
Originally Posted by Carl View Post
Who are you at war with?
Wally has always been at war with EastAsia.

Wasn't it a war against NorthWestania and its Chancellor Obamius?

Uncle Wally
14-01-2015, 22:59
Wasn't it a war against NorthWestania and its Chancellor Obamius?



Laugh. People are getting killed.

AstarD
14-01-2015, 23:09
You still haven't answered who we're a war with.

Alan65
15-01-2015, 03:56
Yes, I just noticed that it's hit 100 to the pound again. It was down about 94 to the pound last week.

I still subconsciously convert a lot of things back to sterling and now it's nice and simple. 1,000 rouble note = 10 note

I always relate it back to a pack of smokes...1000 rubles = 1 pack Marlborough (UK prices)....you are so lucky to be able to get them for 60 rubles in Russia

It so much cheaper to smoke and drink yourself to death in Russia

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 05:19
you are so lucky to be able to get them for 60 rubles in Russia

90-100 rubles now, expected to be 120-130 very soon.

Judge
15-01-2015, 16:31
Hey wally, investors have the gold fever today.:12035:

Armoured
15-01-2015, 16:42
Hey wally, investors have the gold fever today.:12035:

Gold? Ha! The real action is in swiss francs.

Can't get enough of those fiat currencies....

Matt24
15-01-2015, 17:29
Gold? Ha! The real action is in swiss francs.

Can't get enough of those fiat currencies....

Wally don't you listen to the nasty man, if you really want to look like you know what you're talking about create a POV on copper prices, given the world dependence on printed circuit boards what's happening in copperville is astounding - Gold is old peeps, you're making this forum look like something out of the naughties, the 19 naughties.

Judge
15-01-2015, 17:40
Gold? Ha! The real action is in swiss francs.

Can't get enough of those fiat currencies....

And that's why they are buying gold.

Swiss shares fell some 6% and stock markets around Europe fell with investors buying "safe haven" assets such as gold and German bonds.Many investors believe that with the franc so strong Swiss companies will struggle to win exports.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 17:44
90-100 rubles now, expected to be 120-130 very soon.
300 in Aeroexpress terminal in Belorussky. For a year already. :bong:

Armoured
15-01-2015, 17:48
And that's why they are buying gold.

Swiss shares fell some 6% and stock markets around Europe fell with investors buying "safe haven" assets such as gold and German bonds.Many investors believe that with the franc so strong Swiss companies will struggle to win exports.

Ummm, as usual, I have no idea what you're talking about; all of your arguments or points seem to go in circles - "it's bad, therefore it's good (reverse as necessary).

Let's keep this simple. Fiat currency, CHF, is up 20-30%. Gold is up a couple percent last I saw (in dollar price).

This is hardly an argument for gold. Yes, both CHF and gold are considered safe-haven assets, but CHF seems to be preferred today.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 18:01
it's bad, therefore it's good (reverse as necessary)

Yeah, he has learnt the russkie zen buddhism.

Judge
15-01-2015, 18:01
Ummm, as usual, I have no idea what you're talking about; all of your arguments or points seem to go in circles - "it's bad, therefore it's good (reverse as necessary).

Let's keep this simple. Fiat currency, CHF, is up 20-30%. Gold is up a couple percent last I saw (in dollar price).

This is hardly an argument for gold. Yes, both CHF and gold are considered safe-haven assets, but CHF seems to be preferred today.



Yes the CHF is up 30 % .I agree good action for many who bought, but also gold is being bought, not only today but yesterday too cos investors are looking for the usual safe havens.
I ain't comparing the two, just informing wally that investors have the gold bug, danger could be on the horizon.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 18:05
looking for the usual safe havens

The Nigerian naira also looks like a safe haven, in comparison with the ruble. Up 30% recently against the Russian currency. So, before buying gold, Wally must consider the naira. Or, in his case, he should refuse being paid in rubles for his talented songs and think about accepting the naira for his prominent efforts.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 18:34
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2015/01/15/world/europe/15reuters-lithuania-manual.html

VILNIUS — Lithuania is publishing a manual to advise its citizens on how to survive a war on its soil as concerns grow that Russia's intervention in Ukraine heralds increased assertiveness in its tiny Baltic neighbors.

"Keep a sound mind, don't panic and don't lose clear thinking," the manual explains. "Gunshots just outside your window are not the end of the world."

The manual, which the Defence Ministry will send to libraries next week and also distribute at army events, says Lithuanians should resist foreign occupation with demonstrations and strikes, "or at least doing your job worse than usual".

In the event of invasion, the manual says Lithuanians should organize themselves through Twitter and Facebook and attempt cyber attacks against the enemy.

Lithuania spent much of the last century incorporated in Soviet Union, along with Latvia and Estonia, and upon independence in 1991 quickly sought to join the Western NATO alliance and the European Union.

It is increasingly worried about Russia, not least because of a military drill in the Russian enclave of Kaliningrad last month that featured 9,000 soldiers and more than 55 naval vessels.

"The examples of Georgia and Ukraine, which both lost a part of their territory, show us that we cannot rule out a similar kind of situation here, and that we should be ready," Defence Minister Juozas Olekas told Reuters.

The Lithuanian army and its paramilitary reserve force have seen increased recruitment since the crisis in Ukraine.

"When Russia started its aggression in Ukraine, here in Lithuania our citizens understood that our neighbor is not friendly," Olekas added.

The government is also considering requiring all future buildings to incorporate a bomb shelter on the premises.

Russia annexed the Crimean peninsula from Ukraine last year, and Western governments say they have overwhelming evidence that it is supplying troops and weaponry to pro-Russian separatists who have seized parts of eastern Ukraine, an accusation that Moscow denies.

(Writing by Alistair Scrutton; Editing by Kevin Liffey)

:D

Comrades, who knows where I can get this 100-pages doc? :)

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 18:40
Is there anything new you have learned from the excerpt you have just posted?

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 18:50
Is there anything new you have learned from the excerpt you have just posted?
For me here is nothing to learn, only to laugh. That's why I need all the doc.
What about you, bro? ;)

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 19:04
What about you, bro?

Me, nothing new. Am far from laughing though. They have all the reasons to be worried.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 19:15
They have all the reasons to be worried.
Correct. Dumb head is always #1 reason to worry. ;)

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 19:21
Correct. Dumb head is always #1 reason to worry.

Well, they heard it all before in the previous century and learned the lesson the hard way. Whereas you see it as something dumb, I see it as routine prevention work on their part. The current events in Ukraine, quite understandingly, have increased their level of alarm and awareness. I don't see anything strange or funny in this.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 19:35
http://top.rbc.ru/technology_and_media/15/01/2015/54b7cd499a79470b1946a879 - RT to receive 23B rub for propaganda ;)


Well, they heard it all before in the previous century and learned the lesson the hard way.
Stupidity always results in hard ways and lessons.


I don't see anything strange or funny in this.
Look again, under other angle. :)

Alan65
15-01-2015, 19:39
The Nigerian naira also looks like a safe haven, in comparison with the ruble. Up 30% recently against the Russian currency. So, before buying gold, Wally must consider the naira. Or, in his case, he should refuse being paid in rubles for his talented songs and think about accepting the naira for his prominent efforts.

if smokes are going up...I would just buy loads of those...you know they will be sold.

AstarD
15-01-2015, 19:41
http://top.rbc.ru/technology_and_media/15/01/2015/54b7cd499a79470b1946a879 - RT to receive 23B rub for propaganda ;)


Stupidity always results in hard ways and lessons.


Look again, under other angle. :)Same kind of stupidity that has had Russia believing for many years that it's always the real target.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 19:52
Same kind of stupidity that has had Russia believing for many years that it's always the real target.
No, it's different things. We have much more territory and resources, then Litva. :)

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 20:18
No, it's different things. We have much more territory and resources, then Litva.

We? I own neither land nor resources. You must be a very rich man or are like Rusmeister, firmly believe in fairytales. How many oil rigs and gas pipelines do you own? I neither own any nor benefit from any.

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 20:20
We? I own neither land nor resources.
Your bad.


You must be a very rich man.
:verycool:


How many oil rigs do you own?
One, but very potent. :10518:

tonytony
15-01-2015, 20:23
CHF seems to be preferred today.


The reason for this is that the CHF has been pegged against the Euro for the last three years and the Swiss National Bank has spent billions to defend that position - not unlike the Russian central bank recently.

But this morning they suddenly announced that they weren't going to do that any more. So the Euro fell off a cliff after this was announced and has lost about 20% against the CHF and 1.5% against the USD. Now 1.5% might not sound much but that is actually a really big fall in one day.

This decision also affected the USD/CHF rate as well. Incidentally the JPY had a really good day as well.

It's believed that there is going to be some big news next week that will really impact the Euro and that is one of the reasons why the SNB have stopped supporting the CHF rate because it's likely to get even more expensive for them.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 20:31
One, but very potent.

I wasn't asking you about a part of your anatomy. :neiner:

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 20:33
It's believed that there is going to be some big news next week that will really impact the Euro and that is one of the reasons why the SNB have stopped supporting the CHF rate because it's likely to get even more expensive for them.

The big news is out there already - plans to print about 500 bln. euros, according to Goldman Sachs. They believe the euro and the dollar will reach parity in the next year. I am thinking about buying some dollars next week. Euro is becoming not good enough.:)

Judge
15-01-2015, 20:54
The big news is out there already - plans to print about 500 bln. euros, according to Goldman Sachs. They believe the euro and the dollar will reach parity in the next year. I am thinking about buying some dollars next week. Euro is becoming not good enough.:)

Don't forget about the upcoming Greek election, if the Greeks leave the eurozone and everyone sees it's not all doom and gloom after they leave, domino!!

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 21:07
I wasn't asking you about a part of your anatomy. :neiner:
I understand all your thoughts go one critical direction. ;)

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 21:09
The big news is out there already - plans to print about 500 bln. euros, according to Goldman Sachs. They believe the euro and the dollar will reach parity in the next year. I am thinking about buying some dollars next week. Euro is becoming not good enough.:)



The euro's not good enough. The dollar fell too. Get yourself some franks boy.

Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 21:09
if the Greeks leave the eurozone and everyone sees it's not all doom and gloom after they leave, domino!!

Not necessarily so, the EU may become stronger after 2-3 weak members leave. That is, if they leave.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 21:11
I understand all your thoughts go one critical direction.

It is crucial to keep being focused at all times. :watching:

FatAndy
15-01-2015, 21:11
:emote_popcorn:

Judge
15-01-2015, 21:13
Not necessarily so, the EU may become stronger after 2-3 weak members leave. That is, if they leave.

Sure,just a few small countries left with Germany pulling the strings...

tonytony
15-01-2015, 21:14
The big news is out there already - plans to print about 500 bln. euros, according to Goldman Sachs. They believe the euro and the dollar will reach parity in the next year. I am thinking about buying some dollars next week. Euro is becoming not good enough.:)

No - the rumours are that it may be nearer to 1 trillion euros rather than the already reported 500 billion.

That is why people are getting nervous.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 21:16
The euro's not good enough. The dollar fell too. Get yourself some franks boy.

Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide.

Well, I don't expect the euro to become as devalued as the ruble, I am still in the win, the euros I bought for 43 rubles cost 75 rubles today and most likely will cost 100 relatively soon - the oil is expected to drop to 30 now. The biggest losers in Russia are those who have kept their cash in rubles.

Judge
15-01-2015, 21:18
The euro's not good enough. The dollar fell too. Get yourself some franks boy.

Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide.

A bit late to be running for francs now......

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 21:18
Not necessarily so, the EU may become stronger after 2-3 weak members leave. That is, if they leave.



As I heard they want to print up 500 billion euros. Going American style.

Judge
15-01-2015, 21:20
As I heard they want to print up 500 billion euros. Going American style.

They take it in turns, the fed then the Japanese and not to be left out the EU...

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 21:21
A bit late to be running for francs now......



No franks as in hotdogs cuz that's all he'll be able to afford.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 21:23
They take it in turns, the fed then the Japanese and not to be left out the EU...



They are all hurting because the system was made to break. If you run an economy on debt all you get is debt.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 21:31
We? I own neither land nor resources. You must be a very rich man or are like Rusmeister, firmly believe in fairytales. How many oil rigs and gas pipelines do you own? I neither own any nor benefit from any.



Oh contraire my Russian hating friend! You own Gazprom and the pipelines Rosneft and much more. You own them and are to protect them. You instead want to give it all to America.

Russian Lad
15-01-2015, 21:50
You own Gazprom and the pipelines Rosneft and much more. You own them and are to protect them.

They haven't shared a single copeck with me, why should I protect them now?:) Sorry, I don't offer charity. I can work for them for money if they or their affiliates hire me. But I have refused many offers since 2008 simply because I don't work for food and view such employment as charity work too (which, again, I don't do, especially to big corporations).

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 22:06
They haven't shared a single copeck with me, why should I protect them now?:) Sorry, I don't offer charity. I can work for them for money if they or their affiliates hire me. But I have refused many offers since 2008 simply because I don't work for food and view such employment as charity work too (which, again, I don't do, especially to big corporations).



They work for you dear boy. They help keep your taxes low and your army in tip top shape.

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 22:07
....as West European economies are beginning to suffer from the US of A led & encouraged sanctions against the RF.


Austria, Hungary, Italy, Cyprus, Slovakia, France and the Czech Republic support lifting the sanctions on Russia put in place for its involvement in Ukraine, citing an unnamed diplomatic source in Brussels. A source had previously told the news outlet that the European Union would not make any decisions on sanctions at their first meeting this year, scheduled for Jan. 19. According to that source, the sanctions will come under review again in March. However, there have been other indications that the European Union could decide to partially normalize relations with Russia at the Jan. 19 meeting if Russia changes its stance on the conflict in Ukraine.

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 22:16
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2015/01/15/world/europe/15reuters-lithuania-manual.html

VILNIUS — Lithuania is publishing a manual to advise its citizens on how to survive a war on its soil as concerns grow that Russia's intervention in Ukraine heralds increased assertiveness in its tiny Baltic neighbors.

"Keep a sound mind, don't panic and don't lose clear thinking," the manual explains. "Gunshots just outside your window are not the end of the world."

The manual, which the Defence Ministry will send to libraries next week and also distribute at army events, says Lithuanians should resist foreign occupation with demonstrations and strikes, "or at least doing your job worse than usual".

In the event of invasion, the manual says Lithuanians should organize themselves through Twitter and Facebook and attempt cyber attacks against the enemy.

Lithuania spent much of the last century incorporated in Soviet Union, along with Latvia and Estonia, and upon independence in 1991 quickly sought to join the Western NATO alliance and the European Union.

It is increasingly worried about Russia, not least because of a military drill in the Russian enclave of Kaliningrad last month that featured 9,000 soldiers and more than 55 naval vessels.

"The examples of Georgia and Ukraine, which both lost a part of their territory, show us that we cannot rule out a similar kind of situation here, and that we should be ready," Defence Minister Juozas Olekas told Reuters.

The Lithuanian army and its paramilitary reserve force have seen increased recruitment since the crisis in Ukraine.

"When Russia started its aggression in Ukraine, here in Lithuania our citizens understood that our neighbor is not friendly," Olekas added.

The government is also considering requiring all future buildings to incorporate a bomb shelter on the premises.

Russia annexed the Crimean peninsula from Ukraine last year, and Western governments say they have overwhelming evidence that it is supplying troops and weaponry to pro-Russian separatists who have seized parts of eastern Ukraine, an accusation that Moscow denies.

(Writing by Alistair Scrutton; Editing by Kevin Liffey)

:D

Comrades, who knows where I can get this 100-pages doc? :)


Pleased to learn that the Kaliningrad Oblast is being significantly re-inforced by those paid to protect the RF's interests :)

fenrir
15-01-2015, 22:29
They are all hurting because the system was made to break. If you run an economy on debt all you get is debt.

The ruble has been losing major ground for two weeks and has needed active, EXPENSIVE intervention to prop it up and Russia has seen the need to reshuffle its central bank's board. Has either the EU or the US done the same things?

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 22:38
The ruble has been losing major ground for two weeks and has needed active, EXPENSIVE intervention to prop it up and Russia has seen the need to reshuffle its central bank's board. Has either the EU or the US done the same things?



No they just keep lying to you putting you more in debt and making you pay more for things.

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 22:48
No they just keep lying to you putting you more in debt and making you pay more for things.

I read yesterday that domestic household spending in December 2014 was down in the US of A. I guess that only means that the consumer has less confidence in their economy than the White House does!

Yaks
15-01-2015, 23:33
er if a few countries left the eurozone the Euro would rise, not fall. The Euro is a rebranded deutschemark, such is the size of the German economy. To be competitive for exports it saddles on some poor neighbours which devalues the currency. They in turn get access to its banks and lower interest rates to also buy German goods. It is extremely hard for Greece to leave and would put itself in deep recession for years but it might eventually be able to trade out of it with its new non euro currency dropping through the floor, making its exports cheap. but it wouldnt be pretty in the meantime.

Personally I give the chances of Greece leaving only slightly better than Russia leaving Crimea...

Carl
15-01-2015, 23:41
Get yourself some franks boy.

FFS mate, make up your mind! Rubles, gold or franks?:confused1:

Yaks
15-01-2015, 23:41
One day Kaliningrad oblast will be returned to its rightful owners and maybe we will even get compensation for the years of occupation. ;) I would say the German army should march that way to connect it with the rest of Germany once more, but that was already tried in 1939.

Still..

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 23:43
I read yesterday that domestic household spending in December 2014 was down in the US of A. I guess that only means that the consumer has less confidence in their economy than the White House does!



Washington lies! They just updated their unemployment figures and it's not so rosy now. Biggest thing is wages are not going up and interests rates cannot change! With the price of oil down so low people will now default on loans.

The great manipulation is about to start to unravel.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 23:47
FFS mate, make up your mind! Rubles, gold or franks?:confused1:




Gold rubles ah golden rubles!

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 23:48
They can try, but they will get their feet wet!

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 23:49
Personally I give the chances of Greece leaving only slightly better than Russia leaving Crimea...

Spot on!

TolkoRaz
15-01-2015, 23:51
Washington lies! They just updated their unemployment figures and it's not so rosy now. Biggest thing is wages are not going up and interests rates cannot change! With the price of oil down so low people will now default on loans.

The great manipulation is about to start to unravel.

I see BP, Shell and others are now cancelling massive projects in the North Sea and Qatar, and terminating staff because the price of oil has fallen so much.

One expert has said today that oil will be $50 a barrel for at least 3 years - interesting times! :piano:

Uncle Wally
15-01-2015, 23:55
They can try, but they will get their feet wet!


I know a short cut through Poland.

tonytony
16-01-2015, 00:53
Gold rubles ah golden rubles!


I know exactly what you mean. Unfortunately, I'm a bit of a geek who caught numismatism many years ago.

As a result I now actually have several gold roubles. This is a gold 2 rouble coin that I bought at an auction about four years ago; it's from the time of Empress Elizaveta - for those that don't know Russian history so well, she was the youngest daughter of Peter the Great

Russian Lad
16-01-2015, 00:53
I see BP, Shell and others are now cancelling massive projects in the North Sea and Qatar, and terminating staff because the price of oil has fallen so much.

I assume Lukoil and Rosneft are frantically hiring new employees?
Let's remember that the US well-being is not heavily dependent on high oil prices, unlike Russia's well-being.

fenrir
16-01-2015, 10:56
Washington lies! They just updated their unemployment figures and it's not so rosy now. Biggest thing is wages are not going up and interests rates cannot change! With the price of oil down so low people will now default on loans.

The great manipulation is about to start to unravel.

Yet it is in Russia where there is double digit inflation and whose banking sector is in danger of collapse. And long-term low oil prices mean the pain is only beginning.

Armoured
16-01-2015, 11:25
The reason for this is that the CHF has been pegged against the Euro for the last three years and the Swiss National Bank has spent billions to defend that position - not unlike the Russian central bank recently.

But this morning they suddenly announced that they weren't going to do that any more. So the Euro fell off a cliff after this was announced and has lost about 20% against the CHF and 1.5% against the USD.

I admit I was simplifying tremendously for the logic-challenged here.

I kind of disagree with one point you make though - the direction of 'spending' by the SNB is completely different. SNB was trying to restrain increase in value of CHF - which it did by effectively printing CHF (for free) and using those CHF to buy Euros. This is the _opposite_ of what Russia was doing recently (although not dissimilar to Russia during the oil boom/reserves increase, or China during its long boom). You could argue that SNB was getting something (Euros) for nothing (CHF that it prints electronically).

The 'cost' therefore is different - it's the loss of control of monetary policy. That's really the reason they decided to get off the peg, the inflows of money and imbalances were getting out of hand. (There obviously is a balance sheet loss now that the SNB's Euro reserves are worth less in CHF terms than before - although SNB could theoretically have kept doing its Euro cap forever or as long as there was excess demand for CHF, but again, central banks are different).

Anyway, was just making the point that this is hardly info that supports the point that gold is great / fiat currencies doomed.

FatAndy
16-01-2015, 11:36
I know a short cut through Poland.
Poles will be happy? :eh:

Uncle Wally
16-01-2015, 11:46
I assume Lukoil and Rosneft are frantically hiring new employees?
Let's remember that the US well-being is not heavily dependent on high oil prices, unlike Russia's well-being.


No it's dependent on fooling you into believing the dollar is worth something when in reality it's worth less and less.

Uncle Wally
16-01-2015, 11:50
the bigger more important question is why is so little copper is being bought, copper lost 9% in trading on Shanghai yesterday, that's suggesting a hugely grim outlook for manufacturing industry around the globe, and retail - Gold is so last thursday dear, governments with populist manifestos dabble to be seen and private investors with limited access and a cunning plan, (same dudes usually have a master plan to predict roulette), move the stuff around a bit, but copper is more your fundamental test, and the test results are looking pretty poorly



Why don't you look at the US bond market?

Then come back and tell us how well America is doing.

fenrir
16-01-2015, 12:47
Why don't you look at the US bond market?

Then come back and tell us how well America is doing.

Does America have double-digit inflation? How many banks in the US have received bailouts recently?

AstarD
16-01-2015, 12:47
And what has the US bond market got to do with the price of copper?

Russian Lad
16-01-2015, 19:18
No it's dependent on fooling you into believing the dollar is worth something when in reality it's worth less and less.
__________________

Wally, you are making absolutely senseless and illogical comments. The dollar was 33 rubles only a few months ago, right now it is 65 and growing. One can buy more goods with this currency here in Russia now. I mean, get real, you are a grown up man. I know you are a "patriot" and live in some sort of a Dreamland, but there are limits.
By the way, a huge Russian translation agency has informed me today my payment in rubles for December 2014 will be paid only on February 15, 2015, that's a two months delay. Salaries are not paid on time. The crisis has covered Russia in earnest. Some families will starve. If it was my only source of income, I would starve now too. I would have no money to buy me food, here and now, as simple as that.

Uncle Wally
17-01-2015, 00:05
Wally, you are making absolutely senseless and illogical comments. The dollar was 33 rubles only a few months ago, right now it is 65 and growing. One can buy more goods with this currency here in Russia now. I mean, get real, you are a grown up man. I know you are a "patriot" and live in some sort of a Dreamland, but there are limits.
By the way, a huge Russian translation agency has informed me today my payment in rubles for December 2014 will be paid only on February 15, 2015, that's a two months delay. Salaries are not paid on time. The crisis has covered Russia in earnest. Some families will starve. If it was my only source of income, I would starve now too. I would have no money to buy me food, here and now, as simple as that.


When I was young a coke cost 5 cents, a new car was $1600, a house $10,000 a whole meal at McDonalds cost 85 cents!

Uncle Wally
17-01-2015, 00:06
I know exactly what you mean. Unfortunately, I'm a bit of a geek who caught numismatism many years ago.

As a result I now actually have several gold roubles. This is a gold 2 rouble coin that I bought at an auction about four years ago; it's from the time of Empress Elizaveta - for those that don't know Russian history so well, she was the youngest daughter of Peter the Great



Very nice!

Uncle Wally
17-01-2015, 00:08
Does America have double-digit inflation? How many banks in the US have received bailouts recently?



You too look at bonds.

Russian Lad
17-01-2015, 00:09
When I was young a coke cost 5 cents, a new car was $1600, a house $10,000 a whole meal at McDonalds cost 85 cents!

I know that, and? The salaries were much less in dollars too I reckon.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0104547.html

Uncle Wally
17-01-2015, 00:17
I know that, and? The salaries were much less in dollars too I reckon.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0104547.html



Yes but they have not kept pace. Just like this boom in America's economy, they lie about more jobs and say nothing about wages not going up.

Yaks
17-01-2015, 06:46
When I was young a coke cost 5 cents, a new car was $1600, a house $10,000 a whole meal at McDonalds cost 85 cents!

If you look at the chart the US house price to income has been largely static(keeping pace) over the last few decades. It takes the same amount of time to pay it off. So your assertions about the US are wrong.

Whereas in other western countries there has been a blow out in house prices but that is capital growth and you might be the only person who complains about that.

Russian Lad
17-01-2015, 08:19
If you look at the chart the US house price to income has been largely static(keeping pace) over the last few decades. It takes the same amount of time to pay it off. So your assertions about the US are wrong.

What, Wally is wrong again??? Poor, poor Wally. Wally, you should take up the new nick - Wrangly.

Uncle Wally
17-01-2015, 08:55
What, Wally is wrong again??? Poor, poor Wally. Wally, you should take up the new nick - Wrangly.



Are you sure it's not the chart that's wrong?

tonytony
17-01-2015, 12:48
If you look at the chart the US house price to income has been largely static(keeping pace) over the last few decades. It takes the same amount of time to pay it off. So your assertions about the US are wrong.

Whereas in other western countries there has been a blow out in house prices but that is capital growth and you might be the only person who complains about that.


I would also have complaints about the capital growth. This only helps if you are getting out of the market or are down sizing. Otherwise it just makes things a lot more difficult to buy your first house or move up to a larger house when you have children.

That chart stopped in 2011, well the UK is now on a figure of nine times earnings - that's a lot higher than on that chart. The typical first time buyer, a young couple or person buying their first place is having to typically pay over 700 ($1050) per month in mortgage payments. The average take home pay after tax in the UK is 1,800 per month.

By the way, I really can't believe how cheap property is in most of the USA. I know several people who have bought holiday homes there over the last few years because property is just so cheap there.

Russian Lad
17-01-2015, 13:21
By the way, I really can't believe how cheap property is in most of the USA. I know several people who have bought holiday homes there over the last few years because property is just so cheap there.

Guess that's because they have way more free space than what is available on your island.:)

snowdrift
17-01-2015, 13:42
By the way, I really can't believe how cheap property is in most of the USA. I know several people who have bought holiday homes there over the last few years because property is just so cheap there.

it is not that cheap. Apart from the quality of building, prices are bound to and depend on two factors basically: economic situation in the area and how good/bad the neighbourhood is in general. It is common for both Americas. So, once expensive property may become cheap because there are no work nearby and many, say muslims or blacks, live alongside. However, these factors are not so important when people buy property to spend just a couple of weeks per year there.

Judge
20-01-2015, 14:20
Not much debt when comparing to others...

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/central-bank-says-russia-s-foreign-debt-fell-130-billion-in-2014/514610.html

And companies are not refinancing,could Russia be more or less debt free in a few years. ..

AstarD
20-01-2015, 14:21
How can they not refinance? They will default if they don't.

Judge
20-01-2015, 14:27
How can they not refinance? They will default if they don't.
Read the article, they are paying off the debt..... if they can't refinance then bad news also for the banks...

It's better the companies pay off their debt instead of getting in more debt, these sanctions just might be a blessing in disguise for some Russian companies.

Armoured
20-01-2015, 14:36
Not much debt when comparing to others...
...
And companies are not refinancing,could Russia be more or less debt free in a few years. ..

This part is interesting:
Foreign exchange reserves have also been falling rapidly, however, declining last year to $385.5 billion from $509.6 billion.

The Central Bank said external debt of companies and banks at the start of 2015 stood at $547.6 billion, down from $651.2 billion a year earlier.

So foreign debt went down by about $110 billion. Which is slightly _less_ than the $125 billion decline in official reserves.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2015, 15:18
Read the article, they are paying off the debt..... if they can't refinance then bad news also for the banks...

It's better the companies pay off their debt instead of getting in more debt, these sanctions just might be a blessing in disguise for some Russian companies.



But that's not the American way! Debt debt we need more DEBT!!!

drbobguy
20-01-2015, 15:30
This part is interesting:

So foreign debt went down by about $110 billion. Which is slightly _less_ than the $125 billion decline in official reserves.

I think it's slightly more complicated than what that implies.

Foreign debt is going down, but internal/domestic debt is certainly increasing. The strategic reserves are beginning to be used (and will be used much more shortly) to pay foreign creditors their dollars/euros back, but this doesn't actually decrease reserves, as the assets that are taken on are now Russian domestic assets. So in effect the government is replacing its low-risk foreign assets with higher-risk domestic assets, decreasing the robustness of the government's financial position.

It's definitely the correct move, but people should be wary that a decrease in foreign debt doesn't imply the health of Russian companies is improving or that their debt load has decreased.

zzhhst
20-01-2015, 15:36
You use money to make money!!! What is so hard to understand? Money is nothing more than a tool in your box of many. No country in the world can live on the gold standard. Stop living in the past. It will consume you.life is about the future not the what if!:10641:

Armoured
20-01-2015, 15:39
I think it's slightly more complicated than what that implies.

...but people should be wary that a decrease in foreign debt doesn't imply the health of Russian companies is improving or that their debt load has decreased.

I think I overall agree with your analysis, I hadn't intended to imply anything in particular (as I hadn't worked it through and am still not sure).

I mostly just meant to note what you said - that 'foreign debt down by X' tells a rather ambiguous story if it's accompanied by statement that 'official reserves are down by the same amount.'

Judge
20-01-2015, 23:07
But that's not the American way! Debt debt we need more DEBT!!!

The EU is not too far away from America,total debt about $13 trillion ,not to worry, the EU bazooka is polished and ready....they might shoot out 500 billion or a measly trillion. ....
They should cancel all the Greek debt,help them out , but the money will probably end up where it shouldn't. ....
You never know, a few billion might even end up in Russia :11158:

Uncle Wally
20-01-2015, 23:20
You use money to make money!!! What is so hard to understand? Money is nothing more than a tool in your box of many. No country in the world can live on the gold standard. Stop living in the past. It will consume you.life is about the future not the what if!:10641:



All have failed that haven't stuck with gold.

Judge
21-01-2015, 09:00
More on Russia paying off her debts and a few comments from an expert..



Overall this is good adjustment," said Alfa Bank economist Natalia Orlova. "When you have oil prices declining and the economy is making less money on the trade balance, it's normal that foreign debt should go down."


http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSL6N0UZ15320150120?irpc=932

AstarD
21-01-2015, 09:47
All have failed that haven't stuck with gold.The USA was on the Gold standard when the Great Depression hit, wasn't it?

Armoured
21-01-2015, 10:07
All have failed that haven't stuck with gold.

So who is still on the gold standard?

Couldn't you say 'all have failed that tried to stick with gold'?

FatAndy
21-01-2015, 10:47
"Crisis, crisis... 40 years ago a bottle of vodka was 3.62 rub (4 dollars), so does now for the current rate. Stability!"(C)

Judge
21-01-2015, 10:54
"Crisis, crisis... 40 years ago a bottle of vodka was 3.62 rub (4 dollars), so does now for the current rate. Stability!"(C)

Good one :applause::applause:

TolkoRaz
21-01-2015, 11:00
"Crisis, crisis... 40 years ago a bottle of vodka was 3.62 rub (4 dollars), so does now for the current rate. Stability!"(C)

I will drink to that! :)

Водка без пива - деньги на ветер! ;)

FatAndy
21-01-2015, 11:16
Водка без пива - деньги на ветер! ;)
No, reverse... ;)

fenrir
21-01-2015, 12:07
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2015/01/20/russian-oil-giant-gazprom-downgraded-by-moodys/?partner=yahootix

Another downgrade. This is getting boringly routine these days. Of course, Wally will go on about US debt and how Joe Blow lost his job in Boise, Idaho to try and deflect the issue.

Armoured
21-01-2015, 12:22
Another downgrade.

This is a non-event after Russia was downgraded. Traditionally they don't let companies in a country have a higher rating than the country itself, so the Gazprom downgrade was quasi-automatic.

What _will_ be significant is if anyone big is downgraded to junk - there are some companies/banks that have traditionally had a 'one notch below' (sovereign) rating. So if anyone that was BBB- (or equivalent) before _should_ be moved down a notch, and that would have consequences.