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Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 10:56
Wonder when was the last time Wally read a book. Wally, you blame American corporations too for your miserable knowledge of your own language?

Judge
13-01-2016, 11:28
Other countries have tried, let's see how this works out..

Russia Breaking Wall St Oil Price Monopoly


Russia has just taken significant steps that will break the present Wall Street oil price monopoly, at least for a huge part of the world oil market. The move is part of a longer-term strategy of decoupling Russia’s economy and especially its very significant export of oil, from the US dollar, today the Achilles Heel of the Russian economy.

http://journal-neo.org/2016/01/09/russia-breaking-wall-st-oil-price-monopoly/

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 11:38
Hahaha. The Russian CB is basically an obmennik of the Federal Reserve, nothing is going to change till they decouple THAT. And if they decouple THAT we will have shortages and deficit of pretty much everything because Russia is not producing many products. Just like the North Korea or even worse.

Uncle Wally
13-01-2016, 13:12
Wonder when was the last time Wally read a book. Wally, you blame American corporations too for your miserable knowledge of your own language?


Yes of course I do.

I forget the last time I read a book, it was a long time ago.

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 13:17
Yes of course I do.

That's very convenient.:clown:

Judge
13-01-2016, 14:25
Hahaha. The Russian CB is basically an obmennik of the Federal Reserve, nothing is going to change till they decouple THAT. And if they decouple THAT we will have shortages and deficit of pretty much everything because Russia is not producing many products. Just like the North Korea or even worse.


Isn't that the plan, to loosen the grip of the all mighty $ 's hold over the Russian economy. .

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 14:58
Isn't that the plan, to loosen the grip of the all mighty $ 's hold over the Russian economy. .

Is it?:) To me it looks like bluffing and mental porridge for the hoi polloi here, nothing else.

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 15:36
Doubt they have any viable plan at the moment, I think their plan was oil would continue to cost around 100 dollars and they would increase the gas supply to Europe making more USD. Now that it is history there is no plan.

fenrir
13-01-2016, 21:41
Russia announces new budget cuts as oil price slides

http://news.yahoo.com/russia-announces-budget-cuts-amid-oil-slide-105539186.html

It looks like the age of austerity has truly arrived.

Nobbynumbnuts
13-01-2016, 21:59
Russia announces new budget cuts as oil price slides

http://news.yahoo.com/russia-announces-budget-cuts-amid-oil-slide-105539186.html

It looks like the age of austerity has truly arrived.

A 10% cut in budgetary spending is a huge cut But where are they going to cut?

Uncle Wally
13-01-2016, 22:25
At least Russia doesn't have 19 trillion dollars of debt and growing.

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 23:02
Brent 29.95. The lowest since 2004.

Carl
13-01-2016, 23:04
Brent 29.95. The lowest since 2004.

Yeah..but at least Russia doesn't have 19 trillion dollars of debt and growing.

Nobbynumbnuts
13-01-2016, 23:16
Yeah..but at least Russia doesn't have 19 trillion dollars of debt and growing.

PMSL :laughing:

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 23:17
My biggest concern at the moment - will they freeze private hard currency accounts at a certain moment in time in the near future like the idiots did in 1998, giving back devalued rubles after some months? To withdraw or not to withdraw, where is my skull when I need it. Wally, what does your crystal ball say, will they stoop this low this time?

Nobbynumbnuts
13-01-2016, 23:18
Brent 29.95. The lowest since 2004.


The fall in the oil price has been nothing short of spectacular and probably more to come. Where is the bottom?

Nobbynumbnuts
13-01-2016, 23:27
My biggest concern at the moment - will they freeze private hard currency accounts at a certain moment in time in the near future like the idiots did in 1998, giving back devalued rubles after some months? To withdraw or not to withdraw, where is my skull when I need it. Wally, what does your crystal ball say, will they stoop this low this time?

This is what i was saying some time back. At some point surely the government has to step in and take action to protect the ruble as best they can. What that action will be, exchange controls, seizure of hard currency accounts and compulsory conversion to rubles (at a rate beneficial to the government) etc etc. Who knows.
Something will happen soon, oil and ruble cannot continue free falling, surely...

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 23:29
Something will happen soon, oil and ruble cannot continue free falling, surely...

Let's elaborate on this "something". I wonder if I need to take preemptive action, withdraw all I have and bury my hard currency under a tree after drawing the treasure map or something.:)

Nobbynumbnuts
13-01-2016, 23:40
Let's elaborate on this "something". I wonder if I need to take preemptive action, withdraw all I have and bury my hard currency under a tree after drawing the treasure map or something.:)

People will feel more secure holding dollars or euros than rubles of course but i'd be moving my money out of Russia now, without delay...

Russian Lad
13-01-2016, 23:46
but i'd be moving my money out of Russia now, without delay...

My fortune is not that big to take this particular step.:) My only question is - to withdraw whatever I have on an account and to hide it under a matress or to just watch the show without doing it? Maybe will go 50-50 on this, dunno. It is all rather unsettling and disturbing.:)

Judge
14-01-2016, 00:47
PMSL :laughing:

What's so funny, you prefer to have $20tr debt to $400bn? What's your logic?


People will feel more secure holding dollars or euros than rubles of course but i'd be moving my money out of Russia now, without delay...

You ain't in Russia, so?

Nobbynumbnuts
14-01-2016, 00:52
What's so funny....

His complete obsession with America, this is a thread about Russia! lol ...:laughing:

Judge
14-01-2016, 05:54
His complete obsession with America, this is a thread about Russia! lol ...:laughing:

Like your obsession with Russia,which I can understand .

Nobbynumbnuts
14-01-2016, 09:33
Like your obsession with Russia,which I can understand .


Let's see how long your friend can go without mentioning his obsession...:winking:

Meanwhile, back on topic, oil $30.22. Will it close today below $30?

Nobbynumbnuts
14-01-2016, 09:34
.........You ain't in Russia, so?

You or your friend ain't in Britain or USA, don't stop you..:winking:

Judge
14-01-2016, 13:40
You or your friend ain't in Britain or USA, don't stop you..:winking:

Stop what, I still have links to the UK, goings on there still interest me, not as much nowadays,but with the new Labour leader, my interest is starting to grow:winking: ....like I said ,I can understand you, still hoping for 10 ruble vodka kiosk drinks,which I agree with..:big-grin:

Judge
14-01-2016, 13:54
Time for some more testing, getting ready for oil in the low $20s


https://www.rt.com/business/328728-russia-oil-prices-budget/
While US WTI crude briefly stumbled below $30 for the first time in 12 years, Russia's Urals blend is already below that mark trading at $27.14 a barrel. Given the new reality, the Kremlin has ordered stress tests with $25, $35 and $45 oil.

Judge
14-01-2016, 14:20
My fortune is not that big to take this particular step.:) My only question is - to withdraw whatever I have on an account and to hide it under a matress or to just watch the show without doing it? Maybe will go 50-50 on this, dunno. It is all rather unsettling and disturbing.:)

Take Nobbs advice and hit the panic button, send all your money out of the country. ..:ligthbulb:

Russian Lad
14-01-2016, 14:22
Time for some more testing, getting ready for oil in the low $20s


https://www.rt.com/business/328728-russia-oil-prices-budget/
While US WTI crude briefly stumbled below $30 for the first time in 12 years, Russia's Urals blend is already below that mark trading at $27.14 a barrel. Given the new reality, the Kremlin has ordered stress tests with $25, $35 and $45 oil.

If the oil prices remain within 20-30 this year they will have to like cut in half everything (the current budget is balanced at 50), including the salaries and pensions of those on the budget. Many people I know personally draw the pension of 8-12K rubles per month and are barely alive. If they begin drawing 4-6K rubles pensions they will simply face two choices: 1) to hit the streets and to protest (legally, of course:)), 2) to die quietly. Which one will they choose? I am intrigued to know. That is not to mention that inflation will surely follow the ruble slump and the utilities and pretty much everything will cost much more very soon, so if, say, a school teacher who is drawing 30K rubles per month now begins drawing 15K per month (say, with a kid or two), such a person will also face starvation. What will the Russians choose? The time of reckoning and making choices/taking sides has arrived. The fridge has defeated the tv set. :thinking:

Judge
14-01-2016, 14:36
Pensions won't be cut, I believe will be raised by about 5%, money will be taken from the funds, this is what they are for..of course the increase needs to be in line with inflation. .

Russian Lad
14-01-2016, 14:48
Pensions won't be cut, I believe will be raised by about 5%, money will be taken from the funds, this is what they are for..of course the increase needs to be in line with inflation. .

How do you know? Ok, they may cut the salaries.:) The budget is there for a reason, and bear in mind that a lot was cut even when this one balanced around 50 was prepared. It is a cut budget already, now they need to get rid of like 50% more - if we assume the oil prices will remain within 20-30 this year. Who knows, they may even end up being 10-20...

zzhhst
14-01-2016, 20:06
How do you know? Ok, they may cut the salaries.:) The budget is there for a reason, and bear in mind that a lot was cut even when this one balanced around 50 was prepared. It is a cut budget already, now they need to get rid of like 50% more - if we assume the oil prices will remain within 20-30 this year. Who knows, they may even end up being 10-20...

I think what will happen. Raise the retirement age. Seems to be the latest move in the world. They can't cut the pensioners again. Will cause problems. Retirees have a hard enough time now.

Russian Lad
14-01-2016, 21:19
They can't cut the pensioners again. Will cause problems. Retirees have a hard enough time now.

I doubt they really care though. Well, we will see. I am also expecting economic "side effects", it is about time they pop up in earnest. I mean, the new problems that have arisen, they will create other new problems. It is a vicious circle. I am expecting shortages of affordable food in supermarkets and lines for affordable food Venezuela-style, with occasional fights for kolbasa. This is just the beginning of it, it is going to be a funny year.

Armoured
14-01-2016, 21:45
I think what will happen. Raise the retirement age. Seems to be the latest move in the world. They can't cut the pensioners again. Will cause problems. Retirees have a hard enough time now.

Raising the retirement age is a big deal, but it will barely make a dent in the short term. Leaving aside that the usual discussion has been about raising it for some cohort in the future, and raising it by a year at a time. Even if they announce it tomorrow, it will only help the budget with some delay. Granted, raising it drastically for next year's cohort (and all future cohorts) will start adding up to big amounts in just a couple of years.

I agree that _cutting_ in nominal terms would create general outrage. But lower indexing is entirely possible, and when they can't do more of that -- more inflation.

Yes, as things get worse, the desire to turn on the printing presses will get even stronger. Fewer and fewer alternatives.

Nobbynumbnuts
14-01-2016, 21:47
Time for some more testing, getting ready for oil in the low $20s


https://www.rt.com/business/328728-russia-oil-prices-budget/
While US WTI crude briefly stumbled below $30 for the first time in 12 years, Russia's Urals blend is already below that mark trading at $27.14 a barrel. Given the new reality, the Kremlin has ordered stress tests with $25, $35 and $45 oil.

My personal view is that oil will fall further, how much further i have no idea. Then will recover and average between $40-$50 for the rest of year. This is what most analysts are predicting.
If oil stays where it is now then Russia's budget is in for more cuts. Where will those cuts be? What kind of impact will they have on the lives of ordinary Russians already suffering from the current financial situation?

Russia is approaching crisis point..

Uncle Wally
14-01-2016, 22:47
I doubt they really care though. Well, we will see. I am also expecting economic "side effects", it is about time they pop up in earnest. I mean, the new problems that have arisen, they will create other new problems. It is a vicious circle. I am expecting shortages of affordable food in supermarkets and lines for affordable food Venezuela-style, with occasional fights for kolbasa. This is just the beginning of it, it is going to be a funny year.


That's just wishful thinking on your part. Putin is smart enough to know that babushki will be the first ones out protesting. No cuts and some special pricing for things babushki need, bread, milk, eggs... There is some really good bargains out there if you look. Russians understand what is going on and feel better about their county, they understand that America is trying to pressure them and have fallen in line. Russians will not starve, they may not be living the good life but it will be their life and not the life dictated from Washington.

Uncle Wally
14-01-2016, 22:54
My personal view is that oil will fall further, how much further i have no idea. Then will recover and average between $40-$50 for the rest of year. This is what most analysts are predicting.
If oil stays where it is now then Russia's budget is in for more cuts. Where will those cuts be? What kind of impact will they have on the lives of ordinary Russians already suffering from the current financial situation?

Russia is approaching crisis point..


Your"personal view" is also vodka cocktails from a kiosk is heaven.

Here's where I bring up America! Maybe you have noticed that the stock market in the good old USofA has been falling a bit? No? Hence the whole reason why the Chinese stock market has been falling and oil too! When are you going to wake up to the fact that this is a global problem brought on by American miss management and crime?

fenrir
14-01-2016, 22:57
Your"personal view" is also vodka cocktails from a kiosk is heaven.

Here's where I bring up America! Maybe you have noticed that the stock market in the good old USofA has been falling a bit? No? Hence the whole reason why the Chinese stock market has been falling and oil too! When are you going to wake up to the fact that this is a global problem brought on by American miss management and crime?

US stocks are falling because of China, not the other way around. And China's economic situation is pushing oil prices down.

zzhhst
14-01-2016, 23:00
Raising the retirement age is a big deal, but it will barely make a dent in the short term. Leaving aside that the usual discussion has been about raising it for some cohort in the future, and raising it by a year at a time. Even if they announce it tomorrow, it will only help the budget with some delay. Granted, raising it drastically for next year's cohort (and all future cohorts) will start adding up to big amounts in just a couple of years.

I agree that _cutting_ in nominal terms would create general outrage. But lower indexing is entirely possible, and when they can't do more of that -- more inflation.

Yes, as things get worse, the desire to turn on the printing presses will get even stronger. Fewer and fewer alternatives.

Correct, it will take 5 years. My hope things change. Perhaps with a new American President.

Nobbynumbnuts
15-01-2016, 00:16
US stocks are falling because of China, not the other way around. And China's economic situation is pushing oil prices down.

Wally, the village idiot! :laughing:

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 00:29
Correct, it will take 5 years. My hope things change. Perhaps with a new American President.


That's what they keep making you think but has it ever happened?

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 00:31
Wally, the village idiot! :laughing:

Poor Wally. What is your bitter obsession, Wally?:) What is your patent number?:)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNeBhlHQsU

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 00:34
US stocks are falling because of China, not the other way around. And China's economic situation is pushing oil prices down.


Oh it couldn't be that the US is in some real sh!t and have just let the FED create bubbles so nobody is really buying anything and since everything is made in China China has lost a lot of business. China foolishly followed America's lead and created bubbles of their own.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 00:36
Wally, the village idiot! :laughing:


Numbnuts the ageing troll.

Judge
15-01-2016, 10:10
Back to pensions, there are fiscal hawks like Kudrin who's in favour of raising the ages limit, usually he's right, I can't see Putin agreeing to this, with elections soon,maybe after 2018.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 10:28
Back to pensions, there are fiscal hawks like Kudrin who's in favour of raising the ages limit, usually he's right, I can't see Putin agreeing to this, with elections soon,maybe after 2018.


Judge, don't make me laugh, Kudrin hasn't been in power for years now, he warned in due time Russia would face what it is facing. As to the Russian pensioners, millions are starving now, so who cares whether they raise it or not, really. They will eventually, I assume, but I assure you Kudrin has nothing to do with it. He is a nobody at the moment, decides nothing. All the decisions are taken by Putin and his associates. And only they are responsible for everything that is currently happening here in Russia from the economic standpoint. I find it weird that you pretend you don't understand it. That's sort of very detached from reality, even for a stubborn kvas patriot.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 11:12
Judge, don't make me laugh, Kudrin hasn't been in power for years now, he warned in due time Russia would face what it is facing. As to the Russian pensioners, millions are starving now, so who cares whether they raise it or not, really. They will eventually, I assume, but I assure you Kudrin has nothing to do with it. He is a nobody at the moment, decides nothing. All the decisions are taken by Putin and his associates. And only they are responsible for everything that is currently happening here in Russia from the economic standpoint. I find it weird that you pretend you don't understand it. That's sort of very detached from reality, even for a stubborn kvas patriot.


Actually I think he's one of Putin's advisors. He is still in very good with Putin, remember it wasn't Putin who fired him.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 11:28
Actually I think he's one of Putin's advisors. He is still in very good with Putin, remember it wasn't Putin who fired him.

How can he be an advisor if Putin and his team have been doing the opposite of what he has been suggesting publicly for like two years in a row now? It doesn't make sense.

fenrir
15-01-2016, 12:50
Ruble at 83.96 to the euro. That's about what Wally said oil would be at in dollars per barrel.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 12:51
Ruble at 83.96 to the euro. That's about what Wally said oil would be at in dollars per barrel.

Yeah, oil and dollar prices have switched places. A miracle. It used to be oil 80 and dollar 30, now it is all the way around, hehe. Euro 84.11 already, try to keep up, Fenrir. Oil 29.:)

fenrir
15-01-2016, 14:52
Yeah, oil and dollar prices have switched places. A miracle. It used to be oil 80 and dollar 30, now it is all the way around, hehe. Euro 84.11 already, try to keep up, Fenrir. Oil 29.:)

84.38!

Nobbynumbnuts
15-01-2016, 15:23
.... Wally said......

Wally said?? :laughing:

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 16:05
Wally said?? :laughing:

Wally sad.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 18:11
Wally sad.


I am not sad.

I understand Russia will make it through tough times.

What is sad is people who gloat about someone else difficulties. Who wish bad things on other countries because they don't feel good about themselves, even when said country keeps telling everyone they're"number 1" then has to bully everyone because said "number 1" just has a bunch of sickos in charge and wouldn't think it nothing killing everyone on earth just to get the love and respect they think they deserve. The whole might is right bull kaka. Sad is you people afraid to die afraid to live.

Fantastika
15-01-2016, 18:16
US strategerie - low oil prices and sanctions will bring Russia to its knees.

Hmmm - looking at Wall Street today, and since January 1, maybe they should try Plan B.

Can Obama do anything without causing a global disaster? An inauspicious start to the last year for the hologram to leave a legacy for the world to aspire to and admire.

Buy gold/silver.

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 18:47
US strategerie - low oil prices and sanctions will bring Russia to its knees.

Hmmm - looking at Wall Street today, and since January 1, maybe they should try Plan B.

Can Obama do anything without causing a global disaster? An inauspicious start to the last year for the hologram to leave a legacy for the world to aspire to and admire.

Buy gold/silver.


Since you mentioned it. The DOW dropped 400 points on opening today. Hooray fenrir! That's just great huh? Russia is really gonna suffer now! Yeah numbnuts banks are also going to have to suck up all those loan made to flight by night oil companies in the US. Could be into the billions! Woohooo! Russia is gonna hurt now! Hey and now that Turkey is killing so many Kurdish women and children and will have no recourse against them from the always just American government maybe Russia and Syria will start losing to your government backed terrorist! Then we can all live in the perfect fascist state and eat McDonald's till are heart's content! Won't that be great! We can all work 9 to 5 come home to great TV shows and pizza delivery and two whole weeks vacation! Oh boy can't wait till America takes over the world!

FatAndy
15-01-2016, 18:50
:emote_popcorn:

Fantastika
15-01-2016, 18:58
Well, if anyone is worried about not having enough money, ask for advice from Mrs. Clinton. She took $5000 into the stock market and through "clever trading strategies," turned it into $490,000, in only 9 months.

An amazing performance. :) Others called it "Cattlegate".

Fantastika
15-01-2016, 21:08
Stock Market in the US is down 8%-10% on the year, a loss of $trillions in equity.

China is worse, and European markets are not much better.

It's not going to improve while one whole economic sector (oil) is in chaos.

News released on Friday by the Obama administration (they like to release bad news on Fridays, because media is TGIF, few people notice): retail sales in the US decline in December, the economy wraps up worst year since 2009.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-01-15/retail-sales-in-u-s-decrease-to-end-weakest-year-since-2009

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 21:22
Stock Market in the US is down 8%-10% on the year, a loss of $trillions in equity.

China is worse, and European markets are not much better.

Very good, excellent news.

fenrir
15-01-2016, 21:30
Since you mentioned it. The DOW dropped 400 points on opening today. Hooray fenrir! That's just great huh? Russia is really gonna suffer now! Yeah numbnuts banks are also going to have to suck up all those loan made to flight by night oil companies in the US. Could be into the billions! Woohooo! Russia is gonna hurt now! Hey and now that Turkey is killing so many Kurdish women and children and will have no recourse against them from the always just American government maybe Russia and Syria will start losing to your government backed terrorist! Then we can all live in the perfect fascist state and eat McDonald's till are heart's content! Won't that be great! We can all work 9 to 5 come home to great TV shows and pizza delivery and two whole weeks vacation! Oh boy can't wait till America takes over the world!

I don't give a damn if the Dow dropped 400 points. I didn't predict that it would be at 400,000 now (the equivalent prediction of your asinine claims of $80 oil and collapse of the dollar and euro). However, the RTS took a dump today and the ruble did too.

http://news.yahoo.com/moscow-stock-exchange-drops-5-percent-ruble-hit-115803227.html

How do those events jive with your predictions?

fenrir
15-01-2016, 21:34
Russian Pensioners Protest Transport Benefits Cuts in Sochi and Krasnodar (Video)

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/russian-pensioners-protest-transport-benefits-cuts-in-sochi-and-krasnodar-video/555875.html

I wonder what Wally's take is on this. Come on, Wally. Let's hear it.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 21:35
I wonder what Wally's take is on this. Come on, Wally. Let's hear it.

Obama is responsible for this too, I am sure. Can't he leave us alone? Now he has targeted the Russian pensioners. What's next? Kindergartens?

Fantastika
15-01-2016, 21:49
Obama is responsible for this too, I am sure. Can't he leave us alone? Now he has targeted the Russian pensioners. What's next? Kindergartens?

You haven't read Hillary's thesis? "It takes a Village" ? That's a *global* village, that includes your kindergartners, too. Ms. Clinton, representing the beneficent, all-knowing and all-caring nanny government, will confiscate your toddler and take over child rearing/indoctrination when the child turns 3.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 22:07
You haven't read Hillary's thesis? "It takes a Village" ? That's a *global* village, that includes your kindergartners, too. Ms. Clinton, representing the beneficent, all-knowing and all-caring nanny government, will confiscate your toddler and take over child rearing/indoctrination when the child turns 3.

Will she piss and sh't in our podyezds like this rascal Obama is doing or we will be saved from this particular humiliation?

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 22:46
I don't give a damn if the Dow dropped 400 points. I didn't predict that it would be at 400,000 now (the equivalent prediction of your asinine claims of $80 oil and collapse of the dollar and euro). However, the RTS took a dump today and the ruble did too.

http://news.yahoo.com/moscow-stock-exchange-drops-5-percent-ruble-hit-115803227.html

How do those events jive with your predictions?


Oh the only thing that matters in this world is what Wally does or does not predict?

Please someone find this boy some help!

You want a prediction that is 100% sure to come true?

Here it is, Wally is now going to swallow this shot of vodka eat a pickle then fart in the direction of Estonia. You can bank on it!

fenrir
15-01-2016, 22:53
Here it is, Wally is now going to swallow this shot of vodka eat a pickle then fart in the direction of Estonia.

You've got contrary winds, dillweed. Take a big whiff!!!

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 23:12
You've got contrary winds, dillweed. Take a big whiff!!!


Now I am sure you are some kind of sucksussful biznessman in Ebelonia.

You know if I wasn't drunk and old I wouldn't even bother with you. Oops I feel another fart coming on!

fenrir
15-01-2016, 23:15
Now I am sure you are some kind of sucksussful biznessman in Ebelonia.

You know if I wasn't drunk and old I wouldn't even bother with you. Oops I feel another fart coming on!

Don't choke or poison yourself with those noxious fumes. Every village needs its fool/idiot and you are gold on that account!

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 23:33
Don't choke or poison yourself with those noxious fumes. Every village needs its fool/idiot and you are gold on that account!


Oh you are such humanitarian. Don't worry I have a balcony that faces west. I think of you every time I have to fart now. Why because it sounds like Wall Street and the American economy. Talking about the American economy did you hear the people seeking unemployment went up? Funny because retail sales went down, go figure? Just how does that stuff work? You'd think that it being just after Christmas and all that retail sales would be, well kind of good in such a great country like America. You know people wouldn't be losing their jobs just after the holidays which I may point out is when most Americans commit suicide.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 23:45
I think of you every time I have to fart now.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLahdT6wn40

Uncle Wally
15-01-2016, 23:46
Gee you don't think your government has been lying to us do you fenrir? I mean they would never lie to anyone being so "exceptional" and all.

fenrir
15-01-2016, 23:50
Oh you are such humanitarian. Don't worry I have a balcony that faces west. I think of you every time I have to fart now. Why because it sounds like Wall Street and the American economy. Talking about the American economy did you hear the people seeking unemployment went up? Funny because retail sales went down, go figure? Just how does that stuff work? You'd think that it being just after Christmas and all that retail sales would be, well kind of good in such a great country like America. You know people wouldn't be losing their jobs just after the holidays which I may point out is when most Americans commit suicide.

Keep trying to deflect, deflect away, but you live in Russia and the low oil prices and sh-tty ruble concern you more. Enjoy, flatulent boy.

Russian Lad
15-01-2016, 23:55
What a flative narrative indeed.:) Wally, are you on your last box of Доширак?:)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvNjwPRld7c

FatAndy
16-01-2016, 10:03
Kindergaaaaarten... :verycool:

Uncle Wally
16-01-2016, 11:02
Keep trying to deflect, deflect away, but you live in Russia and the low oil prices and sh-tty ruble concern you more. Enjoy, flatulent boy.


No the depression that America is heading for will effect us all. You and Esbelonia. The economic downturn in American is what is causing the biggest problem in China. Wall Street is going to fall faster than world trade center building 7! Taking peoples retirement funds and future with it. Apple lost 3 billion dollars so far, WalMart just announced it's closing 269 stores. Oil companies are starting to go bankrupt then it will be people defaulting on home loans and school loans, it's going to hurt a lot if banks. All this when already 62% of Americans are one pay check from homelessness. People in Canada are already in trouble. The loonie is now worth 70 US cents and food prices are skyrocketing. Russia on the other hand has been preparing for trouble for more that a year now. It maybe hard but a lot better than being in America with all the people so used to higher standards, unable to grow their own food and everyone armed to the teeth. What do you think is going to happen in a country with so many guns in a depression? Crime and shootings will only grow to levels unseen. Oh yeah!

Fantastika
16-01-2016, 11:12
So take up something productive - FARMING!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLOyF50wlBU&index=2&list=RD7_TMUJIWwyI

Poroshenko's answer to Ukraine's problems is to sell Ukrainian farmland to China! :dizzy:

Nobbynumbnuts
16-01-2016, 11:22
Who gives a flying f*&^% about America. This forum is 'Economic situation in Russia'

Oil closed yesterday at $28 Will it get to $25 next week? :winking:

Carl
16-01-2016, 12:00
No the depression that America is heading for will effect us all. You and Esbelonia. The economic downturn in American is what is causing the biggest problem in China. Wall Street is going to fall faster than world trade center building 7! Taking peoples retirement funds and future with it. Apple lost 3 billion dollars so far, WalMart just announced it's closing 269 stores. Oil companies are starting to go bankrupt then it will be people defaulting on home loans and school loans, it's going to hurt a lot if banks. All this when already 62% of Americans are one pay check from homelessness. People in Canada are already in trouble. The loonie is now worth 70 US cents and food prices are skyrocketing. Russia on the other hand has been preparing for trouble for more that a year now. It maybe hard but a lot better than being in America with all the people so used to higher standards, unable to grow their own food and everyone armed to the teeth. What do you think is going to happen in a country with so many guns in a depression? Crime and shootings will only grow to levels unseen. Oh yeah!

Yeah.. But when's the war?

Nobbynumbnuts
16-01-2016, 14:37
A pretty succinct description of what's going on with the oil, ruble and the China effect..

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/article/555714.html

China's Economic Turmoil Ruins Russia's New Year
New fears over China’s economy and sharp falls in the price of oil have worsened the outlook for Russia as it tries to emerge from recession.

The price of crude, the linchpin of Russia’s economy, fell almost 20 percent in the first two weeks of January to just above $30 per barrel after Chinese stock indexes tumbled more than 10 percent in the first days of the year.

While the oil price falls threatened to derail hopes for an economic recovery in Russia, the turmoil on the stock markets deepened fears that Chinese economic growth, which has powered commodity prices and the global economy, could decline faster than expected. This may have serious consequences for Moscow — keeping the price of commodities lower for longer and weakening a strategic trade partner.

“For Russia, this is very unpleasant news,” said Yevgeny Nadorshin, chief economist at AFK Sistema, a major Russian conglomerate.

Worst Case
As the oil price plunged, Russia’s worst case scenario appeared to be coming true. The ruble followed the oil price downward, weakening 4 percent in the first two weeks of January to around 76.5 against the U.S. dollar — near its lowest since the crisis of 1998 and less than half its value two years ago.

Finance Minister Anton Siluanov said at the Gaidar Forum in Moscow that his budget, which receives around half its revenues from the energy industry, would balance only at $82 per barrel, according to the Reuters news agency. Predicting an average oil price of $40 for the year, he said the budget must adapt to new realities or Russia would see a repeat of the disastrous financial crisis of 1998-99.

He also said government departments were drawing up 10 percent spending cuts in non-protected areas.

Already in its longest recession since the 1990s after shrinking an estimated 3.7 percent last year, the economy could contract by another 2-3 percent in 2016 if oil prices average $35 per barrel, the Central Bank said in December, while the budget deficit would expand and currency reserves depleted.

A survey by state pollster VTsIOM published in early January found that more than half of Russians — 52 percent — thought the “hardest times” for the country were yet to come.

Lower for Longer
Stock market volatility in China suggests that they could be right. China’s economy has been the main driver of global demand for commodities, and a slowing of Chinese growth would exacerbate the price slump.

A World Bank report in early January said a one-percent fall in China’s growth rate would reduce the value of commodities by around 6 percent over two years, and warned of a “protracted period of low commodity prices in coming years.”

Oversupply has already sharply lowered the cost of oil, gas and metals, of which Russia is also a major producer. Energy prices fell by 41 percent last year and industrial metals by 24 percent, according to the S&P Goldman Sachs Commodity Index.

Another threat to prices is if China moves to stimulate its economy. Morgan Stanley said in a January report that a rapid devaluation of the Chinese currency designed to boost its exports “could send oil into the $20s [per barrel]” — its lowest in 15 years.

On top of that, a strengthening U.S. dollar is pushing down prices by making it more expensive for those using other currencies to buy dollar-traded commodities.

The movement of these two currencies is mutually reinforcing, Morgan Stanley said — a weaker Chinese economy encourages flight to the dollar, while a stronger dollar increases the temptation for Chinese policymakers to devalue.

Weathering the Storm
President Vladimir Putin in an interview with Germany’s Bild newspaper in early January tried to cast commodities’ low prices as a blessing in disguise, saying that when oil prices were high it was “very difficult for us to resist spending oil revenues to cover current expenses,” and the new reality would be an incentive to rebalance the economy.

But a lack of available investment capital has stifled diversification. And amid a slump in incomes and consumer spending, Russia’s commodities sector is one of the few major industries to be faring relatively well, analysts said.

The weak ruble has allowed energy, metals and mining companies, which earn export revenues in dollars, to maintain incomes in ruble terms. Meanwhile, Russian producers have become much more competitive on global markets thanks to huge falls in the cost of labor that have lowered production costs.

The cost of labor in Russia has fallen to rival that of China, said Valery Mironov, deputy director of the Center of Development at the Higher School of Economics, a Moscow university.

However, new investment in production has been limited by sanctions and the recession at home. And if prices remain low for an extended period of time, even Russian companies will be forced to retrench, analysts said.

Eastern Promises
In the longer term, worries over Chinese growth also strike Russian interests in a deeper way, knocking confidence in China as a financial ally for Moscow.

Following a breakdown in relations with the West following Russia’s annexation of Crimea in 2014 — and more recently with Turkey over the shooting down of a Russian warplane on the Turkish-Syrian border — Moscow has looked to build relations with dynamic emerging markets, particularly with China.

Hopes of a flood of Chinese capital into Russia failed to materialize following the Ukraine crisis, but the longer-term aim of hitching Russia to east-Asian growth remained.

That decision now looks increasingly flawed, said Neil Shearing, chief emerging markets economist at Capital Economics. Russia’s “pivot” to the east and hope that developing nations would become the engine of global growth have been undermined by recent events, he said.

A full-blown crisis is unlikely thanks to China’s massive foreign exchange reserves. But increasing fears of lower Chinese growth are coming as the United States begins to lift interest rates, fueling a massive reallocation of capital from emerging markets to developed ones and sapping strength from emerging economies, many of which are heavily indebted.

That isn't the way Russia planned it. “All bets were on China,” said Sistema’s Nadorshin. 

Russian Lad
16-01-2016, 14:53
There are rumors about the coming "Black Monday" - a significant oil price slump and further weakening of the ruble, due to some decisions related to Iran, supposedly to be taken during this weekend. Wonder if these rumors will turn out to be correct.

Fantastika
16-01-2016, 15:25
Who gives a flying f* about America. This forum (sic) is 'Economic situation in Russia'
Uh...

...China's Economic Turmoil...China's economy...Chinese stock indexes...Chinese economic growth...China...China...
...what?


But increasing fears of lower Chinese growth are coming as the United States begins to lift interest rates,...

The US interest rate went from .1 to .2 %? If the interest rate goes to 5%, and the US is forced into fiscal discipline, instead of Obama's scheme of growing dollars on Xerox trees, the cost of servicing $20 trillion in debt goes to $1 trillion a year; at 10%. $2 trillion. If I go bankrupt, the credit card companies eat my debts. If the credit card company goes bankrupt, the US taxpayer pays off their debt. If the US goes bankrupt, who eats their debt?

Uncle Wally
16-01-2016, 15:26
There are rumors about the coming "Black Monday" - a significant oil price slump and further weakening of the ruble, due to some decisions related to Iran, supposedly to be taken during this weekend. Wonder if these rumors will turn out to be correct.


Sanctions against Iran should be lifted today. Which means the can sell oil too.

Russian Lad
16-01-2016, 15:40
Sanctions against Iran should be lifted today. Which means the can sell oil too.

Perfect. I was reading they can offer big amounts, long term - like up to 35% of the current Russian supply. Add the Americans who lifted their own oil supply embargo, the Saudis who are fighting for the European market by cutting down the price, the Chinese stock market slump and possible crisis in the US, and the picture for those currently in power here in Russia looks increasingly grim. That's before we even begin discussing the mounting local problems and inefficiencies. Are you buckled up yet, Wally? It is not going to be some freaking turbulence this time around like during the last year, it is going to be a powerful, cataclysmic, devastating storm, with lightnings, thunder and all the works - something we haven't seen here in Russia since the end of the eighties-the early nineties in the previous millenium... A whole bundle of negative factors and fatal mistakes have converged in one single focal point. I did say exactly that two years ago, didn't I?:) It is nice to know I can deliver on my promises.

fenrir
16-01-2016, 22:26
No the depression that America is heading for will effect us all. You and Esbelonia. The economic downturn in American is what is causing the biggest problem in China. Wall Street is going to fall faster than world trade center building 7! Taking peoples retirement funds and future with it. Apple lost 3 billion dollars so far, WalMart just announced it's closing 269 stores. Oil companies are starting to go bankrupt then it will be people defaulting on home loans and school loans, it's going to hurt a lot if banks. All this when already 62% of Americans are one pay check from homelessness. People in Canada are already in trouble. The loonie is now worth 70 US cents and food prices are skyrocketing. Russia on the other hand has been preparing for trouble for more that a year now. It maybe hard but a lot better than being in America with all the people so used to higher standards, unable to grow their own food and everyone armed to the teeth. What do you think is going to happen in a country with so many guns in a depression? Crime and shootings will only grow to levels unseen. Oh yeah!

And what exactly does all that yada, yada, yada have to do with the Russian economy going into the sh-tter?

zzhhst
16-01-2016, 22:47
Iran has ships full of crude just waiting to hit the market. It will hurt Russia and many other crude producing countries. Next two weeks we will hit 80. Some people seem to forget or just deny. China is 30 trillion in debt. Personally,the last 3 years have been outstanding for me. This year is on it's way to be even better.

Uncle Wally
17-01-2016, 00:21
Iran has ships full of crude just waiting to hit the market. It will hurt Russia and many other crude producing countries. Next two weeks we will hit 80. Some people seem to forget or just deny. China is 30 trillion in debt. Personally,the last 3 years have been outstanding for me. This year is on it's way to be even better.


No you are confused. China is not in debt, China actually is owed a great deal. It is the Chinese people who owe so much. Now how much do people in the US owe? Not talking about the US government, we know that's like 20 trillion dollars but American people. How much do they owe? Russia and China could pay off their government debt but would maybe have very little left over. The US government would have to take decades to pay off half of what they owe.

Russian Lad
17-01-2016, 00:46
No you are confused. China is not in debt, China actually is owed a great deal. It is the Chinese people who owe so much. Now how much do people in the US owe? Not talking about the US government, we know that's like 20 trillion dollars but American people. How much do they owe? Russia and China could pay off their government debt but would maybe have very little left over. The US government would have to take decades to pay off half of what they owe.

Wally, I heard all that back in USSR when I was a teenager and you were still in the US somewhere in a remote neck of the woods. Then USSR collapsed. If I were you, I would be careful with such statements.

zzhhst
17-01-2016, 01:13
Wally, I heard all that back in USSR when I was a teenager and you were still in the US somewhere in a remote neck of the woods. Then USSR collapsed. If I were you, I would be careful with such statements.

Give me a few days I can prove it with documentation. They went too far on the devaluation yuan (elite scamming). Meanwhile buying treasury bills from the good old U.S.A In reality they will owe the U.S. 10 trillion just on interest. Wallmart, who do you think pushed all the trash here? China

Russian Lad
17-01-2016, 01:58
Give me a few days I can prove it with documentation.

You cannot prove anything to Wally, he is like our dear leader - understands only rough words and sheer force (I suspect), and you don't need to prove anything to me, so don't waste your time looking for it.:evilgrin:

zzhhst
17-01-2016, 02:00
No you are confused. China is not in debt, China actually is owed a great deal. It is the Chinese people who owe so much. Now how much do people in the US owe? Not talking about the US government, we know that's like 20 trillion dollars but American people. How much do they owe? Russia and China could pay off their government debt but would maybe have very little left over. The US government would have to take decades to pay off half of what they owe.


Wally Right or wrong it is capitalism. Will always win. Based on human nature greed bankers what have you. Capitalism is it the devil maybe? Can it be good yes. Money destroys people. People will not destroy money.

zzhhst
17-01-2016, 02:22
I will come up with it because I am tired of this 20t and owe China already in total reverse.( read some history on Japan R.L. If you have not?) Hang on to your dollars it will get wicked in the next few months. Rock&Roll Brother!!!

Russian Lad
17-01-2016, 02:45
I will come up with it because I am tired of this 20t and owe China already in total reverse.( read some history on Japan R.L. If you have not?) Hang on to your dollars it will get wicked in the next few months. Rock&Roll Brother!!!

I believe it will get wicked on Monday, comrade.:) Euros do just fine too. Another sign of the looming disaster - the official CB rate for the weekend for the Euro is 84.77, but at some places here in SPb it is bought today at 85... http://ligovka.ru/ Anyway, we are approaching the golden 100 mark that I promised to all kvas patriots here, at full speed. Hope they enjoy it in silence and with tightly clenched teeth, only moaning every now and then like beaten dogs.:)

zzhhst
17-01-2016, 04:40
Wont be open Monday. U.S. all markets are closed here. Enjoy my music please. Monday Will be real China. Let us see.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fs12_-ihPY:cool:

Uncle Wally
17-01-2016, 22:35
Wont be open Monday. U.S. all markets are closed here. Enjoy my music please. Monday Will be real China. Let us see.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fs12_-ihPY:cool:


Yeah why is it closed on Monday? Could it be that a very great and peaceful man died trying to stand up for the rights of blacks in America? Or do you even care?

Uncle Wally
17-01-2016, 23:02
Wally, I heard all that back in USSR when I was a teenager and you were still in the US somewhere in a remote neck of the woods. Then USSR collapsed. If I were you, I would be careful with such statements.


The first time I came here was 1994. And for your information my job was traveling around playing music.

Uncle Wally
17-01-2016, 23:06
Wally Right or wrong it is capitalism. Will always win. Based on human nature greed bankers what have you. Capitalism is it the devil maybe? Can it be good yes. Money destroys people. People will not destroy money.


Then explain the Russian revolution. You see the only thing wrong with how "capitalism" is run is that there are far too many poor people. If you are not careful those poor people come to you with pitchforks and burning torches at night and hang you from a tree.

fenrir
17-01-2016, 23:35
Then explain the Russian revolution. You see the only thing wrong with how "capitalism" is run is that there are far too many poor people. If you are not careful those poor people come to you with pitchforks and burning torches at night and hang you from a tree.

And Lenin had to resort to capitalistic measures to rebuild the economy.

Uncle Wally
17-01-2016, 23:43
And Lenin had to resort to capitalistic measures to rebuild the economy.


It's not the concept, it's how it is perverted that's the problem.

Nobbynumbnuts
18-01-2016, 09:42
Oil $28.33 and the ruble over 78 to the $
Both continuing to fall like a stone...

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 11:18
Oil $28.33 and the ruble over 78 to the $
Both continuing to fall like a stone...

Cool:).
:party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party:

Judge
18-01-2016, 14:08
Oil $28.33 and the ruble over 78 to the $
Both continuing to fall like a stone...

Sliding is a much better word,:straight-face:
The ruble is sliding lower ,adjusting to weak oil prices, at least they are not burning through their reserves defending the ruble, now it's free floating (no titanic jokes ,thanks ):tongue:

Alan65
18-01-2016, 14:36
Sliding is a much better word,:straight-face:
The ruble is sliding lower ,adjusting to weak oil prices, at least they are not burning through their reserves defending the ruble, now it's free floating (no titanic jokes ,thanks ):tongue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJeFsTFECbM

Judge
18-01-2016, 14:54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJeFsTFECbM

29663

Fantastika
18-01-2016, 16:41
Cool:).
:party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party:

Ruble at 86 to the Euro...Russian Lad is hip-hoppin' in the snow, dancin' the "Cool Jerk"!

Everybody tighten' up, baby, c'mon now!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN7vm-k-AaA

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 16:54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJeFsTFECbM


Can somebody please explain that game?

Alan65
18-01-2016, 16:57
Can somebody please explain that game?

Not to a Sherman.

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 17:01
Cool:).
:party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party::party:


You and that other ******** are not nice people.

Fantastika
18-01-2016, 17:11
Can somebody please explain that game?

It's sticky wickets in cricket, mate.

Fantastika
18-01-2016, 17:16
Until one of you psychopath gun crazed nuts attacks a IRS office, the FED or a Bilderberg meeting I will just assume that you are only a CIA stooge and are being brainwashed to help the government take guns away from people so they might enslave us all that much easier.

It's already happened. Oklahoma City? It happened on the exact day of the one-year anniversary of the US government killing of 83 Christians in Waco, Texas.

The government responded to the OKC bombing by banning large purchases of fertilizer, not guns.

The media responded to the OKC bombing by burying the significance of the date of the attack (revenge for the government's tanks and incineration at Waco) and the fact that the downtown building was packed full of IRS agents - the media instead called attention to "women and children" being killed, not IRS agents.

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 17:36
It's already happened. Oklahoma City? It happened on the exact day of the one-year anniversary of the US government killing of 83 Christians in Waco, Texas.

Obviously, the media buried the significance of the date of the attack (revenge for the government's tanks and incineration at Waco) and the fact that the OKC building was packed full of IRS agents - the media instead called attention to "women and children".

The government responded by banning large purchases of fertilizer, not guns.



Yeah the US government keeps lying about the massacre at Waco when they murdered women and children and Rube Ridge and what really happened in Oklahoma.

Nobbynumbnuts
18-01-2016, 18:23
Sliding is a much better word,:straight-face:
The ruble is sliding lower ,adjusting to weak oil prices, at least they are not burning through their reserves defending the ruble, now it's free floating (no titanic jokes ,thanks ):tongue:

That's one hell of a slide!
And i think you'll find the RCB are spending money to support the ruble, albeit unofficially. Ruble has now fallen to 79 to 1$

Fantastika
18-01-2016, 18:31
That's one hell of a slide!
And i think you'll find the RCB are spending money to support the ruble, albeit unofficially. Ruble has now fallen to 79 to 1$

You're sure now? It's not $79 to the ruble? :)

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 18:41
That's one hell of a slide!
And i think you'll find the RCB are spending money to support the ruble, albeit unofficially. Ruble has now fallen to 79 to 1$


Wow now maybe even you, Flipper the burger can come to Moscow and afford more than cheap vodka cocktails.

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 19:07
You and that other ******** are not nice people.

It is a wild world out there, Wally, there is a price to pay for everything.:dont-tell-anyone::party::party::party:


And i think you'll find the RCB are spending money to support the ruble, albeit unofficially.

It is not a secret anymore, the CB interventions have been filmed and made available to the general public! (see the clip below).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9eig65m0z0

FatAndy
18-01-2016, 19:09
It is a wild world out there, Wally, there is a price to pay for everything.:dont-tell-anyone::party::party::party:
Correct, comrade - no more rotten wings for you... :rasta:

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 19:15
Correct, comrade - no more rotten wings for you...

I have just received a fresh supply of them from Gosdep, together with pechenki. Envy in silence, comrade!

FatAndy
18-01-2016, 19:48
I have just received a fresh supply of them from Gosdep, together with pechenki.
Fresh? These hairsplitters from DoS have started to use express delivery? :jawdrop:

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 19:51
It is a wild world out there, Wally, there is a price to pay for everything.:dont-tell-anyone::party::party::party:



It is not a secret anymore, the CB interventions have been filmed and made available to the general public! (see the clip below).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9eig65m0z0


I pay for things but I don't whine about it and I don't wish people bad. Not like you.

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 20:20
I pay for things but I don't whine about it and I don't wish people bad. Not like you.

You don't wish bad to Obama and the US bankers? Since when exactly? Why have you lied again, Wally? It is bad for your karma.

Carl
18-01-2016, 20:52
Wow now maybe even you, Flipper the burger can come to Moscow and afford more than cheap vodka cocktails.

Says the unemployed squatter..!!:loser::laughing:

fenrir
18-01-2016, 20:59
You don't wish bad to Obama and the US bankers? Since when exactly? Why have you lied again, Wally? It is bad for your karma.

And he has wished all Americans dead twice, which includes his friends and family back home.

Nobbynumbnuts
18-01-2016, 21:02
Says the unemployed squatter..!!:loser::laughing:

Don't, it just encourages more back and fourth nonsense. :winking:

Judge
18-01-2016, 21:11
Don't, it just encourages more back and fourth nonsense. :winking:

Exactly, thank you.:smile:

Judge
18-01-2016, 21:14
You don't wish bad to Obama and the US bankers? Since when exactly? Why have you lied again, Wally? It is bad for your karma.

The bankers who cheat and steal deserve locking up....like this nice bunch,
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/goldman-sachs-pay-billion-mortgage-settlement-36298605
Surely you don't have sympathy for such people. ..

Judge
18-01-2016, 21:18
Back to Russia, not only is China investing in Russia,


Yamal LNG Project has been financed in the amount of $15 bln, Chief Executive Officer of Russian natural gas producer Novatek Leonid Mikhelson said on Monday at the meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin. Chinese partners invested about $5 bln and French partners — $3.7 bln, Mikhelson said. Shareholders of OAO Yamal LNG are Novatek (60%), China’s CNPC (20%) and French Total (20%). About $15 bln have been invested to date, including two thirds being resources of the National Wealth Fund, Mikhelson said. "The time is challenging. Novatek is in the sanction list. We received the second tranche [from the National Wealth Fund] and continue financing together with partners," Mikhelson said. OAO Yamal LNG is implementing the project of constructing the liquefied natural gas plant with the capacity of 16.5 mln tons of LNG per year on the resource base of Yuzhno-Tambeiskoe field. LNG production start is scheduled to 2017.

More:
http://tass.ru/en/economy/850457

Judge
18-01-2016, 21:24
And last bit of news, a lot less money left the country compared to last 2014, debt is being paid off, if Russian companies carry on like this all their debt will be paid off in a few years,then western banks will be begging again to lend to Russian companies. ..


MOSCOW, January 18. /TASS/. Russia’s current account surplus of the payment balance increased to $65.8 bln in 2105, the Central Bank said Monday. According to the Central Bank, the growth was due to a substantial reduction of the negative contribution of the balance of services and investment income, including decline in external debt payments against a reduction of total debt to non-residents.
Net capital outflow from Russia in 2015 totaled $56.9 bln against $153 bln in 2014, the Russian Central Bank went on to say. At the same time, net capital outflow from Russia in the Q4 2015 totaled $9.2 bln. In the Q3, according to the Central Bank, capital inflow to Russia amounted to $3.4 bln. The Central Bank said that in contrast to previous years, the main component in the structure of net capital outflow was repayment of private external debt. At the same time, the most significant part was the reduction in external liabilities of banks, which was carried out by not only selling foreign assets, but also the funds accumulated for current account transactions. "Other sectors, while in the harsh conditions of external financing, were also forced to repay external debt at the minimum increasing of foreign assets in recent years, mainly in the form of direct investments," the Central Bank said.

More:
http://tass.ru/en/economy/850397

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 21:59
You don't wish bad to Obama and the US bankers? Since when exactly? Why have you lied again, Wally? It is bad for your karma.


It's a little bit different than you wishing people to stave because of some miss guided notions you have. Putin will not be leaving anytime soon and Russians are ready to starve because most understand that it's America to blame.

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 22:02
Says the unemployed squatter..!!:loser::laughing:


Oh Carl you are so mixed up. Try being nice to people and maybe someday you to can have friends.

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 22:17
The bankers who cheat and steal deserve locking up....like this nice bunch,
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireS...ement-36298605
Surely you don't have sympathy for such people. ..


Well, sue the ones you don't like, let's get them cheaters and thieves thrown behind bars. But that was not the point - they are people too, and Wally claimed he doesn't wish bad to people. So, you are just trying to divert attention.


It's a little bit different than you wishing people to stave because of some miss guided notions you have. Putin will not be leaving anytime soon and Russians are ready to starve because most understand that it's America to blame.

Your little bit is stretchable like a whore's p//y, it seeems. But let it be. Russians are not ready to starve, buddy, even though you badly want them to, it seems. You want me to prove it to you? Here you go, the number of labor protests in Russia during 2015 increased by 40% in comparison with 2014: http://inukr.net/foreign/296084-rossiya-postavila-rekord-po-zabastovkam-i-trudovym-protestam.html
And don't mix up the cause and the effect - the policies you fully support brought the Russians exactly into the position they are in now, and you, like all other kvas patriots here, bear the full responsibility for the consequences, the existing ones and the ones to come - 100% of it.

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 22:19
Well, sue the ones you don't like, let's get them cheaters and thieves thrown behind bars. But that was not the point - they are people too, and Wally claimed he doesn't wish bad to people. So, you are just trying to divert attention.


You try spinning hard.


They are criminals and hurt people.

Judge
18-01-2016, 22:31
Well, sue the ones you don't like, let's get them cheaters and thieves thrown behind bars. But that was not the point - they are people too, and Wally claimed he doesn't wish bad to people. So, you are just trying to divert attention.


It's not my job to get them cheaters, a slap on the hand is all they get, the one who are doing the slapping used to work for the banks, and if they don't, when they move on from their government jobs can go and work for banks like GS. No diverting, only by you who like to give big banks a free pass...

Since we are talking about banks, banks in Italy are taking a big hit, sorry for the diversion.

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSL8N15228G

Lending at such low interest rates, they would love to be lending at higher rates to Russian companies. .no wonder the Italian leader was questioning sanctions against Russia :hug:


Maybe you have the same expression in Russia ,you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours.
Alistair Darling, former British chancellor, joins Morgan Stanley board

http://gu.com/p/4fvvg?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Messages

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 22:38
only by you who like to give big banks a free pass...

I may even join you in your hatred of big banks and deceitful bankers, but by telling me I like to give big bankers a free pass you have now resorted to a clear-cut lie. Are you trying to compete with Wally? That's even worse than trying to divert attention. Both have sounded very desperate. Well, you kvas patriots are only beginning to taste the desperation. Enjoy it.:) And bear in mind - it is the fruit of your own making, your cheering up one-two years ago has one word for it - complicity.

Uncle Wally
18-01-2016, 22:51
I may even join you in your hatred of big banks and deceitful bankers, but by telling me I like to give big bankers a free pass you have now resorted to a clear-cut lie. Are you trying to compete with Wally? That's even worse than trying to divert attention. Both have sounded very desperate. Well, you kvas patriots are only beginning to taste the desperation. Enjoy it.:) And bear in mind - it is the fruit of your own making, your cheering up one-two years ago has one word for it - complicity.



You give America a free pass too. They have been torturing people, innocent people I may add for 14 years now, you sound like you could care less. You understand well that it was America who overthrew the government in Ukraine and started all this mess. Did you know that the current president of Ukraine has a lower rating now than the last president had when he had to run away?

Judge
18-01-2016, 22:53
I may even join you in your hatred of big banks and deceitful bankers, but by telling me I like to give big bankers a free pass you have now resorted to a clear-cut lie. Are you trying to compete with Wally? That's even worse than trying to divert attention. Both have sounded very desperate. Well, you kvas patriots are only beginning to taste the desperation. Enjoy it.:) And bear in mind - it is the fruit of your own making, your cheering up one-two years ago has one word for it - complicity.

Yes, I missed what you said,
let's get them cheaters and thieves thrown behind bars.
We agree,

No desperation from the usual crowd, just common sense. ..so what's it going to be tommorow, Black Tuesday, no Black Monday today..

Russian Lad
18-01-2016, 22:56
so what's it going to be tommorow, Black Tuesday, no Black Monday today..

I said yesterday there are rumors, I didn't claim anything. You are trying to insinuate something now?:) And it is not like it has been a cloudless Monday, dollar has become worth like 2 rubles more... Like 2-3 years ago you would have agreed it is a huge fall, now you are just used to it.:)

fenrir
18-01-2016, 23:11
You give America a free pass too. They have been torturing people, innocent people I may add for 14 years now, you sound like you could care less. You understand well that it was America who overthrew the government in Ukraine and started all this mess. Did you know that the current president of Ukraine has a lower rating now than the last president had when he had to run away?

And you give Russia a big pass. What about all the death and destruction from the Afghan and Chechen Wars? What about all the colossal crimes against humanity from the Soviet period? Total silence from your end.

zzhhst
18-01-2016, 23:55
It was my claim. HANG SENG look at the last 6 month chart. https://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=%5EHSI+Interactive#{"range":"6mo","allowChartStacking":true}


Also is Stockmann closed for good? Moscow?


What do you people have against bankers? Because they have the upper edge on you? Money makes the world go around and you will never change it. All humanity is based on greed. Perhaps, we should just all barter. I like bartering the best. However, it is impossible in today's world.

zzhhst
19-01-2016, 00:41
B.S. under capitalism you have to get off your ass and work. If you choose welfare and set up a baby factory than you deserve to fail.

Fantastika
19-01-2016, 00:44
The bankers who cheat and steal deserve locking up....like this nice bunch,
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/goldman-sachs-pay-billion-mortgage-settlement-36298605
Surely you don't have sympathy for such people. ..

You're missing the point - the federal government has power over the banks.

The federal government set in place rules and regulations which forced the banks to make loans to unqualified applicants.

Goldman Sachs is being fined for the "sale of shoddy mortgages in the years leading to the housing bubble and subsequent financial crisis," according to ABC "news."

The reality is that the government CAUSED the financial crisis with their rules FORCING the banks to make shoddy loans, such as the $450,000 mortgage loan to my neighbor, a Hispanic cleaning lady, who "qualified" under Federal "Guidelines" *mandating* banks accept mortgages from such unqualified minorities and/or women.

Now that their schemes have proven to be a disaster, the federal government (and New York State) are blaming the banks instead of themselves, and are acting like criminals - using the banks as a cash cow - collecting settlements from them for actions by the banks that the government forced them to perform.

This is soooo f*cked up. The people who CAUSED the crisis (the government) are fining the people who were the intermediaries (the banks) in the government's scheme to bring "fairness" to the mortgage market.

The people who deserve "locking up" are the bureaucrats in Washington who engineered this colossal monument to ignorance, such as: Franklin Raines earned $90 million in salary and bonuses while he was head of Fannie Mae.[19]. And the head of this so-called "watchdog" federal agency LIED and CONCEALED the losses, for years, and instructed his accountants to LIE, instead of alerting everyone to the oncoming financial tsunami.

And they continue to exacerbate the problem today.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/1/fannie-mae-freddie-mac-ceos-massive-pay-raises-spa/?page=all

Judge, please don't believe this spoon-fed jive crap from ABC News and the rest of the "Progressive" media.

Judge
19-01-2016, 07:52
Fantastika, you have it the wrong way round, it's the bankers who control your government,I wonder who pushed Clinton's deregulation of the banking system, also see who had the ear of Reagan. ..
Isn't what they did fraud, isn't that a crime in your country, anyone locked up for 10, 15 years,nice for them when they are playing by the rules they helped to set up.
I don't read ABC news,just posted a link to show the fine,some won't have believed it if it was from Russia media.

Judge
19-01-2016, 07:54
I said yesterday there are rumors, I didn't claim anything. You are trying to insinuate something now?:) And it is not like it has been a cloudless Monday, dollar has become worth like 2 rubles more... Like 2-3 years ago you would have agreed it is a huge fall, now you are just used to it.:)

You heard the rumours when you were out looking for scraps of chicken?

Russian Lad
19-01-2016, 11:17
You heard the rumours when you were out looking for scraps of chicken?

Yes, I overheard a big banker talking over the phone beside a garbage container when he was throwing away his trash.

Uncle Wally
19-01-2016, 11:38
You're missing the point - the federal government has power over the banks.

The federal government set in place rules and regulations which forced the banks to make loans to unqualified applicants.

Goldman Sachs is being fined for the "sale of shoddy mortgages in the years leading to the housing bubble and subsequent financial crisis," according to ABC "news."

The reality is that the government CAUSED the financial crisis with their rules FORCING the banks to make shoddy loans, such as the $450,000 mortgage loan to my neighbor, a Hispanic cleaning lady, who "qualified" under Federal "Guidelines" *mandating* banks accept mortgages from such unqualified minorities and/or women.

Now that their schemes have proven to be a disaster, the federal government (and New York State) are blaming the banks instead of themselves, and are acting like criminals - using the banks as a cash cow - collecting settlements from them for actions by the banks that the government forced them to perform.

This is soooo f*cked up. The people who CAUSED the crisis (the government) are fining the people who were the intermediaries (the banks) in the government's scheme to bring "fairness" to the mortgage market.

The people who deserve "locking up" are the bureaucrats in Washington who engineered this colossal monument to ignorance, such as: Franklin Raines earned $90 million in salary and bonuses while he was head of Fannie Mae.[19]. And the head of this so-called "watchdog" federal agency LIED and CONCEALED the losses, for years, and instructed his accountants to LIE, instead of alerting everyone to the oncoming financial tsunami.

And they continue to exacerbate the problem today.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/1/fannie-mae-freddie-mac-ceos-massive-pay-raises-spa/?page=all

Judge, please don't believe this spoon-fed jive crap from ABC News and the rest of the "Progressive" media.



I guess you haven't heard about this Ted Cruz that's running for president, you know the guy born in Canada. Well it seems his wife works for GS and forget one or two little details about his campaign finance. He kind of forgot about that million dollar loan he got from GS during his last election. Without money you don't get elected.

Carl
19-01-2016, 19:19
You heard the rumours when you were out looking for scraps of chicken?

Encouraging more back & fourth nonsense Judge? Hmmm...:confused:

FatAndy
19-01-2016, 19:38
Encouraging more back & fourth nonsense Judge? Hmmm...:confused:
Get used to this damned managed democracy ;)


Yes, I overheard a big banker talking over the phone beside a garbage container when he was throwing away his trash.
Horizontal connections in secret-service info acquisition? ;)

Russian Lad
19-01-2016, 20:45
Horizontal connections in secret-service info acquisition?

We may apply this definition I assume. So, kvas patriots, Russia is fully and royally screwed up, for many years to come, it seems, thanks to your adolescent cheering as well. Is that what you wanted? Where are all those personages like VicY, Penka, TGP, Tolko and so forth? It is getting boring talking only to drunk Wally here, even Judge is not of much help.:party:

Nobbynumbnuts
19-01-2016, 21:27
....Where are all those personages like VicY, Penka, TGP, Tolko and so forth?............

Just a few of us left. Will the last one out please turn the light off! :winking:

Judge
19-01-2016, 21:29
Encouraging more back & fourth nonsense Judge? Hmmm...:confused:

RL is a good sport, he enjoys the banter...

Judge
19-01-2016, 21:32
We may apply this definition I assume. So, kvas patriots, Russia is fully and royally screwed up, for many years to come, it seems, thanks to your adolescent cheering as well. Is that what you wanted? Where are all those personages like VicY, Penka, TGP, Tolko and so forth? It is getting boring talking only to drunk Wally here, even Judge is not of much help.:party:

More rumours of yours "royally screwed "? Read what you want in it ,the IMF say Russia will see growth in 2017.
Vic back in HK, not much time I guess,Penka, had enough of the Russia bashing, she's sailing around on her yacht,TGP, same, annoyed with the Russia bashing, Tolko,good question, he hasn't logged on this year.

Uncle Wally
19-01-2016, 21:43
We may apply this definition I assume. So, kvas patriots, Russia is fully and royally screwed up, for many years to come, it seems, thanks to your adolescent cheering as well. Is that what you wanted? Where are all those personages like VicY, Penka, TGP, Tolko and so forth? It is getting boring talking only to drunk Wally here, even Judge is not of much help.:party:

No it's your rude behavior that those women no longer come to this forum. Tolko is not afraid of you I'm pretty sure but in these dangerous times finds he is in high demand.

You want to talk about "adolescents"? Lets talk about people who have to come on here every day and post that oil went down or the dollar went up and how smart they are, and "I told you so" na na na na! Some think this site is for bashing Russia and Russians. We have a site for that. This site is to help people who come from foreign lands adjust to living in a place they may not understand. Help them find things, meet people, understand. Some think it's a place to vent their inadequacy. You for one should be trying to help Russia welcome new foreigners and add them in adjusting to Russia because the more Russians meet foreigners the more their minds may change. Wishing them pain caused by a tyrannical country such as the USofA will not work which is proven by Putin's increased approval ratings.

Russian Lad
19-01-2016, 21:53
More rumours of yours "royally screwed "? Read what you want in it ,the IMF say Russia will see growth in 2017.

I chuckled over that one. Ok, you wanna play some more? Let's play, let's see how far it gets you and the drunk Wally here. Only you two are left. That reminds me of the famous story by Christie:party:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOs7OPCIVm4

Judge
19-01-2016, 22:36
I chuckled over that one. Ok, you wanna play some more? Let's play, let's see how far it gets you and the drunk Wally here. Only you two are left.

And once growth starts you will do another disappearing act:smile: ,wondering what happened.
Black Tuesday is passing, what comes next?

Russian Lad
19-01-2016, 23:32
Black Tuesday is passing, what comes next?

Black Wednesday, obviously. You may safely mark all the days in your calendar for 2016 in black for today's Russia under its current management... Then 2017 will come. The Grand Anniversary... Why not celebrate it with salute and some dancing, maybe even twerking? :cool:

Uncle Wally
19-01-2016, 23:45
And once growth starts you will do another disappearing act:smile: ,wondering what happened.
Black Tuesday is passing, what comes next?


That's because he's actually making money at those times and could care less about us. It's when nobody needs translations he starts picking through the trash and whining to us.

Russian Lad
19-01-2016, 23:49
It's when nobody needs translations he starts picking through the trash and whining to us.

Well, actually pretty much nobody needs translations from English into Russian these days, not for a good payment anyway. The moods on Russian translators forums are gloomy. So much so that some Russian employers are offering dog food as payment, seriously. I don't see my future in the translation industry anyway, so I don't give a flying duck about all that sh't. Let it rip, the more the merrier.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 00:08
Well, actually pretty much nobody needs translations from English into Russian these days, not for a good payment anyway. The moods on Russian translators forums are gloomy. So much so that some Russian employers are offering dog food as payment, seriously. I don't see my future in the translation industry anyway, so I don't give a flying duck about all that sh't. Let it rip, the more the merrier.

Hint, you feed the dog the dog food then you eat the dog. Or if you're more business minded you feed the dog and then make pelmeni and sell them to other translators.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 00:28
Hint, you feed the dog the dog food then you eat the dog. Or if you're more business minded you feed the dog and then make pelmeni and sell them to other translators.

I eat only rotten chicken wings, Wally. Dog food - that's for more advanced Russian translators, I haven't reached such giddy heights in the metier yet.:dont-tell-anyone:

fenrir
20-01-2016, 11:50
Something bad is happening today. Ruble at 87.5 to the euro.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 12:45
Something bad is happening today. Ruble at 87.5 to the euro.

Why? The usual drill. Still 13 rubles to go to 100. Dollar 80.:) Kvas patriots, your take on the matter? Have you counted your worthless rubles this morning? :party:

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 12:56
Why? The usual drill. Still 13 rubles to go to 100. Dollar 80.:) Kvas patriots, your take on the matter? Have you counted your worthless rubles this morning? :party:


I was just in the shop yesterday and prices don't seem to have gone up. Got 400g of hamburger for 119 rubles. How much is that in dollar /euros?

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 13:09
I was just in the shop yesterday and prices don't seem to have gone up.

That's because they subsidize the food heavily, they froze the prices on the essential foodstuffs like a year+ ago. What happens after they run out of money? The effect will not be immediate, but wait for 2-3 months... Food in Russia has a lot of foreign components - furtilizer, equipment, packaging, you name it - even if it is produced inside Russia. Take your hamburger, for instance - you have seen a lot of equipment inside when you bought it. How much of it is produced inside Russia using only Russian components do you think? I bet the real answer is zero. It is like a tsunami - when the wave begins in the ocean there is still life going on on the shore - as if nothing is happening. Enjoy it while you still can.:) Your cheap hamburger.:) Things are gonna change pretty soon.

Nobbynumbnuts
20-01-2016, 13:18
Oil at $27 and the ruble at 79.77, a whisker away from 80 to the dollar.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 14:06
That's because they subsidize the food heavily, they froze the prices on the essential foodstuffs like a year+ ago. What happens after they run out of money? The effect will not be immediate, but wait for 2-3 months... Food in Russia has a lot of foreign components - furtilizer, equipment, packaging, you name it - even if it is produced inside Russia. Take your hamburger, for instance - you have seen a lot of equipment inside when you bought it. How much of it is produced inside Russia using only Russian components do you think? I bet the real answer is zero. It is like a tsunami - when the wave begins in the ocean there is still life going on on the shore - as if nothing is happening. Enjoy it while you still can.:) Your cheap hamburger.:) Things are gonna change pretty soon.


The last time I was in a steakhouse I went with the Russian steak, it was much better than the steak I had a few weeks before which wasn't Russian. I don't remember where it was from but not America. I was surprised that they had Russian steaks but then I read how someone imported cattle from Australia I think and began producing beef here. You see in every bad situation you will find opportunities. If you just sit and whine well you ain't gonna find much.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 14:08
If you just sit and whine well you ain't gonna find much.

What is this constant allegation to whining about? I am totally enjoying it.

Judge
20-01-2016, 14:15
Oil at $27 and the ruble at 79.77, a whisker away from 80 to the dollar.
Now the Ruble hit a new low...
https://www.rt.com/business/329535-ruble-record-low-dollar

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 14:16
What is this constant allegation to whining about? I am totally enjoying it.


Come on we know how tricky you Russians are. You are just covering your whining with false declarations of joy.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 14:28
Come on we know how tricky you Russians are. You are just covering your whining with false declarations of joy.

Why should I be whining if all my savings are in euros and dollars? You don't make much sense, Wally. I bought dollars for 30 and now they cost 80. I am as happy as I can be and I want 100 (and I always get what I want). What is there to whine about??? I am getting richer while I sleep in my bed. But I do realize that most Russians are deprived of such niceties and basically work their arses off for crappy food (sometimes - dog food), very small shelter with a dimly lit lamp inside and stinking second hand clothes from China while enjoying Rossiya24 tv programs about how great the new Russia is and about their awesome dear leader.
I am planning to go to Cyprus some time during this coming spring to sip Whiskey under a palm tree and enjoy Rossiya24 broadcasts from there.:) Then maybe to Sochi for 2-3 months. Life is so hard for me. This caviar with blini and all those nubile chicks are unbearable.:(
A song for you, Wally:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESEQ2I6BDqc

Armoured
20-01-2016, 14:29
Come on we know how tricky you Russians are. You are just covering your whining with false declarations of joy.

Racist!

Wait, isn't that what you accuse Americans of? Fake smiling?

(Ignoring of course the lesson of the great Russian director Stanislavsky, based on Pavlov - in short, if you want to feel happy, act happy - physically).

fenrir
20-01-2016, 15:30
Bloodbath time.

1.00 EUR = 88.0584 RUB

1.00 USD = 80.7106 RUB

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 15:37
Why should I be whining if all my savings are in euros and dollars? You don't make much sense, Wally. I bought dollars for 30 and now they cost 80. I am as happy as I can be and I want 100 (and I always get what I want). What is there to whine about??? I am getting richer while I sleep in my bed. But I do realize that most Russians are deprived of such niceties and basically work their arses off for crappy food (sometimes - dog food), very small shelter with a dimly lit lamp inside and stinking second hand clothes from China while enjoying Rossiya24 tv programs about how great the new Russia is and about their awesome dear leader.
I am planning to go to Cyprus some time during this coming spring to sip Whiskey under a palm tree and enjoy Rossiya24 broadcasts from there.:) Then maybe to Sochi for 2-3 months. Life is so hard for me. This caviar with blini and all those nubile chicks are unbearable.:(
A song for you, Wally:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESEQ2I6BDqc


The whole thing is is that you are not spending them. You could have cash them in when the dollar went down

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 15:40
Racist!

Wait, isn't that what you accuse Americans of? Fake smiling?

(Ignoring of course the lesson of the great Russian director Stanislavsky, based on Pavlov - in short, if you want to feel happy, act happy - physically).


I must be getting it from you. You know the more someone reads the bull like on the other side, hey can influence you.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 15:41
Bloodbath time.

1.00 EUR = 88.0584 RUB

1.00 USD = 80.7106 RUB


In your dreams sicko

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 15:52
The whole thing is is that you are not spending them. You could have cash them in when the dollar went down

Why is that?:) I spend as much as I want to, sometimes modestly, sometimes lavishly. It doesn't take much brains to visit an obmennik and get some rubles, as long as one has hard currency. Envy in silence, Wally.:party:

Nobbynumbnuts
20-01-2016, 16:23
Bloodbath time.

1.00 EUR = 88.0584 RUB

1.00 USD = 80.7106 RUB

...and 115 RUB to the £!! Never thought I'd live to see the day.
Well, are we going to get to 85 to the $ and when?

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 16:30
Why is that?:) I spend as much as I want to, sometimes modestly, sometimes lavishly. It doesn't take much brains to visit an obmennik and get some rubles, as long as one has hard currency. Envy in silence, Wally.:party:

Because you lose every time you exchange. Stick with picking garbage.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 16:42
Because you lose every time you exchange. Stick with picking garbage.

How is that, if I bought them for 30? You don't make sense again. Besides, I always exchange some amounts on the peak. For instance, I am planning to get some rubles for myself today-tomorrow to last for a month or two. Euro 88 now. 12 rubles to go to the target.

Fantastika
20-01-2016, 17:17
World markets are in "plunge mode" today.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 17:24
World markets are in "plunge mode" today.



You don't say. It's only Russia that has a problem I thought.

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 17:27
World markets are in "plunge mode" today.

Very good. I do hope the US have a crisis similar to 2008. It is about time.

Uncle Wally
20-01-2016, 17:29
How is that, if I bought them for 30? You don't make sense again. Besides, I always exchange some amounts on the peak. For instance, I am planning to get some rubles for myself today-tomorrow to last for a month or two. Euro 88 now. 12 rubles to go to the target.


So you have not made any money euros/dollars for two years? If you have how do you know which ones to exchange?

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 17:49
So you have not made any money euros/dollars for two years? If you have how do you know which ones to exchange?

I may have made some.:) A sure-fire signal to exchange - the CB raising the interest rate, for instance. Right now it doesn't look like they are going to raise it very soon. Nabiulina has just claimed they are not going to support the ruble for now. They need the higher rate for the dwindling budget. For me it is a win-win game, Wally. I am not rushing around obmenniks trying to gain some copecks - I sell on the peak, spend it, then wait, then sell some more. The ruble will end up being over 100 anyway, both for the ruble and the euro - it is only a matter of time - weeks or months, that's debatable. But not years I think.:)

Fantastika
20-01-2016, 17:58
Very good. I do hope the US have a crisis similar to 2008. It is about time.

You're putting on your misanthrope costume today?

Here we can see Friday's plunge, and today's...

And here I was going to buy Google call options when it was $780 last week. Now it's 680...

29674

Fantastika
20-01-2016, 18:26
Fantastika, you have it the wrong way round, it's the bankers who control your government,I wonder who pushed Clinton's deregulation of the banking system, also see who had the ear of Reagan. ..
Isn't what they did fraud, isn't that a crime in your country, anyone locked up for 10, 15 years,nice for them when they are playing by the rules they helped to set up.
I don't read ABC news,just posted a link to show the fine,some won't have believed it if it was from Russia media.

Someone "pushed" Clinton? Ronald Reagan? Dark Conspiracy. :)

Superficial, Judge. Just the tip of the iceberg as "exposed" :) by ABC, or CNN, or most of the rest of the media. Let me try to walk you through it.

I suppose you could call it the greed of big banks, but government was the enabler - in the same way that free money to an drug user will just allow him to buy more drugs.

True, the regulations on financial institutions may have been loosened in the 1990's, so many more people qualified for mortgages. More Americans could now own their own home. A good idea. 0% down options, (such as the mortgage I just got) and other incentives appeared, and more types of financial organizations appeared. Everyone was happy, many more people were getting mortgages. The pressure on Clinton came from the media and civil-rights organizations who complained that women and minorities were not getting their "fair share" of mortgages, their "fair share" of the American pie. In other words, they accused the mortgage companies of "racism." What was actually happening was that banks were just being circumspect - a profitable business does not loan money to someone who is unable to pay it back.

The federal government got involved (Bill Clinton) and government bureaucrats told the banks they must make a larger percentage of loans to minorities, otherwise they would be dragged into court with charges of "discrimination" and "racism" and "sexism." Under government and media pressure, the banks still refused, because a business goes bankrupt when it is forced to lose money - example - a bank foreclosure on a $250,000-mortgaged house, yields the bank $110,000 after fees and resale at auction, so they lose $140,000 (a personal case I know of). No bank could possibly make large numbers of risky loans and stay afloat.

So the federal government offered a "solution" to this dilemma - they would guarantee all the risky loans. They staffed-up Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, quasi-government institutions, which started assuming failing mortgages. So, instead of refusing loans to risky customers, the bank could now grant the mortgage loan, secure in the knowledge, that if the customer got into financial trouble down the road, and couldn't make payments on the loan, the bank could just dump the messy loan onto Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac's lap, and the bank could walk away, no longer responsible. No foul, no loss. Banks were guaranteed a profit! Everybody wanted in on the government-guaranteed gravy train!

My next door neighbor sold his house, and the new neighbor was an immigrant cleaning lady who "qualified" for a $460,000 loan. She was out after a year, some people lie on their applications, then when they are caught, or refuse to make payments, they complain about "discrimination" and refuse to vacate the premises.

There was an explosion of mortgages, and housing prices went way up - the banks' loans were guaranteed by Freddie and Fannie.

Obviously, Freddie and Fannie started getting a huge amount of bad mortgages. The banks were forced to grant mortgages, and a large amount of these loans were untenable. Fannie and Freddie were soon in $100's of Billions in debt, approaching a $trillion.

Clinton had appointed Franklin Raines as president of Fannie Mae, and Raines' chief accountant was another poltical appointee. Raines and his accountants concealed the huge losses at Fannie Mae:

"As an executive at Fannie Mae, Franklin Raines illegally coerced his employees to falsify accounting facts so he’d get a maximum bonus. The government-backed firm used Enron-like fraud, in part at Raines’s orders, to create the largest bail-out in US history. Raines had the whistleblower fired." (Heritage Foundation)

There was no media curiosity, nor any government investigation nor any prosecution for this criminal wrongdoing at Fannie Mae. Raines walked away with over $100 million in bonuses. American taxpayers will be forever paying off the $trillions in debt piled up these government agencies. Raines, being black, was not prosecuted for his financial crimes. Some people - media-hero minorities, Democrats, etc., (Hillary Clinton) can be lifetime career criminals and never be prosecuted. Where were the Congressional hearings? Where was the Department of Justice? Why aren’t Raines, Johnson, Dodd, and Clinton doing a perp walk on the evening news? Because liberals OWN Washington.

This secrecy surrounding the huge mortgage losses assumed by the government under Fannie and Freddie and the media coverup went on for a couple of years, and by then the underlying problems had become a crisis, thus the recession during the last years of Bush.

The government perversely blamed "big banks" for the crisis, and still is today, collecting huge sums in fines for banks making "shoody mortgages", etc. And the media, superficially, still blames the banks, too.

.....

So it was not the banks which engineered the 2004 fiscal crisis, it was the government.

If you want a real in-depth analysis, check out the Heritage Foundation studies and Washington Times articles on this.

FatAndy
20-01-2016, 19:01
You're putting on your misanthrope costume today?
Comrade RL even sleeps in it... ;)

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 20:43
Originally Posted by Fantastika View Post
You're putting on your misanthrope costume today?
Comrade RL even sleeps in it...

I haven't been the one who has cheered to the current policies that directly led to today's economic situation here in Russia. Why don't you chaps look in the mirror? Why do you hate the Russians so much? Or is it a form of sado-masochism?
Update: Euro 90, 10 more rubles to go to reach the target. Judge, this Wednesday, black enough for you???

FatAndy
20-01-2016, 21:20
I haven't been the one who has cheered to the current policies that directly led to today's economic situation here in Russia. Why don't you chaps look in the mirror? Why do you hate the Russians so much? Or is it a form of sado-masochism?
Sadism, comrade. ;)

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 21:44
Sadism, comrade. ;)

Ok, that explains the motivation of the elite, but what is the motivation of their willing victims (the majority of the population)?

Armoured
20-01-2016, 21:56
Ok, that explains the motivation of the elite, but what is the motivation of their willing victims (the majority of the population)?

Masochism of course.

You do know what the masochist said to the sadist? "Hurt me, hurt me."

And the sadist replied?

"Later, later."

FatAndy
20-01-2016, 22:08
And the sadist replied?
- No-o-o-uuuu... :vampire:

Russian Lad
20-01-2016, 22:23
Masochism of course.

You do know what the masochist said to the sadist? "Hurt me, hurt me."

And the sadist replied?

"Later, later."

Ok, well, that's what I thought to begin with.:party:

annasophia
21-01-2016, 05:55
January 20, 2016: 2:02 PM ET


It dropped 4% to 82 rubles per U.S. dollar on Wednesday, passing a previous low hit in late 2014 and piling on the pain for an economy already deep in recession.

The latest slump was triggered by another steep drop in oil prices -- crude sank below $27 a barrel to its lowest level since September 2003. The ruble often mirrors movements in oil prices because the Russian economy is extremely dependent on energy.

Earnings from oil and gas exports make up roughly half of government revenues.
The oil price crash from over $100 per barrel just 18 months ago has been disastrous for Russia. To balance its budget, the country needs to be able to sell oil for $82 per barrel.

"The latest slide in oil prices has obviously darkened the outlook for Russia's economy," said Neil Shearing, chief emerging markets economist at Capital Economics.

Still, some Russian executives believe there could be an upside to the collapsing currency.
"The current situation is challenging, but the significant depreciation of the ruble made our national production more competitive," Alexey Mordashov, chief executive of Russian mining company Severstal, told CNN at the World Economic Forum in Davos. "I hope that Russia is reaching some kind of new equilibrium."

Ordinary Russians are paying the price. New lows for the ruble could put more pressure on Russian prices. Inflation reached 12.5% in 2015 while real wages kept dropping, leaving many people much worse off.

Official statistics show that over 20 million Russians, roughly 14% of the population, are now living in poverty. That compares with 16 million in 2014.


CNNMoney (DAVOS, Switzerland)
First published January 20, 2016: 2:02 PM ET


http://money.cnn.com/2016/01/20/investing/russia-ruble-record-low/

rumple_stilskin
21-01-2016, 08:49
As usual with CNN or other western media, a bit biased.

They say inflation is 12.5%, but do ordinary Russians buy goods that have increased in price?

The low Rouble price means imported goods are more expensive, but are "ordinary Russians" are buying imported goods?

Armoured
21-01-2016, 09:59
As usual with CNN or other western media, a bit biased.

They say inflation is 12.5%, but do ordinary Russians buy goods that have increased in price?

Wait - now it's considered biased to quote official Russian statistics?

In the meantime, I'm at a loss to find any significant groups of goods that have not increased in price over the year - according to official data.

Anyway, well-run statistics agencies worldwide make adjustments for inflation to account for changes in purchase patterns - the 'basket' no longer includes purchasing ice for the icebox (and should also correct for how shifting from imported to domestic). So at any rate, Rosstat's figures either already include what you're referring to, or it is not a well-run agency and you shouldn't trust the government. You can't have it both ways.

Suuryaa
21-01-2016, 11:18
As usual with CNN or other western media, a bit biased.

They say inflation is 12.5%, but do ordinary Russians buy goods that have increased in price?

The low Rouble price means imported goods are more expensive, but are "ordinary Russians" are buying imported goods?

Almost everything has increased in price, including domestically produced things.

Nobbynumbnuts
21-01-2016, 11:22
Almost everything has increased in price, including domestically produced things.

Not according to Wally...:winking:

Russian Lad
21-01-2016, 11:51
Euro 92.47. Seven more rubles to go to reach the target.

Judge
21-01-2016, 12:31
Euro 92.47. Seven more rubles to go to reach the target.

Is today Black Thursday?:dont-tell-anyone:

rumple_stilskin
21-01-2016, 12:31
Wait - now it's considered biased to quote official Russian statistics?

In the meantime, I'm at a loss to find any significant groups of goods that have not increased in price over the year - according to official data.

Anyway, well-run statistics agencies worldwide make adjustments for inflation to account for changes in purchase patterns - the 'basket' no longer includes purchasing ice for the icebox (and should also correct for how shifting from imported to domestic). So at any rate, Rosstat's figures either already include what you're referring to, or it is not a well-run agency and you shouldn't trust the government. You can't have it both ways.

But is it 12.5% inflation for "ordinary Russians".
Has rent, electricity, gas, metro tickets....
I think basic food has, but this is only a percentage of the basket.

And secondly, they can be biased for simply reporting the bad news but never the good.(deliberately)

Russian Lad
21-01-2016, 13:08
Is today Black Thursday?

You haven't marked the whole calendar for 2016 in black yet like I suggested? You better do. :party: Or you find it perfectly normal that the rate changed by 5 (five) rubles within two hours today? That's huge volatility, if you ask me. Guess the euro will hit 100 pretty soon.


And secondly, they can be biased for simply reporting the bad news but never the good.(deliberately)

What is the good news? You are welcome to report, old sport.

Armoured
21-01-2016, 13:33
But is it 12.5% inflation for "ordinary Russians".
Has rent, electricity, gas, metro tickets....
I think basic food has, but this is only a percentage of the basket.

In short, yes. Check Rosstat. They're not idiots, although you seem to think they are.


And secondly, they can be biased for simply reporting the bad news but never the good.(deliberately)

Sure. But likewise, your questions (uninformed) about basic facts and accusations of bias (based on things you don't know) could just as easily be indications of your own bias.

Frankly there are a few things in that article that I think are wrong - like inflation was 12.9% [bias _for_ Russia?], and the claim that the budget needs $80/barrel to balance. To me, that points to a rushed journalist doing a mediocre job. But there's no obvious indication of bias - virtually everything in that article is in Russian press,too.

Russian Lad
21-01-2016, 13:34
Guess whom I met today at my favorite gargage container? I have filmed it, see below.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMM-YJp2-As

Uncle Wally
21-01-2016, 14:20
Guess whom I met today at my favorite gargage container? I have filmed it, see below.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMM-YJp2-As



You like to waste digital space with your stupid jokes huh?


Seems to me that this is not just a Russian problem and originates in the west.

Finnish are crying, Greeks having mass protest, Canadians killing themselves is sky rocketing and so are the food prices. Four heads of cauliflower cost more than a barrel of oil in Canada! Their currency is dropping quickly and depend on imports for most foods.

Fantastika
21-01-2016, 15:03
As usual with CNN or other western media, a bit biased.

A "bit" biased? Only a "bit"? Not perpetually, not overwhelmingly? Absotively, Posilutely? Not narrow minded, opinionated, warped, logic twisted into a pretzel?

Oh, wait, you're being sarcastic! :) I get the irony. When you say "a bit" you mean "obviously" or "totally" or "to the Nth degree." :)

Fantastika
21-01-2016, 15:08
Guess whom I met today at my favorite (garbage) container? I have filmed it, see below.


Hey don't knock it if you haven't tried it. Dumpster diving can yield antiques and other cool stuff. :)

Nobbynumbnuts
23-01-2016, 13:59
Interesting article in the Telegraph..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/davos/12115319/Monstrous-Russian-authorities-driving-companies-out-of-business.html

Davos: 'Monstrous' Russian authorities driving companies out of business
Alexei Kudrin, Russia's former finance minister, says authorities there are strangling companies as deputy prime minister Yury Trutnev admits country must reform to haul itself out of crisis

Russia must stop deploying "monstrous methods" to terrorise the country's companies and drive them out of business, its former finance minister has warned.
Alexei Kudrin, who served as finance minister for more than a decade, said the tactics used by authorities against the business community were harming the already beleaguered economy.
Mr Kudrin, who is widely tipped to rejoin the government, said most of the 400,000 criminal cases opened against Russian-based companies in 2014 had proven "futile".

"It goes to show how inefficient the monstrous methods that are used by law enforcement against business are," he told an audience at the World Economic Forum (WEF) in Davos, Switzerland.
Speaking on the same panel, Yury Trutnev, the deputy prime minister, admitted that Russia would have to overhaul its budget and implement deep structural reforms in order to drag itself out of crisis.
Mr Trutnev agreed that supporting businesses and investment was the government's top priority.

"Given the situation, our budget needs to be regrouped significantly," he said. "We need to focus predominantly on investment areas to support businesses and the government is discussing these factors.
"We need to calculate how much each rouble brings in terms of return and investments for our economy. If we redistribute our budget based on this analysis I hope the population will understand us and within two to three years we can build a foundation for Russia's new economy.

The drop in oil prices to $30 a barrel has put Russia and its currency under severe pressure, with the turmoil forcing its central bank governor to pull out of this year's WEF.
Mr Kudrin described the recent falls as a "cold shower" for policymakers, and warned that Russia was yet to feel the worst of the crisis. "No-one could have imagined that oil prices would fall so badly. This reshaped our reality and the peak of this crisis is still ahead of us," he said.
"What concerns me is that investments will fall, and this is the foundation for the future ... The real income of the nation will fall, the standard of living will fall, which is a very painful thing for the population. It reduces demand."
Speaking at a breakfast earlier this week, Mr Kudrin said oil prices could fall to as low as $16, but that these low prices "wouldn't last long".
Mr Kudrin said he was confident that growth would return to positive territory in Russia in a couple of years, and that the country would eventually be allowed back into the G8 club of rich economies.
Russia was suspended from the club following its annexation of Crimea in Ukraine, but John Kerry, US Secretary of State, told the WEF on Friday that damaging sanctions against Russia could be removed within "months" if it cooperates.
However, Mr Trutnev insisted that Russia did not depend on Westerns ties to thrive.
He said Russian officials had held meetings with Chinese, Japanese, Korean and Indian businesses to drum up investment, which would move the country into a "new competitive space" in the Far East."I donít see any other way for us, frankly."However, he said that by the time businesses had been cleared of wrongdoing, many were "partially or fully lost".

My question is, why has it taken so long Russian for a finance minister to come to these conclusions?

Russian Lad
23-01-2016, 14:12
What I found interesting last week was Nabiulina's claim that the ruble-oil prices dependence is not there anymore, while the ruble rate followed the oil prices like a dog on a leash every single day of the week.:smug: Frankly, I think at this point they don't know what to do at all, they are so utterly helpless that they cannot even lie in a credible manner anymore. While the snowball keeps rolling down a steep hill and keeps getting bigger and bigger. As to Kudrin, he is on the sidelines of the developments, and if he steps in to hold any meaningful post in the current government, he will surely be made a scapegoat for the imminent failure. Even Kudrin cannot change anything at this point. The car has lost its breaks and is out of control.

Nobbynumbnuts
23-01-2016, 14:28
What I found interesting last week was Nabiulina's claim that the ruble-oil prices dependence is not there anymore, while the ruble rate followed the oil prices like a dog on a leash every single day of the week.:smug: Frankly, I think at this point they don't know what to do at all, they are so utterly helpless that they cannot even lie in a credible manner anymore. While the snowball keeps rolling down a steep hill and keeps getting bigger and bigger.

I guess they are waiting for the turnaround in the oil price that everyone is talking about and a recovery in the ruble from it's present lows. Oil has been forecasted to fall anywhere from $16 to $20 a barrel. I agree with many analysts that the eventual lows reached by oil and the ruble will probably be short lived. Prices usually over shoot on the way down as they do on the way up. Oil and the ruble will probably rise and then settle at albeit very low levels still.
Going to be difficult for the Russian authorities to figure out what to do but more importantly when to implement any actions until some stability has return to the markets

Russian Lad
23-01-2016, 14:35
I agree with many analysts that the eventual lows reached by oil and the ruble will probably be short lived.

The new lows are for years to come I think - if you look at previous cycles, they lasted for like a decade+ each. Low-high-low ones. Besides, there are Iran and the US with their oil. Add the possibility of an economic downturn in China and a possible crisis in the US similar to the one in 2008 and the picture is more than just gloomy for the wobbling towers.:)

FatAndy
23-01-2016, 14:37
http://www.rbc.ru/society/23/01/2016/56a35bfa9a794709b8f119e0 - V. Novgorod, hotel's maid have found forgotten cash (dirty green papers, oiros and rubles, totally for ~1M rub) under a mattress. RL, your friends were searching for rotten wings and potato peels in qtys? ;)

Nobbynumbnuts
23-01-2016, 14:49
The new lows are for years to come I think - if you look at previous cycles, they lasted for like a decade+ each. Low-high-low ones. Besides, there are Iran and the US with their oil. Add the possibility of an economic downturn in China and a possible crisis in the US similar to the one in 2008 and the picture is more than just gloomy for the wobbling towers.:)

My point is that markets always over react to bad news, just as they do to good news. Take a look at any chart for oil, ruble or stock market for that matter. You'll see that in times of a heavy sell off (or buying) the market over reacts. The bottom is clearly defined (in retrospect) by a final spike down and spike back up. That's not to say the price won't finally settle at a level that is still considered to be very low. Like oil-$40 and $-70RUB for example. Not making any predictions, i have no idea which direction markets will take, just quoting the well know mechanics of
markets.

Suuryaa
23-01-2016, 17:46
Interesting article in the Telegraph..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/davos/12115319/Monstrous-Russian-authorities-driving-companies-out-of-business.html

Alexei Kudrin, who served as finance minister for more than a decade

My question is, why has it taken so long Russian for a finance minister to come to these conclusions?

And my question is, why didn't Kudrin take action to diversify the Russian economy during his decade in office? There were lots of time and high oil prices.

Carl
23-01-2016, 18:44
What I found interesting last week was Nabiulina's claim that the ruble-oil prices dependence is not there anymore, while the ruble rate followed the oil prices like a dog on a leash every single day of the week.:smug: Frankly, I think at this point they don't know what to do at all, they are so utterly helpless that they cannot even lie in a credible manner anymore. While the snowball keeps rolling down a steep hill and keeps getting bigger and bigger. As to Kudrin, he is on the sidelines of the developments, and if he steps in to hold any meaningful post in the current government, he will surely be made a scapegoat for the imminent failure. Even Kudrin cannot change anything at this point. The car has lost its breaks and is out of control.

Lad, you shouldn't scream 'Fire!' in a crowded theater (even if it is on fire(?).. Willy, Judge and Andy have consistently been telling us all is good. The Rondina (and her economy) are on the right trajectory.
Oh ye of little faith...

Russian Lad
23-01-2016, 18:48
And my question is, why didn't Kudrin take action to diversify the Russian economy during his decade in office? There were lots of time and high oil prices.

Was he allowed to? Everything has been decided by one man here in Russia for the last 16 years, and his name is not Kudrin.


Lad, you shouldn't scream 'Fire!' in a crowded theater (even if it is on fire(?).. Willy, Judge and Andy have consistently been telling us all is good. The Rondina (and her economy) are on the right trajectory.
Oh ye of little faith...

Well, I believe all is good too, - excellent and surpassing my wildest and wettest dreams, in fact. For my own reasons.:)

Nobbynumbnuts
23-01-2016, 20:41
And my question is, why didn't Kudrin take action to diversify the Russian economy during his decade in office? There were lots of time and high oil prices.

Putin would ultimately make such a decision but you have to wonder why when everybody and his dog was telling them it should be done..

Uncle Wally
23-01-2016, 20:56
And my question is, why didn't Kudrin take action to diversify the Russian economy during his decade in office? There were lots of time and high oil prices.


He did the best he could.

Suuryaa
23-01-2016, 22:23
Was he allowed to? Everything has been decided by one man here in Russia for the last 16 years, and his name is not Kudrin.

I don't buy this. One can tell lots of stories, but what really matters is personal responsibility. And I don't agree to believe that Putin is a kind of an all-powerful magician.

Suuryaa
23-01-2016, 22:25
He did the best he could.

Then he was quite impotent.

Nobbynumbnuts
23-01-2016, 23:55
I don't buy this. One can tell lots of stories, but what really matters is personal responsibility. And I don't agree to believe that Putin is a kind of an all-powerful magician.

It's pretty much impossible to think that any leader anywhere in the world would allow the country's economy to be diversified away from it's major income source without giving the go ahead. Let alone an autocrat like Putin..

Russian Lad
24-01-2016, 00:29
I don't buy this. One can tell lots of stories, but what really matters is personal responsibility. And I don't agree to believe that Putin is a kind of an all-powerful magician.

No, he is not a magician, who told you he is? So, let's get is straight, you demand personal responsibility for Kudrin who hasn't been in power for years now and who has never been the president but you seem to be reluctant to hold Putin accountable for the current economic situation because he is not "a kind of an all-powerful magician"? This is a very twisted logic, or I would say a complete lack of it. In my book, the person who has superior power bears superior responsibility. An acting president is far more superior to a minister, especially to a former minister. Are we on the same page now?:) Also, let me remind you that Kudrin was fired specifically because he was against certain economic measures that paved the way to quite many of the current economic problems. If you want to assign scapegoats and strelochniki, I would advise to look in the direction of Nabiulina and Gref, at least it would make a modicum of sense (though still not a lot of it). With trying to assign Kudrin as a scapegoat you are not making any sense at all. You may just as well blame Obama or even Pushkin for everything.

Suuryaa
24-01-2016, 11:46
you seem to be reluctant to hold Putin accountable for the current economic situation because he is not "a kind of an all-powerful magician"? This is a very twisted logic, or I would say a complete lack of it.

If you want to assign scapegoats and strelochniki

With trying to assign Kudrin as a scapegoat you are not making any sense at all. You may just as well blame Obama or even Pushkin for everything.

Do you have even a modicum of politeness? You cannot write a single reply without implying that your interlocutor is an idiot. And stop putting words into my mouth. There's not a single comment from me where I hold Kudrin more accountable than Putin. I have not mentioned that topic at all. And I have never said or written the things you wrote about me. By magician I meant that he does not control everything in Russia, every breath of the wind, every action of everybody. People, including Kudrin, can take initiative and act. Before posting something, think. I don't want to waste time reading comments of somebody who's unwilling to consider others' ideas as they are and who assumes from the beginning that his interlocutor is mentally weak.

FatAndy
24-01-2016, 12:26
:emote_popcorn:


Willy, Judge and Andy have consistently been telling us all is good. The Rondina (and her economy) are on the right trajectory.
Finally, you've started to understand. Good. ;)

Russian Lad
24-01-2016, 12:52
There's not a single comment from me where I hold Kudrin more accountable than Putin.


So, you want to hold them both accountable? If so, it is fine with me, on a larger scale of things, but you have been hiding this intention of yours very well, because I haven't seen it in your previous posts, I have seen the talk about Kudrin's personal responsibility and about Putin "not being a magician". I find it sort of hard with Kudrin though because he hasn't been in power for years. Personally, I don't find it fair to blame him for something since he was blatantly fired and not allowed to reform anything. I mean, view the country as a big corporation - its boss fires a manager some years ago, the corporation begins suffering terrible losses, someone like you comes up with the brilliant idea: "Listen, people, remember this guy we fired a few years back? I think we sould hold him accountable for what is going on with us today!" Does it make sense?

Suuryaa
24-01-2016, 12:59
It's pretty much impossible to think that any leader anywhere in the world would allow the country's economy to be diversified away from it's major income source without giving the go ahead. Let alone an autocrat like Putin..

I did not understand your post, Nobby. Why not diversify? It's only logical, anyone understands that it's risky to rely only on one source of income.

Russian Lad
24-01-2016, 13:22
Why not diversify?

You cannot make a Lada beat a Mercedes. In other words, too many structural changes are needed for a proper diversification. Just having a desire is not enough, no matter how strong this desire is. A 100 y.o. man may desire a young and nubile girl with all his heart, soul and body. But does he have the capacity to fulfill his desire? In most cases probably not. Also, see my reply on the previous page.
Speaking about Mercedes, they have made a really nice E cl**** probably I should purchase it to make my trips to garbage containers more comfortable.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCBkTp6uwfY

Nobbynumbnuts
24-01-2016, 17:04
I did not understand your post, Nobby. Why not diversify? It's only logical, anyone understands that it's risky to rely only on one source of income.

Of course diversify, everybody has been saying Russia should push on with this since as long as i can remember. This is nothing new.
The point i'm trying to make is that such a big decision would not be made without Putin's directive..

Uncle Wally
24-01-2016, 21:37
You cannot make a Lada beat a Mercedes. In other words, too many structural changes are needed for a proper diversification. Just having a desire is not enough, no matter how strong this desire is. A 100 y.o. man may desire a young and nubile girl with all his heart, soul and body. But does he have the capacity to fulfill his desire? In most cases probably not. Also, see my reply on the previous page.
Speaking about Mercedes, they have made a really nice E cl**** probably I should purchase it to make my trips to garbage containers more comfortable.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCBkTp6uwfY



Oh yes you can! You can win in any situation no matter what the odds.


One thing that many don't understand is that Putin inherited a country that was close to falling apart. Somehow he held it all together.

Russian Lad
24-01-2016, 22:36
You can win in any situation no matter what the odds.


Right. A lesson in Wally logic.

Fantastika
24-01-2016, 23:42
It seems to me, that, given the wild and crazy swings in ruble's exchange rates last week, that the hedge-fund (big banks, Wally!) and independent speculators are driving the volatility, moreso than underlying economic issues...

Wish I knew how to trade Forex options (if there is such a thing).

Carl
25-01-2016, 00:07
https://tvrain.ru/news/nanotechnology-402305/

Paving the road to Russia's economic future.. Right & correct!!

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 03:49
It seems to me, that, given the wild and crazy swings in ruble's exchange rates last week, that the hedge-fund (big banks, Wally!) and independent speculators are driving the volatility, moreso than underlying economic issues...

The ruble follows the oil price like a dog on a leash, nothing unusual here, given the fact that 50%+ of the Russian economy are based solely on oil revenues. However, I am also expecting serious structural problems, they will be in full swing this year already. So, at a certain point you will see the oil prices rising but the ruble falling. For instance, the real estate market is still overheated, I am expecting at least a 100% slump in prices (i.e. a crash) within a year (it has dropped by 35% during the last two years, so far you may call it a relatively slow decline). Totally new problems will emerge from all this.
To give you a visual idea of the things to come:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdT163r3dUQ

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 06:21
However, I am also expecting serious structural problems, they will be in full swing this year already. So, at a certain point you will see the oil prices rising but the ruble falling. For instance, the real estate market is still overheated, I am expecting at least a 100% slump in prices (i.e. a crash) within a year...


A 100% drop? That means for a few kopeks I could buy blocks and blocks of downtown Moscow real estate! Woooh boy!

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 09:20
A 100% drop? That means for a few kopeks I could buy blocks and blocks of downtown Moscow real estate! Woooh boy!

Well, the cheapest one room apartment cost less than 10K dollars in Saint Pete in 1998. Right now the cheapest one is around 30K dollars. So, there is a room for improvement.:)

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 11:01
For instance, the real estate market is still overheated, I am expecting at least a 100% slump in prices (i.e. a crash) within a year (it has dropped by 35% during the last two years, so far you may call it a relatively slow decline).

Well, the cheapest one room apartment cost less than 10K dollars in Saint Pete in 1998. Right now the cheapest one is around 30K dollars.

???

Sheesh! Make up my mind for me, will you? Are prices getting higher or lower?

FatAndy
25-01-2016, 11:37
Paving the road to Russia's economic future.. Right & correct!!
Better go to censor.net, you'll like the smell even more ;)


The point i'm trying to make is that such a big decision would not be made without Putin's directive..
The Tsar is responsible for everything. Ave Caesar! ģ :D

Suuryaa
25-01-2016, 13:26
So, you want to hold them both accountable?... I mean, view the country as a big corporation - its boss fires a manager some years ago, the corporation begins suffering terrible losses, someone like you comes up with the brilliant idea: "Listen, people, remember this guy we fired a few years back? I think we sould hold him accountable for what is going on with us today!" Does it make sense?

It was a question to learn others' opinions.

As for responsibility, when this topic comes up, I feel that it's me who's most responsible. I'm not a kindergarten child and don't blame bad adults for my problems. If my country is in trouble, I'd rather ask, what was my contribution? What can I do to improve the situation? This sounds more mature than blaming Putin for everything, indeed, it seems some people think he's a magician, nothing in the country can happen without his participation.

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 14:24
Sheesh! Make up my mind for me, will you? Are prices getting higher or lower?

Is it my fault you cannot read plain English?:) They are getting lower in comparison with 2013-2014, but they are still much higher, of course, if we compare them with 1998 prices, after the crisis back then. What is not clear, comrade?:) Also, there are many owners who want to sell for the old prices, hence a huge dominance of supply over demand. The Russian mentality for the last 16 years has been - real estate is a sure-fire investment, the prices on real estate are always going to grow, blah-blah-blah. The misinformed who believed in this (like 99% of the Russians) are going to pay through their nose for this now if they try to sell.:)


I'm not a kindergarten child and don't blame bad adults for my problems. If my country is in trouble, I'd rather ask, what was my contribution? What can I do to improve the situation? This sounds more mature than blaming Putin for everything, indeed, it seems some people think he's a magician, nothing in the country can happen without his participation.

You have mixed oranges and apples here. As far as I remember, we haven't been discussing our own problems and/or circumstances. On the personal level, of course I agree that every person is ultimately responsible for his well-being, despite the circumstances. It is also true that the circumstances in a country can be made favorable for this or not - by the state-level decision-makers including the president (whom you refer to as "adults"). Denying the important role of policy-makers is an anarchist view of the lay of the land. You are not an anarchist, right? Also, a situation like mine is possible - I am doing increasingly well financially, but it doesn't stop me from seeing the overall economic decline and utterly ineffective, even medieval management practices here in Russia, fully detrimental to the well-being of most citizens. And, unlike you, I do realize that fish always begins rotting from the head, without a single exception. And forget about magicians - think more about rats...

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 14:52
You have mixed oranges and apples here. As far as I remember, we haven't been discussing our own problems and/or circumstances. On the personal level, of course I agree that every person is ultimately responsible for his well-being, despite the circumstances. It is also true that the circumstances in a country can be favorable for this or not. Also, a situation like mine is possible - I am doing increasingly well financially, but it doesn't stop me from seeing the overall economic decline and utterly ineffective, even medieval management practices here in Russia, fully detrimental to the well-being of most citizens. ...


...As for responsibility, when this topic comes up, I feel that it's me who's most responsible. I'm not a kindergarten child and don't blame bad adults for my problems. If my country is in trouble, I'd rather ask, what was my contribution? What can I do to improve the situation? This sounds more mature than blaming Putin for everything, indeed, it seems some people think he's a magician, nothing in the country can happen without his participation.

So, RL, you view yourself as a victim or an effect of your country, what your country is, is out of your control, it's not your problem. Suuryaa takes responsibility and participates in her country.

I would say you are thinking similar to Obama or Merkel, who don't care about their countries or their civilization: "borders, language, culture" as talk-show host Michael Savage says, meaning "no borders, no common language, no common culture," as they decree unlimited immigration of foreign young males of military age who do not assimilate. I know you say you are no "Kvas patriot" but corruption in your government is no excuse to deny inherent obligations to support your native land.

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 14:57
So, RL, you view yourself as a victim or an effect of your country, what your country is out of your control, it's not your problem. Suuryaa takes responsibility and participates in her country.

I would say you are thinking similar to Obama or Merkel, who don't care about their countries or their civilization: "borders, language, culture" as talk-show host Michael Savage says, meaning "no borders, no common language, no common culture," as they decree unlimited immigration of young males who do not assimilate. I know you say you are no "Kvas patriot" but corruption in your government is no excuse to deny inherent obligations to support your native land.

What you are saying mostly doesn't describe me at all, it is just that it is convenient for you to say that. However, I have one comment - I do make a difference between supporting one's government and supporting one's land. I do believe you make this distinction as well, otherwise the same accusation can be thrown at you - you don't support Obama hence you don't support the US. I haven't gone that far, I do believe it is possible for an American to hate Obama and to love the US, so why do you take the liberty of throwing this lame and immature accusation at me then?:) Throwing stones in a glass house? Refusing to look in the mirror?

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 15:06
Is it my fault you cannot read plain English?:) They are getting lower in comparison with 2013-2014, but they are still much higher, of course, if we compare them with 1998 prices, after the crisis back then. What is not clear, comrade?:) Also, there are many owners who want to sell for the old prices, hence a huge dominance of supply over demand. The Russian mentality for the last 16 years has been - real estate is a sure-fire investment, the prices on real estate are always going to grow, blah-blah-blah. The misinformed who believed in this (like 99% of the Russians) are going to pay through their nose for this now if they try to sell.:)


You really think 99% of your fellow countrymen are idiots? :)

I think you are just trying to say, economic conditions were bad in 1998, they got worse in 2004-8, economic conditions were horrible in the past couple of years, and things are going to descend to really, really horrible in the near future.

Economic tornado alert! Everyone in the bunker! :eek:

I'm curious if the price for flats/houses has gone down or up in the past couple years, but measured in rubles, not dollars. Most people purchasing in Russia are paying in rubles, yes?

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 15:15
What you are saying mostly doesn't describe me at all, it is just that it is convenient for you to say that. However, I have one comment - I do make a difference between supporting one's government and supporting one's land. I do believe you make this distinction as well, otherwise the same accusation can be thrown at you - you don't support Obama hence you don't support the US. I haven't gone that far, I do believe it is possible for an American to hate Obama and to love the US, so why do you take the liberty of throwing this lame and immature accusation at me then?:) Throwing stones in a glass house? Refusing to look in the mirror?

I don't understand your use of the word "convenient."

Supporting a leader who hates his native country (Obama) and supporting a leader who loves his native country (Putin) are two wildly different things.

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 15:20
I don't understand your use of the word "convenient."

Supporting a leader who hates his native country (Obama) and supporting a leader who loves his native country (Putin) are two wildly different things.

Loves and hates are entirely subjective words here in what you say. I think the opposite is true.


I'm curious if the price for flats/houses has gone down or up in the past couple years, but measured in rubles, not dollars. Most people purchasing in Russia are paying in rubles, yes?

Why would I measure it in rubles if I don't keep rubles? It is also falling in rubles I think.


You really think 99% of your fellow countrymen are idiots?

The misinformed.:) 99% was an overstretch on my part though, make it 85%.

Uncle Wally
25-01-2016, 15:29
No home prices have not fallen in rubles but they haven't gone up.


The ruble has though. 77 now.

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 15:30
The misinformed.:) 99% was an overstretch on my part though, make it 85%.

I liked your "100% drop in value" (of housing prices). That meant everything was free!

Fantastika
25-01-2016, 15:33
No home prices have not fallen in rubles but they haven't gone up.
The ruble has though. 77 now.

With ruble losing half its value over the past year, it seems Russian real estate would be attractive investment opportunity, for foreigners.

Alan65
25-01-2016, 15:37
With ruble losing half its value over the past year, it seems Russian real estate would be attractive investment opportunity, for foreigners.

Lets think about this one, Southern Spain, the med in general or Russia:winking:

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 15:41
Lets think about this one, Southern Spain, the med in general or Russia:winking:

The prices there in Spain are in general probably still much cheaper than here in Russia.:)


I liked your "100% drop in value" (of housing prices). That meant everything was free!

I stand corrected, make it 50%. I am sure you understood well what I meant though.


The ruble has though. 77 now.

How about 79.64?:) I know it is like measuring the temperature of a dead horse these days, but let's try to keep up, it is still fun.

Suuryaa
25-01-2016, 18:41
You have mixed oranges and apples here. As far as I remember, we haven't been discussing our own problems and/or circumstances. On the personal level, of course I agree that every person is ultimately responsible for his well-being, despite the circumstances. It is also true that the circumstances in a country can be made favorable for this or not - by the state-level decision-makers including the president (whom you refer to as "adults"). Denying the important role of policy-makers is an anarchist view of the lay of the land. You are not an anarchist, right? Also, a situation like mine is possible - I am doing increasingly well financially, but it doesn't stop me from seeing the overall economic decline and utterly ineffective, even medieval management practices here in Russia, fully detrimental to the well-being of most citizens. And, unlike you, I do realize that fish always begins rotting from the head, without a single exception. And forget about magicians - think more about rats...

Maybe the sentence in bold is where we misunderstand each other. I'll rephrase your sentence: every person is ultimately responsible for his country's well-being. This is what I think. That's what I meant by adult. Not blaming big bosses because you feel you are a nobody, but taking responsibility to make a difference to your country. And circumstances don't appear out of nothing, it's me who's creating them.

Suuryaa
25-01-2016, 18:44
Lets think about this one, Southern Spain, the med in general or Russia:winking:

Well, if they like skiing and skating... :)

Russian Lad
25-01-2016, 19:41
Maybe the sentence in bold is where we misunderstand each other. I'll rephrase your sentence: every person is ultimately responsible for his country's well-being. This is what I think. That's what I meant by adult. Not blaming big bosses because you feel you are a nobody, but taking responsibility to make a difference to your country. And circumstances don't appear out of nothing, it's me who's creating them.


What you are saying is clear-cut anarchism, 100%. Admit that you are an anarchist and it will be easier for us to understand each other. I mean, you seem to dismiss any role of central/governing bodies in our daily life by claiming we cannot/should not blame "big bosses" for anything. Also, thus you are de facto giving them cart-blanche and free them from any accountability whatsoever. Very convenient for them and their associates, very harmful to the rest of us. The truth is always somewhere in the middle, I suggested this middle ground but you didn't like it, it seems. Tant pis, because your ideas are not sustainable, history has proven it many times here in Russia. You are treading on a very thin ice and I hear it cracking already, rather loudly.


Anarchism is a political philosophy that advocates self-governed societies with voluntary institutions. These are often described as stateless societies, but several authors have defined them more specifically as institutions based on non-hierarchical free associations. Anarchism holds the state to be undesirable, unnecessary.