PDA

View Full Version : Fur coats??



Miracle77777
10-02-2008, 01:05
Are you against wearing and producing fur things??
Or you feel neutral to this??
Or maybe, you think, that nothing could compare with those gorgeous mink's and ermine's coats and hats ??
There are a lot of Campagnies against unreasonable murdering of animals in General....and nowadays, for example in Russia, fur-production line started minimize their activity.....
Please, vote and leave your opinion about topic....

Thanks in advance>>>

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 01:29
We have animals and we breed and catch them (some of them) for the purpose of providing food and clothes - we always have and we always will.

Do I support mis-teatment of animals - no!
Do I support unneccesary pain for animals - no!
Do I like chicken batteries - no!

Do I eat meat and buy my wife fur coats - yes (I don't wear them as I get too hot - the fur coats that is).

Do I get upset when live animals are sent overseas to foreign countries to be eaten by other people as fresh meat - no!

Do I get upset when someone says that 'poor little animals' are being slaughtered to give me meat - no!

I am a carnivore!

:ak: :reindeer::reindeer::reindeer::reindeer::reindeer:

:10518:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 01:37
Fur sold in Russia is mostly made of animals caught in Canada and some other countries, because in Russia there not enough of them for all this demand.

I'm not only against fur in fashion, I think it's a conscious choice of an individual. ANd don;t compare this with food. The purpose and process of killing animals (as well as type of animals) are completely different.


But I have another question. The leather jackets? Are the animals specially killed for this, or is the leather made of the skin of the animals that were anyway slaughtered for food?! Thanks

Miracle77777
10-02-2008, 01:51
:5387:
My guess - they were specially killed.....
More than that - they were killed by special way, for not "spolied" a skin's quality....:yikes:
Personally - I do not like leather's things......Compare to this - fur is more preferable......

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 02:02
What sort of leather are you talking about?

It comes from sheep, cows, deer, and pretty much all the animals that are killed for food. Skins are a by-product from the food/meat industry and from that by-product comes leather.

However, there are lots of other leathers where the skin is the primary product and the meat is the by-product: crocodile, fish, turtle, kangaroo, emu, stingray, snake, eel etc etc. Just the same as furs.

And I don't agree that you can separate between food and furs so easily - eating meat is a lifestyle choice, just as wearing furs is and for plenty of fur users, it is not just a lifestyle choice, but the only realistic way that they can stay warm and alive. The same for leather - it is a lifestyle choice.

People could choose to live their life wearing synthetic clothes and shoes and be forever uncomfortable and unnatural and they could choose to not eat meat (and in my view be also unhappy), or they can choose to allow animals to be killed to produce nice shoes and handbags for them, along with a nice fillet steak.

Emus are killed for meat, skin, oil, feathers eggs;
Snakes are killed for skin (not much for meat);
Kanagaroos are killed for meat (dog food, unless you are a Bulgarian sausage maker), skin, fur;
Fish are killed for skin, food;
Eels are killed for skin, food;
Stingrays are killed for skin, food;
Beavers are killed for fur, meat;

The three areas of fur, leather and food are all very intertwined.

12791

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 02:05
One for the animals

12792

AndreyS
10-02-2008, 02:07
One for the animals

12792

Stunning! Thank you!

Miracle77777
10-02-2008, 02:19
Like a pic with Turtle and Croc....
:mooooh:
Poor creatures!! It seems they will be popular in Show-business for a long time...:( :)

jumatre
10-02-2008, 04:36
fur is something for bitches (males and females) who do not feel confident in their own skin...

SilverBullet
10-02-2008, 05:13
I am against fur coats in general since they are no longer needed. There are so many other alternative synthetic warm jackets these days. In America they are out of fashion because of animal activists, except in Alaska with long fur trade traditions. The long traditions exist for Russia too. With so many old furs in the country I think it is ok for people to wear them and it feels natural in Russia because of this. I guess my feelings about this is mixed. It looks ok in Moscow, St Pete and Novosibirsk but not in New York. Don't wear it for fashion but use fur to stay warm.

Albertina
10-02-2008, 10:34
Then, I am okay with leather whoch is a by-product of food process...
And I'm okay with eating meat, which is necessary to live, while fur is definitely not necessary for survival in the metropolitan areas. In fact, feng shui is against fur :p:ninja:
Can't stand those bitches in fur :ninja:

Also, I stopped buying and using the cosmetic products by companies that test on animals - P&G and Unilever, L'Oreal are among the worst.
Surprisingly, Clarins, Clinique do not test on animals! Hooray!

Albertina
10-02-2008, 10:37
We have animals and we breed and catch them (some of them) for the purpose of providing food and clothes - we always have and we always will.

Do I support mis-teatment of animals - no!
Do I support unneccesary pain for animals - no!
Do I like chicken batteries - no!

Do I eat meat and buy my wife fur coats - yes (I don't wear them as I get too hot - the fur coats that is).

Do I get upset when live animals are sent overseas to foreign countries to be eaten by other people as fresh meat - no!

Do I get upset when someone says that 'poor little animals' are being slaughtered to give me meat - no!

I am a carnivore!

:ak: :reindeer::reindeer::reindeer::reindeer::reindeer:

:10518:

hehe - sounds like you a have a deep inner conflict :10600:, as well as dual morality...:10189::10518: do you solve this by drinking?! :drink::sunny:

Natkin
10-02-2008, 11:27
Can't stand those bitches in fur :ninja:



So, every woman in fur coat is a bitch??? Why?:9437:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 11:32
So, every woman in fur coat is a bitch??? Why?:9437:

Because she didn't take time to educate herself on the process of how this fur was produced, because she blindly follows the vanity trend.
Most importantly, bitch is not a bad word in this context, it's how you call females in the animal kingdom adn that's how she looks in fur :reindeer:

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 11:37
Not really a conflict, just reality. Born in the country, have cut the throat of live sheep to skin and gut them (to eat them) and am very aware of the need for the live animal trade (especially sheep in Australia) to keep many farmers living on their farm.

Don't agree with being cruel to animals for the sake of being cruel - everybody loves their dog :SwoonLoveSmiley: (Cats - well they are best cut into quarters and used for fresh crayfish [lobster for the uneducated] bait]. :12115:

Do not like radical animal rights activists - would generally be happy to cut their throat and skin and gut them as well. They travel the world saving animals, but would walk past a starving child 10 feet away ... :question:

And any US animal rights activist who comes to Australia to tell me that we are being cruel when we cull Kangaroos as they are in plague proportions and sending farmers broke, who have families to feed and mortgages to meet - well, lets just say that they should go out into the bush where they cull these kangaroos and they can be culled as well! :ak: :ak: :10301: :10301:

If you think Guest has an attitude issue with the Brits "colonising Russia", you should see how much Australians hate the yanks telling us what animals we are allowed to kill in Australia! :verymad: :verymad:
:ninja: :ninja: :ninja:

But this is an emotional issue for most, and people's emotions don't work on logic or even common sense sometimes, so it is not the sort of thing where you can tell anybody that they are wrong, so we all have to live with other people's views and accept them ....

... and if they really annoy you, you can always use them for leather .... :eek: :devilish:

Hannibal the cannibal ...
:10518:

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 11:40
Because she didn't take time to educate herself on the process of how this fur was produced, because she blindly follows the vanity trend.
Most importantly, bitch is not a bad word in this context, it's how you call females in the animal kingdom adn that's how she looks in fur :reindeer:

Then .....

....me lika da bitch ... grrrr ....

:SwoonLoveSmiley: :SwoonLoveSmiley:
:11109:
:ak: :10301::10301:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 11:40
PETA TV:Trent Reznor - China Dog and Cat Fur Farm Investigation (http://www.petatv.com/tvpopup/video.asp?video=trent_fur&Player=wm)

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA): The animal rights organization (http://www.peta.org/)

Albertina
10-02-2008, 11:44
There was also slavery in America and lots of people liked it.
There was also KKK and lots of people liked it.
Fortunately, the movement for animal rights is on the way. In most developed countries fur is already unacceptable, and it will reach Russia. No question about that.

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 12:00
There was also slavery in America and lots of people liked it.
There was also KKK and lots of people liked it.
Fortunately, the movement for animal rights is on the way. In most developed countries fur is already unacceptable, and it will reach Russia. No question about that.


But I don't think we can place wearing fur and leather in the same category as Slavery and Bigotry and Racial genocide ...

People could argue that by referring to slavery and the KKK along with saving animals, you are trivialising the plight of the African American or worse, placing them in the same arena as animal rights ...

Albertina .... you naughty girl :9451::9451::9451:
(But we know you didn't mean it that way)

In relation to the fur trade though, in most developed countries (unfortunately) the extremely vocal minority are allowed to have lots of say and break the law and impose their minority view upon the general public ... so we don't really know how many people are horrified and disgusted that people wear fur ...
:bash::bash:


... as for Russia, well at least for a while, the vocal minority don't really get much of a say, so furs are here to stay for as long as we keep Sovereign Democracy as the rule of law!

:iagree:

Plus, people here can resist the tide of moral conscience for animals ... they don't need to succumb to the views of the democratised animal liberationists ...
:10241: :11513:

:10518:

Natkin
10-02-2008, 12:08
Wearing fur coats in Russia has nothing to do with a fashion, it is a nesessity.
I am fine without it this year, but when we hit -15, I put it on.

Go to Siberia, where average winter temp is -25 or more, and tell them all your Protect the animals staff.

Btw, if you really are up to protecting animals, forget about meat and leather.

vox16
10-02-2008, 12:19
I am against fur coats in general since they are no longer needed. There are so many other alternative synthetic warm jackets these days. In America they are out of fashion because of animal activists

I believe that sometime a new trend will appear - 'green' or whatever called fur, made of poor creatures died of age/disease. Of course such coats must be 5-10 times more expensive, and may be not so elegant, but it worths it - to let all grinpiss activists stfu.

vox16
10-02-2008, 12:34
I am only against furs of herbivorous animals like beavers - they did not deserve it. However, carnivorous weasels and stuff like have been vehemently devourin other poor creatures for millions years, and now their victims' souls beg for revenge. The fact that mink or sable can't understand its prey sufferings does not make it less detestable.
Insectivorous animals are somwhere between - as it is widely acceptable that insects have no soul and can't suffer.

vox16
10-02-2008, 13:04
People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA): The animal rights organization (http://www.peta.org/)
peta.... just google for 'PETA Killed 97 Percent Animals'... ethically killed, for sure. For $30 m.

TGP
10-02-2008, 21:15
fur is something for bitches (males and females) who do not feel confident in their own skin...

Meet one of these bitches - that's me.

I don't wear a fur coat all the time, but even without it I feel confident enough not to care about what they think of my garments, fur or not fur. :wavey:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 21:18
I'm pleasantly surprised though that over 50% said they are absolutely against. I thought it would be a minority.

TGP, hope you won't travel in your coat to the US or Europe :farout: Worried about your safety, Cheney might take you for an animal and shoot :farout::reindeer:

TGP
10-02-2008, 21:22
And I'm okay with eating meat, which is necessary to live, while fur is definitely not necessary for survival in the metropolitan areas. In fact, feng shui is against fur :p:ninja:
Can't stand those bitches in fur :ninja:


Why meat is necessary to live? Vegetarians live long life, too.

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 21:24
I'm pleasantly surprised though that over 50% said they are absolutely against. I thought it would be a minority.

TGP, hope you won't travel in your coat to the US or Europe :farout: Worried about your safety, Cheney might take you for an animal and shoot :farout::reindeer:

Looking at the survey now it is only just on 50% against ... the tide is turning against you ... :jester:

Come on Russians and fur lovers all, get off your collective leather hides and vote for fur ...

:cheerleader::cheerleader::cheerleader:
:cheerleader::cheerleader::cheerleader:
:10806::10806::10806::10806:

TGP
10-02-2008, 21:30
Looking at the survey now it is only just on 50% against ... the tide is turning against you ... :jester:

Come on Russians and fur lovers all, get off your collective leather hides and vote for fur ...

:cheerleader::cheerleader::cheerleader:
:10806::10806::10806::10806:

I voted for "neutral". If, supposedly, there will be no fur coats at all, I will survive the fact, but while there is a special industry of it, I wear my fur caot when it is cold and windy. The best thing in such weather.

Besides, synthetics is synthetics, be it clothes, or food or whatever... natural is always valued more than man-made ;)

Miracle77777
10-02-2008, 21:49
:reindeer:
Wow....such a lively discussion.....
Actually I was not aware that a problem is so deep....:mooooh: :mooooh:

Yes...you right, Rus.... - if animals were murdered for meat - it is "blessing" to use their skin, fur or whatever.....
But, you do know of course, that for high industry - they require a special specimens...the best products....So I doubted, they use leftovers......
Much more surely - they are killing animals in a special cautios way...and very often leave meat ....

I agree with Natkin....To wear fur in a winters...especially Russian's ones is really necessarily thing.....But, as Vox said - there is always an alternative between rare precious mink 's fur and fur, which is not from herbivorous animals......

Here you could choose - whether you are bitch in manto...or just nice girl who is cold :evilgrin:

Miracle77777
10-02-2008, 21:55
As for activists against animals - mostly they do it for political reasons.....or just for attract world's attention....
A percent of Truthful defenders is really small on my opinion......
Unfortunately...
And for sure - our world would be much more better, if we will start to think about defencing our Old peoples....homeless childrens....peoples with hard diseases.....and donate sources to their fonds.....
Finally - who cares about one more fur scarf when someone need organs for donations??
:10189:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 22:26
Geez, I would have expected more pro-animal rights messages, but I guess they are all scared by such aggressive campaign for the slaughtering.
EVERYTHING you said in support of fur is simply excuses for your vanity and lack of will to see the real picture (it's not for political reasons, and I'm not a fan of anything - I just educate myself and consciously make decisions, it's not comparable with meat for food, because for now it's not realistic to live without some quantity of meat, while fur is a luxury - that's all; lastly, the only place it's so widely and wildly fashionable is Russia, you won't be comfortable in it in other countries; and no I'm not preaching to you, so no need to become personal, I'm just expressing my point of view and being puzzled by yours :eh:)

I don't want to look like a bear or a fox either! :sunny:

Good night!

PS: In fact I think that you are merely rationalizing your multi-thousand rubles investment in fur coats... Because you need to believe that what you've done was moral and smart :-) And the winters are so mild that they don't require for fur coats. Cheers again.

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 22:29
I don't want to look like a bear or a fox either! :sunny:

Good night!

But we all still think that you look foxy Albertina - furry or not ....

:queen:

:cheerleader::cheerleader:

:10518:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 22:34
But we all still think that you look foxy Albertina - furry or not ....

:queen:

:cheerleader::cheerleader:

:10518:

Just admit it - paying 3-5000+ bucks for a dead animal was not smart. IT's too warm the second year in a row :applause::evilgrin:
Overcoming denial is the first step in healing!

Albertina
10-02-2008, 22:39
QBRHLIH-CUM

Albertina
10-02-2008, 22:44
AiMubYwQTR0&NR=1

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 22:47
Just admit it - paying 3-5000+ bucks for a dead animal was not smart. IT's too warm the second year in a row :applause::evilgrin:
Overcoming denial is the first step in healing!

Possibly true, paying €3500 for a Mink was not the smartest investment I ever made - depreciating value the second I paid, but I used my credit card and got about 3000 miles added to my frequent flyer program....
:11629:

but...

the intent of the investment was to make a fur loving Russian wife happy, the dead animal was really just a by-product of my insane need to keep a pathologically insane Russian female satisfied that she has had an animal killed for her coat and that once she has one or two of them, she will not cut my throat while I sleep at night and move on to find a better hunter and gatherer to go forth and have animals murdered and slaughtered to keep her warm and cuddly ...
:ninja::eek:

.. so really I was only buying it to stay alive and enjoy my retirement (when I get there) ...

... and really, when you think about it, it was just like Adam and Eve and original sin ....

.... SHE MADE ME DO IT!

so I am an innocent victim (and so is the dead animal) of a manipulative and cruel female human race ....

:10168::5387:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 22:50
Peace.
It's bed time. Let's all wish each other sweet dreams.
And let's pray for better next lives to all the millions of creatures who are being slauthered this very moment so we could keep our asses warm.

Rustralian
10-02-2008, 22:52
I want to come back as a crockroach ... nothing seems to kill them and they must get to see lots of interesting things ...

:trampoline::trampoline::trampoline:

Good night!

:bedtime:

Albertina
10-02-2008, 23:30
I want to come back as a crockroach ... nothing seems to kill them and they must get to see lots of interesting things ...

:trampoline::trampoline::trampoline:

Good night!

:bedtime:

it surely is better to come back ac cockroach, than a mink. Good choice!
:elf:

Clean32
11-02-2008, 00:16
Ohhh this is a hot topic for me. I have worked as a culler in aussie (Queensland) and in the south island of New Zealand. I have tabbed across thousands of square miles of native bush and farm land in both countries, I have first hand seen the devastation of over population of some pests I have all so seen the suffering and sicking sites of inbreed populations. I have culled roos, brumbies horse’s goats wallabies possums deer and dogs, not forgetting as many cats stoats ferrets as I could. I have been flown around both countries to track and kill Boer dogs (a lone dog that kills sheep for fun, up to a 100 sheep a night) and yet hat has been call inhuman, I say what about he sheep.

In my lifetime I have seen the possum fur trade die because some fat assed do gooders decided it wasn’t nice, then I saw trapping of possums made illegal. Now I see poison (245T and cyanide) dropped or placed in native bush. (go for a walk in the forest and it full of cyanide bates? Don’t take your kids) I have seen great swaths of bush striped of any thing green due to over population.
I have also seen thousands of tones of land slides, I have seen small rivers and streams blocked by land slides with the resulting flooding, and then the damage down stream when this unnatural dam broke, all the result of deer and goats damaging the fragile soil. Yet many say it is unhuman that its not nice it incorrect. Well I say grow up.

Leather mainly comes from cows or pigs

TGP
11-02-2008, 00:55
Just admit it - paying 3-5000+ bucks for a dead animal was not smart. IT's too warm the second year in a row :applause::evilgrin:
Overcoming denial is the first step in healing!


Maybe 3-5000+ bucks for someone is like 3-5 bucks for you... ;)

pjw
11-02-2008, 04:26
YouTube - Fur Coats...Animal Disaster (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBRHLIH-CUM)
Hi Albertina,
I agree with you completely on this. The video is sad and shocking. Makes me feel really sick coz this industry has nothing to do with beauty or glamour. We must change this!

rosieredwood
11-02-2008, 04:51
Technology dictates that we do not need fur, in any guise.

Penelope
11-02-2008, 13:16
People Eating Tasty Animals :cheerleader:

Albertina
11-02-2008, 20:18
Maybe 3-5000+ bucks for someone is like 3-5 bucks for you... ;)

I know some millionnaires and they care A LOT about every 1000 bucks.

Plus, this one not the idea of my statement. DO you have problems with logic?

TGP
11-02-2008, 22:07
I know some millionnaires and they care A LOT about every 1000 bucks.

Plus, this one not the idea of my statement. DO you have problems with logic?


I know such people too. I also know some Scrooges. Pityful sight.

Hey, don't take it so pesonally! As for logic, I really don't see it in this discussion. People are different, and a millionare in old clothes may look as strange as a poor man who spends his last cents to buy a luxurious thing which does not fit his surrounding. I think both of them have their own reasons for that, and we should not judge them.

MickeyTong
12-02-2008, 02:28
I certainly won't buy any fur from China........
Serious Warning
This is a video of foxes being skinned alive. It is gross and disgusting. Watch it all.....then wear your fur coat.

Video Chinese fur traders skinning foxes alive (full version) - spécisme, antispécisme, speciesism, animal, animaux - Dailymotion Share Your Videos (http://www.dailymotion.com/country:se/tag/front/video/x34xu5_chinese-fur-traders-skinning-foxes)

SilverBullet
17-02-2008, 05:34
Worried about your safety, Cheney might take you for an animal and shoot :farout::reindeer:

Hey, VP Cheney just did what most us want to do and he got away with it! He shot a lawyer and got away with it! He didn't even get sued! :10241:

SilverBullet
17-02-2008, 05:42
I certainly won't buy any fur from China........
Video Chinese fur traders skinning foxes alive [/url]

You could have spared us for a video like this. I didn't click the link thanks to your warning. That said, I don't buy anything from China at all. Their products are just dangerous, poision, fire hazards, and made by cheap Chinese "slave" labor pay. China is the most polluted and dirty country in the world. I will not be watching the Summer Olympics from Beijing this year. I am boycotting that nation 110%.

Miracle77777
17-02-2008, 21:03
You could have spared us for a video like this. I didn't click the link thanks to your warning. That said, I don't buy anything from China at all. Their products are just dangerous, poision, fire hazards, and made by cheap Chinese "slave" labor pay. China is the most polluted and dirty country in the world. I will not be watching the Summer Olympics from Beijing this year. I am boycotting that nation 110%.

I am not Chinese....and I do not love some things there too.....
But, I am sorry for you being such a one-sided, shallow nature....
if you see just the worse in others and not respect ancient traditions and rich Culture of this country.....
:smurf: :10305:

Mete
20-02-2008, 15:53
I am totally against fur coats. As for the people saying it's just warm during cold winter weather I beg to differ- I have never seen, nor heard of anyone conquering Mount Everest in a fur coat. Funnily enough, I used to go out running with one that actually made it to the top of the World and I did not get the impression he was sponsored by Snezhnaya Koroleva. Then he went on to go to the South and North Poles and guess what- he still did wear fur on his journeys.
I could go on and on about it for ages, however, risking getting a few unfriendly remarks, I do believe that fur coat fashion will be modern in Russia for as long the society is as conformist as it is. I would love to draw a parallel to the longivity of all these business suits with stripes on, that have been around here for more than 10 years. They have been selling out as they are going out of fashion, whixh is not exactly the case is it?:11109:
I guess, Rustralian, you have not been a great fan of Midnight Oil, then, which is quite rare, as they are totally adored in Ozzland. Just see the video to River Runs Red, I guess it was, dedicated to Exxon Valdez catastrophe and it will make you sick. Why elocogical catastrohy would be any different to a simple slaughter?
Been to Valdez a few times, the only thing you see is a huge pipe running from the top of the slope, to the sea!
I do believe, as Albertina said(called her Angelina once, and was quite happy it did not trigger a cyclone) we are the conscious choices we make. Therefore, the only leather you could see on me, are my shoes. Survived a winter in the URALS with a synthetic jacket on! Let me tell you- it wasn't a sacrifice!
Cheers