PDA

View Full Version : economic situation in russia



Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21

fenrir
31-07-2015, 17:05
Seems the ruble is going the other way now^ up. It's falling again. Things are too volatile right now to make any accurate predictions.

fenrir
31-07-2015, 17:10
Average Bribe in Russia Doubles in Rubles, Remains Steady in Dollars

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/average-bribe-in-russia-doubles-in-rubles-remains-steady-in-dollars/526556.html

And certain clueless (or just outright lying) posters say how the US is more corrupt than Russia.

fenrir
31-07-2015, 17:18
OPEC says oil will not go any lower.

Oh, really?

Oil falls after OPEC comments imply no supply cut

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/oil-falls-opec-comments-imply-092111461.html

The article came up only two hours ago.

Carl
31-07-2015, 17:40
He was "projecting" his own personal issues onto me in non-polite manner, and didn't understand my hints to stop. Insha alla.

Nope.. no personal issues here. Our illustrious Andy just has very thin skin when it comes to those who do not agree with him. (What happened to the 'finger' smiley?)

penka
31-07-2015, 17:44
It's falling again. Things are too volatile right now to make any accurate predictions.

Naturally, it's falling. Oil is low and CB lowed key interest to 11%.

penka
31-07-2015, 17:45
Average Bribe in Russia Doubles in Rubles, Remains Steady in Dollars

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/average-bribe-in-russia-doubles-in-rubles-remains-steady-in-dollars/526556.html

And certain clueless (or just outright lying) posters say how the US is more corrupt than Russia.

You'd better take more cash for your vacation, dräng!:D

FatAndy
31-07-2015, 18:04
Our illustrious Andy just has very thin skin when it comes to those who do not agree with him.
Come on, I banned you on the second day only. :) Finger smiley seems gone with older shell. But I love you too.


the US is more corrupt than Russia.
Sure. They live in KAPITALIZOM longer then we do. ;)

Russian Lad
31-07-2015, 19:02
Naturally, it's falling.

Naturally???!!! A mind-boggling and shattering 100% collapse of the national currency to the gutter level (combined with the almost doubled CB interest rate) within a year sounds like something natural to you?:) So, I assume when it hits 100 rubles per 1 dollar, you will also call it natural? And no big deal? You have no pity at all for millions of your compatriots now suffering from malnutrition and unable to feed their children with proper food because it has become too expensive for them, while you are comfortably weathering the storm abroad, earning your salary in a foreign currency and visiting delicious restaurants and fancy resorts (I assume that because you have told Fenrir his 3K euros are not enough for a nice vacation in the Crimea during 15 days)?

penka
31-07-2015, 19:06
Come on, I banned you on the second day only. :) Finger smiley seems gone with older shell. But I love you too.


Sure. They live in KAPITALIZOM longer then we do. ;)


Your tolerance level is flabbergasting and utmost humbling, Andy. Seriously.

penka
31-07-2015, 19:17
Naturally???!!! 100% collapse within a year sounds like something natural to you?:) So, I assume when it hits 100 rubles per 1 dollar, you will also call it natural? And no big deal? You have no pity at all for millions of your compatriots now suffering from malnutrition and unable to feed their children with proper food because it has become too expensive for them, while you are comfortably weathering the storm abroad, earning your salary in a foreign currency and visiting delicious restaurants and fancy resorts (I assume that because you have told Fenrir his 3K euros are not enough for a nice vacation in the Crimea during 15 days)?

Quit being such a hysterical sissy:) Your populistic and provocative rant doesn't have much effect on me. But perhaps, you should start giving lessons to the trolls:)
Envy is a self-destructing quality, my friend.
Foreign currency means foreign taxes and foreign prices which you blissfully forget about.
Besides, stop b**ing. I offered you a position of my slave for a good pay and you declined. If you are so picky, you should not complain.

Russian Lad
31-07-2015, 19:21
Envy is a self-destructing quality, my friend.

Where did I say I envy you? You are making up stuff.


I offered you a position of my slave for a good pay and you declined. If you are so picky, you should not complain.

Well, have you managed to find a decent slave? You should consult the Ukrainians - it is common knowledge here in Russia that each of them gets two Russian speaking slaves and a plot of land, the mainstream Russian media covered this fact extensively a while back...

FatAndy
31-07-2015, 19:56
Your tolerance level is flabbergasting and utmost humbling, Andy. Seriously.
Thank you, dear :) I also love you, but more than Carl :D

tonytony
31-07-2015, 21:23
This has just been published by the BBC. I don't know what people here think:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33717488

Russian debtors despair as boom turns to bust

31 July 2015

Millions of Russians took out loans during the economic boom years, but now they face crippling debts and the law is not on their side, the BBC's Oleg Boldyrev reports.

At the start of each month Elena, a 40-year-old Muscovite, spreads all the family cash on the table and starts dividing it into small piles.
"When I do this I shake, I feel nauseous," she says.

"This goes to one bank, that to another, then the third one… There's one more bank, but we don't have the money for them - I had to go and buy some food. I guess we'll have to put up with their telephone reminders."

Elena and her husband owe well over 1m roubles (about £10,800; $17,000) to those four banks. After the cash piles are sorted the family of three is left with only 10,000 roubles (£107; $167). That puts them below the poverty line - and recently Elena lost her job.

Debt mountain

Millions of those in debt live like Elena.

According to the Russian United Credit Bureau (UCB), 40 million Russians have loans or mortgages. By June, 12.5m of those loans had not been paid for at least a month, and in another 8m cases the arrears stretched back over three months.

The Russian Central Bank says those chronic debts now total 1tn roubles (£10.7bn; $16.7bn). And that is at least 10% of the total personal debt - 10% which cannot be recovered by the banks.

For Elena and her husband, this is a story of almost two decades of borrowing. They started getting loans in the mid-1990s to pay for their daughter's medical treatment. Then they took a bigger loan to pay off the smaller ones.

It all seemed manageable, says Elena, but then new expenses came along - and two banks offered credit cards with generous conditions.
"We were a bit stupid," Elena says. "They told us the minimum payment was 5,000 roubles a month and we paid that every month. But that was just the interest, not the loan itself."

Sudden shocks

During Russia's boom years credit history checks meant virtually nothing. An individual already saddled with loans could take out another one, hoping to pay off previous debts. The small print was often too small to bother about.

Then the music stopped. Money got tight after the 2008 global financial crisis and Western sanctions against Russia over its role in the Ukraine conflict.

The average personal loan in 2014 was 54,600 roubles.

Olga Mazurova is head of Sentinel Credit Management, one of Russia's largest debt-collecting agencies. She says that often Russians are hit by a sudden drop in income, because "the firm goes bankrupt, the working week is cut, there are layoffs or wage cuts - we see that especially in industrial cities in Siberia and the Urals". Few Russians have insurance for such contingencies, she says.

Debtors cannot get much help. There are plans to amend the law on insolvency, to allow individuals to be declared bankrupt. But nothing will happen on that until October. Russian MPs decided that criminal courts were unprepared for the likely flood of such cases and that courts of arbitration should handle debt cases instead.

Each debtor has to beg the bank to cut them some slack. But Russia's financial ombudsman Pavel Medvedev says that rarely works if someone owes money to more than one institution.

A former adviser to President Vladimir Putin, he knows many top Russian financiers personally - but that does not help him to lobby on behalf of indebted callers. Typically, he says, lenders refuse to restructure personal debts with the words: "I've got a business to run and shareholders demand profits - I can't do it!"

Mr Medvedev says his success rate in helping debtors has dropped from 51% to 33% and "this year it's probably going to be around 16%".

No escape

He had no solution for one caller, Vladimir Frolov, living near Moscow.

Mr Frolov started borrowing four years ago to help his partner, living separately from him, in Ukraine. The debts snowballed. Finally, unable to get an unsecured loan, he mortgaged the flat he shares with his elderly parents.

His father Anatoly, who co-signed the agreement, is bewildered when asked which bank it was. "How should I know? They took us into some room, the light was dim and the print was tiny. I just asked if everything was alright and they told me it was."

Besides the mortgage, Vladimir Frolov's parents took out two loans to help him, which eat up 18,000 of their 22,000-rouble monthly pension allowance.

And now Vladimir has defaulted on the mortgage. The bank is suing and they may well lose their only dwelling. "There must be a normal way out - maybe give the bank a fixed share of my wages?" Vladimir wonders. But so far he has not found anyone at the bank to discuss his dilemma.

"Isn't there a law against this?" asks his father, equally helplessly. "How can they let people borrow so much without checking them first?" After the good years many Russians are now getting a harsh lesson in capitalism - and inadequate regulations mean there is nothing to soften the blow.

fenrir
31-07-2015, 21:50
You'd better take more cash for your vacation, dräng!:D

I'll take that under consideration, põllutööline!

penka
31-07-2015, 22:22
This has just been published by the BBC. I don't know what people here think:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33717488

Russian debtors despair as boom turns to bust

31 July 2015

Millions of Russians took out loans during the economic boom years, but now they face crippling debts and the law is not on their side, the BBC's Oleg Boldyrev reports.

At the start of each month Elena, a 40-year-old Muscovite, spreads all the family cash on the table and starts dividing it into small piles.
"When I do this I shake, I feel nauseous," she says.

"This goes to one bank, that to another, then the third one… There's one more bank, but we don't have the money for them - I had to go and buy some food. I guess we'll have to put up with their telephone reminders."

Elena and her husband owe well over 1m roubles (about £10,800; $17,000) to those four banks. After the cash piles are sorted the family of three is left with only 10,000 roubles (£107; $167). That puts them below the poverty line - and recently Elena lost her job.

Debt mountain

Millions of those in debt live like Elena.

According to the Russian United Credit Bureau (UCB), 40 million Russians have loans or mortgages. By June, 12.5m of those loans had not been paid for at least a month, and in another 8m cases the arrears stretched back over three months.

The Russian Central Bank says those chronic debts now total 1tn roubles (£10.7bn; $16.7bn). And that is at least 10% of the total personal debt - 10% which cannot be recovered by the banks.

For Elena and her husband, this is a story of almost two decades of borrowing. They started getting loans in the mid-1990s to pay for their daughter's medical treatment. Then they took a bigger loan to pay off the smaller ones.

It all seemed manageable, says Elena, but then new expenses came along - and two banks offered credit cards with generous conditions.
"We were a bit stupid," Elena says. "They told us the minimum payment was 5,000 roubles a month and we paid that every month. But that was just the interest, not the loan itself."

Sudden shocks

During Russia's boom years credit history checks meant virtually nothing. An individual already saddled with loans could take out another one, hoping to pay off previous debts. The small print was often too small to bother about.

Then the music stopped. Money got tight after the 2008 global financial crisis and Western sanctions against Russia over its role in the Ukraine conflict.

The average personal loan in 2014 was 54,600 roubles.

Olga Mazurova is head of Sentinel Credit Management, one of Russia's largest debt-collecting agencies. She says that often Russians are hit by a sudden drop in income, because "the firm goes bankrupt, the working week is cut, there are layoffs or wage cuts - we see that especially in industrial cities in Siberia and the Urals". Few Russians have insurance for such contingencies, she says.

Debtors cannot get much help. There are plans to amend the law on insolvency, to allow individuals to be declared bankrupt. But nothing will happen on that until October. Russian MPs decided that criminal courts were unprepared for the likely flood of such cases and that courts of arbitration should handle debt cases instead.

Each debtor has to beg the bank to cut them some slack. But Russia's financial ombudsman Pavel Medvedev says that rarely works if someone owes money to more than one institution.

A former adviser to President Vladimir Putin, he knows many top Russian financiers personally - but that does not help him to lobby on behalf of indebted callers. Typically, he says, lenders refuse to restructure personal debts with the words: "I've got a business to run and shareholders demand profits - I can't do it!"

Mr Medvedev says his success rate in helping debtors has dropped from 51% to 33% and "this year it's probably going to be around 16%".

No escape

He had no solution for one caller, Vladimir Frolov, living near Moscow.

Mr Frolov started borrowing four years ago to help his partner, living separately from him, in Ukraine. The debts snowballed. Finally, unable to get an unsecured loan, he mortgaged the flat he shares with his elderly parents.

His father Anatoly, who co-signed the agreement, is bewildered when asked which bank it was. "How should I know? They took us into some room, the light was dim and the print was tiny. I just asked if everything was alright and they told me it was."

Besides the mortgage, Vladimir Frolov's parents took out two loans to help him, which eat up 18,000 of their 22,000-rouble monthly pension allowance.

And now Vladimir has defaulted on the mortgage. The bank is suing and they may well lose their only dwelling. "There must be a normal way out - maybe give the bank a fixed share of my wages?" Vladimir wonders. But so far he has not found anyone at the bank to discuss his dilemma.

"Isn't there a law against this?" asks his father, equally helplessly. "How can they let people borrow so much without checking them first?" After the good years many Russians are now getting a harsh lesson in capitalism - and inadequate regulations mean there is nothing to soften the blow.


Yes, it is awful. I believe those people and their stories.
Banks in RF take extremely high interest, the loan, even a mortgage is very time-limited unlike elsewhere and one must pay off the principle. BTW, paying off the principle obligatory is about to be re-introduced in Europe.
However, those are adult, sane people, who lived through the 90s. The have read the bank deed of agreement, presumably. And they signed it.
I repeat, it is RF. Socialism is over. They lived through the 90s.
However awful, the state is not coming to a rescue.

In Europe they will calculate how old are you, how much you earn, what are your dependants, what you own, etc before even considering giving you a loan.
In Sweden one can declare personal bankruptcy and the state will release you. But then you are screwed. All your possessions worth of anything will be confiscated, screaming underage children or not. From each penny you earn, a hefty percentage will be taken by the collectors to cover the debt and you will have to learn how to survive on very little means. After you will clear your debt before the state, you will not be granted any credit card for 10 years. And your bad credit history will haunt you. That is Sweden, the land of social welfare. Just to compare.

penka
31-07-2015, 22:23
Thank you, dear :) I also love you, but more than Carl :D

I love you too!:) far more than Carl, believe me!

penka
31-07-2015, 22:27
I'll take that under consideration, põllutööline!


That's you, my little dräng.
You can call me Master:) Must come natural to your kind in any case:)

fenrir
31-07-2015, 22:44
That's you, my little dräng.
You can call me Master:) Must come natural to your kind in any case:)

That is a bit rich from a väejooksik. And try not to forget that I am American. You know, from the country that defeated yours in the Cold War, and still frightens the bejeezus out of Moscow even now.

Uncle Wally
31-07-2015, 22:52
That is a bit rich from a väejooksik. And try not to forget that I am American. You know, from the country that defeated yours in the Cold War, and still frightens the bejeezus out of Moscow even now.


America "defeated" the USSR huh? Last time I checked Russia was her own sovereign country. The only thing that "frightens" Russia about America is the freakin loonies that want to take the world on a suicide ride. It's when people like you say stupid stuff like that is when normal people get frighten, Russia or American.

penka
31-07-2015, 23:24
That is a bit rich from a väejooksik. And try not to forget that I am American. You know, from the country that defeated yours in the Cold War, and still frightens the bejeezus out of Moscow even now.

You're getting emotional and agitated, dräng:D

fenrir
31-07-2015, 23:29
You're getting emotional and agitated, dräng:D

And you are delusional, väejooksik. It happens to the defeated. It helps them psychologically deal with their inferiority.

fenrir
31-07-2015, 23:31
America "defeated" the USSR huh? Last time I checked Russia was her own sovereign country. The only thing that "frightens" Russia about America is the freakin loonies that want to take the world on a suicide ride. It's when people like you say stupid stuff like that is when normal people get frighten, Russia or American.

Yeah, Wally: defeated. You constantly demonstrate how badly you flunked history and are doing it again. The Cold War is over. You tell us: Who won?

nicklcool
31-07-2015, 23:32
If the fundamentals were great (there were all the chances one can imagine to make them great, with the oil around and over 100 for years), it would not be bad right now. And there are all the fundamentals in place one can imagine to make it much worse in the near future. You ignore it all - fine with me. Unlike you, I live in Russia, Russian is my mother tongue, I have a Russian passport - so I may know a bit more about the situation in Russia than a Cool Nick living in the US and offering his "expert opinion" on the situation in Russia from the comfort of his American home... You do sound like an Olgino troll though, you may not even be located in the US. Who knows. Keep typing for the sake of typing, if you want. The dollar is 61 already, the euro - 67. All is just f...ing great. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J88-RdWnNT0

This is not true at all. The fundamentals are awful in Amerikkka, yet her economy is in a weak recession vs. absolute collapse. Likewise IMHO the economy in RF is going through a rough patch now but fundamentals (see my list) point to a stronger future.

Keep calling me a troll, RL -- name-calling is the rhetorical tactic people resort to when they cannot argue the merits of their position.

More fun facts!! :wazzup::uk:

1. Female Workforce participation rate is rising in RF and falling in USA (http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SL.TLF.CACT.FE.ZS)

2. Also, overall workforce participation rate is rising in RF yet falling in the USA (http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SL.TLF.CACT.ZS) ...If you look at this data, what REALLY surprised me is that in 2012 the participation rate in RF actually was higher than in the USA!

The trend is your friend!!

So, which country has the brighter future? The one with more and more people working (and paying taxes), a.k.a. "makers," or the one with more and more people receiving social welfare, a.k.a. "takers"? :trampoline:

RL, I'm offering my opinion interspersed with actual stats and facts, what are you offering again? :suspect:

You mentioned oil again, is that what you're banking on, that oil will never recover?

And in case my locale matters (I think it does not), if you recall, I'm making the move soon to the Rodina, so I will have some skin in the game! :uk:

Russian Lad
31-07-2015, 23:47
so I will have some skin in the game!

When? Put your skin in first, then we can talk. After 3-5 months of your skin-testing here. If you are still around after the probation period. Get real, young man, deeds count more than words.
My personal opinion is though, irrespective of an economic situation in a country, it is better to avoid pinning your business on a certain geographical location. But that's just me, you may disregard that.

nicklcool
01-08-2015, 00:11
When? Put your skin in first, then we can talk. After 3-5 months of your skin-testing here. If you are still around after the probation period. Get real, young man, deeds count more than words.
My personal opinion is though, irrespective of an economic situation in a country, it is better to avoid pinning your business on a certain geographical location. But that's just me, you may disregard that.

C'mon, "young man"!? Let's stop with the insults RL, no need to call me a troll or be patronizing. Penka and Fenrir seem to have that covered in this thread, not sure where it came from, kind of random :/

It's like pulling teeth trying to get some analysis out of you. Just share some damn measurable reasons you think the economic situation in Russia is not going to turn around!

Until then you sound like the Americans who say, when I tell them I'm moving to Russia, gems like:
"You're giving up the best healthcare system in the world"
"We have more freedoms here than they do"
"You're going to live with those communists?"
"What will you do when they don't let you leave the country?"
"That Putin -- what a dictator!"

Lots of empty rhetoric but no substance :fridaysign:

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 00:53
Yeah, Wally: defeated. You constantly demonstrate how badly you flunked history and are doing it again. The Cold War is over. You tell us: Who won?



Duh, if you haven't noticed the "cold war" is not over. If it was America wouldn't be sending so many heavy weapons to eastern Europe. They wouldn't be attacking Russia economically with such zeal. Looks like those crazy neo-cons in America won't be happy until the destroy the earth.

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 01:11
C'mon, "young man"!? Let's stop with the insults RL, no need to call me a troll or be patronizing

Didn't you say you are 20+ y.o. at a certain point? I am in my forties, so I assumed calling you "young man" is legit.:) Sorry if it offended you, I was using it half-joking.


Just share some damn measurable reasons you think the economic situation in Russia is not going to turn around!

I have done it many times, do some research. Including 1.5-2 years ago when I first claimed ruble was going to crash and was laughed at by posters like Penka, FatAndy, Tolko and so forth.


Yes, it is awful. I believe those people and their stories.
Banks in RF take extremely high interest, the loan, even a mortgage is very time-limited unlike elsewhere and one must pay off the principle. BTW, paying off the principle obligatory is about to be re-introduced in Europe.
However, those are adult, sane people, who lived through the 90s. The have read the bank deed of agreement, presumably. And they signed it.
I repeat, it is RF. Socialism is over. They lived through the 90s.
However awful, the state is not coming to a rescue.

In Europe they will calculate how old are you, how much you earn, what are your dependants, what you own, etc before even considering giving you a loan.
In Sweden one can declare personal bankruptcy and the state will release you. But then you are screwed. All your possessions worth of anything will be confiscated, screaming underage children or not. From each penny you earn, a hefty percentage will be taken by the collectors to cover the debt and you will have to learn how to survive on very little means. After you will clear your debt before the state, you will not be granted any credit card for 10 years. And your bad credit history will haunt you. That is Sweden, the land of social welfare. Just to compare.

Just to compare, has Sweden's national currency been put to its knees like the ruble recently, with 100%+ devaluation? Have prices been soaring through the roof in Sweden this year? This is before we even begin discussing the real consumption power of Ru/Swe salaries...

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 06:36
Bloviating! :book:

Nice word :)

For everybody else's education, if required:

Bloviation is a style of empty, pompous political speech particularly associated with Ohio due to the term's popularization by United States President Warren G. Harding, who, himself a master of the technique, described it as "the art of speaking for as long as the occasion warrants, and saying nothing". The verb "to bloviate" is the act of creating bloviation. In terms of its etymology, according to one source, the word is a "compound of blow, in its sense of 'to boast' (also in another typical Americanism, blowhard), with a mock-Latin ending to give it the self-important stature implicit in its meaning."

I always thought "bloviate" had something to do with a cow. :)

I like this word: "verborrhea" but it isn't in any official dictionaries..."An excessive and seemingly uncontrollable amount of words that shoots out from a person. Can be written or verbal. The characteristics of the outpouring tends to be words not contributing to the general understanding of the topic at hand. "Karen’s verborrhea put an immediate halt to the discussion on the plight in Darfur.""

ORIGIN late Modern English: a portmanteau word combing early Modern English verbose with late Middle English diarrhea.

fenrir
01-08-2015, 09:03
Duh, if you haven't noticed the "cold war" is not over. If it was America wouldn't be sending so many heavy weapons to eastern Europe. They wouldn't be attacking Russia economically with such zeal. Looks like those crazy neo-cons in America won't be happy until the destroy the earth.

Wally, the Cold War you and I grew up during ended when the USSR collapsed. You do know that you are living in the Russian Federation, not the USSR, don't you? Now, who won that Cold War? Don't think about the new Cold War that is forming now, just concentrate on the 'classic' one.

fenrir
01-08-2015, 09:11
C'mon, "young man"!? Let's stop with the insults RL, no need to call me a troll or be patronizing. Penka and Fenrir seem to have that covered in this thread, not sure where it came from, kind of random :/

It's like pulling teeth trying to get some analysis out of you. Just share some damn measurable reasons you think the economic situation in Russia is not going to turn around!

Until then you sound like the Americans who say, when I tell them I'm moving to Russia, gems like:
"You're giving up the best healthcare system in the world"
"We have more freedoms here than they do"
"You're going to live with those communists?"
"What will you do when they don't let you leave the country?"
"That Putin -- what a dictator!"

Lots of empty rhetoric but no substance :fridaysign:

Dude, you have to be realistic if you are really planning to move here. Medical care is far, far better in the US than in Russia and you do have far more freedoms there than in the RF. Do you have children? Do you think it normal to have to pay big bribes just to get your kid into a nursery school (kindergarten)? What about having to pay bribes for standard medical care that the law says you are entitled to for free? I chose those two points because as a family man, they would stop me from moving to any country where what I wrote about is the case.

I'm not going to get into where is 'better' to live. My point is only that you should be realistic about where you are going to live. If you are okay with all the negatives that go along with all the positives, then go for it.

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 11:38
Dude, you have to be realistic if you are really planning to move here. Medical care is far, far better in the US than in Russia and you do have far more freedoms there than in the RF. Do you have children? Do you think it normal to have to pay big bribes just to get your kid into a nursery school (kindergarten)? What about having to pay bribes for standard medical care that the law says you are entitled to for free? I chose those two points because as a family man, they would stop me from moving to any country where what I wrote about is the case.

My grandmother spent two weeks in a hospital half a year ago - a "free" one. She was returned in a worse condition, covered with multiple bruises. She said they were literally throwing her around (especially in the reanimation room) like a sack of potatoes. That's in Saint Petersburb, I don't even want to begin thinking what the "healthcare" is like in smaller towns in Russia.
The streets of my city are full of gangs of thiefs now (I guess due to the rampant unemployment), there are many cases of mugging and robbery in my neighborhood. I don't even venture outside after midnight.
Drugs seem to have become a real issue again, due to many signs. Whenever I take a stroll in my ghetto, I see junkies operating street hookers (guess also junkies). I have had to throw out from my podyezd like 20-30 junkies this year alone.
The police, they arrest random people for drinking beer in the street or smoking beside the metro, but they seem to turn a blind eye on more serious crimes (or even serve as a "cover", I suspect).
So, the Cool Nick, WHEN are you coming?:) We can't wait. I think it is a brilliant idea, please come asap. And you absolutely must visit Saint Pete, hehe.

Nobbynumbnuts
01-08-2015, 11:59
My grandmother spent two weeks in a hospital half a year ago - a "free" one. She was returned in a worse condition, covered with multiple bruises. She said they were literally throwing her around (especially in the reanimation room) like a sack of potatoes. That's in Saint Petersburb, I don't even want to begin thinking what the "healthcare" is like in smaller towns in Russia.
The streets of my city are full of gangs of thiefs now (I guess due to the rampant unemployment), there are many cases of mugging and robbery in my neighborhood. I don't even venture outside after midnight.
Drugs seem to have become a real issue again, due to many signs. Whenever I take a stroll in my ghetto, I see junkies operating street hookers (guess also junkies). I have had to throw out from my podyezd like 20-30 junkies this year alone.
So, the Cool Nick, WHEN are you coming?:) We can't wait. I think it is a brilliant idea, please come asap.

..i had to go to a public hospital in Tyumen to have the government tests for working in the food industry. It was decrepit, run down and dingy. Reminded me of a 19th century psychiatric institution. The senior nurse i was seeing was shouting at her subordinates! Scary...

Amazing how Russian people just seem to accept the state of Russia's health service (and other public services).....But then of course, they do have a very tough leader. :rolleyes::D

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 12:04
..i had to go to a public hospital in Tyumen to have the government tests for working in the food industry. It was decrepit, run down and dingy. Reminded me of a 19th century psychiatric institution. The senior nurse i was seeing was shouting at her subordinates! Scary...

Amazing how Russian people just seem to accept the state of Russia's health service (and other public services).....But then of course, they do have a very tough leader. :rolleyes::D



You were in a 19th century psychiatric hospital? When? I doesn't seem to have help you much. Try again.

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 12:04
Amazing how Russian people just seem to accept the state of Russia's health service (and other public services).....

Many haven't gotten to trust Internet sources, especially older people, so they are brainwashed by TV. My father, for instance, he is a retired man now. I tried to show him stuff on Internet, but he goes like: "Hey, it is just Internet, they can forge anything there!" And he takes everything they say on central tv channels for truth. I feel almost like crying when I see him perched beside a TV, the mouth half-open, watching a new concoction of lies. But I can do nothing.
And younger people, they have a much shorter attention span, even though they are more knowledgeable about Internet. I bet they think about shagging much more than, say, about politics.:))) But living conditions keep going down, so I assume it is a very shaky "status quo", even if it exists. My father does like counting the money and his attention to what I tell him has increased during the last year, because his salary/pension can buy him much less (like I told him it would happen). The tough battle between the tv and the fridge continues.

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 12:11
My grandmother spent two weeks in a hospital half a year ago - a "free" one. She was returned in a worse condition, covered with multiple bruises. She said they were literally throwing her around (especially in the reanimation room) like a sack of potatoes. That's in Saint Petersburb, I don't even want to begin thinking what the "healthcare" is like in smaller towns in Russia.
The streets of my city are full of gangs of thiefs now (I guess due to the rampant unemployment), there are many cases of mugging and robbery in my neighborhood. I don't even venture outside after midnight.
Drugs seem to have become a real issue again, due to many signs. Whenever I take a stroll in my ghetto, I see junkies operating street hookers (guess also junkies). I have had to throw out from my podyezd like 20-30 junkies this year alone.
The police, they arrest random people for drinking beer in the street or smoking beside the metro, but they seem to turn a blind eye on more serious crimes (or even serve as a "cover", I suspect).
So, the Cool Nick, WHEN are you coming?:) We can't wait. I think it is a brilliant idea, please come asap. And you absolutely must visit Saint Pete, hehe.


You think ghettos in the US are any better?

I can only tell about Moscow but things aren't that bad here. I live in the center but my girlfriend lives on the edge of Moscow and it doesn't seem that bad.



Heroin overdose is now the number one cause of death in the US. It just surpassed death by gun shot and car accident.

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 12:18
Dude, you have to be realistic if you are really planning to move here. Medical care is far, far better in the US than in Russia and you do have far more freedoms there than in the RF. Do you have children? Do you think it normal to have to pay big bribes just to get your kid into a nursery school (kindergarten)? What about having to pay bribes for standard medical care that the law says you are entitled to for free? I chose those two points because as a family man, they would stop me from moving to any country where what I wrote about is the case.

I'm not going to get into where is 'better' to live. My point is only that you should be realistic about where you are going to live. If you are okay with all the negatives that go along with all the positives, then go for it.




Freedom ha! Like the freedom to be locked up without charge indefinitely or just out right killed on the spot.


Russian education far surpasses the US.

Nobbynumbnuts
01-08-2015, 12:19
Many haven't gotten to trust Internet sources, especially older people, so they are brainwashed by TV. My father, for instance, he is a retired man now. I tried to show him stuff on Internet, but he goes like: "Hey, it is just Internet, they can forge anything there!" And he takes everything they say on central tv channels for truth. I feel almost like crying when I see him perched beside a TV, the mouth half-open, watching a new concoction of lies. But I can do nothing.
And younger people, they have a much shorter attention span, even though they are more knowledgeable about Internet. I bet they think about shagging much more than, say, about politics.:))) But living conditions keep going down, so I assume it is a very shaky "status quo", even if it exists. My father does like counting the money and his attention to what I tell him has increased during the last year, because his salary/pension can buy him much less (like I told him it would happen). The tough battle between the tv and the fridge continues.

Until Russians start demanding more from their government nothing will change....

nicklcool
01-08-2015, 13:08
Until Russians start demanding more from their government nothing will change....


RL, I'm in my early 30s, thank you if you meant no offense, but one of the intracacies of American English is that words like buddy or young man, if said to an adultby an adultvs. to a child, are used to patronnize.

And a big thank you to all the expats showing their concern, especially the one who ised the same line I'm heading over here-"we're more free" - The western propaganda has worked quite well on y'all I see!

RL, the anecdotes about roving gangs of unemployed youth, how does that fly when the unemployment rate is going down in RF while labor participation rate is going up? Vs. USA where they celebrate the lowering unemployment rate as the participation rate also lowers in parallel. To borrow you're tactic I'm not going to repeat myself and post the links- but they are very easy to find and I'm the only one between us who posts cold hard statistics vs. news stories anyway. As Wally said, if you live in a rough area of course you're seeing this, but that doesn't mean the country as a wbole is experiencing the same thing and the stats back that up.

Re- medicalcare, how are the private clinics? I see the free govt medical care like disaster medical insurance, and unless you've experienced tge high premium high deductible new world of Obamacare, you don't really understand the state of healthcare in the USA or more importantly where it's headed.

RE schools, Yes public primary school is much better in RF than in the USA, and even if you go the private tutors route in RF it will be much cheaper. VS in the USA where you pay exorbitant taxes to fund teachers unions, cant do school vouchers, and private school tuition will cost you thousands per year.

RL I know you think money grows on trees in USA, but did you ever stop to think about what your 100k salary would look like after taxes? As I said before the stories about low Russian average salaries are a kittle hyped, since in RF the salaries are quoted after tax while in the USA thsy are before tax. A mid five figures salary becomes about low 30s "take home pay" after the socialists take out Medicare, FICA, health care premiums, etc. So in any case the labor participation rate is lowering in the USA while it's rising in RF- the trend is your friend! Which country has hard working citizens on the increase and which has govt handout takers on the rise?

fenrir
01-08-2015, 13:13
Russian education far surpasses the US.

Here are the latest international rankings (13 May 2015).

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-32608772

Hold your mouse over a country on the map to see its rating. The US is 28th. Russia is 34th. Little Estonia is 7th!

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 13:17
My grandmother spent two weeks in a hospital half a year ago - a "free" one. She was returned in a worse condition, covered with multiple bruises. She said they were literally throwing her around (especially in the reanimation room) like a sack of potatoes. That's in Saint Petersburb, I don't even want to begin thinking what the "healthcare" is like in smaller towns in Russia.
The streets of my city are full of gangs of thiefs now (I guess due to the rampant unemployment), there are many cases of mugging and robbery in my neighborhood. I don't even venture outside after midnight.
Drugs seem to have become a real issue again, due to many signs. Whenever I take a stroll in my ghetto, I see junkies operating street hookers (guess also junkies). I have had to throw out from my podyezd like 20-30 junkies this year alone.
The police, they arrest random people for drinking beer in the street or smoking beside the metro, but they seem to turn a blind eye on more serious crimes (or even serve as a "cover", I suspect).
So, the Cool Nick, WHEN are you coming?:) We can't wait. I think it is a brilliant idea, please come asap. And you absolutely must visit Saint Pete, hehe.

Sounds just like large parts of the economically strong & powerful US of A!

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 13:26
how does that fly when the unemployment rate is going down in RF while labor participation rate is going up?

Even officially the unemployment rate is up in the RF, from like 4.9 to like 6%. These official numbers are bogus though, because there is a lot of hidden unemployment. Now that lay-offs are becoming a massive trend, I am not even sure what you are talking about.


Re- medicalcare, how are the private clinics?

What's the use of them if most Russians can't afford them? Guess they may be good, I have never been to one.


RL I know you think money grows on trees in USA

I lived in the US myself, I have a friend who lives and works there now as an engineer. He is making like 70K per year, it has been enough for him to buy two apartments in Russia and to buy a 350K house on mortgage in the US (together with his wife who also works and earns like 50K per year). So, better reserve these stories for nubile Russian girls. Though they will want to hear about your American success, not about your American failure.:)

Nobbynumbnuts
01-08-2015, 13:32
RL, I'm in my early 30s, thank you if you meant no offense, but one of the intracacies of American English is that words like buddy or young man, if said to an adultby an adultvs. to a child, are used to patronnize.

And a big thank you to all the expats showing their concern, especially the one who ised the same line I'm heading over here-"we're more free" - The western propaganda has worked quite well on y'all I see!

RL, the anecdotes about roving gangs of unemployed youth, how does that fly when the unemployment rate is going down in RF while labor participation rate is going up? Vs. USA where they celebrate the lowering unemployment rate as the participation rate also lowers in parallel. To borrow you're tactic I'm not going to repeat myself and post the links- but they are very easy to find and I'm the only one between us who posts cold hard statistics vs. news stories anyway. As Wally said, if you live in a rough area of course you're seeing this, but that doesn't mean the country as a wbole is experiencing the same thing and the stats back that up.

Re- medicalcare, how are the private clinics? I see the free govt medical care like disaster medical insurance, and unless you've experienced tge high premium high deductible new world of Obamacare, you don't really understand the state of healthcare in the USA or more importantly where it's headed.

RE schools, Yes public primary school is much better in RF than in the USA, and even if you go the private tutors route in RF it will be much cheaper. VS in the USA where you pay exorbitant taxes to fund teachers unions, cant do school vouchers, and private school tuition will cost you thousands per year.

RL I know you think money grows on trees in USA, but did you ever stop to think about what your 100k salary would look like after taxes? As I said before the stories about low Russian average salaries are a kittle hyped, since in RF the salaries are quoted after tax while in the USA thsy are before tax. A mid five figures salary becomes about low 30s "take home pay" after the socialists take out Medicare, FICA, health care premiums, etc. So in any case the labor participation rate is lowering in the USA while it's rising in RF- the trend is your friend! Which country has hard working citizens on the increase and which has govt handout takers on the rise?

I had a hernia operation at a private clinic while in Vladivostok. The place was recommended to me. I had no complaints at all. It's a pretty routine operation anyway but did require full anesthetic and 3 days recuperation in the clinic. They didn't use the latest technology (hence the lengthy recuperation) which is less intrusive and more like keyhole surgery. The cost was 600 bucks.

That's all well and good but what do you do if you can't afford 600 bucks? You can find good health care in Russia but it will cost you..

FatAndy
01-08-2015, 14:02
:emote_popcorn:

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 14:17
Dude, you have to be realistic if you are really planning to move here. Medical care is far, far better in the US than in Russia and you do have far more freedoms there than in the RF. Do you have children? Do you think it normal to have to pay big bribes just to get your kid into a nursery school (kindergarten)? What about having to pay bribes for standard medical care that the law says you are entitled to for free? I chose those two points because as a family man, they would stop me from moving to any country where what I wrote about is the case.

I'm not going to get into where is 'better' to live. My point is only that you should be realistic about where you are going to live. If you are okay with all the negatives that go along with all the positives, then go for it.

Dude, you remind me a Bugs Bunny cartoon. :)

Medical care is better in the US? Well, it's also 100 times more expensive. It's not a choice, either, it's a law that you MUST pay for, or pay a ever-growing fine, or, if either, go to jail for violation of IRS rules. It was intended to be a mandatory medical service (Obamacare), but the clownish Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, John Roberts, decreed it a "tax" which can mean federal prison if you run afoul of it. Forcing a young man of 21 to pay $1200/month for medical coverage (including in case of pregnancy!) and including if he wants a sex-change operation, is...I can't think of a comparison, it's just wrong. He doesn't wnat to spend his money on never-needed medical care, he wants a new car...

In the hospital I was in in DC after a bad auto accident, I met a lot of good nurses, but there were also a lot of complete racist schit-heads and "nurses" who don't give a FF about patients.

Dental care is 10x more expensive in the US, than in Russia. The quality is about the same. My friend needs a certain procedure which would cost $6800 in the US. The same procedure in Russia would be $500.

Who has to pay bribes for "standard medical care" (whatever that means). Russia has a two-tired system, where you can go to the state hospital for free, or visit the office, and pay, to consult with a private doctor.

Bribes to get into a certain school? Proof? Even in Ukraine, when I visited there, I saw the schools accepted on merit, and "first-come, first-serve." And Ukraine is far more corrupt than Russia. And in most countries, a doctor gets paid for services, but you call any money a doctor or educator receives, a "bribe". :rofl: Are they supposed to work for free?

Perhaps you prefer the American system. Let's see, if Washington, DC, each student in high school is supported with $27,000 in public funding. What do we get with this $27,000 per pupil/per year, graduates from a DC school? Many are functional illiterates, many are criminals. And taxpayers are forced to pay this tax money, under threat of imprisonment. An open system of bribery would be better than this corrupt edu-ocracy.

And, as I already explained, the medical system will suffer under its forced bureaucratization. My doctor's contains 1 doctor, 1 nurse-practitioner (almost a doctor), 3 nurse, and 4 office people (filling out paperwork on computers). So when you "visit the doctor," you are paying not just the doctor, you are paying the doctor, nurses and bureaucrats, as well as the off-site Obamacare federal bureaucrats exchanging paperwork with your local office. And you have to pay a monthly fee (large and rapidly increasing) whether you ail or not.

I foresee the US medical and educational systems continuing to disintegrate under the crushing corrupt weight of bureaucracy, while those systems in the rest of the world continue to improve.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 14:22
Here are the latest international rankings (13 May 2015).

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-32608772

Hold your mouse over a country on the map to see its rating. The US is 28th. Russia is 34th. Little Estonia is 7th!

Educational ratings...from the BBC :rofl:

Don't hold your mouse, hold your nose! :)

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 14:34
And Ukraine is far more corrupt than Russia.

That's highly debatable, especially nowadays. I would say the opposite may be true.
As to school bribes, many schools charge the money officially, they just tell the parents that this or that amount is needed. The parents pay through the nose. If they complain to the authorities, their child may not be able to attend this school anymore.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 14:35
Sounds just like large parts of the economically strong & powerful US of A!

New York City is becoming a lot more dangerous. It was bad in the 1970's-80's, then Mayor Giuliani clean it up. Mayor Bloomberg instituted a "stop-and-frisk"policy - any police officer could stop any kid and search him, without cause (without the cop having to explain the reason for body searching the kid). This caused young gang members to stop carrying weapons and drugs. Now, under Mayor De Blasio, that policy was stopped, and crime is rapidly increasing. The homeless are rapidly becoming more of a probelm, too. Previsouly you could just yell at them "get the fu.. out of here, fu..ing bum!" if they bothered you, or the police prodding them away with a nightstick, now you are in danger of lawsuit for civil rights violation, and the police are afraid of being labeled "racists," so the civilized people are staying indoors.

But, under President Obama, everything is wonderful in US cities, according to the media. They are guarding his "legacy" and never must anyone say anything bad about the effects of conditions he is creating, either domestically or internationally.

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 14:40
New York City is becoming a lot more dangerous. It was bad in the 1970's-80's, then Mayor Giuliani clean it up. Mayor Bloomberg instituted a "stop-and-frisk"policy - any police officer could stop any kid and search him, without cause (without the cop having to explain the reason for body searching the kid). This caused young gang members to stop carrying weapons and drugs. Now, under Mayor De Blasio, that policy was stopped, and crime is rapidly increasing. The homeless are rapidly becoming more of a probelm, too. Previsouly you could just yell at them "get the fu.. out of here, fu..ing bum!" if they bothered you, or the police prodding them away with a nightstick, now you are in danger of lawsuit for civil rights violation, and the police are afraid of being labeled "racists," so the civilized people are staying indoors.

But, under President Obama, everything is wonderful in US cities, according to the media. They are guarding his "legacy" and never must anyone say anything bad about the effects of conditions he is creating, either domestically or internationally.

Interestingly during the recent Obama visit to Kenya and Ethiopia, I spoke to many of the US Secret Service guys & gals who are stationed in Washington DC. Apparently there is very little gun crime in Washington DC because there is a ban on guns presumably because of the White House etc. Given the results, I am mystified why the US of A does not use that as example and roll-out the 'no gun' regulations across other parts of the country.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 14:45
That's highly debatable, especially nowadays. I would say the opposite may be true.

You have run business in Ukraine, too? Good luck if you try!

I ran a business in Russia, and there was a funny monthly "fee" tacked onto the office rent that no one could ever explain to me, but it was only 200 rubles...

In Ukraine, I asked around town (Lugansk) and I talked to residents and other business owners, and it seems that every tin pot official has their hand out, and doing a legitimate business, without drowning in corruption, would be impossible.

Yes, according to 24/7 first-person reports (written by reporters in Kiev hotel rooms) and stories emanating from the glittering towers of disinformation BBC and CNN, Ukraine has made great strides in throwing off the shackles of its corrupt past. Prosperity, Truth, Justice and the American way is just around the corner... if you want to wait another 30 years to get to that corner....:rofl:

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 15:14
Interestingly during the recent Obama visit to Kenya and Ethiopia, I spoke to many of the US Secret Service guys & gals who are stationed in Washington DC. Apparently there is very little gun crime in Washington DC because there is a ban on guns presumably because of the White House etc. Given the results, I am mystified why the US of A does not use that as example and roll-out the 'no gun' regulations across other parts of the country.

Who did you talk to? Maybe they are misinformed:

Washington City paper, July 15, 2015: As of last week, D.C. had seen an 18 percent increase in murders, a 16 percent increase in armed robberies, and a 19 percent increase in armed assaults over 2014, according to WTOP. Nationally, experts say, it's too early to determine whether the country is experiencing a crime wave.

Lanier (Mayor of DC) said she will soon meet with other police chiefs whose cities are seeing more homicides, and she wants to send a message that “people are tired of the recklessness [and] the illegal guns.”

Lanier is only half-right. The increase in lawlessness in American big cities this summer, is caused by an increase in "recklessness" and perceived "injustice" arising from Ferguson and other falsely informing "white-police-kill-innocent-black-children" inflammatory stories in the media. This lawlessness is not connected to, nor caused by, guns; guns are the tools these criminals use to express their rage at and "right the wrongs of" such perceived social unfairness. Obama's economy, where few people in major big cities actually have a job, and where many need a purpose for their life, doesn't help, either.

We have a Second Amendment to the Constitution which guarantees the right to own firearms.

Bowser’s and Lanier’s remarks came on the heels of the fatal shooting of three-year-old Dalis Cox, who died late Wednesday after being transported to Prince George’s Hospital Center from her home on the 600 block of 46th Place SE. Cox might have been killed by another young child playing with a firearm that authorities now know was unregistered.

Sure, go ahead and register guns, like in Switzerland. Just don't take away my right to defend myself, until there is world that is free of violent criminals.

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/citydesk/2015/07/31/mayor-police-chief-rail-against-gun-violence/

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 15:28
Percentages mean nothing if there was zero or very little gun crime beforehand in Washington.. Anyway, they assured me that gun crime in Washington DC was not an issue like it is in other parts of the US of A.

We also discussed the fact that the Second Amendment is an Amendment - As such, why can it not be amended? ;)

The US of A must be the only country in the World which allows its people to be armed just in case they want to overthrow their own democratically elected government - totally bizarre!

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 15:41
Percentages mean nothing if there was zero or very little gun crime beforehand in Washington.. Anyway, they assured me that gun crime in Washington DC was not an issue like it is in other parts of the US of A.

We also discussed the fact that the Second Amendment is an Amendment - As such, why can it not be amended? ;)

The US of A must be the only country in the World which allows its people to be armed just in case they want to overthrow their own democratically elected government - totally bizarre!

"Bizarre" (different) works for me :) The history of the world is a history of tyrannical governments, is it not?

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 15:53
Percentages mean nothing if there was zero or very little gun crime beforehand in Washington.. Anyway, they assured me that gun crime in Washington DC was not an issue like it is in other parts of the US of A.

We also discussed the fact that the Second Amendment is an Amendment - As such, why can it not be amended? ;)

The US of A must be the only country in the World which allows its people to be armed just in case they want to overthrow their own democratically elected government - totally bizarre!

There may be thousands of police, secret service, armed marshalls, various other gun-toting agencies in DC guarding the government, White House, tourist areas, etc. but NE and SE of the city has been and continues to be a very dangerous place.

You are talking to unelected Secret Service bureaucrats and armed people with a vested interest in seeing all other people disarmed. They look at all civilians as potential enemies. Of course, everyone in US sees their city as "no problems" and touts it to foreigners. I am proud of my city, too. :)

No one is going to alter the Constitution, or it won't be America any more. Until recently, the US worked, it was the place where everyone wanted to immigrate to. Now the government has become insular, aloof from the people, and perceives the people as, at best, as idiots who need help managing their lives, at worst, as enemies. The government is arming itself to suppress the people.

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 16:15
The government is arming itself to suppress the people.

In that case, all the more reason to amend the 2nd Amendment! ;)

fenrir
01-08-2015, 16:16
Educational ratings...from the BBC :rofl:

Don't hold your mouse, hold your nose! :)

Did you bother to read the article, Miss Teacher? The article references the most recent OECD assessment of international education (the largest ever global school rankings). The OECD carries these out every few years. I am surprised you don't know about it considering your profession because they are always big news when the results come out.

fenrir
01-08-2015, 16:25
You have run business in Ukraine, too? Good luck if you try!

I ran a business in Russia, and there was a funny monthly "fee" tacked onto the office rent that no one could ever explain to me, but it was only 200 rubles...

In Ukraine, I asked around town (Lugansk) and I talked to residents and other business owners, and it seems that every tin pot official has their hand out, and doing a legitimate business, without drowning in corruption, would be impossible.

Yes, according to 24/7 first-person reports (written by reporters in Kiev hotel rooms) and stories emanating from the glittering towers of disinformation BBC and CNN, Ukraine has made great strides in throwing off the shackles of its corrupt past. Prosperity, Truth, Justice and the American way is just around the corner... if you want to wait another 30 years to get to that corner....:rofl:

Check out the link in Post 1502 for the current average bribe in Russia these days. Do you know anyone in Russia who currently owns a business? I do. I've just returned from a trip to Russia and my friends with businesses there had heaps of horror stories to tell. They've always had to deal with bribery, but the fire and tax authorities have been putting a new squeeze on businesses lately. Anyone who owns or knows someone who owns a business will know what I am referring to.

Carl
01-08-2015, 16:31
I'm making the move soon to the Rodina, so I will have some skin in the game! :uk:

How much time have you spent in Russia up to now nicklcool?

fenrir
01-08-2015, 16:46
Dude, you remind me a Bugs Bunny cartoon. :)

Medical care is better in the US? Well, it's also 100 times more expensive. It's not a choice, either, it's a law that you MUST pay for, or pay a ever-growing fine, or, if either, go to jail for violation of IRS rules. It was intended to be a mandatory medical service (Obamacare), but the clownish Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, John Roberts, decreed it a "tax" which can mean federal prison if you run afoul of it. Forcing a young man of 21 to pay $1200/month for medical coverage (including in case of pregnancy!) and including if he wants a sex-change operation, is...I can't think of a comparison, it's just wrong. He doesn't wnat to spend his money on never-needed medical care, he wants a new car...

In the hospital I was in in DC after a bad auto accident, I met a lot of good nurses, but there were also a lot of complete racist schit-heads and "nurses" who don't give a FF about patients.

Dental care is 10x more expensive in the US, than in Russia. The quality is about the same. My friend needs a certain procedure which would cost $6800 in the US. The same procedure in Russia would be $500.

Who has to pay bribes for "standard medical care" (whatever that means). Russia has a two-tired system, where you can go to the state hospital for free, or visit the office, and pay, to consult with a private doctor.

Bribes to get into a certain school? Proof? Even in Ukraine, when I visited there, I saw the schools accepted on merit, and "first-come, first-serve." And Ukraine is far more corrupt than Russia. And in most countries, a doctor gets paid for services, but you call any money a doctor or educator receives, a "bribe". :rofl: Are they supposed to work for free?

Perhaps you prefer the American system. Let's see, if Washington, DC, each student in high school is supported with $27,000 in public funding. What do we get with this $27,000 per pupil/per year, graduates from a DC school? Many are functional illiterates, many are criminals. And taxpayers are forced to pay this tax money, under threat of imprisonment. An open system of bribery would be better than this corrupt edu-ocracy.

And, as I already explained, the medical system will suffer under its forced bureaucratization. My doctor's contains 1 doctor, 1 nurse-practitioner (almost a doctor), 3 nurse, and 4 office people (filling out paperwork on computers). So when you "visit the doctor," you are paying not just the doctor, you are paying the doctor, nurses and bureaucrats, as well as the off-site Obamacare federal bureaucrats exchanging paperwork with your local office. And you have to pay a monthly fee (large and rapidly increasing) whether you ail or not.

I foresee the US medical and educational systems continuing to disintegrate under the crushing corrupt weight of bureaucracy, while those systems in the rest of the world continue to improve.

People pay for it in Russia with the 36% social tax (I don't know the exact term that is used in Russia for it) that employers pay on their employees' salaries. There is no such tax in the US.

I don't know how Obamacare works as I don't live in the US but my mother had surgery recently and my brother was hospitalized with a severe allergic reaction that left him in a coma for a week. Both sang the praises about their care.

Regarding bribes, a Google search turns up multiple hits. Here's one from a few years ago that gives lists:

http://www.sras.org/all_moscow_bribes

All of my wife's friends with children have had to pay bribes to get their children into kindergarten (Moscow and St. Pete).

Regarding hospitals, a personally paid a $500 bribe to a doctor so he would sign off on cancer treatment for my wife's godmother (Moscow).

Don't you have ANY friends or family in Russia? Everyone has a story or two to tell about bribery or corruption.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 16:46
Check out the link in Post 1502 for the current average bribe in Russia these days. Do you know anyone in Russia who currently owns a business? I do. I've just returned from a trip to Russia and my friends with businesses there had heaps of horror stories to tell. They've always had to deal with bribery, but the fire and tax authorities have been putting a new squeeze on businesses lately. Anyone who owns or knows someone who owns a business will know what I am referring to.

Considering the amount of hostility you display towards Russia, I can believe that your fellow Estonians, generating similar hostility, encounter "corruption" in Russia. When you dislike someone, they want to get their payback!

Maybe Russian officials like Americans who are nice to them, smile, pay the rent on time, help them out, etc.

But like I said, bribery is wrong, but being forced to pay onerous taxes to a stifling bureaucracy is even worse.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 16:49
In that case, all the more reason to amend the 2nd Amendment! ;)

:) Yes, the people should be allowed to own tanks, howitzers, armed drones, etc. (I suggested my local store use a drone to deliver my pizza, but they just stared at me.) Myself, I would like a home-defense bazooka.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 16:54
People pay for it in Russia with the 36% social tax (I don't know the exact term that is used in Russia for it) that employers pay on their employees' salaries. There is no such tax in the US.

"There is no such tax in the US." :rofl: Maybe you should listen to "Taxman" by the Beatles, an oldie but a goodie, and a truthie.


I don't know how Obamacare works

You finally got one right! Congratulations!!! Neither does anyone else know. With 12,000 pages of regulations so far, and growing rapidly, no one knows what it is, other than the end of Liberty in the US.

Fantastika
01-08-2015, 16:57
Did you bother to read the article, Miss Teacher? The article references the most recent OECD assessment of international education (the largest ever global school rankings). The OECD carries these out every few years. I am surprised you don't know about it considering your profession because they are always big news when the results come out.

The OECD!!! :rofl: WOW!!! "OECD Report" - A bunch of unelected world-class bureaucrats singing the praises of a bunch of unelected edu-crats! "Bless me, OECD, I bring alms and First-Class Lufthansa tickets!"

rumple_stilskin
01-08-2015, 17:23
Lanier is only half-right. The increase in lawlessness in American big cities this summer, is caused by an increase in "recklessness" and perceived "injustice" arising from Ferguson and other falsely informing "white-police-kill-innocent-black-children" inflammatory stories in the media. This lawlessness is not connected to, nor caused by, guns; guns are the tools these criminals use to express their rage at and "right the wrongs of" such perceived social unfairness. Obama's economy, where few people in major big cities actually have a job, and where many need a purpose for their life, doesn't help, either.

We have a Second Amendment to the Constitution which guarantees the right to own firearms.


Perceived injustice or actual injustice. looks like the bankrupt banker rule system is finally falling apart, the slaves now know they are slaves.

Second amendment - how many years ago was this written? maybe time for a fresh look? It was written in a time of plenty.

nicklcool
01-08-2015, 17:43
How much time have you spent in Russia up to now nicklcool?

A little over two years, spread out over three visits. Right, so I'm fully aware of what I 'm getting myself into ;)

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 18:21
A little over two years, spread out over three visits. Right, so I'm fully aware of what I 'm getting myself into ;)

So, Cool Nick, when are we to expect you set your foot here? Give us a tentative date, I promise I will not meet you at the airport. :coffee:

Carl
01-08-2015, 18:59
A little over two years, spread out over three visits. Right, so I'm fully aware of what I 'm getting myself into ;)

Is the plan to find a job once here?.. Or do you already have a job waiting for you?

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 19:02
Is the plan to find a job once here?.. Or do you already have a job waiting for you?

I assume he is bringing a suitcase stuffed with cash to launch a real estate business. :watching: Supposedly. Err, that's the coverup legend for him here.:10310: Let's believe it. A discrepancy of sorts is though that he has been complaining he is offered only low-profile office jobs in the US, so he might just as well be day-dreaming at his leisure time, sipping coffee in a Starbucks after his daily 9.00-17.00 stint at an office stuffed up to the hilt with other similarly miserable human beings.

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 21:27
:) Yes, the people should be allowed to own tanks, howitzers, armed drones, etc. (I suggested my local store use a drone to deliver my pizza, but they just stared at me.) Myself, I would like a home-defense bazooka.

I can only assume that you live in a heavily fortified bunker deep below ground level fitted with air filtration (and internet connection)? ;)

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 21:30
Perceived injustice or actual injustice. looks like the bankrupt banker rule system is finally falling apart, the slaves now know they are sl.aves

Second amendment - how many years ago was this written? maybe time for a fresh look? It was written in a time of plenty.

The Amendment regarding Slavery was re-written / abolished, so why can't the 2nd be rewritten?

And, when the 2nd was written, the people had bows & arrows, and Muskets - now they have heavy machine guns, assault rifles and armour piercing ammunition! :eek:

nicklcool
01-08-2015, 21:48
So, Cool Nick, when are we to expect you set your foot here? Give us a tentative date, I promise I will not meet you at the airport. :coffee:

Unhealthy interest in personal affairs. :queen:

Who cares when the anonymous poster on the expat ru forums is returning to Russia? My parents taught me not to talk to strangers. :9451:

TolkoRaz
01-08-2015, 22:04
Unhealthy interest in personal affairs. :queen:

Who cares when the anonymous poster on the expat ru forums is returning to Russia? My parents taught me not to talk to strangers. :9451:

Especially strange men (who offer to meet you at the airport)! :eek:

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 22:27
Interestingly during the recent Obama visit to Kenya and Ethiopia, I spoke to many of the US Secret Service guys & gals who are stationed in Washington DC. Apparently there is very little gun crime in Washington DC because there is a ban on guns presumably because of the White House etc. Given the results, I am mystified why the US of A does not use that as example and roll-out the 'no gun' regulations across other parts of the country.


Because they are afraid of the government and the fools believe their pee shooters will somehow stop the tanks and jets that will crush them into oblivion.

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 22:36
The Amendment regarding Slavery was re-written / abolished, so why can't the 2nd be rewritten?

And, when the 2nd was written, the people had bows & arrows, and Muskets - now they have heavy machine guns, assault rifles and armour piercing ammunition! :eek:


The weapons are just f*cking crazy now, firing hundreds of projectiles a second. I blame it on TV and the movie industry for the amount of idiots living in the USofA. I say we just blockade from Mexico to Canada and let them kill each other.

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 22:39
Especially strange men (who offer to meet you at the airport)! :eek:


Didn't you offer to meet me at the airport once?

Uncle Wally
01-08-2015, 22:44
Check out the link in Post 1502 for the current average bribe in Russia these days. Do you know anyone in Russia who currently owns a business? I do. I've just returned from a trip to Russia and my friends with businesses there had heaps of horror stories to tell. They've always had to deal with bribery, but the fire and tax authorities have been putting a new squeeze on businesses lately. Anyone who owns or knows someone who owns a business will know what I am referring to.



Yes and we should always believe a Russian hater such as yourself.


Bla bla bla, hate hate hate. All is bad America is great. That's why you live in Estonia.

Russian Lad
01-08-2015, 23:30
Who cares when the anonymous poster on the expat ru forums is returning to Russia? My parents taught me not to talk to strangers.

I assume you will be pretty safe in just telling us the month of a year. We don't know your real name anyway. I just think you are a bogus poster here, that's all. You seem to be eager to confirm that. Inshallah.


Especially strange men (who offer to meet you at the airport)!

I believe I offered quite the opposite.

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 00:35
The Amendment regarding Slavery was re-written / abolished, so why can't the 2nd be rewritten?

And, when the 2nd was written, the people had bows & arrows, and Muskets - now they have heavy machine guns, assault rifles and armour piercing ammunition! :eek:

There is no amendment regarding slavery.

Don't worry, NickCool, Russian Lad only comes out of the Peterbunker during daylight.


I can only assume that you live in a heavily fortified bunker deep below ground level fitted with air filtration (and internet connection)? ;)

The bunker's location coordinates are not available to the public. Sometimes you might see it referred to as "Site B". :) If you see my big-screen TV in the dumpster, you're pretty close. :)


The weapons are just f*cking crazy now, firing hundreds of projectiles a second. I blame it on TV and the movie industry for the amount of idiots living in the USofA. I say we just blockade from Mexico to Canada and let them kill each other.

The TV and the Movie Industry are symptoms, effects, not causes.

The "cause" might be better stated as "the gradual suppression, since the late 1800's, of traditional Judeo-Christian morality and its replacement with humanism, as typically advanced by Darwin, Marx, Freud, etc." Ask the Rusinator, he can advance you a much more accurate analysis.

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 00:48
Don't worry, NickCool, Russian Lad only comes out of the Peterbunker during daylight.


That's true... It is only 0.41 right now, but from my window I can already hear drunk shouts of a violent fight. It is a daily noise outside after midnight, I am actually surprised if it doesn't happen. If I bothered to film all the violence I have witnessed from my balcony while smoking, it would make a big documentary. That's in my own yard, now, where I sort of know the people. Venturing into other neighborhoods may be plain lethal. It has become much worse during the last year. So, seeing the police arrest people for drinking beer in the street or for smoking or for crossing the street on the red light makes me puke, because they disappear for the night anyway. I am on my own. I am considering getting myself a legal weapon, maybe a gas pistol.

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 00:59
I just think you are a bogus poster here, that's all.

NickC is not bogus.

Maybe you are not used to seeing (maybe in your business?) Americans who get their "news" from a much more diverse array of sources than simply Yahoo!, BBC and CNN.

When I was in Russia, I met a lot of visiting Americans, ALL of them were Liberals, Lefties, Progressives, choose your moniker. After a while, I just made excuses when asked to go out. Who wants to listen to arrogant "I'm the super-cool American and you're the pissant Russkies" bloviating about the great Clintons, the great Obama, and the evil Reagan, the evil George Bush? Get me a barf-bag!

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 01:05
Maybe you are not used to seeing (maybe in your business?) Americans who get their "news" from a much more diverse array of sources than simply Yahoo!, BBC and CNN.

Oh, he is like me, watching and reading news in Russian, English, Ukrainian, Spanish and French? Cool, I haven't realized he is well-informed like that, it is nice to know.


"I'm the super-cool American and you're the pissant Russkies"

If I feel such vibes I just tell them I have had sex with a few cool American girls and that some of them are better in bed than the Russian ones, even the ones who are married.:) And that I would like to share with them a few personal details in a moment. It shuts them up very quickly. I have met many nice Americans in Russia though, had some nice colleagues (idiots too).

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 01:09
That's true... It is only 0.41 right now, but from my window I can already hear drunk shouts of a violent fight. It is a daily noise outside after midnight, I am actually surprised if it doesn't happen. If I bothered to film all the violence I have witnessed from my balcony while smoking, it would make a big documentary. That's in my own yard, now, where I sort of know the people. Venturing into other neighborhoods may be plain lethal. It has become much worse during the last year. So, seeing the police arrest people for drinking beer in the street or for smoking or for crossing the street on the red light makes me puke, because they disappear for the night anyway. I am on my own. I am considering getting myself a legal weapon, maybe a gas pistol.

Why don't you keep a chronicle, then you can turn it into a book someday. Call it "Watchtower above the Jungle" :)

A pellet pistol won't stop an enraged drunk. Was it in Ferguson? I don't remember, but the perp keep right on coming even after 3 body shots by the cop. I got some army-grade tear gas at the auction, I can send you.

Seems to be similar to US - NYC has much less rate of crime than Chicago, the 2nd largest city. Same with Moscow and St. Pete?

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 01:10
Why don't you keep a chronicle, then you can turn it into a book someday. Call it "Watchtower above the Jungle"

"Watchtower above the Gulag":) I actually have a good idea for a book in mind.:))) Very good one. You may not like it though, it involves Russia.:) You can imagine what I will write.:)


A pellet pistol won't stop an enraged drunk.

I meant something similar to this, a traumatic one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdI_JU-Xe9Q

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 01:20
Oh, he is like me, watching and reading news in Russian, English, Ukrainian, Spanish and French? Cool, I haven't realized he is well-informed like that, it is nice to know.

I'm not sure it's the variety of languages which yields a diversity of opinion. In the US, we have the official news (BBC, Yahoo!, CNN, New York Times, Bloomberg, etc.) and then we have "counter-news," which is mostly talk-radio shows. They are on AM radio, mostly 3 hours long, easy to listen to while working, its like "background noise". The talk-show hosts parse the "official" news, document the lies, and heavily critique the politicians feeding us the lies. Those of us who listen to talk-radio get both sides of every story, the CNN viewers only get the official version. I don't know of any other country where is a such a 50-50 split (60-40 in our favor in the election in 2014) in the populace between the "low information zombies" and the people who listen to both sides of the story.

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 01:23
I'm not sure it's the variety of languages which yields a diversity of opinion. In the US, we have the official news (BBC, Yahoo!, CNN, New York Times, Bloomberg, etc.) and then we have "counter-news," which is mostly talk-radio shows. They are on AM radio, mostly 3 hours long, easy to listen to while working, its like "background noise". The talk-show hosts parse the "official" news, document the lies, and heavily critique the politicians feeding us the lies. Those of us who listen to talk-radio get both sides of every story, the CNN viewers only get the official version. I don't know of any other country where is a such a 50-50 split (60-40 in our favor in the election in 2014) in the populace between the "low information zombies" and the people who listen to both sides of the story.

I sort of know, I have access to this:): http://shoutcast.com/

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 01:29
"Watchtower above the Gulag":) I actually have a good idea for a book in mind.:))) Very good one. You may not like it though, it involves Russia.:) You can imagine what I will write.:)

Well, keep your notes secure, or backed up. When I moved from Samara to Togliatti, I had a box of notes which I had compiled. I would jot down something that I was thinking about, on a scrap or sheet of paper. I would fill up whole sheets and small notebooks, writing stuff down every day, for several years. I had brought the box to Russia, still adding to it, planning to finally compile and classify everything and set up a structure for the opus. I had a tentaive title "Gleanings from Stuporia." I realized at some point after the move that I was missing that box of notes (200 or so pages). I went to the mover but he knew nothing, he had probably trashed it, thinking it was junk. I think I screamed for 3 days. :)

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 01:35
Well, keep your notes secure, or backed up. When I moved from Samara to Togliatti, I had a box of notes which I had compiled. I would jot down something that I was thinking about, on a scrap or sheet of paper. I would fill up whole sheets and small notebooks, writing stuff down every day, for several years. I had brought the box to Russia, still adding to it, planning to finally compile and classify everything and set up a structure for the opus. I had a tentaive title "Gleanings from Stuporia." I realized at some point after the move that I was missing that box of notes (200 or so pages). I went to the mover but he knew nothing, he had probably trashed it, thinking it was junk. I think I screamed for 3 days.

You sound like a prolific writer.:) We both hate what is going on in our countries, have writing proclivities, maybe we should get married or something.:) You have a boyfriend/husband?:)

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 02:02
I sort of know, I have access to this:): http://shoutcast.com/

I look at that website, there's nothing in the "political" section I ever heard of. It's probably just government sponsored "talk"- the sincere "discussion" similar to our tax-paid "NPR" National Public Radio.

None of them dare to talk like these guys:

http://www.lauraingraham.com/

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/ (Most popular show in the US - 10x as many listeners as CNN has viewers). he doesn't tell you what the politicians did yesterday, he tells you, accurately, what they will do tomorrow.

http://www.marklevinshow.com/ A very intelligent guy. But gets very angry. Nickname: "The Great One" (and he broadcasts "Deep Underground, from the Bunker". :) Well, I suppose you have a right to be angry when you are constantly carrying on legal action, bravely, against a government which doesn't fight fair. Very courageous, and he is filing lawsuits all the time, to counter the creeping rise of Washington government regulation and suppression.

You would like these three, they are also anti-Putin, anti-Kremlin. "Old School - Communism is bad, and Russia = Communism." They do not know much about Russia other than the Russkies put Laika in orbit before we put up a man. Laura has 2 Russian kids she adopted, and she did live in St. Pete for a while, but still thinks of Russia as the USSR.

The fourth one I try to catch every day, John Batchelor, has a regular guest, a professor from Princeton, who exposes the corrupt nature of the Western-sponsored "news" about Ukraine and the replacement regime in Kiev.

http://johnbatchelorshow.com/

Non-US citizens mostly don't know about these shows, because it's difficult for non-native English speakers to understand the rapid radio speech. (I once timed it: 7 words a second). The "official" news vilifies these talk-shows and suppresses their views. And even if you listen to it, a literal translation is far from valid - the talk is rife with sarcasm, irony and humor; they employ the latest slang and idioms. They have real people calling up and offering their opinions, so you have to get used to different people with different accents, etc.

These are the Great Americans, not those jackasses in Washington.

Fantastika
02-08-2015, 02:05
You sound like a prolific writer.:) We both hate what is going on in our countries, have writing proclivities, maybe we should get married or something.:) You have a boyfriend/husband?:)

I love my independence, even if others think it's narcissism or arrogance.

Russian Lad
02-08-2015, 02:11
I love my independence, even if others think it's narcissism or arrogance.

I don't mean to encroach on your independence in any way.:)

TolkoRaz
02-08-2015, 11:55
I love my independence, even if others think it's narcissism or arrogance.

And, you have your own national holiday! ;)

Russian Lad
03-08-2015, 19:46
So, oil - 49.70, Euro - 69, dollar - 63. The downward spiral continues... Are people still laughing in restaurants, Wally? Because if they still do, you may have mistaken a psychiatric asylum feeding ward for a restaurant...

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 19:58
So, oil - 49.70, Euro - 69, dollar - 63. The downward spiral continues... Are people still laughing in restaurants, Wally? Because if they still do, you may have mistaken a psychiatric asylum feeding ward for a restaurant...

..you beat me to it, i was just about to post the same data. Oil futures for September fell to $46!
In Wally World OPEC said oil wouldn't fall further! lol :p

JPS
03-08-2015, 20:09
Are people still laughing in restaurants, Wally?


In Wally World...

The English have a wonderful phrase - "What a wally" or "He's a wally". It means "what an idiot" though I'm sure you could put your own descriptive word as a substitute to "idiot".

"A silly and inept person; someone who is regarded as stupid. A ***** sap, saphead, muggins, tom***** simpleton, simple"

Forum names should always be chosen with care :)

Judge
03-08-2015, 20:11
What's new, the ruble is adjusting to the price of oil, it's been like that for awhile now, like years,
in other news,
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russian-food-prices-stabilize-after-months-of-racing-inflation/526610.html

Record Price Drop
The cost of food has seen a record decline since the start of April, the Industry and Trade Ministry said in late July. The ministry published data on a clutch of products that said the price of eggs fell by 20 percent over the period from April to mid-July, the cost of granulated sugar by 2.4 percent, fish by 3.8 percent and cheese by 7.6 percent.

The most dramatic falls were in the cost of fruit and vegetables. The price of cucumbers fell by 58.7 percent over April to mid-July, while the cost of tomatoes tumbled 41.3 percent, the ministry said.

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 20:20
The English have a wonderful phrase - "What a wally" or "He's a wally". It means "what an idiot" though I'm sure you could put your own descriptive word as a substitute to "idiot".

"A silly and inept person; someone who is regarded as stupid. A ***** sap, saphead, muggins, tom***** simpleton, simple"

Forum names should always be chosen with care :)

...you forgot my favourite-a prat! :p

Russian Lad
03-08-2015, 20:30
Record Price Drop
The cost of food has seen a record decline since the start of April, the Industry and Trade Ministry said in late July. The ministry published data on a clutch of products that said the price of eggs fell by 20 percent over the period from April to mid-July, the cost of granulated sugar by 2.4 percent, fish by 3.8 percent and cheese by 7.6 percent.

The most dramatic falls were in the cost of fruit and vegetables. The price of cucumbers fell by 58.7 percent over April to mid-July, while the cost of tomatoes tumbled 41.3 percent, the ministry said.

I don't see this record high drop somehow when I visit Piatorochka. Well, unless you want me and other russkies to become vegans, that is - but it still costs me a little fortune whenever I buy fruits and vegetables, the prices have like doubled since a year ago. Wonder if we will get to taste the boiled grass/popato peels soup soon... Besides, don't forget - the most essential groceries are being subsidized, and that is about to be over any time soon.

FatAndy
03-08-2015, 20:44
Wonder if we will get to taste the boiled grass/popato peels soup soon...
:agree:
...and a bouillon from eggs.

:emote_popcorn:

Russian Lad
03-08-2015, 20:50
...and a bouillon from eggs.

Not every Russian can afford eggs these days. They are becoming way too expensive. Should I blame Obama for this? Did Obama manhandle Russian hens? Many Russians sound like hens and cocks these days when I talk to them, especially if we gauge the level of intelligence and information awareness, maybe I should ask some of them to lay eggs for my omelette?

FatAndy
03-08-2015, 20:54
Not every Russian can afford eggs these days. They are becoming way too expensive.
Poor, poor not every Russians...


Should I blame Obama for this?
Whoever you want, comrade - you're living in the country of freedom. :verycool:

nicklcool
03-08-2015, 21:33
..you beat me to it, i was just about to post the same data. Oil futures for September fell to $46!
In Wally World OPEC said oil wouldn't fall further! lol :p

What a great sale! Time to buy some rubles, property, stocks, whatever you can get your hands on while the sale continues!!

(If you recall I paraphrased Robert Kiyosaki's observation that people buy buy buy like crazy when cars clothes electronics or other consumer goods go on sale, yet when assests go on sale during economic downturns every gets fearful and sells their stocks or other assets) :zoom:

nicklcool
03-08-2015, 21:38
Not every Russian can afford eggs these days. They are becoming way too expensive. Should I blame Obama for this? Did Obama manhandle Russian hens? Many Russians sound like hens and cocks these days when I talk to them, especially if we gauge the level of intelligence and information awareness, maybe I should ask some of them to lay eggs for my omelette?

For the sake of our other posters, keep this all in perspective: official RU inflation rates (currently at 15% if I'm not mistaken) include food and oil/gas prices, while the official USA rate excludes the prices of these goods (ostensibly because the prices on those goods are too volatile and would inhibit a useful measurement of the economy).

So we can all enjoy watching the chicken littles on expat.ru running around and shouting, but let's all keep perspective: what is the "real" inflation rate in other countries, if we count food and oil/gasoline costs??

Russian Lad
03-08-2015, 22:05
Time to buy some rubles

Wally said the same when 1 dollar cost 40 rubles. I am glad I didn't listen to this bu**sh*t, but if I did, I would be suffering now. Why do you want the Russians to suffer bitterly? Why do you hate us that much???:question: Have you rushed to buy rubles yourself today? Or maybe Tolko who thanked you has done it today? I strongly doubt it. Which makes you what exactly here? A windbag with all talk and no trousers?


So we can all enjoy watching the chicken littles on expat.ru running around and shouting, but let's all keep perspective: what is the "real" inflation rate in other countries, if we count food and oil/gasoline costs??

Why do you want to deflect my attention to other countries now? I am a Russian and I live in Russia and I go to Russian shops every day, I am totally dismayed by the steeply risen prices on pretty much everything! And I would like to know who is responsible for this inside my country...

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 22:21
What a great sale! Time to buy some rubles, property, stocks, whatever you can get your hands on while the sale continues!!

(If you recall I paraphrased Robert Kiyosaki's observation that people buy buy buy like crazy when cars clothes electronics or other consumer goods go on sale, yet when assests go on sale during economic downturns every gets fearful and sells their stocks or other assets) :zoom:

..if you take a very long view, why not buy some rubles, stocks or property. Wont get an argument from me. But be prepared for a bumpy ride! ;)

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 22:24
......official RU inflation rates (currently at 15% if I'm not mistaken) include food and oil/gas prices, while the official USA rate excludes the prices of these goods (ostensibly because the prices on those goods are too volatile and would inhibit a useful measurement of the economy).......

...i'm sure that makes the poor babushka counting her kopeks feel a lot better! ;)

Uncle Wally
03-08-2015, 22:48
For the sake of our other posters, keep this all in perspective: official RU inflation rates (currently at 15% if I'm not mistaken) include food and oil/gas prices, while the official USA rate excludes the prices of these goods (ostensibly because the prices on those goods are too volatile and would inhibit a useful measurement of the economy).

So we can all enjoy watching the chicken littles on expat.ru running around and shouting, but let's all keep perspective: what is the "real" inflation rate in other countries, if we count food and oil/gasoline costs??



They're not looking at what is going on in the rest of the world. They (I call them the "Bad news Bears of expat) don't even care though they are not even in Russia (RL excluded). There are global problems and some are trying manipulate the news. Sad how the TV, internet and other forms of mass communication can make us feel deprived and bad about ourselves all so the people that control it can control us more. Now it's " give them something to worry about so they won't understand we're stealing as much as we can before we start a world war and eliminate a large part of the human population". The only option they give us is slavery. Sad to see some here pick slavery.

Uncle Wally
03-08-2015, 22:50
...i'm sure that makes the poor babushka counting her kopeks feel a lot better! ;)



Why don't you ask some pensioner in the UK how they feel about getting their benefits cut?

Uncle Wally
03-08-2015, 22:53
Not every Russian can afford eggs these days. They are becoming way too expensive. Should I blame Obama for this? Did Obama manhandle Russian hens? Many Russians sound like hens and cocks these days when I talk to them, especially if we gauge the level of intelligence and information awareness, maybe I should ask some of them to lay eggs for my omelette?


Oh please stop it you freakin drama queen.

nicklcool
03-08-2015, 22:55
Wally said the same when 1 dollar cost 40 rubles. I am glad I didn't listen to this bu**sh*t, but if I did, I would be suffering now. Why do you want the Russians to suffer bitterly? Why do you hate us that much???:question: Have you rushed to buy rubles yourself today? Or maybe Tolko who thanked you has done it today? I strongly doubt it. Which makes you what exactly here? A windbag with all talk and no trousers?



Why do you want to deflect my attention to other countries now? I am a Russian and I live in Russia and I go to Russian shops every day, I am totally dismayed by the steeply risen prices on pretty much everything! And I would like to know who is responsible for this inside my country...


Sorry, RL, this is the b*llsh*t right here, you claim you love your country but want her to surrender her foreign and domestic affairs decisions to outside bodies like the UN, USA, EU, etc. (well maybe you don't want this but your implicit support of the sanctions, joy that pipeline deals are killed, ecstasy that the ruble FX rate is declining, etc. all imply you think it's OK for these foreign bodies to impose their will on your rodina, your mother country)

Forgive me the metaphor but you sound like our lefties who say they love their country but also do outrageous things like say we "deserved" 9/11 because of our policies in the Middle East!

In fact Fantastika's observation that the expats in Russia lean heavily Progressive/Leftist sounds more and more true :sick:

I do not want Russians to suffer; I do not hate Russia. I think you should sit and think long and hard about whether you love your country or just want it to become something it's not, in order to love it. Like the Progressives in the USA who have tried for decades to make the country more European, and only now that it's becoming such do they love their country.

RE: the starving Russians, you are obviously engaging in hyperbole since Russians are resilient and the majority know how to cook - with such resiliency they will not starve if suddenly they cannot afford Starbucks & fast food!

And my Real Estate point is that, like the bible says, there will always be the poor - some who can manage their desires (postpone gratification) and manage their money will do quite well during this assets sale! Others who did not live within their means may suffer, yes, but how is this different from the poor in any other country!?

And don't give us the leftist BS that only the rich can buy assets!! Think of all the rags-to-riches stories of people who had impoverished childhoods but turned things around in their lives! (Ben Carson, Bill Gates, Robert Kiyosaki, Shultz the current owner of Starbucks, Colonel Sanders of KFC - started his company at 65!! etc. etc.)

Russian Lad
03-08-2015, 23:06
They are screaming now. Good. It means I have poked the vipers' nest good and proper. I can take a break till tomorrow then.:evilgrin: So, Cool Nick, how much rubles have you bought today?
As to your other comments, I don't want to comment on it, hell, it may even be illegal now to comment on it here.:) So, I will be silent on those - till the time comes... Remember - I am only worried about steep prices in grocery stores, nothing else!
Wally, talking about drama queens - look at your comrade Cool Nick, he is screaming like a girl now...:)

tonytony
03-08-2015, 23:08
What's new, the ruble is adjusting to the price of oil, it's been like that for awhile now, like years,
in other news,
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russian-food-prices-stabilize-after-months-of-racing-inflation/526610.html

Record Price Drop
The cost of food has seen a record decline since the start of April, the Industry and Trade Ministry said in late July. The ministry published data on a clutch of products that said the price of eggs fell by 20 percent over the period from April to mid-July, the cost of granulated sugar by 2.4 percent, fish by 3.8 percent and cheese by 7.6 percent.

The most dramatic falls were in the cost of fruit and vegetables. The price of cucumbers fell by 58.7 percent over April to mid-July, while the cost of tomatoes tumbled 41.3 percent, the ministry said.


To be frank, this is really just them choosing a particular start date in order to make the figures look good. If you have a look over a slightly longer timescale then you will see a very different picture.

If you have a look at the official figures from the Federal State Statistics Service for June - they haven't published July's figures yet - then you will see the following annual inflation rises from this time last year:-

http://www.gks.ru/bgd/free/b04_03/IssWWW.exe/Stg/d05/133.htm

bread 15%
cereals and legumes 43%
pasta 23%
meat and poultry 15%
fish and seafood 31%
milk 13%
butter 13%
sunflower oil 28%
eggs 17%
sugar 29%
all other fruit and veg 22%
alcoholic drinks 11%


Quite honestly, it is no surprise that fresh food is cheaper now than it was in April.

This was also the case in June when you can see that there were big falls compared to May, however, it does not negate the fact that prices for fresh food are still up 20% on this time last year:-


Продовольственные товары без алкоголь-ных напитков Июнь 2015г к июню 2014г - 20.0%


In June, a decrease in prices for the majority of the observed types of food products.

In the group of fruits and vegetables cucumbers become cheaper by 39.2%, white cabbage and tomatoes - by 27.5% and 23.1%, respectively, onion - by 12.0%, bananas - 7.5%. However, prices for beet dining room rose 15.5%, lemons - by 11.6%, carrots - by 9.3%, dried fruit, oranges, grapes and potatoes - by 2,3-4,1%.

Reduced price recorded for all types of cereals, including polished rice - by 1.9%, wheat - by 1.3%, semolina and buckwheat-Unground - by 1.2%.

In addition, 1.8% cheaper rennet hard and soft, at 0.5-0.8% - wheat flour, drinking milk, poultry, beef liver and fish frozen in split (except for salmon).

At the same time a number of food products prices rose. For example, a 2.5% price increase was chocolate, 2.1% - live fish and chilled, at 1.0-1.9% - coffee, caramel, chocolate sweets, cakes, rolls, jam, dried soups in packets, brandy, beer, canned fish and vegetable baby food, ice cream.

nicklcool
03-08-2015, 23:16
They are screaming now. Good. It means I have poked the vipers' nest good and proper. I can take a break till tomorrow then.:evilgrin: So, Cool Nick, how much rubles have you bought today?
As to your other comments, I don't want to comment on it, hell, it may even be illegal now to comment on it here.:) So, I will be silent on those - till the time comes... Remember - I am only worried about steep prices in grocery stores, nothing else!
Wally, talking about drama queens - look at your comrade Cool Nick, he is screaming like a girl now...:)

Sweet dreams, RL ;)

Uncle Wally
03-08-2015, 23:17
They are screaming now. Good. It means I have poked the vipers' nest good and proper. I can take a break till tomorrow then.:evilgrin: So, Cool Nick, how much rubles have you bought today?


Good try, but you can get off that easy.


He's right, you want all Russians to suffer because you're selfish, not to mention antisocial. You know you, fenrir, numbnuts, Carl, JPS, none of you could go to Natlee's birthday thread and just post a little"happy birthday" what she ever do to you? She's been a part of this expat community for a long time but all you and the rest want to do is push some anti Russian addenda. Go ahead stomp off whining that "they don't understand" it just shows that nickcool is right.

Judge
03-08-2015, 23:30
To be frank, this is really just them choosing a particular start date in order to make the figures look good. If you have a look over a slightly longer timescale then you will see a very different picture.

If you have a look at the official figures from the Federal State Statistics Service for June - they haven't published July's figures yet - then you will see the following annual inflation rises from this time last year:-

http://www.gks.ru/bgd/free/b04_03/IssWWW.exe/Stg/d05/133.htm

bread 15%
cereals and legumes 43%
pasta 23%
meat and poultry 15%
fish and seafood 31%
milk 13%
butter 13%
sunflower oil 28%
eggs 17%
sugar 29%
all other fruit and veg 22%
alcoholic drinks 11%


Quite honestly, it is no surprise that fresh food is cheaper now than it was in April.

This was also the case in June when you can see that there were big falls compared to May, however, it does not negate the fact that prices for fresh food are still up 20% on this time last year:-

Personally I've seen most goods that I often buy back to what they were before they shot up, like eggs, meat,milk,bread and some fruit. Now the gap has been filled when the sanctions started,prices shouldn't shoot up again like they did a few months ago...For sure there are more Russian made products on the market.

tonytony
03-08-2015, 23:39
For the sake of our other posters, keep this all in perspective: official RU inflation rates (currently at 15% if I'm not mistaken) include food and oil/gas prices, while the official USA rate excludes the prices of these goods (ostensibly because the prices on those goods are too volatile and would inhibit a useful measurement of the economy).

So we can all enjoy watching the chicken littles on expat.ru running around and shouting, but let's all keep perspective: what is the "real" inflation rate in other countries, if we count food and oil/gasoline costs??


The ''real'' - as you call it - inflation rate is published at exactly the same time. The USA generally releases this information in the middle of the month so figures for June were released on the 17th July.

The annual CPI excluding food and gas for June was 1.8% compared to the previous year.

The annual CPI including food and gas for June was only 0.1% compared to the previous year. This big difference was largely accounted for by the fall in the price of oil.


It is a similar case in the UK, the latest figures were reported on 14th July.

The annual CPI excluding food and gas was 0.8% compared to the previous year.

The annual CPI including food and gas was 0% compared to the previous year.

The inclusive figure is the usual headline figure for inflation that is quoted when people talk about UK infllation.


So you are clearly wrong in what you say. There is a huge difference between Russian inflation rates of 15% and UK/US inflation rates in the 1% to 2% range.

Judge
03-08-2015, 23:40
Sorry, RL, this is the b*llsh*t right here, you claim you love your country but want her to surrender her foreign and domestic affairs decisions to outside bodies like the UN, USA, EU, etc.
I can't really speak for RL , from what I take from reading his posts all these years, he like many believe that his country and the Russian people are better off without the ones who are in the Kremlin, be it a puppet leader controlled by the US ,EU, UK.
For wanting his country to go in another direction, it's not an anti-Russia agenda to him ,it's his way of showing how much he loves his country.
These past few days I've spoken to a few Russians who I haven't seen for a few years and all of then were worried about the future here,they didn't hear from me for awhile and thought I packed up and left, strange they thought that I'm still here when themselves and many they know would jump at the chance to leave.

tonytony
03-08-2015, 23:42
Personally I've seen most goods that I often buy back to what they were before they shot up, like eggs, meat,milk,bread and some fruit. Now the gap has been filled when the sanctions started,prices shouldn't shoot up again like they did a few months ago...For sure there are more Russian made products on the market.


I totally agree with you that I don't think prices will rise much from the present level. The fact remains though that they are higher than this time last year and wages have not risen by anywhere near as much and so, I would suggest, a lot of discretionary spending is likely to be curtailed.

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 23:43
The ''real'' - as you call it - inflation rate is published at exactly the same time. The USA generally releases this information in the middle of the month so figures for June were released on the 17th July.

The annual CPI excluding food and gas for June was 1.8% compared to the previous year.

The annual CPI including food and gas for June was only 0.1% compared to the previous year. This big difference was largely accounted for by the fall in the price of oil.


It is a similar case in the UK, the latest figures were reported on 14th July.

The annual CPI excluding food and gas was 0.8% compared to the previous year.

The annual CPI including food and gas was 0% compared to the previous year.

The inclusive figure is the usual headline figure for inflation that is quoted when people talk about UK infllation.


So you are clearly wrong in what you say. There is a huge difference between Russian inflation rates of 15% and UK/US inflation rates in the 1% to 2% range.

You are absolutely right of course but the title of this thread is 'Economic situation in Russia'................so let's talk about Russia! ;)

TolkoRaz
03-08-2015, 23:43
Personally I've seen most goods that I often buy back to what they were before they shot up, like eggs, meat,milk,bread and some fruit. Now the gap has been filled when the sanctions started,prices shouldn't shoot up again like they did a few months ago...For sure there are more Russian made products on the market.

This is good news - Support domestic suppliers; its a winner for all concerned. Just need to improve the quality!

Nobbynumbnuts
03-08-2015, 23:53
I totally agree with you that I don't think prices will rise much from the present level. The fact remains though that they are higher than this time last year and wages have not risen by anywhere near as much and so, I would suggest, a lot of discretionary spending is likely to be curtailed.


When the currency falls then there is more demand for locally produced products because imported ones rise in price. This we all understand but unless the switch from foreign to local is smooth and unless locally produced can keep up with the increased demand then prices of locally produced will rise as well. Basic economics.
I'm not convinced that in a poorly organized economy like Russia's this can be achieved. Can local be produced at short notice to satisfy demand and be got to market in an efficient manner without creating bottle necks?.................Let's see

Judge
03-08-2015, 23:54
You are absolutely right of course but the title of this thread is 'Economic situation in Russia'................so let's talk about Russia! ;)
Blin !
I was going to post this link to Wally ,to show him that it's not only UK pensioners who are suffering,
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/benefit-cuts-deaths-time-iain-6177882

Nobbynumbnuts
04-08-2015, 00:02
Blin !
I was going to post this link to Wally ,to show him that it's not only UK pensioners who are suffering,
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/benefit-cuts-deaths-time-iain-6177882

Judge, i've got absolutely no problem discussing the short comings of the UK but i get a bit pissed when told not to discuss the situation in Russia in a thread about Russia! lol

Still what do you expect. Must be happy hour again in Wally World...:D

Judge
04-08-2015, 00:09
Judge, i've got absolutely no problem discussing the short comings of the UK but i get a bit pissed when told not to discuss the situation in a Russia in a thread about Russia! lol

Still what do you expect. Must be happy hour again in Wally World...:D

It's time for me to enjoy happy hour then and down a few in my dreams, the other day was in a pub here and tried for first time ESB (Extra Special Bitter) nice drink, and not bad for 320 ru for 0.5l, at today's rate, that's just over 3 quid a pint :10518:

Nobbynumbnuts
04-08-2015, 00:15
It's time for me to enjoy happy hour then and down a few in my dreams, the other day was in a pub here and tried for first time ESB (Extra Special Bitter) nice drink, and not bad for 320 ru for 0.5l, at today's rate, that's just over 3 quid a pint :10518:

Costs me 3 pound 95p a pint here! Most of that is tax though as we all know.
Can remember back in 2001 buying those large cans (500ml) of vodka and orange for 11 rubles outside the metro in Moscow..........F*ck those were the days!! :10518:

Uncle Wally
04-08-2015, 00:33
Blin !
I was going to post this link to Wally ,to show him that it's not only UK pensioners who are suffering,
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/benefit-cuts-deaths-time-iain-6177882


I got a lot of time on my hands now and read a lot. This stuff has been going on for months now and it's just going to get worse. You don't even want to look at what welfare cuts will do to the children that count on benefits.


It's all over the world, wage cuts in Australia, price increases in America (Tony figures are wrong for the US) inflation is much higher than they say.

RL and numbnuts don't understand that it's August and time to pick the local fruit and vegetables and there for unimaginably cheap! Got a pack of cucumbers ( five) for 16 rubles two days ago. How much is that in dollar terms? Also I'd like to mention that there has been much problem with supply. Israeli has been supplying lots of vegetables and South America fruit, and cheaper than before!

Uncle Wally
04-08-2015, 00:35
Costs me 3 pound 95p a pint here! Most of that is tax though as we all know.
Can remember back in 2001 buying those large cans (500ml) of vodka and orange for 11 rubles outside the metro in Moscow..........F*ck those were the days!! :10518:


It was also 23 rubles to the doller then.


But who would drink such crap?

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 00:36
none of you could go to Natlee's birthday thread and just post a little"happy birthday" what she ever do to you? She's been a part of this expat community for a long time but all you and the rest want to do is push some anti Russian addenda. Go ahead stomp off whining that "they don't understand" it just shows that nickcool is right.

I rarely go to that other section, post mostly here, may have missed it. I haven't been congratulated on my B-day here since I joined (it is not a real date there, but never mind, it is not the point), so it is not a big deal. But you being a drama queen have already seen some deep meanings in this.


Now the gap has been filled when the sanctions started,prices shouldn't shoot up again like they did a few months ago...For sure there are more Russian made products on the market.

Furtilizer, machinery, etc. - a lot of imported components. This agricultural bonanza will be a miserable failure just like Khruschev's kukuruza, just wait... You cannot make a Mercedes out of Lada spareparts. Simples... Your enthusiasm, if it is genuine, is rather funny. I guess I know Russia a bit more than you do - I am not enthused.:)

Uncle Wally
04-08-2015, 00:47
I rarely go to that other section, post mostly here, may have missed it. I haven't been congratulated on my B-day here since I joined (it is not a real date there, but never mind, it is not the point), so it is not a big deal. But you being a drama queen have already seen some deep meanings in this.



Furtilizer, machinery, etc. - a lot of imported components. This agricultural bonanza will be a miserable failure just like Khruschev's kukuruza, just wait... You cannot make a Mercedes out of Lada spareparts. Simples...



Yeah but now that you know you still don't want to say happy birthday to Natlee just because we don't really know when your birthday is and have never said happy birthday to you? What she ever do to you that makes it soo hard just to post a quick congratulations? If I knew when your birthday was I would say happy birthday to you.


And no "deep meaning" just saying we can be part of the community.

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 00:56
And no "deep meaning" just saying we can be part of the community.

In honor of being part of the community, RL-- I am coming to RF in early Fall of this year. But please don't meet us at the airport!! We will be exhausted and unkempt by then and I want to put my best foot forward :)

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 00:57
Yeah but now that you know you still don't want to say happy birthday to Natlee just because we don't really know when your birthday is and have never said happy birthday to you? What she ever do to you that makes it soo hard just to post a quick congratulations? If I knew when your birthday was I would say happy birthday to you.


And no "deep meaning" just saying we can be part of the community.

You expect me to jump when you say so?:) Besides, for many reasons I am not a part of this community per se, not since their own rules were broken by them the first time, more than a year ago. If I post here, it is merely for the sake of those Russians who are just fence-sitters and readers here, trying to understand what is going on. It has been 100% for them for over a year now. And it is not like I have been trying hard recently (for instance, I don't even remember when I bothered to start a new thread whereas you, on the contrary, produce them with a machine gun intensity), because those with any brains already see the big picture anyway. Poking at you or the Cool Nick is fun on occasion, but that's way too easy. I don't enjoy doing something that's very easy. An example is provided below.


I am coming to RF in early Fall of this year

Welcome. And do buy a briefcase of rubles tomorrow. If your theory is correct, you will be laughing all the way to a restaurant together with Wally, clutching a huge pile of money you have made on the exchange difference...

Nobbynumbnuts
04-08-2015, 01:01
.....Furtilizer, machinery, etc. - a lot of imported components. This agricultural bonanza will be a miserable failure just like Khruschev's kukuruza, just wait... You cannot make a Mercedes out of Lada spareparts. Simples... Your enthusiasm, if it is genuine, is rather funny. I guess I know Russia a bit more than you do - I am not enthused.:)

.. this is what worries me when people say local produce will simply fill the space left by imports. Russian economy is unwieldily and not efficient. It's going to be difficult to ramp up production from local producers, get it to market in a timely manner and satisfy demand. I believe the Russian government is subsidizing local products to keep the price down. This is a solution in the short term but has huge implications for the economy as a whole, long term. Added cost for government and then where's the incentive for producers and suppliers to make efficiencies and improve to remain competitive? It's bad for the Russian economy in the long run..

Carl
04-08-2015, 01:14
It can't all be bad if the president's press secretary wears a $600,000 watch. :cheerleader::cheerleader:

Carl
04-08-2015, 01:18
It can't all be bad if the president's press secretary wears a $600,000 watch. :cheerleader::cheerleader:

And yes Andy.. I envy��

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 01:24
He said it is his wife's present for the wedding, you Western liars! But wait, isn't there a photo of him dated three weeks ago, and he is wearing the same watch there? Wally must investigate... The style of the watch is rather revealing too... Unequivocally unambiguous.

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 02:12
You expect me to jump when you say so?:) Besides, for many reasons I am not a part of this community per se, not since their own rules were broken by them the first time, more than a year ago. If I post here, it is merely for the sake of those Russians who are just fence-sitters and readers here, trying to understand what is going on. It has been 100% for them for over a year now. And it is not like I have been trying hard recently (for instance, I don't even remember when I bothered to start a new thread whereas you, on the contrary, produce them with a machine gun intensity), because those with any brains already see the big picture anyway. Poking at you or the Cool Nick is fun on occasion, but that's way too easy. I don't enjoy doing something that's very easy. An example is provided below.



Welcome. And do buy a briefcase of rubles tomorrow. If your theory is correct, you will be laughing all the way to a restaurant together with Wally, clutching a huge pile of money you have made on the exchange difference...
RL, you say you want what's best for your fellow countrymen. Do you respect what they want when a large proportion of them support their president, their annexation of Crimea, their protection of traditional values, etc. Or, as I suspect, do you patronizingly "know what's best" for your fellow countrymen, and you live what Russia could be fundamentally transformed into, not what she is culturally and politically today?

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 02:21
RL, you say you want what's best for your fellow countrymen. Do you respect what they want when a large proportion of them support their president, their annexation of Crimea, their protection of traditional values, etc. Or, as I suspect, do you patronizingly "know what's best" for your fellow countrymen, and you live what Russia could be fundamentally transformed into, not what she is culturally and politically today?

First of all, sociology is an interesting science - in repressive regimes people often respond how they believe they are expected to respond. Secondly, most Russians still trust central tv channels, especially older people. Thirdly, there are also millions of uneducated Russians who will believe mostly anything they are told and have zero analytical skills. However, they express their opinions in a relative stability, we are yet to witness how these opinions are going to change when real hardships arrive - there is a lot of momentum, I may compare it with the braking of a huge truck - takes time and road space to stop and then to go the other way, especially on a very icy road. I believe we are almost there and I just hope the truck will not fall off the road entirely (a clearly distinct possibility, by all means, and something I would rather see avoided).
That said, I only have my own opinion, I have no power to impose it on other people. I usually don't go together with the flow. I am not religious, but I remember there is a passage in the Bible about where exactly a wide path that many people take leads...
Hope that helps.:)

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 08:06
And yes Andy.. I envy
I know, go on ;)

Carl
04-08-2015, 13:13
The economic situation in Russia for some seems to be very very bright..:vomit:
Please excuse me while I go envy..:(
28919
28920
28921
28922

Uncle Wally
04-08-2015, 13:25
The economic situation in Russia for some seems to be very very bright..:vomit:
Please excuse me while I go envy..:(
28919
28920
28921
28922



You never heard of PhotoShop Carl?

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 13:37
The economic situation in Russia for some seems to be very very bright..:vomit:
You're vomiting, consult a doctor. We don't want to loose you.


Please excuse me while I go envy..:(
You're repeating? We already know :)

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 14:28
Yes, Andy, we all just keep envying, very hard. Kindergarten - and you know it...

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 14:55
Yes, Andy, we all just keep envying, very hard.
Better do something positive. If can't - do something negative. If can't - do something. :verycool:


Kindergarten - and you know it...
Sure, nothing new.

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 15:07
Better do something positive. If can't - do something negative. If can't - do something. :verycool:


Sure, nothing new.

What I mean is - forget about the watch cost and the evident lies that followed (what else do they lie to us about?), even though it is a huge embarrassment. Think about who would wear a watch with a skull plastered all over it on his wedding day... Any "patriotic" russkie ladies here to comment on that?:) You have been very silent recently... Penka? Vicy? Anybody?

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 15:14
what else do they lie to us about?
Everything - such a nasty rotten bloody regime! :rasta:

AstarD
04-08-2015, 15:18
It is a rather ugly watch. But not everybody has the same taste.

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 16:14
It is a rather ugly watch.
All four or you mean one of them?

AstarD
04-08-2015, 17:14
the one RL was referring to.

28923

Carl
04-08-2015, 18:39
While I'm disgusted by the open display of ill gotten gains... The folks running the show don't seem to give a rip what their constituency see/hear about their shenanigans.
Is there no outrage from the folks that are being ruled by this regime? Andy seems to think it's a great point of pride. "Ha! our press secretary wears a $600,000 watch" A reason for others to envy.. He doesn't care? What's to be proud of in such a situation?

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 18:52
Is there no outrage from the folks that are being ruled by this regime?
How did you miss the "outrage" of Anal'ny?


A reason for others to envy.. He doesn't care?
Sure. Why should I care about your envy? It is funny, but not more :)

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 19:16
While I'm disgusted by the open display of ill gotten gains... The folks running the show don't seem to give a rip what their constituency see/hear about their shenanigans.
Is there no outrage from the folks that are being ruled by this regime? Andy seems to think it's a great point of pride. "Ha! our press secretary wears a $600,000 watch" A reason for others to envy.. He doesn't care? What's to be proud of in such a situation?

This is only relevant to the discussion if one thinks RF's corruption is so much worse, that it harms the country's economy more than any other country's. :boxing:

As to this particular instance of corruption, it is small potatoes, in the six-figure range. You've gotta hit the seven-digits, if not mid-to-high seven-digits, to be noteworthy corruption. Think Clinton Foundation speeches and donations, sale of nuclear material to Russian company, flying your dog and his trainer separately to your vacation spot, flying the First Lady separately to vacation, handing out millions in new welfare through SSDI and Obamacare, taking lots n lots n lots of vacations on the taxpayer's dime, taking your mother-in-law and daughters with you for a trip to China, etc. :piano:

Nobbynumbnuts
04-08-2015, 19:19
This is only relevant to the discussion if one thinks RF's corruption is so much worse, that it harms the country's economy more than any other country's. :boxing:

As to this particular instance of corruption, it is small potatoes, in the six-figure range. You've gotta hit the seven-digits, if not mid-to-high seven-digits, to be noteworthy corruption. Think Clinton Foundation speeches and donations, sale of nuclear material to Russian company, flying your dog and his trainer separately to your vacation spot, flying the First Lady separately to vacation, handing out millions in new welfare through SSDI and Obamacare, taking lots n lots n lots of vacations on the taxpayer's dime, taking your mother-in-law and daughters with you for a trip to China, etc. :piano:

..Russia's obviously not in that league! :D

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 19:25
As to this particular instance of corruption, it is small potatoes, in the six-figure range. You've gotta hit the seven-digits, if not mid-to-high seven-digits, to be noteworthy corruption.

I am sorry, Cool Nick, but you have just demonstrated a totally defective, irredeemably false logic. Again. The correct logic would be: if this guy, a state official with a rather modest salary and no officially declared business, can afford a watch worth six hundred thousand dollars, what does his house really look like? How much does he really spend per month? Where has he got the money from? How many other Russian state officials are the same or similar way? How many millions of babuskas might be starving because of this? How many Russians, including little cute children and women, have died because they haven't received proper medical aid because of this? The rabbit hole seems to be very deep. You don't make any sense at all, Cool Nick. :emote_popcorn:

FatAndy
04-08-2015, 19:38
:emote_popcorn:

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 19:57
I am sorry, Cool Nick, but you have just demonstrated a totally defective, irredeemably false logic. Again. The correct logic would be: if this guy, a state official with a rather modest salary and no officially declared business, can afford a watch worth six hundred thousand dollars, what does his house really look like? ....
How many millions of babuskas might be starving because of this? How many Russians, including little cute children and women, have died because they haven't received proper medical aid because of this?

Yes RL, their are two interpretations of this, yours is the Kartoshka v Mundire variety ;)

If you take the skin off these potatoes, this really is small potatoes corruption, in Western society it really is common for our elected officials to be horribly overpaid for their "service to country," then they make seven-figure salaries consulting contacting or lobbying for the government job they left. :shhhhhh:

Again I think it's a stretch to deduce that the decrease in RF's economy is in parallel to an increase in corruption, so probably the corruption is a mitigating factor but not causal relationship to the RF's economy's decline. :boxing:

But this line of logic is a great path to take if the goal is to pull RF back towards socialism...your babushkas, women and children line is classic, it directly parallels the USA Left's attack on the rich. :yellowcard:
i.e. ->
RL, your pending website, "you didn't build that!" You used the RF infrastructure and RF citizens as workers, all paid for (trained) by taxes, to build your website! Socialism sounds great on paper but in reality its a filthy flimsy Potemkin village :twofaced:

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 20:13
But this line of logic is a great path to take if the goal is to pull RF back towards socialism...your babushkas, women and children line is classic, it directly parallels the USA Left's attack on the rich.
i.e. ->
RL, your pending website, "you didn't build that!" You used the RF infrastructure and RF citizens as workers, all paid for (trained) by taxes, to build your website! Socialism sounds great on paper but in reality its a filthy flimsy Potemkin village

No one is attacking capitalism here, I am not sure where you got this idea from. Another false logic example, I assume. Once again, if you are in a tank - he is a government official on a relatively modest government salary (I am not).
As to my site, I have personally written the technical description on over 60 pages (that's after I wrote 30 pages on the design), among other things, so one may say I do have something to do with it. Whatever I am paying to designers and programmers, I earned all this through my nose, working on full time and sporadic translation jobs - so I am not sure how you can even begin dragging me into this. You seem to be stuffed with false logic like a Thanksgiving turkey. No real person can be that, how to say it in a polite way, difficult, so I still think you are not a real person.
As to the Western corruption - a Polish official (minister of transportation) immediately resigned after it turned out he was wearing an undeclared watch worth 5 thousand dollars - so again, you are clutching at straws here.

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 20:28
No one is attacking capitalism here, I am not sure where you got this idea from. Another false logic example, I assume.
As to my site, I have personally written the technical description on over 60 pages, among other things, so one may say I do have something to do with it. Whatever I am paying to designers and programmers, I earned all this through my nose, working on full time and sporadic translation jobs - so I am not sure how you can even begin dragging me into this.

You're a great candidate for capitalism, RL....I wish we could trade some of the crazies in our country supporting Bernie Sanders for more hardworking wealth creators like you!

My apologies if you did not intend to attack capitalism, but if this is the case, why did you bring babushkas and cute women and children into this conversation? The facts remain, this watch situation is a sad example of corruption but:
1. Corruption occurs on a much larger level in some of the big dog countries, yet most of the MSM are too timid to report on this. On RF's corruption, they are ready to write volumes.
2. Just like you worked hard to build your website, perhaps this bureaucrat worked hard to get his salary (how high is it, does anyone know?) to buy his shiny watches. But you're mistaken if you think the Wset has few fatcat corrupt bureaucrats....just look at all the slime at the UN in New York who get paid to create committes ansd issue dictates but get absolutely nothing done!
3. The corruption does not have a causal relationship to the RF economy's decline. Unless someone has some data or graphs that have not been posted here. As far as I am aware the RF economy did not rise in the 2000s as corruption declined, and now in 2014-2015 corruption is not rising as the economy declines.
4. # 3 means the bureaucrat with the watches has nothing to do with the poor babushkas women & children - this is just a populist platitude!

I will say, RL, debating you is challenging and interesting; I'm glad for your contributions and probably agree with you on more than you think. Our main disagreement is that I think RF strengthening its culture will produce great ROI in the future, and the cultural collapses in the West (esp. USA) are leading those countries on teetering train tracks headed towards eventual doom.

Russian Lad
04-08-2015, 20:32
My apologies if you did not intend to attack capitalism, but if this is the case, why did you bring babushkas and cute women and children into this conversation?

Because even under capitalism hospitals and healthcare are subsidized in many ways.


Just like you worked hard to build your website, perhaps this bureaucrat worked hard to get his salary (how high is it, does anyone know?) to buy his shiny watches.

Yes, 9 million rubles per year. Which means he would need to be saving for four years in a row (without spending a copeck on anything) to buy this watch. The issue is not so much him personally as the system as such.


I will say, RL, debating you is challenging and interesting; I'm glad for your contributions and probably agree with you on more than you think. Our main disagreement is that I think RF strengthening its culture will produce great ROI in the future, and the cultural collapses in the West (esp. USA) are leading those countries on teetering train tracks headed towards eventual doom.

I believe you think so only because you seem to face solely grim choices in the US at the moment (like toiling hard in an office and sipping coffee at Starbucks after 17.00, bemoaning your fate) and for some reason you imagine you will have a lot of great opportunities in Russia. You might be mistaken thinking that, but of course I don't know your real situation.

nicklcool
04-08-2015, 22:11
I believe you think so only because you seem to face solely grim choices in the US at the moment (like toiling hard in an office and sipping coffee at Starbucks after 17.00, bemoaning your fate) and for some reason you imagine you will have a lot of great opportunities in Russia. You might be mistaken thinking that, but of course I don't know your real situation.

Always making it personal, RL. :sick:

What about this six-figure corruption? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKKHSAE1gIs

Did you finally nail down the reason you think RF's economy is suffering? Is it due to all the rampant corruption? Any stats or figures to back that up? :zoom:

FatAndy
05-08-2015, 11:44
a Polish official (minister of transportation) immediately resigned after it turned out he was wearing an undeclared watch worth 5 thousand dollars - so again, you are clutching at straws here.
No surprise that he has resigned - it's a shame to have such beggar watches on such respectable position ;)

Just for a case, for those who likes to masturbate on watches:
http://ruposters.ru/news/03-08-2015/chasovyh-del-mastera-o

Carl
05-08-2015, 12:19
No surprise that he has resigned - it's a shame to have such beggar watches on such respectable position ;)

Just for a case, for those who likes to masturbate on watches:
http://ruposters.ru/news/03-08-2015/chasovyh-del-mastera-o

Yeah.. they should ban government officials that don't steal a respectable enough amount of the masses money.

FatAndy
05-08-2015, 12:44
Yeah.. they should ban government officials that don't steal a respectable enough amount of the masses money.
Yeah, we've started purges already, my stonecrusher works almost 24*7.

Carl
05-08-2015, 13:30
No surprise that he has resigned - it's a shame to have such beggar watches on such respectable position ;)

Just for a case, for those who likes to masturbate on watches:
http://ruposters.ru/news/03-08-2015/chasovyh-del-mastera-o

They should ban government officials that don't steal a respectably large enough amount of the citizenry's money..

Russian Lad
06-08-2015, 13:55
Euro 70 and counting... Can we please change the title from the "Economic situation in Russia" to the "Economic collapse in Russia"? It would be more appropriate I reckon. :yawn2:

Uncle Wally
06-08-2015, 15:02
Euro 70 and counting... Can we please change the title from the "Economic situation in Russia" to the "Economic collapse in Russia"? It would be more appropriate I reckon. :yawn2:


Why don't you just start your own thread.

AstarD
06-08-2015, 15:11
Andy will just merge it with this one or start another one with a very losable headline.

FatAndy
06-08-2015, 15:16
Andy will just merge it with this one
Sure, the $h!t should be in one place (water closet), not dropped around, as I was taught in military-medical dept :)

Uncle Wally
06-08-2015, 16:36
Sure, the $h!t should be in one place (water closet), not dropped around, as I was taught in military-medical dept :)


That was in bone crushing class?

nicklcool
06-08-2015, 17:10
Euro 70 and counting... Can we please change the title from the "Economic situation in Russia" to the "Economic collapse in Russia"? It would be more appropriate I reckon. :yawn2:
I would vote with my feet RL, you'd better get yourself out of that godforsaken h*llhole of a country before it's too late and bread costs a wheelbarrow full of rubles and the food riots begin!
Remember every country gets the government it deserves

FatAndy
06-08-2015, 17:10
That was in bone crushing class?
No, military epidemiology.

Russian Lad
06-08-2015, 17:27
I would vote with my feet RL, you'd better get yourself out of that godforsaken h*llhole of a country before it's too late and bread costs a wheelbarrow full of rubles and the food riots begin!


Why, I keep my cash in hard currencies. But most russkies don't even have any savings, neither in hard currencies, nor in rubles, moreover - millions are in debt and they will never be able to pay it back, it seems. And the clock is ticking. We can't really stop the time, can we? Many people in history have tried fighting against the time, but all have perished, alas, c'est la vie. :yawn2:


Remember every country gets the government it deserves

That's true, by an large. Well, I have never voted for those currently in power.
It seems to me you have been quite a bit hysterical recently. Something is bothering you, comrade?:)
P.S. Interesting changes are occurring in my neighborhood - it seems we are heading back to the beginning of the nineties very fast - throngs of peddlers, beggars and hookers in the streets. Everyone is clamorous for attention. Crime is rampant.

nicklcool
06-08-2015, 17:42
It seems to me you have been quite a bit hysterical recently. Something is bothering you, comrade?:)

NO, not hysterical, RL....I know you said that in post 1608 I was whining like a little girl, but that's your MO, to insult and make it personal when you have nothing else to say, because your theory (RF economy on its way towards eventual collapse - post 1662) has absolutely no basis in economic facts or statistics.

You're very good at commenting on the obvious - yes, FOREX is getting worse for the ruble - you'd make a great after-the-fact weatherman!

Ruble exchange rate getting worse = effect, what is the cause? I've identified many many factors that predict there won't be a collapse, that this is Russia's version of the "Great Recession" that the USA suffered in 2007-2009. Until we identify the cause we cannot predict how the economy will perform in the future. I know you won't answer but I figured I'd ask you again for the umpteenth time.

Russian Lad
06-08-2015, 17:49
Ruble exchange rate getting worse = effect, what is the cause? I've identified many many factors that predict there won't be a collapse, that this is Russia's version of the "Great Recession" that the USA suffered in 2007-2009. Until we identify the cause we cannot predict how the economy will perform in the future. I know you won't answer but I figured I'd ask you again for the umpteenth time.

The cause - rampant prices on everything, since most products/equipment and/or their ingredients/components are imported. It is rather straightforward, I guess it is not my problem you are not grasping this. That's #1. #2 - continued shutting down/shrinking of businesses, rising unemployment. #3 - continued capital flight. #4 - a seriously hit banking sector, unable to borrow from the West in many cases. Et cetera. In fact, unlike you, I don't see a single positive factor and I see like 100 negative ones (plus like 500 more as the inevitable side effects from those 100 negative factors). But I don't intend to write a thesis for you here. Pay me - I will write a 100 pages report on my findings, together with a detailed analysis of what is going to happen and why.:)
As to my post fact predictions - I was predicting the ruble would crash like 2 years ago and was laughed at by most posters here. Well, now it is my turn to laugh.

Nobbynumbnuts
06-08-2015, 19:08
....Ruble exchange rate getting worse = effect, what is the cause? I've identified many many factors that predict there won't be a collapse, that this is Russia's version of the "Great Recession" that the USA suffered in 2007-2009. Until we identify the cause we cannot predict how the economy will perform in the future. I know you won't answer but I figured I'd ask you again for the umpteenth time.

Effect? Falling oil price, mainly.
Russia also suffered a severe recession 2008-2009 :winking:

bydand
06-08-2015, 21:50
Effect? Falling oil price, mainly.
Russia also suffered a severe recession 2008-2009 :winking:

Unbridled corruption, and prohibitive taxes on business, I might add.

Russian Lad
06-08-2015, 22:45
Hello, Bydand, long time no see:) Doing ok?

Alan65
07-08-2015, 00:22
Effect? Falling oil price, mainly.
Russia also suffered a severe recession 2008-2009 :winking:

This thing about 2008 2009 is something I don't understand, today the sterling to ruble rate once again passed the 100 mark, however looking back over the last 10 years, sterling to ruble was typically in the 40 - 50 band, suddenly circa 18 months ago something significantly changed

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=RUB&view=10Y

Not even 2008 - 2009 caused this fluctuation and this was a global recession, what is the reason for these dynamics, it all started in 2013 prior to Ukraine.

Carl
07-08-2015, 07:40
https://www.facebook.com/vmoskve/videos/1136694763012780/

bydand
07-08-2015, 10:28
Hello, Bydand, long time no see:) Doing ok?




:wavey::thumbsup:



:fridaysign:

nicklcool
07-08-2015, 16:57
The cause - rampant prices on everything, since most products/equipment and/or their ingredients/components are imported. That's #1. #2 - continued shutting down/shrinking of businesses, rising unemployment. #3 - continued capital flight. #4 - a seriously hit banking sector, unable to borrow from the West in many cases. Et cetera. In fact, unlike you, I don't see a single positive factor and I see like 100 negative ones (plus like 500 more as the inevitable side effects from those 100 negative factors).

For the sake of compare/contrast:

1/3 of USA population isn't in the workforce (http://cnsnews.com/news/article/susan-jones/record-93770000-americans-not-labor-force-participation-rate-matches-38), oh my! :

""cording to the Congressional Budget Office's 2015 long-term outlook, the number of working Americans is expected to increase more slowly in coming decades, as more workers exit the labor force, many of them retiring baby-boomers; and fewer workers enter it -- given declining birth rates and a levelling-off of women in the labor force.""

I posted the links earlier, RF's workforce participation rate and female participation rate are rising, as the unemployment rate is falling. RL, where did you find data showing a rising unemployment rate for RF?

Of course neither of us is an economic or finance expert, or we'd be working in the President's cabinet or working in finance making big $$$ based on our economic analytical and predictive skills!

But your focus RL is on today's data; today's FOREX rate and today's price of bread. Who cares about today or even the next few years?? The data - and participation rate and unemployment rate are pretty big among them - do not point to an RF economic collapse in the long term, but USA's CBO's data in the link above show some hard times ahead for USA - with a shrinking workforce who's gonna pay for all these existing and new welfare programs??

#1, 3, and 4 I cannot speak on yet - but I'd love for you to share some data confirming those points, as I have with the RF data like military spending vs. GDP, welfare spending vs. GDP, unemployment rate through 2014, rising birth rates, workforce participation rates, etc.

:fridaysign::fridaysign:

TolkoRaz
07-08-2015, 18:11
How much of the US of A's adult population is in prison? I read somewhere that it has the highest adult prison population in the World! :book:

Uncle Wally
07-08-2015, 18:31
How much of the US of A's adult population is in prison? I read somewhere that it has the highest adult prison population in the World! :book:



Something around 2 million. Then there are all the ex-con, people on probation and all the people who have suspended sentences or house arrest.

Russian Lad
07-08-2015, 18:43
Russia's imprisonment rate is one of the highest as well, ranking right after the US, so what?

Russian Lad
07-08-2015, 18:51
where did you find data showing a rising unemployment rate for RF?

Once again, you seem to be a troll, because no real person can be that intellectually challenged. How do you even plan to survive in Russia? Even Wally is beginning to seem like a shining and shrewd scientist in comparison. Where do I take my info? Like from everywhere*, what about you? Give me links showing the unemployment today is lower in Russia than a year-a year and a half ago. All the sources I have seen tell me now the unemployment is already higher than in the crisis of 2008-2009 (and there is a huge chunk of unregistered unemployment - millions of people).
*
http://www.huthut.ru/russia/economic/2944-bezrabotica-v-rossii
http://comstol.info/2015/02/ekonomika/10646
http://rusrand.ru/analytics/bezrabotitsa-v-rossii

TolkoRaz
07-08-2015, 22:11
Something around 2 million. Then there are all the ex-con, people on probation and all the people who have suspended sentences or house arrest.

I wonder who builds the ever expanding prisons? ;) Halliburton or KBR by any chance? ;)

Judge
07-08-2015, 23:02
Where do I take my info? Like from everywhere*, what about you? Give me links showing the unemployment today is lower in Russia than a year-a year and a half ago. All the sources I have seen tell me now the unemployment is already higher than in the crisis of 2008-2009 (and there is a huge chunk of unregistered unemployment - millions of people).
*
http://www.huthut.ru/russia/economic/2944-bezrabotica-v-rossii
http://comstol.info/2015/02/ekonomika/10646
http://rusrand.ru/analytics/bezrabotitsa-v-rossii

How high was unemployment at the peak of the crisis 2008-2009?

Russian Lad
07-08-2015, 23:44
You can google-translate and read my links.:) The answer is there. And, for like 48959504005 time - there is a lot of unregistered unemployment. All the unemployed people I know are not officially registered as such. Then there are millions of Russians who do only sporadic jobs, you may call them unemployed as well. Then there are also millions of housewives who leech off their husbands/lovers, don't work anywhere or are listed somewhere nominally, just for the pension reasons.
They are lying about many things, I don't see any reasons they would not want to lie about unemployment. But this is increasingly difficult anyway.

Judge
07-08-2015, 23:51
You can google-translate and read my links.:) The answer is there. And, for like 48959504005 time - there is a lot of unregistered unemployment. All the unemployed people I know are not officially registered as such. Then there are millions of Russians who do only sporadic jobs, you may call them unemployed as well. Then there are also millions of housewives who leech off their husbands/lovers, don't work anywhere or are listed somewhere nominally, just for the pension reasons.

Your links don't say much, one is gibberish,another about how not to lose your job, the other I didn't even bother with.

According to this, unemployment "now" is about 5.4% and at the height of the 2008/9 crisis as high as 9%.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/russia/unemployment-rate
and for the past few months unemployment is decreasing.

Russian Lad
07-08-2015, 23:57
Like I said, it depends how you count it, see what I said above. Let's try to be logical (I know it is hard) - what has improved in the Russian economy to create jobs? Compare it with what has become worse. Nothing comes out of nothing, as they say. Where did all those new millions of Russians living below the poverty line come from then, if employment is improving? It doesn't add up. That's even before we touch upon the fact that all salaries paid in rubles have lost a huge chunk of their purchasing power during the last year and a half.

nicklcool
08-08-2015, 00:03
Concentrate, RL, Focus. USA and probably every other economy has this shadow unemployment (in USA it is that U15 (Usomething?) number), so to compare apples to apples we use RF's "official" unemployment and USA's "official" (U5) unemployment rate.
....But you're on to something here...RF's 10+ % inflation rate includes food and gas/fuel, while USA's 5- % inflation rate does not, hmmmmmm....

Judge, I found the article humorous, too, I skimmed the first one and saw the tips for keeping your job - "don't use social networks or play games on the computer at work" - LOL that's exactly what I'm doing right now!!

Judge
08-08-2015, 00:29
Like I said, it depends how you count it, see what I said above. Let's try to be logical (I know it is hard) - what has improved in the Russian economy to create jobs? Compare it with what has become worse. Nothing comes out of nothing, as they say. Where did all those new millions of Russians living below the poverty line come from then, if employment is improving? It doesn't add up. That's even before we touch upon the fact that all salaries paid in rubles have lost a huge chunk of their purchasing power during the last year and a half.

The Kremlin back in February said they will spend 52bn rubles to fight the rise of unemployment ,creating new jobs.
This was back in February, unemployment has been decreasing since then each month ,which could meen the plan is working,for now.
http://cdn.tradingeconomics.com/charts/russia-unemployment-rate.png?s=ruuer&v=201508041955d

RL, I'm not saying there isn't massive layoffs at the moment cos I know there are,like this,http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russian-car-dealerships-see-spike-in-layoffs-as-sales-plummet/527535.html
but ,for all we know there are other jobs out there and people won't stay unemployed for long.

Nobbynumbnuts
08-08-2015, 01:08
The Kremlin back in February said they will spend 52bn rubles to fight the rise of unemployment ,creating new jobs.
This was back in February, unemployment has been decreasing since then each month ,which could meen the plan is working,for now.
http://cdn.tradingeconomics.com/charts/russia-unemployment-rate.png?s=ruuer&v=201508041955d

RL, I'm not saying there isn't massive layoffs at the moment cos I know there are,like this,http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russian-car-dealerships-see-spike-in-layoffs-as-sales-plummet/527535.html
but ,for all we know there are other jobs out there and people won't stay unemployed for long.

I think it's important to understand the link between unemployment and GDP (gross domestic product. The value of all goods and services produced by the country) Both are linked. If people are unemployed and sitting at home, they are not producing. If GDP is shrinking (Russia -3.8% early 2015 Latest, -4.3%) then unemployment cannot be falling. If it was then GDP would be increasing, not decreasing.
In fact, often there is an increase in GDP first but no decrease in unemployment because employers would rather ask staff to work extra hours, hire part time staff etc before taking on extra labour cost before they are sure the recovery is permanent.

I'm sure the Russian government has a plan to tackle unemployment and spending money to do so is probably a good move but it will take time to show results. Those results will show themselves first in an improving GDP number...

Russian Lad
08-08-2015, 02:03
but it will take time

Yes, and the clock is ticking...


for all we know there are other jobs out there

In which sectors? And again, where did those below the poverty line millions come from, if employment is on a rise?
Besides, let's remember that employment serves a purpose - some minimum standards of living should be met. But many job offers are so substandard I have a feeling slaves lived in much better conditions, say, in the US.

Judge
08-08-2015, 10:21
Yes, and the clock is ticking...



In which sectors? And again, where did those below the poverty line millions come from, if employment is on a rise?
Besides, let's remember that employment serves a purpose - some minimum standards of living should be met. But many job offers are so substandard I have a feeling slaves lived in much better conditions, say, in the US.

More people fell into poverty cos cost of living went up,inflation
,not much to do with unemployment increasing, which in fact it isn't now.
Maybe minimum wage needs to be raised, for sure pensions should be, I remember reading they will increase pensions.

This bit from you is what made me question your source.

All the sources I have seen tell me now the unemployment is already higher than in the crisis of 2008-2009

Which sectors, I don't know but with local food in big demand I would think that more jobs are being created in this sector....Also in construction, housing, stadiums roads, bridges, list is endless in this sector,so much is needed to be built.

Uncle Wally
08-08-2015, 11:07
More people fell into poverty cos cost of living went up,inflation
,not much to do with unemployment increasing, which in fact it isn't now.
Maybe minimum wage needs to be raised, for sure pensions should be, I remember reading they will increase pensions.

This bit from you is what made me question your source.


Which sectors, I don't know but with local food in big demand I would think that more jobs are being created in this sector....Also in construction, housing, stadiums roads, bridges, list is endless in this sector,so much is needed to be built.



But in a lot of jobs people aren't Russian they're Tajik or Uzbek.

Nobbynumbnuts
08-08-2015, 11:11
More people fell into poverty cos cost of living went up,inflation
,not much to do with unemployment increasing, which in fact it isn't now.
Maybe minimum wage needs to be raised, for sure pensions should be, I remember reading they will increase pensions.

This bit from you is what made me question your source.


Which sectors, I don't know but with local food in big demand I would think that more jobs are being created in this sector....Also in construction, housing, stadiums roads, bridges, list is endless in this sector,so much is needed to be built.

I'm having trouble believing Russian unemployment is falling when the Russian finance ministry it's self, Sberbank and VTB bank admit that the Russian economy has shrunk further since earlier reports of a decline back in May. Goes against all logic..

Uncle Wally
08-08-2015, 11:15
I'm having trouble believing Russian unemployment is falling when the Russian finance ministry it's self, Sberbank and VTB bank admit that the Russian economy has shrunk further since earlier reports of a decline back in May. Goes against all logic..



You and logic don't seem to mix.

Judge
08-08-2015, 11:21
I'm having trouble believing Russian unemployment is falling when the Russian finance ministry it's self, Sberbank and VTB bank admit that the Russian economy has shrunk further since earlier reports of a decline back in May. Goes against all logic..

I'm just going from that link I posted, from February there's been a decrease. .The CBR predicted that unemployment will rise from 5.6% to 6.5% at the end of 2015.

Nobbynumbnuts
08-08-2015, 11:34
.....The CBR predicted that unemployment will rise from 5.6% to 6.5% at the end of 2015.

That would make more sense given the government's own figures on GDP. If they are spending 52 billion to increase employment and they are successful, then perhaps we'll see signs later in the year/early next year
It takes time from making an announcement. Deciding where to spend the money, detailing plans for projects, dealing with bids and quotes, finalizing contracts and getting start dates...

Judge
08-08-2015, 11:36
But in a lot of jobs people aren't Russian they're Tajik or Uzbek.

Not only, crane drivers, truck drivers ,formen etc, are mostly Russians.Don't forget all matrials locally produced, office workers too.

Russian Lad
08-08-2015, 14:15
More people fell into poverty cos cost of living went up,inflation
,not much to do with unemployment increasing, which in fact it isn't now.

Which brings us again to the question why we need such an "employment"... When I walk in my neighborhood, it looks like I am in a "Stan". All these "stan" people are either taking the jobs from Russians for a lower pay or are involved in crime. There is "мухаббат" with a phone number ("love" in a "stan" language) painted like in 10 places on the asphalt where I take my strolls. That's in Saint Petersburg.

Capman
08-08-2015, 14:38
I wonder who builds the ever expanding prisons? ;) Halliburton or KBR by any chance? ;)

That they are built by oddly named security companies that are owned by shell companies, which own several other companies that build prisons in Europe and other countries. The same shell companies also own other companies that produce military grade weapons, which in turn, sell those weapons to any country that has the money.
:dont-tell-anyone:

rumple_stilskin
09-08-2015, 00:55
How much of the US of A's adult population is in prison? I read somewhere that it has the highest adult prison population in the World! :book:

It's not just that 1% of the US is in Prison at any point in time. they say about 46 million americans will end up in prison, it's about 1 in 10!

Worse of all, is that 25% of men are raped in Prison. So about 10 million americans will have been raped in Prison.

So Russian ladies, if you are thinking of finding yourself an american man,, remember. 1 in 10 has been in Prison, and 1 in 30 was raped by another man in Prison.

There was an article in the guardian where they were saying in the USA, more men are raped than women!!!!! Literally!

Disgusting or ?

america in 2015 is like the soviet union in Stalin times.

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 01:53
I am not sure how it is related to the economic situation in Russia and why you are eager to derail the thread, but here you go then:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlxNRueCC-4

rumple_stilskin
09-08-2015, 10:44
I am not sure how it is related to the economic situation in Russia]

I started a new thread - maybe the moderator could delete the above post. I just saw the comment about USA prisons.....had to add my trivia

TolkoRaz
09-08-2015, 11:18
That they are built by oddly named security companies that are owned by shell companies, which own several other companies that build prisons in Europe and other countries. The same shell companies also own other companies that produce military grade weapons, which in turn, sell those weapons to any country that has the money.
:dont-tell-anyone:

I assume a 'shell' company is an umbrella company designed to mask the owners?

If so, any ideas who actually owns the final entity?

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 13:03
Wonder if we are going to have a Black Monday.:) Things are awefully quiet.

rumple_stilskin
09-08-2015, 13:57
Wonder if we are going to have a Black Monday.:) Things are awefully quiet.

you have to start thinking positive

penka
09-08-2015, 14:13
you have to start thinking positive

Ha! Haven't you noticed that he thoroughly enjoys himself by stirring everyone around? He needs opponents, not only those that agree with him otherwise there's no sport.

PS Yeah, the usual response would be: You bi***c sit in Stockholm and give no cr*p of poverty and suffering here. Were I married/ had a bf, he'd write, You b**c not only sit in Stockholm but also leech off your hubby, regardless were the absent hubby a millionaire or an unemployed. And in another thread he'd write of awful Russians that are chauvinist, xenophobic pigs. I mean, we heard it all and it's plain boring.
On which he'd say, Clock is ticking, you won't be bored soon enough.
And then he'll keep calling folks for trolls.
Etc etc etc.
I mean. BORING.

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 14:15
you have to start thinking positive

My thinking is entirely positive.:smug:


Ha! Haven't you noticed that he thoroughly enjoys himself by stirring everyone around? He needs opponents, not only those that agree with him otherwise there's no sport.

Any healthy debate would be impossible without opponents. Don't you think having a Black Monday would be great, Penka?:) We haven't had one for a little while, I am missing the fun and the excitement watching the currencies climb to 100 online. And appliances stores haven't been ransacked for quite a while too. Wonder if the Russians have any cash left for this invigorating activity or this time it will be an onslaught on grocery stores. I am seriously intrigued by that, don't know about you. The most essential groceries price freeze is about to expire, wonder if it will get prolonged or we will be seeing the first signs of food deficit straight away, Venezuela way. So many captivating issues to ponder on, do be a sport too, let's speculate about the near future. Have your Russian friends stockpiled on buckwheat and cheese yet? There is still time, not all the food has been destroyed yet, only 348 tons: http://zenrus.ru/
In Saint Petersburg (where millions died from hunger in WW-II) food has been burnt in special incinerators, isn't this a great achievement?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcxUk25TgYI See, by destroying food we are rising from our knees, you gotta appreciate and admire that, comrade. That said, the rotten West is reporting that food sanctions are not hurting them and the foodstuffs export has recently posted a 5% increase - they have simply routed the barred flows to China, India and so forth. Perhaps we should burn more food? So far they have only been laughing at us (or scratching their heads in disbelief).


PS Yeah, the usual response would be: You bi***c sit in Stockholm and give no cr*p of poverty and suffering here. Were I married/ had a bf, he'd write, You b**c not only sit in Stockholm but also leech off your hubby, regardless were the absent hubby a millionaire or an unemployed. And in another thread he'd write of awful Russians that are chauvinist, xenophobic pigs. I mean, we heard it all and it's plain boring.

Wow, now, I have liked this, that's a good retort. Please continue.

penka
09-08-2015, 14:53
My thinking is entirely positive.:smug:



Any healthy debate would be impossible without opponents. Don't you think having a Black Monday would be great, Penka?:) We haven't had one for a little while, I am missing the fun and the excitement watching the currencies climb to 100 online. And appliances stores haven't been ransacked for quite a while too. Wonder if the Russians have any cash left for this invigorating activity or this time it will be an onslaught on grocery stores. I am seriously intrigued by that, don't know about you. The most essential groceries price freeze is about to expire, wonder if it will get prolonged or we will be seeing the first signs of food deficit straight away, Venezuela way. So many captivating issues to ponder on, do be a sport too, let's speculate about the near future. Have your Russian friends stockpiled on buckwheat and cheese yet? There is still time, not all the food has been destroyed yet, only 348 tons: http://zenrus.ru/
In Saint Petersburg (where millions died from hunger in WW-II) food has been burnt in special incinerators, isn't this a great achievement?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcxUk25TgYI See, by destroying food we are rising from our knees, you gotta appreciate and admire that, comrade. That said, the rotten West is reporting that food sanctions are not hurting them and the foodstuffs export has recently posted a 5% increase - they have simply routed the barred flows to China, India and so forth. Perhaps we should burn more food? So far they have only been laughing at us (or scratching their heads in disbelief).



Wow, now, I have liked this, that's a good retort. Please continue.

I was not aware you were living off Parmigiano Reggiano and Jamon Iberico, which demise you grieve so sincerely, you used to say you're poor. What's the nature of this grief, precisely?

Besides, this text I've already seen in snob.ru. Boring to see the reprint.

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 14:59
Besides, this text I've already seen in snob.ru. Boring to see the reprint.

Which text exactly? I am not Rusmeister, I don't copy-paste.:tongue: But if there is someone else thinking like me, I can only welcome it.


I was not aware you were living off Parmigiano Reggiano and Jamon Iberico, which demise you grieve so sincerely, you used to say you're poor. What's the nature of this grief, precisely?

That's exactly my point - I am poor as a church mouse, and people like me have never tasted fine cheeses or Jamon, and now all this great food is publicly destroyed, while we are counting copecks to be able to buy frozen meat once a week. I would not mind a morcel.:) You find it boring because you are a well-fed lady enjoying Western food and Western freedoms, while I am oppressed and underfed here in Russia...

Nobbynumbnuts
09-08-2015, 15:33
Just like to add..
The sanctions could be a long term advantage to Russia. The present situation should force the government to develop local industry, agriculture, distribution and infrastructure etc. There's a lot of cost and organization involved, Russia's a very big country. It won't happen over night as some seem to think it will. But for me the biggest problem is the government it's self. Will it seize this opportunity? I seriously have my doubts..

I'd like to give an example of the craziness that is Russia. I did some work for Hilton Double Tree in Novosibirsk a few years ago. We were located not far from the central rynok. Anyone who has been to a Russian market knows about the amazing products that can be found there. The hotel was buying all it's fruit and veg. from Metro, a large cash and carry style operation on the edge of town. Everything was much more expensive and imported! I tried to change this and organize accounts with suppliers at the market and get a van and driver to go everyday and collect our requirement.
Firstly, there was no enthusiasm from anyone in senior management to do this. A crazy notion that products there were not as good as from Metro (imported is best), we would be cheated by the suppliers and/or the buyer/driver. I tried to persuade them that products at the market will be fresher, more likely to be local (supporting local suppliers meant nothing to them) we can buy what we need everyday rather than twice a week at Metro. Therefore a tighter control over over our daily changing needs. Further, i tried to explain systems can be put into place to minimize dishonesty. Incredibly they were happy to continue paying a lot more for poorer quality, imported products, that proved difficult for us to order accurately twice a week.

My point is, that making a lot of the changes need to make Russia operate more effectively can't be improved simply by organization and money. Most of what needs to change is a mindset and that's much harder and takes longer to do. But it's got to start from the top...

TolkoRaz
09-08-2015, 17:14
Ha! Haven't you noticed that he thoroughly enjoys himself by stirring everyone around? He needs opponents, not only those that agree with him otherwise there's no sport.

PS Yeah, the usual response would be: You bi***c sit in Stockholm and give no cr*p of poverty and suffering here. Were I married/ had a bf, he'd write, You b**c not only sit in Stockholm but also leech off your hubby, regardless were the absent hubby a millionaire or an unemployed. And in another thread he'd write of awful Russians that are chauvinist, xenophobic pigs. I mean, we heard it all and it's plain boring.
On which he'd say, Clock is ticking, you won't be bored soon enough.
And then he'll keep calling folks for trolls.
Etc etc etc.
I mean. BORING.

I am still waiting for the Ruble to be 100 to the US of A Dollar!

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 18:24
Your wish is my command.:) Unless a miracle happens... 36 rubles to go, we have gone 55% of the way... Let's have a Black Monday. It would look cool in headlines. I would even settle for a Black Tuesday or a Black Wednesday.:)
Tolko, you mentioned Mariupol like a year ago and said something about a land passage to Krym, why have you failed?:) You don't seem to be delivering.

Nobbynumbnuts
09-08-2015, 20:13
..some more news to digest.

Full article here:-http://peakoil.com/business/russias-energy-giant-implodes

Russia’s Energy Giant Implodes

Business
It was not too long ago that Gazprom, the state-controlled energy conglomerate, was one of the Kremlin’s most potent geopolitical weapons. But those days now seem like a distant memory: Gazprom is a financial shadow of its former self.

The speed of Gazprom’s decline is breathtaking. At its peak in May 2008, the company’s market capitalization reached $367.27 billion, making it one of world’s most valuable companies, according to a survey compiled by the Financial Times. Gazprom’s deputy chair, Alexander Medvedev, repeatedly predicted at the time that within a decade the Russian energy giant could be worth $1 trillion.

That prediction now seem foolhardy. Since 2008, Gazprom’s value has plummeted. As of August 3, it had a market capitalization of $51.12 billion. A little over four years ago, in April 2011, the figure stood at $194.5 billion. No company among the planet’s Top 5,000 has suffered a bigger collapse in market capitalization, according to Bloomberg Business News.

Indicators suggest Gazprom is nowhere near hitting bottom, and lingering uncertainty raises questions about its survivability. During the first two quarters of 2015, Gazprom’s natural gas production fell by 12.9%. In addition, Russia’s Ministry of Economic Development predicts that annual production will fall to 414 billion cubic meters (bcm), the lowest level in Gazprom’s history, and well below the company’s 2015 target of 485 bcm. Last year, production declined by 9% to 444 bcm, which, at the time, was the lowest on record. Industry experts forecast that production will remain low over the next few years.

Not only production is sagging, export revenues are also taking a big hit. During the first five months of 2015, export revenue shrank by 35.8% to $18.768 billion, according to Russia’s Federal Customs Service. Last year, the company’s net income plummeted by over seven times in ruble terms to 159 billion rubles from 1.139 trillion rubles in 2013, and by whopping 12.5 times in dollar terms to $2.8 billion from $34.8 billion in 2013.......

Capman
09-08-2015, 20:45
I assume a 'shell' company is an umbrella company designed to mask the owners?

If so, any ideas who actually owns the final entity?

Correct.
All I remember is, it is a type of firm with several owners/partnership.

I can't even be sure where I read about it ... I want to say Forbes Magazine, but I can't be sure .... The names of the companies were really odd, nothing sounded American.

bydand
09-08-2015, 20:46
..some more news to digest.

Full article here:-http://peakoil.com/business/russias-energy-giant-implodes

Russia’s Energy Giant Implodes

Business
It was not too long ago that Gazprom, the state-controlled energy conglomerate, was one of the Kremlin’s most potent geopolitical weapons. But those days now seem like a distant memory: Gazprom is a financial shadow of its former self.

The speed of Gazprom’s decline is breathtaking. At its peak in May 2008, the company’s market capitalization reached $367.27 billion, making it one of world’s most valuable companies, according to a survey compiled by the Financial Times. Gazprom’s deputy chair, Alexander Medvedev, repeatedly predicted at the time that within a decade the Russian energy giant could be worth $1 trillion.

That prediction now seem foolhardy. Since 2008, Gazprom’s value has plummeted. As of August 3, it had a market capitalization of $51.12 billion. A little over four years ago, in April 2011, the figure stood at $194.5 billion. No company among the planet’s Top 5,000 has suffered a bigger collapse in market capitalization, according to Bloomberg Business News.

Indicators suggest Gazprom is nowhere near hitting bottom, and lingering uncertainty raises questions about its survivability. During the first two quarters of 2015, Gazprom’s natural gas production fell by 12.9%. In addition, Russia’s Ministry of Economic Development predicts that annual production will fall to 414 billion cubic meters (bcm), the lowest level in Gazprom’s history, and well below the company’s 2015 target of 485 bcm. Last year, production declined by 9% to 444 bcm, which, at the time, was the lowest on record. Industry experts forecast that production will remain low over the next few years.

Not only production is sagging, export revenues are also taking a big hit. During the first five months of 2015, export revenue shrank by 35.8% to $18.768 billion, according to Russia’s Federal Customs Service. Last year, the company’s net income plummeted by over seven times in ruble terms to 159 billion rubles from 1.139 trillion rubles in 2013, and by whopping 12.5 times in dollar terms to $2.8 billion from $34.8 billion in 2013.......

Well, Nobby, I'm not surprised.
That's what happens when Gravy Sucking Pigs embezzle and otherwise purloin money from a (state confiscated/owned) company.

penka
09-08-2015, 20:47
I am still waiting for the Ruble to be 100 to the US of A Dollar!

I doubt that will happen any time soon.

penka
09-08-2015, 20:49
Your wish is my command.:) Unless a miracle happens... 36 rubles to go, we have gone 55% of the way... Let's have a Black Monday. It would look cool in headlines. I would even settle for a Black Tuesday or a Black Wednesday.:)
Tolko, you mentioned Mariupol like a year ago and said something about a land passage to Krym, why have you failed?:) You don't seem to be delivering.

Look, who's talking!:) Three years ago you said, you'd be out of the country in two years. You are telling me, you got more predictive power over a national currency than your own life?:D

PS Yep, you and Rus are very similar, in fact:)

TolkoRaz
09-08-2015, 22:11
It seems that pessimism costs less in the Rodina than optimism does! ;)

Nobbynumbnuts
09-08-2015, 23:20
It seems that pessimism costs less in the Rodina than optimism does! ;)

...that would have something to do with the business climate! :winking:

Russian Lad
09-08-2015, 23:45
Look, who's talking! Three years ago you said, you'd be out of the country in two years. You are telling me, you got more predictive power over a national currency than your own life?

Well, I can jump the plane tomorrow, but I have some things to do here. If you want, let's have a bet for USD 10000, I can leave the country in a week for your pleasure, but money first.:)
It was two years ago (maybe even a year and a half), I believe, not three years ago. That I started concocting such plans. However, those are personal plans, hundreds of unexpected obstacles may pop up that need a resolution. I can send you postcards from there like next week, but it would require me to cancel some other things, not a wise thing to do, I reckon.
As to my predictive power, I believe you laughed the loudest two years ago when I predicted the ruble crash. Well, it crashed, 100%. Right now (I am sure you haven't noticed that) there is much more at stake than just the ruble rate. Much, much more.


PS Yep, you and Rus are very similar, in fact

I believe our similarity begins and ends after the first three letters in our nicknames. And even those three letters, I think I have way more rights to them than he does, for that matter.:)

Judge
11-08-2015, 07:00
Not all bad new,
It does make a change, we often here about countries debt growing,

Nabiullina told Putin that Russia's financial system was not in crisis and was expected to turn a 100 billion ruble ($1.6 billion) profit this year despite several months of losses.
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/putin-praises-central-banks-work-strengthening-ruble/527714.html

FatAndy
11-08-2015, 10:48
Not all bad new,
It does make a change, we often here about countries debt growing,

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/putin-praises-central-banks-work-strengthening-ruble/527714.html
Will see, chicken are counted at autumn...©

penka
11-08-2015, 14:36
Not all bad new,
It does make a change, we often here about countries debt growing,

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/putin-praises-central-banks-work-strengthening-ruble/527714.html

What Nabiullina is doing is logical: Weak national currency = Energises the state budget, industrial production and export.

But: Will the industry/ agriculture pick up? Producing something/ investing in production/ modernising the production is a long and tedious process, no fast money there. Also: Will there be cheap credits for the industry/agriculture? How plausible is that the bureaucratic processes will be eased?

As for oil and the dynamics of stable demand/ multiple suppliers, it will go up but not till the previous lovely levels. Approx price for 2016 will be about 65USD/barrell, as estimated by, say, Norwegians.

nicklcool
11-08-2015, 16:20
Will see, chicken are counted at autumn...©

Yes, lots of European chest-puffing in summer when it's warm, we'll see how many nuts she's stowed away for the Winter when it's cold and she needs natural gas

Fantastika
11-08-2015, 17:21
1) If devaluation of a currency ($ vs. Ruble) is bad, why does China do it on purpose?

2) Gazprom's market cap(italization) measured in Rubles, has declined not nearly so dramatically.

penka
11-08-2015, 17:28
1) If devaluation of a currency ($ vs. Ruble) is bad, why does China do it on purpose?

2) Gazprom's market cap(italization) measured in Rubles, has declined not nearly so dramatically.

I've already addressed your question:)

Russian Lad
11-08-2015, 17:47
What Nabiullina is doing is logical: Weak national currency = Energises the state budget, industrial production and export.

Industrial production, right. In a country with like 60% budget dependence on oil and gas sales. You must be joking, right? And now that the Chinese have weakened their currency to continue flooding the world with their even cheaper merchandise, there are like from zero to none chances for the Russian "industries" (whatever you mean by that) to increase their production and to become competitive on the global market... What a joke amidst an unprecedented economic turmoil in the making.
Meanwhile, the dollar has climbed over 64, the euro - over 71. What a smart move! We are going to have even more rubles! Hohoho

Fantastika
11-08-2015, 17:56
I've already addressed your question:)

I was posting for the benefit of those who live in St. Petersburg. :)

Russian Lad
11-08-2015, 20:13
Will it improve the investment climate?

FatAndy
11-08-2015, 20:25
Will it improve the investment climate?
It depends on the profit expected.
"With adequate profit, capital is very bold. A certain 10 per cent. will ensure its employment anywhere; 20 per cent. certain will produce eagerness; 50 per cent., positive audacity; 100 per cent. will make it ready to trample on all human laws; 300 per cent., and there is not a crime at which it will scruple, nor a risk it will not run, even to the chance of its owner being hanged." © ;)

Russian Lad
11-08-2015, 20:31
I would like all this nonsense to stop and get back to the food coupons, like in the old good days. I am hearing they are closing Ashan or something like that. This is good and correct. All Western supermarkets need to be closed, the food should be rationed. I am missing the thrill of standing in a huge line for a kilo of sausages with my line number written in ink on my hand, when it is minus 30 outside. Let's have it again.

bydand
11-08-2015, 20:37
It depends on the profit expected.
"With adequate profit, capital is very bold. A certain 10 per cent. will ensure its employment anywhere;

Nothing is certain in Russia, ask Yukos stockholders.

penka
11-08-2015, 20:40
Copy-pasting from another thread. Or did you get a clone?

FatAndy
11-08-2015, 20:42
Nothing is certain in Russia, ask Yukos stockholders.
Poor Yukos stockholders... they've put on the wrong horse. L'alla as sayah... ® :rasta:


Copy-pasting from another thread. Or did you get a clone?
No, just moved valuable opinions to tne appropriate place ;)

Judge
11-08-2015, 21:53
What Nabiullina is doing is logical: Weak national currency = Energises the state budget, industrial production and export.

As for oil and the dynamics of stable demand/ multiple suppliers, it will go up but not till the previous lovely levels. Approx price for 2016 will be about 65USD/barrell, as estimated by, say, Norwegians.

You're right of course, today's news from Gazprom,

Russia's largest gas producer Gazprom beat expectations with a 71 percent jump in first-quarter net profit after weakness in the ruble more than compensated for a drop in sales volumes to Europe.
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/business/article/russias-gazprom-defies-expectations-with-profit-growth-despite-sanctions/527647.html

But: Will the industry/ agriculture pick up? Producing something/ investing in production/ modernising the production is a long and tedious process, no fast money there. Also: Will there be cheap credits for the industry/agriculture? How plausible is that the bureaucratic processes will be eased?

It has already picked up, these sanctions have given this sector the kick up the arse it needed.Demand for local produced goods is rising and local companies know they should aim for higher quaility so they can increase their market share.

Russian Lad
11-08-2015, 23:21
after weakness in the ruble more than compensated for a drop in sales volumes to Europe

This phrase alone contains a clear message: the sales in hard currencies are dropping, only the continued devaluation of the ruble helps propping up the revenues in rubles. It is a dead-end road. It will quickly backfire because most of the products are imported - the prices on pretty much everything will keep hiking together with the hard currencies. Millions more Russians will find themselves below the official poverty level by the end of this year. Hungry, angry and disillusioned.


these sanctions have given this sector the kick up the arse it needed.Demand for local produced goods is rising

Oh, that's why the deputy minister of agriculture was fired yesterday? Because of the great success in this area?
Hohoho.
http://www.mk.ru/politics/2015/08/10/medvedev-uvolil-zamministra-selskogo-khozyaystva.html
http://www.fair.ru/medvedev-uvolil-zamministra-selskogo-hozyaistva-15081021361878.htm

Fantastika
12-08-2015, 02:02
And in economic news from Ukraine, the Kiev government is taking advantage of new investment opportunities offered by the US of A:

VOA Hackers-traders-accused-biggest-US-insider-trading-scheme (http://www.voanews.com/content/hackers-traders-accused-biggest-us-insider-trading-scheme/2914001.html)

"Nine people in the United States and Ukraine have been indicted for alleged fraud... Federal authorities in New Jersey said Tuesday it is the biggest scheme of its kind ever prosecuted..."

What? VOA? Voice of America? We should call it VOAG? Voice of American Government. Or VOPAG - Voice of Progressive American Government.

Why is VOAG publicizing this story? Get with the program, VOPAG!!! - Ukrainians-good people, Russians-bad people.

"Authorities said hackers stole financial and other information from companies that publish press releases. Members of the group were able to make trades in stocks and options before the information was made public, giving them an unfair, illegal and highly profitable advantage in trading."

I must admire their creativity and cleverness.

Some people will do *anything* to avoid work.
...
Hello? Where is everyone? Is there anyone on the forum? Has everyone rushed out to google "companies that publish press releases"? :)

Judge
12-08-2015, 06:24
Oh, that's why the deputy minister of agriculture was fired yesterday? Because of the great success in this area?
Hohoho.
http://www.mk.ru/politics/2015/08/10/medvedev-uvolil-zamministra-selskogo-khozyaystva.html
http://www.fair.ru/medvedev-uvolil-zamministra-selskogo-hozyaistva-15081021361878.htm

There are usually a number of deputies, if they aren't doing their job well or reduction or position,maybe that's what Medvedev did, send a warning to the sector to get a move on,you know to keep them on their toes.
I'm interested in her sacking, if you find any links in Russian post them here.

Russian Lad
12-08-2015, 15:27
There are usually a number of deputies, if they aren't doing their job well or reduction or position,maybe that's what Medvedev did, send a warning to the sector to get a move on,you know to keep them on their toes.
I'm interested in her sacking, if you find any links in Russian post them here.

It's him actually, not her.:) Валерий, not Валерия. Well, to me it looks like a move dictated by desperation. There are many other ways to motivate the personnel, besides firing them (under normal, not desperate circumstances). We both know it, don't we? Meanwhile, Euro 72...

Judge
12-08-2015, 16:02
It's him actually, not her.:) Валерий, not Валерия. Well, to me it looks like a move dictated by desperation. There are many other ways to motivate the personnel, besides firing them (under normal, not desperate circumstances). We both know it, don't we? Meanwhile, Euro 72...

Let the euro climb high, I have family coming this week, they will find everything dirt cheap ,they can get a feel of how things were back in the USSR, cheap products, banned food.:cool:

Uncle Wally
12-08-2015, 16:28
Let the euro climb high, I have family coming this week, they find everything dirt cheap ,they can get a feel of how things were back in the USSR, cheap products, banned food.:cool:



That's the spirit!


My girlfriend just came home from Sweden last night and she said she will never leave Russia again! First was an American woman that after tripping coming through the door and passing her " I will never understand these Russians!" First she was American and it is totally possible she didn't understand Sweden is not part of Russia. Then getting off the plane in Riga, again Americans taking their bags from the overhead. "oh look at this! "These dam Russians don't care about anything!" My girlfriend didn't see any other Russians there and she had her bag under the seat. Then while wait for her next flight some different Americans. " look at all these Russians! What about the sanctions! How can they be traveling?"

She said next year she goes to Crimea.

Carl
12-08-2015, 16:58
That's the spirit!


My girlfriend just came home from Sweden last night and she said she will never leave Russia again! First was an American woman that after tripping coming through the door and passing her " I will never understand these Russians!" First she was American and it is totally possible she didn't understand Sweden is not part of Russia. Then getting off the plane in Riga, again Americans taking their bags from the overhead. "oh look at this! "These dam Russians don't care about anything!" My girlfriend didn't see any other Russians there and she had her bag under the seat. Then while wait for her next flight some different Americans. " look at all these Russians! What about the sanctions! How can they be traveling?"

She said next year she goes to Crimea.

That's interesting. I travel extensively in the region. Don't really see many Americans very often.

Fantastika
12-08-2015, 17:19
Dow Jones down 200 in the first 20 minutes. Should be an interesting day...

Gold is up $10, and silver up 20c. Finally, they are rising. That makes sense, because the money has to go somewhere.

Russian Lad
12-08-2015, 18:44
Let the euro climb high, I have family coming this week, they find everything dirt cheap ,they can get a feel of how things were back in the USSR, cheap products, banned food.

That's all cool if you are paid in euros or dollars, I am guessing 99% of Russians are paid in rubles. So, how are they supposed to share your enthusiasm and your advantages???

Judge
12-08-2015, 18:56
That's all cool if you are paid in euros or dollars, I am guessing 99% of Russians are paid in rubles. So, how are they supposed to share your enthusiasm and your advantages???

My advantages,what are they? I'm part of the 99% club.

The weak ruble is good for the tourist industry ,cheap hotels, restaurants,pubs bars, excursions and so on....Your own city should be doing well now,I bet the city centre streets are packed with tourists enjoying your wonderful city.

A little googling brings this up,

The number of foreign tourists visiting Russia grew by 16 percent in the first quarter compared with a year earlier, helped by a devalued ruble amid Western sanctions, a tourism official told AFP on Tuesday.

“Almost five million foreign tourists have visited Russia in the first quarter of this year,” representing a 16 percent increase from the same period in 2014, said Irina Shchegolkova, the spokeswoman for Rosturizm, the government’s tourism agency.
http://www.ngrguardiannews.com/2015/06/russia-sees-more-foreign-tourists-despite-ukraine-crisis-official/

You see, another sector that is seeing a massive boom in trade

nicklcool
12-08-2015, 19:12
The Dow is hit again today - maybe the USA wasn't aware how intertwined her economy is to the Yuan's FOREX value. RL, don't be so fearful, RF is not going back to talony for food - absolutely no indicators point to that being a nearby result. Remember, it's possible (likely?) that RF is simply going through another recession.

“When the winds of change blow, some people build walls and others build windmills.” – Chinese proverb

Russian Lad
12-08-2015, 20:16
The weak ruble is good for the tourist industry ,cheap hotels, restaurants,pubs bars, excursions and so on....Your own city should be doing well now,I bet the city centre streets are packed with tourists enjoying your wonderful city.

I am seeing almost no tourists at all, so I assume they have mistaken some stan countries ghastarbeiters for tourists. It would be weird to have a lot of tourists from the West under such conditions. It may not even be safe for them anymore, - they broadcast venomous anti-West programs on Rossiya-24 around the clock, it all reflects on the local mentality to a certain extent. So, I don't know what you are talking about. But even if there were tourists, again, the local Russians are suffering hard from the current situation. All the tourist gains would simply be pocketed by the selected few.

tonytony
12-08-2015, 20:32
Let the euro climb high, I have family coming this week, they will find everything dirt cheap ,they can get a feel of how things were back in the USSR, cheap products, banned food.:cool:


Unfortunately, the Euro has also fallen off a cliff over the last year. In July last year you were getting 1.35 Dollars to the Euro - today you're only getting 1.11 Dollars to the Euro.

You might be getting 72 Roubles to the Euro at the moment, but if it hadn't been for the dramatic fall of the Euro over the last 12 months then you would have been getting around 88 Roubles to the Euro at the moment.

I just noticed that the pound is back up to 100 Roubles to the pound today - it's been hovering around the 98-99 point for the last week or so.

But I agree with your general point that tourists will perceive that a lot of things are dirt cheap compared to this time last year.

Carl
12-08-2015, 20:45
I am seeing almost no tourists at all, so I assume they have mistaken some stan countries ghastarbeiters for tourists. It would be weird to have a lot of tourists from the West under such conditions. It may not even be safe for them anymore, - they broadcast venomous anti-West programs on Rossiya-24 around the clock, it all reflects on the local mentality to a certain extent. So, I don't know what you are talking about. But even if there were tourists, again, the local Russians are suffering hard from the current situation. All the tourist gains would simply be pocketed by the selected few.

I just today returned from Spb, where I spent the past 10 days.. To be honest, a fair amount of tourists. Based on what I saw while out and about and at the hotel (major Int. chain) looks like a ton of Chinese and Indian visitors with a few westerners here and there.. If not eating in the hotel everyday, quite reasonable in terms of daily spend. Getting around town in an Uber 'Black Car' (Merc/BMW/Audi) for 400-500 rubles a pop sure is nice! In short, great for the tourists, not so great for the locals...