PDA

View Full Version : The American Dream



quincy
06-02-2008, 16:03
Penelope and Sevan, as authentic Americans here's your opportunity to explain to the lesser informed what it's all about!

Penelope
06-02-2008, 16:05
I never wanted to talk about the American Dream. You're the one who pretends to know what it is and isn't. You're the one who claims that people who don't conform to it--whatever it is--are marginalized.

sevan
06-02-2008, 16:24
No quincy - it is pointless to engage in a conversation with people like you and Guest.

Penelope
06-02-2008, 16:29
In some posters' cases, it's impossible to engage in a conversation.

Guest
06-02-2008, 16:46
No quincy - it is pointless to engage in a conversation with people like you and Guest.


If you begin like this... Anyway you would be very surprised about what I think about America. It is 200% the opposite of what I think about England, you should be happy!

Look, I do support Mc Cain, hope he will become your next president! Strange, hey?

Guest
06-02-2008, 16:47
In some posters' cases, it's impossible to engage in a conversation.


Speak for you, dear?

Penelope
06-02-2008, 16:48
I apologise if I offended you, Guest. I meant quincy. I should have specified. You will actually answer questions that are put to you, and generally participate in a discussion, whether it's heated or not. :)

Len Ganley Stance
06-02-2008, 16:48
This thread is bound to surpass the 'Is the EU a country' thread

As George Carlin said - “The reason they call it the American dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it.”

Guest
06-02-2008, 17:26
LOL if THAT is the American dream...



This thread is bound to surpass the 'Is the EU a country' thread

As George Carlin said - “The reason they call it the American dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it.”

Guest
06-02-2008, 17:27
No no, I was not offended :) I just imagined a new USA/Russia cold war :evilgrin:

No need it here, 2008 will already be hard for both countries...


I apologise if I offended you, Guest. I meant quincy. I should have specified. You will actually answer questions that are put to you, and generally participate in a discussion, whether it's heated or not. :)

elis
07-02-2008, 00:08
Here's how Merriam-Webster defines it:

"an American social ideal that stresses egalitarianism and especially material prosperity ; also : the prosperity or life that is the realization of this ideal."

So, I suppose by that definition, it's all about "we all have the same God given ability to go out and get as much stuff as we can . . . possibly--hopefully--more than the next guy."

But I believe that the original ideal is a bit less materialistic than that. Perhaps Thomas Jefferson said it best, when addressing our rights to the pursuit of happiness. And if some fool coined that into being 2.5 kids, a golden retriever, and a white picket fence--well, how many other idealistic phrases have been sullied in similar ways.

Frankly, I think there's a synonym for the "American dream" in every language--some phrase or idea that speaks to people's yearnings for a better life for themselves and their children.

Miracle77777
07-02-2008, 00:31
How about American Tragedy?? :question:
All things should be in balance ;)

Albertina
07-02-2008, 00:38
Frankly, I think there's a synonym for the "American dream" in every language--some phrase or idea that speaks to people's yearnings for a better life for themselves and their children.

hmm what's it in Russia?!

Русский Стандарт?

Miracle77777
07-02-2008, 01:01
hmm what's it in Russia?!

Русский Стандарт?

It was in Soviet times:
>To bring up a child
>To built a house and
>To plant a tree.
:D :D :D

But, seems now - the standarts become higher :evilgreen:....like
>To bring up a tennis-player/singer/lawyer/e t.c.
>To have apts in Moscow, on few islands e t.c.
>afraid even to suggest...:rolleyes: :p

quincy
07-02-2008, 10:42
Here's how Merriam-Webster defines it:

"an American social ideal that stresses egalitarianism and especially material prosperity ; also : the prosperity or life that is the realization of this ideal."

So, I suppose by that definition, it's all about "we all have the same God given ability to go out and get as much stuff as we can . . . possibly--hopefully--more than the next guy."

But I believe that the original ideal is a bit less materialistic than that. Perhaps Thomas Jefferson said it best, when addressing our rights to the pursuit of happiness. And if some fool coined that into being 2.5 kids, a golden retriever, and a white picket fence--well, how many other idealistic phrases have been sullied in similar ways.

Frankly, I think there's a synonym for the "American dream" in every language--some phrase or idea that speaks to people's yearnings for a better life for themselves and their children.
The original concept was probably more modest, but for some decades now the American dream has stressed maximum material possession as way of proving your worthiness as an American citizen. Slogans like "America's business is business" and "What's good for General Motors is good for America" are designed to encourage the public to think along those lines. Also, I think there are also strong notions of nationalism/patriotism included as part of the package of the 'American dream'

quincy
07-02-2008, 10:45
I never wanted to talk about the American Dream. You're the one who pretends to know what it is and isn't. You're the one who claims that people who don't conform to it--whatever it is--are marginalized.
but why don't you want the American dream discussed?

Penelope
07-02-2008, 11:23
Did I try to keep you or anyone else from discussing it?

quincy
07-02-2008, 11:35
Did I try to keep you or anyone else from discussing it?


well, you sounded disapproving, and most recently you said 'whatever it is', meaning you were unsure of what it stood for, so I was hoping you would welcome the chance to discuss it

elis
07-02-2008, 11:43
Also, I think there are also strong notions of nationalism/patriotism included as part of the package of the 'American dream'

What makes you say that?

Penelope
07-02-2008, 11:51
well, you sounded disapproving, and most recently you said 'whatever it is', meaning you were unsure of what it stood for, so I was hoping you would welcome the chance to discuss it
I don't disapprove of the American Dream. I do indeed have my ideas of what it is. What I disapprove of is your refusal to answer questions in another thread after touting your superior knowledge of America.

quincy
07-02-2008, 13:10
I don't disapprove of the American Dream. I do indeed have my ideas of what it is. What I disapprove of is your refusal to answer questions in another thread after touting your superior knowledge of America.
No , I said you sounded disapproving of discussing it here on this discussion board. Never mind about me touting my superior knowledge. if you have your ideas, let's have them, otherwise stop being negative!:bash:

quincy
07-02-2008, 13:11
What makes you say that?
because it is considered a patriotic duty to live by the American dream. Is that not right?

kirk10071
07-02-2008, 13:13
I thought the American Dream wasn't a specific goal, but an ability to acheive it. In many European countries in the 18th and 19th centuries, there were strict social classes that did not permit in a practical way a person to rise above their station. The American Dream was to come to America and to be able to make yourself into whatever your talents allowed. Thus, Abraham Lincoln (or Bill Clinton) can be President without coming from an established political family like Taft or Kennedy or Bush, Bill Gates can be rich, etc. It's not the pursuit of material wealth, but the knowledge that it is possible to pursue it. It's equality of opportunity. It's hope. You don't need family money or family connections to make it big (not that they don't help, of course, as Bush has learned) but your own drive and talent can also gain you the reward. At least that's what *I* thought it was.

kirk10071
07-02-2008, 13:14
because it is considered a patriotic duty to live by the American dream. Is that not right?

Absolutely not at all.

Penelope
07-02-2008, 13:30
No , I said you sounded disapproving of discussing it here on this discussion board. Never mind about me touting my superior knowledge. if you have your ideas, let's have them, otherwise stop being negative!:bash:I'll be happy to contribute positively to this thread when you are ready to contribute positively to this one:
http://www.expat.ru/forum/current-affairs/62575-looking-speak-russian-journalists.html

I think you have a lot of gall accusing me of being negative. So far you've been nothing but negative in any reference to America. And when called on it, or asked for your "qualifications" to make such negative references, you just say that you know--better than we do!

elis
07-02-2008, 13:39
Absolutely not at all.

I totally second that!

quincy
07-02-2008, 14:31
I'll be happy to contribute positively to this thread when you are ready to contribute positively to this one:
http://www.expat.ru/forum/current-affairs/62575-looking-speak-russian-journalists.html

I think you have a lot of gall accusing me of being negative. So far you've been nothing but negative in any reference to America. And when called on it, or asked for your "qualifications" to make such negative references, you just say that you know--better than we do!
Never mind! cheer up and don't take everything so seriously, especially message boards! udachi!

Penelope
07-02-2008, 15:55
Ladna. You've just proven once again that you won't answer questions.

As to what I think of as the American Dream, it's your children having a better life than you do.

Judge
07-02-2008, 21:06
If you begin like this... Anyway you would be very surprised about what I think about America. It is 200% the opposite of what I think about England, you should be happy!

Look, I do support Mc Cain, hope he will become your next president! Strange, hey?

That is very strange,why do you like McCain?he doesn't have a good word to say about Russia.