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DaveUKagain
07-03-2004, 21:15
So. I`m round at Brother Dear`s today and he`s a Formula 1 freak. We watch the race.

Formula 1, for those who don`t know, is a competitive sport where

Gearchanges are done by computer
The cars have so much downforce you could drive `em on the ceiling
Hardly anyone overtakes anyone
Murray Walker retired and James Hunt snuffed it......

and worst of all

Michael Schu-bl**dy-macher always, always, always wins.

Bring back Clark, Fangio, Moss ...... anyone agree ????? At least I know what I`ll be doing every second Sunday from now on....... something other than watching F1......... zzzzzzzzz, zzzzzzzz and thrice zzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Anouk
07-03-2004, 23:38
How can you say that about F1?! The tactics, the speed, the uncertainty, the rich young drivers ;). Probably Schumacher will win the championship again, but there is always a chance he won't, if Mercedes or BMW sort themselves out and Ferrari have a few problems. Even if mid-season the championship looks certain, you can watch what's happening to the teams at the back of the grid........see not boring :) :rolleyes:......I'm gonna stop before i sound too much like a petrol head.

I agree todays race was a bit unevenful, but watching F1 was better than France v. Wales zzzzzzzzz or Tranmere v. Millwall zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Racing Post
08-03-2004, 00:01
Just be thankful Kieren Fallon isn't driving one of the cars!

DaveUKagain
08-03-2004, 00:53
Originally posted by Anouk
How can you say that about F1?! The tactics, the speed, the uncertainty, the rich young drivers ;). Probably Schumacher will win the championship again, but there is always a chance he won't, if Mercedes or BMW sort themselves out and Ferrari have a few problems. Even if mid-season the championship looks certain, you can watch what's happening to the teams at the back of the grid........see not boring :) :rolleyes:......I'm gonna stop before i sound too much like a petrol head.

I agree todays race was a bit unevenful, but watching F1 was better than France v. Wales zzzzzzzzz or Tranmere v. Millwall zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Compared to what it USED to be, and I`m old enough to have seen the tail end of the glory years of Grand Prix, the only thing I have to say is

booooooooooooooooooooooring :)

Take the aero OFF, fill up the cars from milk jugs, take the chicanes out.........

Random
08-03-2004, 01:22
Why can't they build a track where it's easy to over take ? or get round the first bend with out a big pile up ?

"And welcome to the Murray Walker track where its very easy to over take .... and the bloke who was fastest yesterday starts from the back of the grid"

Luckly it was on at 6 am here so didn't feel like you had got up for nothing ...oh no wait ..yes it did !!

As for Mr Fallon - did you see the footage from the other day ? He looked over his shoulder twice !! Ban the bloke for a long time !!!


:agree:

DaveUKagain
08-03-2004, 01:26
It USED to be called Spa Francorchamps. ;-)))))

Big Grand Prix Legends fan here (it`s the most accurate Grand Prix simulation ever ) - and love the history of Grand Prix. Put me in a Lotus 49 or a Brabham any day of the week. I started watching the racing in about 1972 and every single year has got more and more staid and boooooooooring and dull dull dull......

"No more heroes any more".............

in Red
08-03-2004, 11:23
Originally posted by DaveUKagain
I started watching the racing in about 1972 and every single year has got more and more staid and boooooooooring and dull dull dull......

"No more heroes any more".............

Well, i don't claim to be an expert, i wasn't even born when Dave started to watch F1 :shame:
But what about drivers dying??? At the times you were talking about so many horrible accidents were happening! How can this be fun???
Why should it be boring if modern technology is advanced enough to make races more safe and less dangerous?
Don't know what about you guys, but i wouldn't watch F1 if there were death accidents.
Just girl's point of view, of course :)

kniga
08-03-2004, 11:40
Dave,

I watched Juan Fangio, Phil Hill, Sterling Moss and the rest of the luminaries of real racing at Seabring in Florida which I attended in '55, so I gotta agree with you about today's highly enhanced Formula 1 compared with the leather helmets avec goggles of yesteryear.

DaveUKagain
08-03-2004, 11:52
Thank you kindly, Mr Book. ;-))))) Someone once said, "It is the business of the future to be dangerous".

I don`t think they meant F!. ;-))))) Somehow, in the transition from "danger" to "safety", "emasculation" crept in instead.

How can you be considered to be driving a car when the computer changes gear for you, an engine management system (controlled from the pits) does all the fine tuning (so much for lean/ rich and spark retard in the cockpit) - the suspension`s computer controlled and whoever has the most money has the biggest advantage ?? - due to the cars being over-complicated ??

F1 now seems to me to be little more than remote control piles of money (with adverts on them) being driven around an emasculated race track. From the pits.

Sebring, Kniga - now we`re going back !! ;)

Random
08-03-2004, 11:56
For those of you hankering after days of yore ...I suggest a trip to any of the Goodwood meetings - NO not the nags, the cars !!

www.goodwood.co.uk

A top weekends fun and action - you get to see all the old cars zipping around and so on.



;)

kniga
08-03-2004, 15:07
Dave,

Sebring it is, of course.

vikas_ajwani
08-03-2004, 17:37
Well Well guys , i am watching formula 1 for last 5yrs only and now any1 can call me F1 freak , roaming around on the streets of moscow in a Ferrari T-shirt and cap during race weekend (very rare to find same logo on any1 else clothes) . waking up at 5am (slept at 2 night before) to watch the car starting from garage till the post race interviews , everyday morning 1st thing on net is to read formula 1 news....................and all this started coz of 1 man Michael Shumacher.

I started waching formula 1 after i use to read in news of his wins. If any1 tells me of Formula 1 without shumy , I won't be a freak anymore and I am sure without him , Formula 1 will loose more fans.he is just not a driver , he knows everything about his car and the team........And if Ferrari is that good of a team , it's because of some real good ppl together.

But it's not just Shumy , it's about Ferrari also , which is a great team , except for that we have Montoyo who is as crazy as anyone can get on wheels , we have Alonso who is young . good looking and fast , Webber who is following Shumy's footsteps and our "Ice Man" Kimi......who is really COOOL and FAST !

Cars go round and round , what's great about it , my friends ask me , but every round has so much changes and affects the race.

Australian race is over and waiting for Malaysian , ppl interested to make a group and watch together ?????

Wanderer
08-03-2004, 18:45
Yes dave - try going to Classic car events.

Mingle with the drivers & cars, have a fag whilst "fillin' her up", smell the fumes, hear the roar, have a picnic tasting of Redex...there's plenty on from Spring - Autumn.

I'm off to the Historic Grand Prix at Monaco in May....what a treat. Can't wait !!

trebor
08-03-2004, 19:25
DaveUk
you are right!
formular one is tiresome now and you don't have to go right back to Fangio, Moss et al to remember the good times. what about, Mansel, Prost and Senna?
Loads of spills and thrills then. In my opinion F1 is dying a slow and boring death.
Ferrari are a great team and Schumacher is no doubt one of the greatest drivers ever, but he is also one of the most boring!
The Arsenal of football
The Ivan Lendle of tennis
The Steve Davis of snooker
need i say more?
If you realy want to see some exciting racing do what i did. I was changing channels once and stumbled on bike racing. Had me on the edge of my seat.......................................and i hate motobikes!

kniga
08-03-2004, 19:37
Trebor,

Your posts are always thought provoking. Maybe their appeal is that you post seldom and so catch our attention when you do. I hate motobikes, too, but must admit that the kids who ride them are fearless and crazy as only immortal youth dares to be.

DaveUKagain
09-03-2004, 00:57
Too true, folks - and I was going to include Senna and Mansell in that earlier post. Nige Mansell, professionally boring - however - the man DROVE. ;-)))))

IE the car was connected to him, like Clark, Stewart, Lauda, Fangio, Moss..... etc etc etc.

Crash boxes. Three litre non turbo`d V8`s. Rear wheel drift. Bloody heroics - real ones, uninsulated by cotton wool. Racing with the soul still in it - and thank God for Glorious Goodwood, is what I say. ;-)))))) I just can`t watch F1 any more, I`m afraid - when the clutch is in fact a microswitch and the only limit in cornering is the ability of the driver to tolerate G - as the car will stay glued to the track no matter what due to the aero...... something`s gone wrong.

"How fast DARE you go before the car kills you ? " Or you kill yourself. THAT was the mighty appeal of Grand Prix - and it DID become safe. Before Ratzenburger and Senna died, there`d not been one fatality in ten years - I think. And I remember seeing Lauda get burnt and Villenueve killed..... no one wants THEM days back........ but the safety aspect has gone TOO far. With survival cells and crumple zones, you CAN crash at high speeds and remain unscathed, but the cars are virtually superglued to the track nowadays and the SKILL of taking a corner with the back end stepping out, braking down without locking solid (and no ABS to catch you, changing down without a rod going through the cam covers - have gone.

And the SKILL has gone out of it. Point and squirt. The computer does the rest.

Booooooooooooooooring.

I remember seeing what happened when traction control was taken off F1 cars - they couldn`t drive `em, even with all the electronics compensating...... at what point does the driver stop DRIVING the car and the electronics take over ????

I reckon a solution is an "unlimited class" - do whatever you want - nitro, turbo, blowers, ground effect, air dams - whatever you want to do - how fast do you dare to go ??? With NO uplink to the pits ??? Now that WOULD be fun. ;-))))))))))

DaveUKagain
09-03-2004, 01:06
Just one word here to illustrate EVERYTHING about Grand Prix ??

"Hockenheim"

I`m still lamenting what they did to Monza, by the way..... mind you, the REAL aficionados amongst us`ll probably be upset about when they took the wooden banking off it........... ;-))))

Oh, more than one word...... sorry. ;) (What a surprise, eh ? ;-)) )

in Red
09-03-2004, 17:10
Well, perhaps for those, who used to watch the different F1, it seems boring or very booooooooooooooooring now :)
But as for me, i started watching it some 1,5 years ago. Then it have already been what it is now. And I like it as it is, as a competition of high technologies and team strategies. I quite agree, though, that driving skills are not the most important component of success. Much is said about how "good" some F1 drivers are in real conditions.
I was really suprised to hear that Ralf Schumacher refused to drive in Moscow, and used a driver. Well, those who drive here would confirm, perhaps, that driving in Moscow is no less dangerous than driving F1 cars :D no one cares about anything :rolleyes:
Dave, you should think it's a real challenge!
But money is not everything in F1 either. My favourite Toyota have enough money, but still they don't have competitive package, car and strategy :( So it is also a matter of constructor talent, knowledge, experience and luck. And that makes F1 interesting, even though Schumi keeps on winning all the time :)

vikas_ajwani
09-03-2004, 17:27
Good Point "RED" .

But when did Ralf came to Moscow ? Never heard about it !!

Best part of Formula 1 , if Ferrari is not the best car on the grid , still Shumy can win races.............isn't that interesting ?

in Red
09-03-2004, 19:09
Vikas, I don't remember. Just read it somewhere pretty long time ago. Hopefully that wasn't made out :)
But the point I took it as example was not to say that Ralf is bad as a driver or other F1 drivers are bad and unskilled. I just wanted to point out that F1 requires different kind of skills from a driver.
And as for me, i admire F1 as it is :)

vikas_ajwani
09-03-2004, 19:17
My point is also not that he is bad or good , just that i missed a chance to see a Formula 1 driver , may be could have taken his autograph .....................

I 2 admire and Love Formula 1 + Ferrari + Shumy !!

Wanderer
10-03-2004, 11:25
What's the fastest any of you guys has driven (yourself) on a public highway ?

Me, it's 135 MPH on the M5 Gloucester - Bristol bit .

DaveUKagain
10-03-2004, 11:41
Flat out in an XR2 - Bisley to Manchester - and a VERY scary time on the back of a Kawasaki ZX-10 - helmet lifted up, I took a hand off the grab rail to push it back down and lost my balance - white lines going zip -zip- zip past me: last time I ever ride pillion......

Random
10-03-2004, 11:48
Speeding Officer Wanderer ? No never ....

The A30 after Launceston late at night ......nice new road ....

:agree:

DaveUKagain
12-03-2004, 05:01
"Just giving it a blast to clear the carbs, Oshifer"...... ;)

There`s a point - never been to the US - do most people strictly observe the tortoise-pace speed limit, there ???

I was in Sweden once, going up a long, long, long, LONG road at a pedestrian 45 mph in the dubious company of my repellant boss from Germany. The kind of road you could never have an accident on. Boss then tells me that the Swedes are all - to a man - terrified of a moose leaping out at them and causing an accident, which is why they drive so slowly...... every single one o` them. ;-)))))) Well, apart from the rally drivers...... :)

Wanderer
12-03-2004, 12:18
Dave - the "moose factor" happens in East Canada too. Bad news if you hit one at speed....

BTW you are lucky if you've never been to the US...i'd keep it that way if I were you.

Random
12-03-2004, 12:32
Agree re the Moose thing - was in Bergen all very safe and calm.

Having once hit a deer in Scotland whilst driving a Ford Fiesta I can assure anybody the damage is quite significant. Front of the car was very badly damaged. Deer wasn't too chipper either ....

geordie
12-03-2004, 19:05
I bet you made a few quid from the butcher, though

Filimon
12-03-2004, 19:24
Originally posted by Wanderer
What's the fastest any of you guys has driven (yourself) on a public highway ?

Me, it's 135 MPH on the M5 Gloucester - Bristol bit .

Down M1 while coming back to London from Manchester at 2 am on Vauxhall Vectra SRi (2.5 l) - 130-135 mph. Was racing with a Lexus.

kniga
12-03-2004, 21:49
Dave,

In the 50s my father was driving his XK-140 Jag (wish I still had it!) along the famous Rout 66 in Southern California at, shall we say, excessive speed, and was pulled over by a traffic cop. When my father explained to the officer, who had had some trouble catching up with him, that he couldn't get it out of second gear, the cop laughed so hard that he just gave him a warning instead of a ticket!

Wanderer
12-03-2004, 22:10
Interestingly my 135mph stint was in a new Ford Granada 2.0l ! (or maybe a new Rover 800) it's a few years ago. There was a bit more left as well...

I did 130 mph (only just) recently in my 6 yr old V6 Merc on the same M5 stretch. It just wouldn't do any more ....

Happy days.

Why do people want to SLOW motorways down ? The safest place to be is on the M4 (or M5) in the outside lane at circa 90mph. Often you can drive from around Slough to Swindon on the M4 at 90 mph and be left behind....

The most dangerous place to be is in lane 1 or 2 at 60-70mph : lorries swerving in and out, dozy old prawns in the wrong lane at the wrong speed not looking behind them, people SMOKING and EATING and ORGANISING the KIDS without due care & attention to the road / other cars (what's wrong with using the phone exactly ??).

How may accidents are caused by regular long distance "business / commuter" drivers, and how many are caused by yobs or wallys (eg as above) ??
The old bill are strangely silent on this.

DaveUKagain
13-03-2004, 14:08
:) Love it, Kniga. ;-) Did I mention that a friend of mine bought an XK 120 to do up ? He fabricated two sills for it - both right hand ones. Just made a pattern and followed it. Real clever stuff, there. ;-)))))) Also, whilst doing some welding on it, he decided to leave his mask off and went blind for three days. ;-))))

This is the same fella who did the IOM junior TT. Lap one, his exhaust fell off. Heroically he carried on- got off the bike - suddenly realised that his girlfriend was speaking to him and he couldn`t understand what she was saying - he went deaf for a week, but at least fiinished the race. ;-)))))) Total bloody lunatic. ;-))))

Last saw Dennis a few years back, and he was STILL working on the XK.........

Hang on, hit a deer/ moose fast enough and it`ll bounce RIGHT over the car........... ;-))))))

DaveUKagain
13-03-2004, 14:11
Wanderer is, of course, right - speed doesn`t cause accidents. Crashing causes accidents. ;-)))))) Drove a bit on autobahns - and they`re no more dangerous than UK motorways - probably less so.

More fun, too. ;-))))) Apparently if you`re doing more than 200kph and there`s an accident, you`re more likely to be seen to be at fault....... but who cares ? You won`t be around to be charged - not at that speed. Mere technicality. ;-))))))))))))

braganza
17-03-2004, 12:40
I have only been here a few weeks but I reckon that here in Moscow there would be far more entertainment in watching the fur clad old ladies race around the block carrying bags of groceries. In fact I think there might be a pretty good sport in the making there - Handicap Biddy Racing in Moscow. Might see if ESPN will take me up on that one.

Lexis
17-03-2004, 15:01
Originally posted by DaveUKagain
More fun, too. ;-))))) Apparently if you`re doing more than 200kph and there`s an accident, you`re more likely to be seen to be at fault....... but who cares ? You won`t be around to be charged - not at that speed. Mere technicality. ;-))))))))))))

In Germany you are not insured on the autobahn when you drive faster than 150KM/H.

(not entirely sure if 150 is the limit for insurance, but I am not far off :))