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pjw
26-01-2008, 17:10
juOQhTuzDQ0

Albertina
26-01-2008, 17:39
There is one spelling error in that statement.
Europe is a county.

PS: But seriously, I am tired of this anti-American propaganda. Boring, not to mention that it's not true, representative, conclusive or deserves attention. :mad:

pjw
26-01-2008, 21:31
There is one spelling error in that statement.
Europe is a county.

PS: But seriously, I am tired of this anti-American propaganda. Boring, not to mention that it's not true, representative, conclusive or deserves attention. :mad:

Oh Albertina,

Are you tired of all this anti-American propaganda? Are you bored of it all? You don't think it's true or representative or conclusive or deserves attention, do you?

Ok, listen, please promise me you're not gonna take the clip personally. It's not directed at you or anybody. Maybe it's true. I don't know. But thankyou for your funny comment:rolleyes:

SalTheReturn
26-01-2008, 21:59
There is one spelling error in that statement.
Europe is a county.

PS: But seriously, I am tired of this anti-American propaganda. Boring, not to mention that it's not true, representative, conclusive or deserves attention. :mad:

I am sorry Albertina but despite I am clever enough to perfectly understand that lots of Americans are not like that, still lots of Americans are actually like that and hence i find the video hilarious but at the same time representative of a fairly huge share of American citizens

it is clear they have weaker cultural basis compared to Europeans and cannot compete on such grounds with us

live with that, as same as italian students have recently emerged as the most math unskilled in europe

Bels
26-01-2008, 22:09
I am sorry Albertina but despite I am clever enough to perfectly understand that lots of Americans are not like that, still lots of Americans are actually like that and hence i find the video hilarious but at the same time representative of a fairly huge share of American citizens

it is clear they have weaker cultural basis compared to Europeans and cannot compete on such grounds with us

live with that, as same as italian students have recently emerged as the most math unskilled in europe

It's maths in Europe Sal :) It's math in America. The problem is that American minds are closed within their own country. A mistake the Russians also made inthe past. A hundred years later Americans will ask the same question. What's going on, why have fallen behind with the rest of the world.

Transparent Theatre
26-01-2008, 22:20
I have met very few Americans who had even the vaguest knowledge of the geography of Europe.

Having said that, very few Europeans could place Wisconsin, South Dakota or Delaware on a map of the USA. Even more worryingly, around 98% of Europeans would try very hard to place Alberta and Ontario on a map of the USA.

The most utterly misinformed nation I've come across are the Chinese, because they are offically taught rubbish in their own Governnment-printed textbooks. They are taught that the European Union IS one country. They are taught that Singapore, Taiwan, and Mongolia are all parts of China.

I crossed the Russian border from Blagoveschensk (on the Amur) to Heihei (Heilonjiang Province, PRC) 4 years ago. The border is the River Amur itself, there's a daily ferryboat crossing. The Russians were a bit unsure about letting me cross, and checked my (valid) Chinese visa about five times before letting me on the boat.

On Arrival on the other side there were two queues, marked "Chinese Citizens" and "Russian Citizens". I joined the "Russian Citizens" queue and filled-out an Immigration Form.

I was immediately arrested and taken to the Police Station. "You write Place Of Birth, London England, yes?"

"Yes"

"WHERE FROM YOU GET STOLEN BRITISH PASSPORT??" (shaking my passport in my face)

"YOU NOT BRITISH!! YOU ENGLISH! YOU STEAL THIS PASSPORT FROM DEAD MAN!!" (They also added that "Ing-lan is a country in SOUTH AMERICA!")

They offered me a lawyer and an interpreter, but I asked if I could just have a Chinese map of the world. They finally released me 3 hours later, after calling their bosses in Beijing.

"NEXT TIME YOU BRING OWN PASSPORT, NOT STOLEN ONE!" they shouted at me, as they threw my suitcase at me when leaving their police-station.

Albertina
26-01-2008, 22:26
Knowledge of geography does not equate IQ.
And yes, this thread is boring, wrong and I'll have to ignore it. I'm not going to listen to bashing statements against Americans.

pjw
26-01-2008, 22:37
Knowledge of geography does not equate IQ.
And yes, this thread is boring, wrong and I'll have to ignore it. I'm not going to listen to bashing statements against Americans.

Ok Albertina,
If you think so. But I never said one word against Americans. Nobody did. Australians are by far the worst in my opinion. That's why I left.

But a last little whisper in your ear, from Carl Gustav Jung, if you can't laugh at yourself, everybody else will.

Now quoting shrinks is really boring so let's change the subject, shall we?

Bels
26-01-2008, 22:38
Knowledge of geography does not equate IQ.
And yes, this thread is boring, wrong and I'll have to ignore it. I'm not going to listen to bashing statements against Americans.

I'm sorry Albertina it's British and American culture. Often allowed because we're both too darned arrogent to be offended. Hit another country because their called the ethnic minority and we'll be attacked for not being politically correct or even worse racism. So, leave us alone :)

MissAnnElk
26-01-2008, 22:56
The most utterly misinformed nation I've come across are the Chinese, because they are offically taught rubbish in their own Governnment-printed textbooks. They are taught that the European Union IS one country. They are taught that Singapore, Taiwan, and Mongolia are all parts of China.

I lived in Taiwan in 1986. Can't comment on Singapore and Mongolia, but PRC believes Taiwan (ROC) is still a part of them. And Taiwan still believes PRC (Mainland China) is part of Taiwan. Each group has representatives of the other place in their governments. That little Revolution never happened, you see . . .

Judge
26-01-2008, 23:08
I could listen to her accent all day long,very cool.

Bels
26-01-2008, 23:22
Judge, our neutral Brit. No, I don't mean this in a negative way :) But, hey football it might be a different matter.

Judge
26-01-2008, 23:29
Judge, our neutral Brit. No, I don't mean this in a negative way :) But, hey football it might be a different matter.

Ne ponyatno

SalTheReturn
26-01-2008, 23:30
I have met very few Americans who had even the vaguest knowledge of the geography of Europe.

Having said that, very few Europeans could place Wisconsin, South Dakota or Delaware on a map of the USA. Even more worryingly, around 98% of Europeans would try very hard to place Alberta and Ontario on a map of the USA.

The most utterly misinformed nation I've come across are the Chinese, because they are offically taught rubbish in their own Governnment-printed textbooks. They are taught that the European Union IS one country. They are taught that Singapore, Taiwan, and Mongolia are all parts of China.

I crossed the Russian border from Blagoveschensk (on the Amur) to Heihei (Heilonjiang Province, PRC) 4 years ago. The border is the River Amur itself, there's a daily ferryboat crossing. The Russians were a bit unsure about letting me cross, and checked my (valid) Chinese visa about five times before letting me on the boat.

On Arrival on the other side there were two queues, marked "Chinese Citizens" and "Russian Citizens". I joined the "Russian Citizens" queue and filled-out an Immigration Form.

I was immediately arrested and taken to the Police Station. "You write Place Of Birth, London England, yes?"

"Yes"

"WHERE FROM YOU GET STOLEN BRITISH PASSPORT??" (shaking my passport in my face)

"YOU NOT BRITISH!! YOU ENGLISH! YOU STEAL THIS PASSPORT FROM DEAD MAN!!" (They also added that "Ing-lan is a country in SOUTH AMERICA!")

They offered me a lawyer and an interpreter, but I asked if I could just have a Chinese map of the world. They finally released me 3 hours later, after calling their bosses in Beijing.

"NEXT TIME YOU BRING OWN PASSPORT, NOT STOLEN ONE!" they shouted at me, as they threw my suitcase at me when leaving their police-station.

well at least they knew about England!!!

SalTheReturn
26-01-2008, 23:31
Ne ponyatno

dont worry dude, you are not alone in it!!!

SalTheReturn
26-01-2008, 23:32
the girl in the video? would love her to be my wife!

Hawk
27-01-2008, 01:32
She is a good looking blonde, and has a fun personality.....

:bedtime:

J.D.
27-01-2008, 08:18
I remember being taught world geography in school. I knew all of the continents. I could place the major European countries. We were even taught where Canada is, but I don't remember being taught anything about Canada. I'm still sketchy about its divisions. Strange that we were taught more about Europe than Canada.

Now most Americans think that England is a country and I think that most Englishmen agree. However educated Americans think that England is not a country. What does that say about the education of the English? Puts them right up there with Chinese I guess.

One question for the English;
Is Northern Ireland a country?

Len Ganley Stance
27-01-2008, 09:24
She is a good looking blonde, and has a fun personality.....

:bedtime:

She sure has.

I'd hit it.

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 11:25
She is a good looking blonde, and has a fun personality.....

:bedtime:

dude thats not the question actually, the question is that she would rave about that all the bloody time!:hippydj:

no brain, just a sick personality and a fit body. hat off and personally i have never doubted it: US produces the hottest chicks ever.

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 11:27
I remember being taught world geography in school. I knew all of the continents. I could place the major European countries. We were even taught where Canada is, but I don't remember being taught anything about Canada. I'm still sketchy about its divisions. Strange that we were taught more about Europe than Canada.

Now most Americans think that England is a country and I think that most Englishmen agree. However educated Americans think that England is not a country. What does that say about the education of the English? Puts them right up there with Chinese I guess.

One question for the English;
Is Northern Ireland a country?

England is not a country

Northern Ireland is a country

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 11:31
and to those saying that Europeans dunno about states in the US, well thats really different from not knowing about countries in Europe

I know where is Mexico, Canada, etc...dunno where is Ohio or whatever

anyway Americans were so dumb to declare war to Afganistan and then 40& of its citizens were unable to locate it on a geographic map LOL LOL LOL

Len Ganley Stance
27-01-2008, 12:21
England is not a country

Northern Ireland is a country

They're both 'constituent countries' of the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland, as are Scotland and Wales.

Of the four components of the Union, only England doesn't have it's own seperate Parliament or Governmental Assembly. Northern Ireland and Wales both have 'Assemblies' and Scotland has its own Parliament. England is governed from Westminster, by the Parliament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Members of Parliament from Northern Ireland / Wales and Scotland can sit in the Westminster Parliament but English MP's cannot sit in the Assemblies in Northern Ireland / Wales or the Parliment in Scotland.

So, maybe you're right, England isn't really a country (I'm obviously joking).

Bels
27-01-2008, 12:22
England is not a country

Northern Ireland is a country

Northern Ireland and Englands are pieces of a great country, which is of course Great Britain :) And let's not forget Wales, Scotland and The Channel Isles.

Len Ganley Stance
27-01-2008, 12:35
Here's a couple of links to test your Geography skills. The only complaint I'd have about the second one of these is that the Map is too bloody small and your accuracy can be undermined -

World Maps - geography online games (http://www.sheppardsoftware.com/Geography.htm)

Traveller IQ Challenge- TripAdvisor (http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/TIQGame?nl=MU&pid=646)

Transparent Theatre
27-01-2008, 12:43
and to those saying that Europeans dunno about states in the US, well thats really different from not knowing about countries in Europe

Is it? OK, well try this simple test..

... you make yourself a placard that says "Vote Now For Gay Marriage!" and you try walking along the street with it in The East Village, NYC Richmond, Virginia Boise, Idaho The Bay Area of San Francisco Austin, Texas


And then tell us how you got on?

ROFL!!

Sometime you ought to go to Petropavlovksk, Kamchatka. They love to show Brits around their City Museum. There is a whole display of cannon and British military uniforms captured during the C19th. Y'see, during the Crimean War, someone in the War Office had the idea to land a British Relief Force on the Kamchatka Peninsular. They were going to - oooops, I'm laughing too much to type - march North and cross into the Russian mainland... then, errr, march across Siberia 2500 miles... and relieve the British force in Crimea!! All while dressed in Her Majesty's red uniforms, of course.

Of course, every single one of them was killed. The Charge Of The Light Brigade looks like a success-story by comparison - no-one in London even wants to talk about the Crimean Relief Force incident, and you won't read about it even in books.

This is what happens to people who assume they know it all about a country because they know one place in that country :-/

Transparent Theatre
27-01-2008, 12:52
Scotland IS a country, and any Brit who claims it is not just proves that they were looking out of the window during fourth-form History :(

Scotland is a country which is voluntarily joined to England by the Act Of Union (1707).

Although the Act Of Union created one kingdom (ie the same monarch ruled with equal force over the two countries) the countries retained their separate Constitutions and legislatures. (England, of course, doesn't have a written Constitution anyhow).

The point being that Scotland has the right to cede from this Union if it wishes - there is no impediment to this happening.

It is absolutely realistic that Scotland may now do so. A referendum would be required to secure a mandate for Scotland's independence.

Bear in mind that the Scottish Nationalist Party is now the majority power in Scotland, and gained power on a manifesto committed to independence - so there is no secret about this, and Scots have voted for a party committed to independence for Scotland.

It's this legal nicety that permits England, Scotland, Wales and N Ireland to have their own separate football teams lose in major world tournaments.

If you are going to rant about your country, at least have the first clue what ye're talkin' aboot, eh??? ;)

Len Ganley Stance
27-01-2008, 12:59
Scotland IS a country, and any Brit who claims it is not just proves that they were looking out of the window during fourth-form History :(

Scotland is a country which is voluntarily joined to England by the Act Of Union (1707).

Although the Act Of Union created one kingdom (ie the same monarch ruled with equal force over the two countries) the countries retained their separate Constitutions and legislatures. (England, of course, doesn't have a written Constitution anyhow).

The point being that Scotland has the right to cede from this Union if it wishes - there is no impediment to this happening.

It is absolutely realistic that Scotland may now do so. A referendum would be required to secure a mandate for Scotland's independence.

Bear in mind that the Scottish Nationalist Party is now the majority power in Scotland, and gained power on a manifesto committed to independence - so there is no secret about this, and Scots have voted for a party committed to independence for Scotland.

It's this legal nicety that permits England, Scotland, Wales and N Ireland to have their own separate football teams lose in major world tournaments.

If you are going to rant about your country, at least have the first clue what ye're talkin' aboot, eh??? ;)

Absoluely correct.

And for the record, Great Britain is not a country either. It's an island and is the largest component part of the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland.

Bels
27-01-2008, 13:32
Absoluely correct.

And for the record, Great Britain is not a country either. It's an island and is the largest component part of the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland.

Wow! Now that bit I didn't know. Someone asked me recently what was the difference between the UK and Great Britain and I thought there was no difference. Which one has the Union Jack, Great Britain or the U.K.? When do we say The UK and when do we say Great Britain :) Isn't it confusing?
What do you write on an address to your country, The UK or Great Britain, or does it really matter that much?

Len Ganley Stance
27-01-2008, 13:48
Wow! Now that bit I didn't know. Someone asked me recently what was the difference between the UK and Great Britain and I thought there was no difference. Which one has the Union Jack, Great Britain or the U.K.? When do we say The UK and when do we say Great Britain :) Isn't it confusing?
What do you write on an address to your country, The UK or Great Britain, or does it really matter that much?

You write United Kingdom.

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 14:40
Guys I am confused and sincerely thank LenG.Stance for his contributes

we are usually simply taught the following more or less (this is based on the italian schooling system)

1)England stands to UK as a region composing a country
2)UK and Great Britain are synomins
3)The fact they may have independent parliament (was it scotland, right?) does not make them countries

At this point I am very interested in finding out more and eager to see whats the UN say about that, what definitions they give

in fact i do not care about what Britons/English think I want to know how the international community rules on the subject

Wodin
27-01-2008, 14:55
Wow! Now that bit I didn't know. Someone asked me recently what was the difference between the UK and Great Britain and I thought there was no difference. Which one has the Union Jack, Great Britain or the U.K.? When do we say The UK and when do we say Great Britain :) Isn't it confusing?
What do you write on an address to your country, The UK or Great Britain, or does it really matter that much?

Quite true. The Union Jack is the flag of the UK as far as I recall. All the components of the UK have their own national flag. To my mind, in a non-technincal conversation, the UK and GB are quite interchangeable, but the "political unit" as it were is the UK. The UN member is the UK not GB. As for myself, I usuall tend to address my letters to the UK rather than GB, but that's simply becasue it's easier to write UK than Great Britain (the initials GB probably not being clear enough to mail sorters in some countries).

I think, the easiest way to exlain it would be by anology to the fact that while a person could be English (or Scot or Welsh etc) by nationality, he or she would be British by citizenship.

Funnily enough, I never think of the consituents as "countries", although I suppose they are.

Bels
27-01-2008, 15:54
I've been reading here. Great Britain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Satellite_image_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland_in_April_2002.jpg" class="image"><img alt="Satellite image of Great Britain and Northern Ireland in April 2002.jpg" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6d/Satellite_image_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland_in_April_2002.jpg/200px-Satellite_image_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland_in_April_2002.jpg"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/6/6d/Satellite_image_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland_in_April_2002.jpg/200px-Satellite_image_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland_in_April_2002.jpg

Informative but with some questions still cofusing. A Scot is a Brit, yes because he's from the mainland of Britain. Is a Northern Irish person or a Channel islander a Brit or are they United kingdomese.

Is The Union Jack combined only with Scotland ? As that's what it looks like. What part of the union Jack is Northern Irish and Welsh.

pjw
27-01-2008, 16:08
Northern Ireland and Englands are pieces of a great country, which is of course Great Britain :) And let's not forget Wales, Scotland and The Channel Isles.

Generally I only got the English using the term Great Britain. Never heard a Scot or Welsh saying they're not countries. Even people from Northern Ireland I reckon feel they have more in common with their island rather than wanting to jump on some kinda British trip. No matter what colour their passport is.

Another little tip, if you start calling New Zealanders Australians, well you're only looking for trouble, displaying your pig ignorance and stopping a potentially interesting conversation in it's tracks.

My point is, Scots are Scots not Welsh. Only the English start trying to talk about big happy families. This idea of common group is in the English mind alone.

Now I got a chance to place a new emoticon:uk::uk:

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 16:24
len ganley has probably copy and pasted lots of crap

PS.Bels please at least stop relying on Wikipedia, for you it is not good at all

Bels
27-01-2008, 16:44
Generally I only got the English using the term Great Britain. Never heard a Scot or Welsh saying they're not countries. Even people from Northern Ireland I reckon feel they have more in common with their island rather than wanting to jump on some kinda British trip. No matter what colour their passport is.

Another little tip, if you start calling New Zealanders Australians, well you're only looking for trouble, displaying your pig ignorance and stopping a potentially interesting conversation in it's tracks.

My point is, Scots are Scots not Welsh. Only the English start trying to talk about big happy families. This idea of common group is in the English mind alone.

Now I got a chance to place a new emoticon:uk::uk:

I was born in Scotland and I call myself a Brit. How's that :)

Bels
27-01-2008, 16:45
len ganley has probably copy and pasted lots of crap

PS.Bels please at least stop relying on Wikipedia, for you it is not good at all

What's wrong with Wikopedia, Sal ?

J.D.
27-01-2008, 17:09
My point was two fold.
First that the definition of a country is not as clear as one might think.
By some reasoning presented here, each of the states in the United States is a country.

The second that not everyone agrees on whether a particular entity is a country or not.

check out this list of countries by population
List of countries by population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:World_population.PNG" class="image"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b1/World_population.PNG/300px-World_population.PNG"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/b/b1/World_population.PNG/300px-World_population.PNG

Bels
27-01-2008, 17:12
Is the USA not a continent with a lot of countries ?

J.D.
27-01-2008, 17:18
Almost. We consider Canada as a subsidiary but we don't claim Mexico.

Wodin
27-01-2008, 18:23
I've been reading here. Great Britain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Britain)

Informative but with some questions still cofusing. A Scot is a Brit, yes because he's from the mainland of Britain. Is a Northern Irish person or a Channel islander a Brit or are they United kingdomese.

Is The Union Jack combined only with Scotland ? As that's what it looks like. What part of the union Jack is Northern Irish and Welsh.

The Channel Islands are not actually part of the UK or Britain. I'm not sure of their actual status, but as far as I know we only look after their defence and foreign affairs. They are probably a country (or State) in their own right. A Northern Irish person is technically a citizen of the UK (since the UK comprises Eng, Sco, Wal and NI, but not a UK citizen since there is no such thing) and carries British passport, making them British Citizens, but almost half of them will beat you up if you say so and the rest will beat you up if you don't :) I know that the Welsh cross is on the Union Jack and I think that the Irish had something on there too but can't remember what or if it's still there.

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 18:53
My point was two fold.
First that the definition of a country is not as clear as one might think.
By some reasoning presented here, each of the states in the United States is a country.

The second that not everyone agrees on whether a particular entity is a country or not.

check out this list of countries by population
List of countries by population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population)

but we dont care about certain reasonings
the UN has a final word on that by deciding what country is officially recognized as such and what are not

so Checenya is a country dude according to some reasoning...

and Americans are also taught that the world has 7 continentes LOL LOL

Bels
27-01-2008, 20:01
but we dont care about certain reasonings
the UN has a final word on that by deciding what country is officially recognized as such and what are not

so Checenya is a country dude according to some reasoning...

and Americans are also taught that the world has 7 continentes LOL LOL

Since it has recently been claimed that Britain is proportionally the largest contributer for the UN, then it's only right that Britain makes all the decisions :)

Bels
27-01-2008, 20:12
Jersey is a British Island for example, and is a dependancy of Great Britain. The channel Isles were the only part of British soil ever to be invaded.

Visitors site (http://www.jersey.com/promo_index.asp?target=/content_page.asp?id=22)

pjw
27-01-2008, 20:48
Jersey is a British Island for example, and is a dependancy of Great Britain. The channel Isles were the only part of British soil ever to be invaded.

Visitors site (http://www.jersey.com/promo_index.asp?target=/content_page.asp?id=22)

Hi Bels,

If you believe this fine, but William of Normandy CONQUERED in 1066. If you don´t see this as invasion it means you are on his side. Bels, why aren´t you proud of your celt, saxon, pik heritage instead of siding with those down south over the border. You should want a free Scotland with its own capital. Most Scots I know think like this.

British is a word used by non-Brits to refer to a collection of countries in an economical or political sense. It´s only theoretical. But it´s not physical, it´s not a real country. It´s not real. If you hear on the telly, IN BRITAIN TODAY, it is an English journalist talking about a group of countries. I never heard someone say I´m from Britain when they were from Northern Ireland, Wales or Scotland. One exception: Oh we don´t eat like that here in Britain. For heaven´s sake, hold fork properly.

It´s the same as Australasia. It´s not a place anyone says they are from. No self-respecting Kiwi uses this term in reality. :uk::uk::uk:

Bels
27-01-2008, 21:09
It's nice to see you're waving our flag, and that Australia still keeps the Union jack as part of their flag. I do believe 1066 was the beginning of real British history, the signing of the charter after the battle of Hastings. I could also state that that the the only British soil that the Germans managed to invade in both World wars was the channel Isles, simply because it was beside France.

Bels
27-01-2008, 21:18
Hi Bels,

If you believe this fine, but William of Normandy CONQUERED in 1066. If you don´t see this as invasion it means you are on his side. Bels, why aren´t you proud of your celt, saxon, pik heritage instead of siding with those down south over the border. You should want a free Scotland with its own capital. Most Scots I know think like this.

British is a word used by non-Brits to refer to a collection of countries in an economical or political sense. It´s only theoretical. But it´s not physical, it´s not a real country. It´s not real. If you hear on the telly, IN BRITAIN TODAY, it is an English journalist talking about a group of countries. I never heard someone say I´m from Britain when they were from Northern Ireland, Wales or Scotland. One exception: Oh we don´t eat like that here in Britain. For heaven´s sake, hold fork properly.

It´s the same as Australasia. It´s not a place anyone says they are from. No self-respecting Kiwi uses this term in reality. :uk::uk::uk:

A free Scotland would be disastrous for Britain, if we are not united we wouldn't be strong and we would have the little Englander comments. And our beautiful union Jack would disappear. Also Scotland has North Sea oil and gas and Britain can't do without that.

Scotland has voted a few times and in those times they chose to remain as Britain. I must admit that Scotland is more socialist than the rest of Britain, and if Scotland wasn't Britain the conservative party would be in power.

I was born in Scotland, but I moved to the South of England as a child.

pullar
27-01-2008, 21:40
Guys I am confused and sincerely thank LenG.Stance for his contributes

we are usually simply taught the following more or less (this is based on the italian schooling system)

1)England stands to UK as a region composing a country
2)UK and Great Britain are synomins
3)The fact they may have independent parliament (was it scotland, right?) does not make them countries

At this point I am very interested in finding out more and eager to see whats the UN say about that, what definitions they give

in fact i do not care about what Britons/English think I want to know how the international community rules on the subject

Unfortunately you were taught wrongly. The UK is short for the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Hence GB is England and Wales joined with Scotland. Both the Channel Isles and the Isle of Man are independent countries with their own parliaments, although the rely on the UK in certain areas, like defence

MissAnnElk
27-01-2008, 22:04
and Americans are also taught that the world has 7 continentes LOL LOL

It DOES!
North America
South America
Australia
Europe
Asia
Africa
Antarctica

It says so in the Bible, doesn't it? (joking . . .)

Bels
27-01-2008, 22:13
So, the biggest country in the world, or is it a continent also? Where does Russia come in to this. Is it Europe or is it Europe and Asia.:eh:

J.D.
27-01-2008, 22:45
but we dont care about certain reasonings
the UN has a final word on that by deciding what country is officially recognized as such and what are not

so Checenya is a country dude according to some reasoning...

and Americans are also taught that the world has 7 continentes LOL LOL

Who is 'we'?

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 22:52
It DOES!
North America
South America
Australia
Europe
Asia
Africa
Antarctica

It says so in the Bible, doesn't it? (joking . . .)

pls no misleading posts, readers might even believe you

SalTheReturn
27-01-2008, 22:53
Who is 'we'?

WE is Europeans representatives of a fine culture justappoxed to YOU American representative of a lack of culture

Bels
27-01-2008, 22:57
pls no misleading posts, readers might even believe you

So sal, what are the contienents. Asia, Europe, Australasia, are without doubt, so who are the rest?

Bels
27-01-2008, 23:00
Although I'm not of where exactly where the berline exists in Russia, does anybody know that one. I bet wikopedia got an answer somewhere:)

Bels
27-01-2008, 23:32
WE is Europeans representatives of a fine culture justappoxed to YOU American representative of a lack of culture

Are you cultured Sal :):eh:

Wodin
27-01-2008, 23:42
Although I'm not of where exactly where the berline exists in Russia, does anybody know that one. I bet wikopedia got an answer somewhere:)

The border between European Russia and Asia is in the Urals. There's a monument close to Yekaterinburg.

Finskij Paren
28-01-2008, 00:15
I have met very few Americans who had even the vaguest knowledge of the geography of Europe.

Having said that, very few Europeans could place Wisconsin, South Dakota or Delaware on a map of the USA. Even more worryingly, around 98% of Europeans would try very hard to place Alberta and Ontario on a map of the USA.


Yes, not all European know where to pick the states. I am from Finland, I guess you know where that is. But could you place "Uusimaa" on the map? That's part of Finland, like Wisconsin in the USA... I think it's a bit too arrogant from Americans to even expect to know all the STATES. Sovereign states are different think. Just just my opinion..

SalTheReturn
28-01-2008, 00:18
Europe has 5 continents, the following:

Asia

Europe

Oceania (dunno in english)

America

Africa

PS. Bels, you love making me sick dont you? what do you mean by Australasia?:bird:

SalTheReturn
28-01-2008, 00:20
Yes, not all European know where to pick the states. I am from Finland, I guess you know where that is. But could you place "Uusimaa" on the map? That's part of Finland, like Wisconsin in the USA... I think it's a bit too arrogant from Americans to even expect to know all the STATES. Sovereign states are different think. Just just my opinion..

i back you on that mate

when yanks and rednecks gets mocked coz they dunno about europe they always answer "but do you know wheres wisconsin?"

they dont realize that I am allowed not to be able to locate wisconsin but things get pretty ridicolous when an individual does not know where is Finland or sth like that

even the geo-political knowledge of americans is really know, they still think there is war in the Balkans LOL LOL LOL

pjw
28-01-2008, 00:28
It's nice to see you're waving our flag, and that Australia still keeps the Union jack as part of their flag. I do believe 1066 was the beginning of real British history, the signing of the charter after the battle of Hastings. I could also state that that the the only British soil that the Germans managed to invade in both World wars was the channel Isles, simply because it was beside France.

I´m not proud of the union jack in the corner of the aussie flag. Why is it there? I can tell you exactly why and at the same time why we got this foreign girl on the back of our coins and our notes. Because 51% of australians don´t care. It´s also been voted on several times. It´s illogical that India could somehow have managed to free itself from the realm but oz still clings on. And to what? I don´t know. It´s not my problem anymore. I´m flying a green and gold flag with kangaroo.

But why do you think British history started with William in 1066? This is short-sighted. If you believed in Robin Hood and what he fought for then you would know that the Saxons fought against the Normans and that´s why we have Scotland today. The French fought to get over that blasted Hadrian´s Wall originally built by Celts against the Romans but couldn´t. Heard of William Wallace Bels? England is not as good as they tell you in school. I went to school for a short while there too.

pjw
28-01-2008, 00:32
Europe has 5 continents, the following:

Asia

Europe

Oceania (dunno in english)

America

Africa

PS. Bels, you love making me sick dont you? what do you mean by Australasia?:bird:

Europe´s definitely put on a bit of weight since last time I looked at the map. Sal are you 100% positive about this info you have chosen to share? Europe´s getting fat man:nut:

pjw
28-01-2008, 03:02
I was born in Scotland and I call myself a Brit. How's that :)

Hey Bels,
I´ve had a rethink and I now I say what you choose to call yourself is your own personal business and I´m taking liberties trying to dispute this or make you justify it:rasta:

J.D.
28-01-2008, 06:12
Europe has 5 continents, the following:

Asia

Europe

Oceania (dunno in english)

America

Africa

PS. Bels, you love making me sick dont you? what do you mean by Australasia?:bird:

Your genius is nicely balanced by your ego.

MissAnnElk
29-01-2008, 22:17
You guys are the best, you know.

When I said I was moving to Slovakia, a SPANISH friend said, "OH, but what about the war?"

Every nation has its geographic morons. Just because *I* keep an atlas next to my bed and get off on reading maps doesn't mean everyone else does. And, hell, those non-map-readers may be good at higher math, at which I suck.

I have an English degree. Two of them. And even though I get lazy and don't always run SpellCheck, I do tend to judge people based on their spelling and grammar (with consideration for non-native speakers, of course).

But scientifically speaking, spelling is just a skill. Like riding a bike or juggling. It is not necessarily tied to intelligence (although the ability to remember to run the SpellCheck probably is).

:-)

SalTheReturn
29-01-2008, 22:20
Your genius is nicely balanced by your ego.

I mistake the beginning of the sentence "world"

5 continents, whats wrong with that? pls tell me dude...

Bels
29-01-2008, 22:43
You guys are the best, you know.

When I said I was moving to Slovakia, a SPANISH friend said, "OH, but what about the war?"

Every nation has its geographic morons. Just because *I* keep an atlas next to my bed and get off on reading maps doesn't mean everyone else does. And, hell, those non-map-readers may be good at higher math, at which I suck.

I have an English degree. Two of them. And even though I get lazy and don't always run SpellCheck, I do tend to judge people based on their spelling and grammar (with consideration for non-native speakers, of course).

But scientifically speaking, spelling is just a skill. Like riding a bike or juggling. It is not necessarily tied to intelligence (although the ability to remember to run the SpellCheck probably is).

:-)

Good post, a greenie from me :)

Bels
29-01-2008, 22:48
Your genius is nicely balanced by your ego.

Ok, it's in my intermediete EFL text books, and err! many other texts. Australasia is the smallest continent in the world, with Austaralia being the largest island in the world. And Captain Cook discovered it and Britain put their convicts over or under there. How's that for facts :) And I didn't even check up Wikopedia, purely memory :)

pjw
29-01-2008, 22:49
I mistake the beginning of the sentence "world"

5 continents, whats wrong with that? pls tell me dude...

I´m sorry too dude. Was just mega surprised to see that Australia had joined the EU overnight:mooooh::mooooh: You almost made me go and get my atlas and czech!

pjw
29-01-2008, 22:59
Ok, it's in my intermediete EFL text books, and err! many other texts. Australasia is the smallest continent in the world, with Austaralia being the largest island in the world. And Captain Cook discovered it and Britain put their convicts over or under there. How's that for facts :) And I didn't even check up Wikopedia, purely memory :)

Let me tell you a little bit about Australia, Bels. The lowdown. Captain Cook was not the first of a pack of greedy white invaders who said the country was uninhabited. Disrespectful and shameful. If you lived in Oz, you know it is a black country with a black soul. The only way to move into a harmonious balanced future is to accept this. To make things right and to respect everyone. These words are wasted on most people. Most people couldn´t give a damn and don´t bother to pay out if you don´t understand. Racism and proud people make me sick:vader:

But in no way do I mean to say that you are racist Bels. Nothing in your posts say this. I was just blowing off steam against racism in general, but not against you.

MissAnnElk
29-01-2008, 23:09
I spent a summer in NSW in 1977 (yeah . . . I really am that old). It was interesting . .. the Austrialians' views on the aborigines then. And their views on the whole Pacific Rim. Now they all study Japanese and Chinese . . . big positive steps!

pjw
29-01-2008, 23:39
I spent a summer in NSW in 1977 (yeah . . . I really am that old). It was interesting . .. the Austrialians' views on the aborigines then. And their views on the whole Pacific Rim. Now they all study Japanese and Chinese . . . big positive steps!

Interesting what you say. The new Oz leader is one of the only world reps outside China and Taiwan who can speak fluent Chinese. New generation of understanding?:question:

MissAnnElk
29-01-2008, 23:44
Well, in general it seems the Aussies have figured a lot out in the past 30 years . .. like who the closest market is.

I always thought the Australians were cool, as a group, just so far away geographically that this affected social issues. In 1977, it felt like 1957 to me, in terms of the race issues (in terms of enviroment you were light years ahead).

In 1996-97, when I was living in Taiwan, a colleague went to Oz for our winter break (we were teaching English at a university). She's a white American southern woman. When she went through Oz immigration, the officer said something to her about how "At least you're not black." As a white chick from Alabama, this was profoundly interesting to her.

My perception is that the country has progressed IMMENSELY.

pjw
29-01-2008, 23:54
Well, in general it seems the Aussies have figured a lot out in the past 30 years . .. like who the closest market is.

I always thought the Australians were cool, as a group, just so far away geographically that this affected social issues. In 1977, it felt like 1957 to me, in terms of the race issues (in terms of enviroment you were light years ahead).

In 1996-97, when I was living in Taiwan, a colleague went to Oz for our winter break (we were teaching English at a university). She's a white American southern woman. When she went through Oz immigration, the officer said something to her about how "At least you're not black." As a white chick from Alabama, this was profoundly interesting to her.

My perception is that the country has progressed IMMENSELY.

Yes perhaps progressed immensely but not enough and still too many dumbos. Don´t forget the 1970s were just 100 years after the convict system was abolished. Strange to think in that way. You seem to have been in a lot of interesting places and seen alot of the world. Where´s home? Why is it your home? Do you miss it?:nut:

SalTheReturn
29-01-2008, 23:56
I´m sorry too dude. Was just mega surprised to see that Australia had joined the EU overnight:mooooh::mooooh: You almost made me go and get my atlas and czech!

Australia is not a continent, the continent name is Oceania (in italian of course) and incl Australia and some other islands where people resembles fishes

MissAnnElk
29-01-2008, 23:58
Yeah, well we all know the US has its share of morons. Some of them were on the news yesterday . . .

Home? At the moment it is Moscow. We just bought a house in Ohio (hear that, Sal? Now I expect you to know where it is! There will be a quiz on the 88 counties and the Mound Builders!). Our passports say USA. But really, anymore, we are nomads.

Bels
30-01-2008, 00:01
Australia is not a continent, the continent name is Oceania (in italian of course) and incl Australia and some other islands where people resembles fishes

Wow! I didn't know that, and does it make sense? Oceania, the name for all oceans including the Pacific. Sorry I can't comprehend the purpose of that name. Who decided to come up with that logical???? name?

Korotky Gennady
30-01-2008, 00:02
I have met very few Americans who had even the vaguest knowledge of the geography of Europe.

Having said that, very few Europeans could place Wisconsin, South Dakota or Delaware on a map of the USA. Even more worryingly, around 98% of Europeans would try very hard to place Alberta and Ontario on a map of the USA.

The most utterly misinformed nation I've come across are the Chinese, because they are offically taught rubbish in their own Governnment-printed textbooks. They are taught that the European Union IS one country. They are taught that Singapore, Taiwan, and Mongolia are all parts of China.

I crossed the Russian border from Blagoveschensk (on the Amur) to Heihei (Heilonjiang Province, PRC) 4 years ago. The border is the River Amur itself, there's a daily ferryboat crossing. The Russians were a bit unsure about letting me cross, and checked my (valid) Chinese visa about five times before letting me on the boat.

On Arrival on the other side there were two queues, marked "Chinese Citizens" and "Russian Citizens". I joined the "Russian Citizens" queue and filled-out an Immigration Form.

I was immediately arrested and taken to the Police Station. "You write Place Of Birth, London England, yes?"

"Yes"

"WHERE FROM YOU GET STOLEN BRITISH PASSPORT??" (shaking my passport in my face)

"YOU NOT BRITISH!! YOU ENGLISH! YOU STEAL THIS PASSPORT FROM DEAD MAN!!" (They also added that "Ing-lan is a country in SOUTH AMERICA!")

They offered me a lawyer and an interpreter, but I asked if I could just have a Chinese map of the world. They finally released me 3 hours later, after calling their bosses in Beijing.

"NEXT TIME YOU BRING OWN PASSPORT, NOT STOLEN ONE!" they shouted at me, as they threw my suitcase at me when leaving their police-station.

Sorry but i can't believe your story... :fireworks:

Bels
30-01-2008, 00:08
Yeah, well we all know the US has its share of morons. Some of them were on the news yesterday . . .

Home? At the moment it is Moscow. We just bought a house in Ohio (hear that, Sal? Now I expect you to know where it is! There will be a quiz on the 88 counties and the Mound Builders!). Our passports say USA. But really, anymore, we are nomads.

Well, every country has it's morons, but America simply has got more of them :)Observation arrive from looking at the posts on this forum :)

SalTheReturn
30-01-2008, 00:10
Sorry but i can't believe your story... :fireworks:

KG is surely true!!!

once i was asked by a university student if New York was in the UK

that even defeat an american fat-assed girl who told prague was in germany

pjw
30-01-2008, 00:10
Wow! I didn't know that, and does it make sense? Oceania, the name for all oceans including the Pacific. Sorry I can't comprehend the purpose of that name. Who decided to come up with that logical???? name?

Wasn´t it George Orwell in 1984 who first penned the term Oceania? It just snowballed from there I guess. But the basic idea is that Australasia is just 4 islands

jordan74
30-01-2008, 00:58
It’s OK; in fact, it’s just as funny to Americans to see such amazing ignorance. Moreover, I don’t have to feel guilty about posting this hilarious video: 301 Moved Permanently

MissAnnElk
30-01-2008, 06:14
It’s OK; in fact, it’s just as funny to Americans to see such amazing ignorance.

Jay Leno/The Tonight Show has made a good living off of it, no? They love to stop people on the street and ask basic geography questions and get dumb answers . . . the bit is called "Jay Walking" I think.

J.D.
30-01-2008, 08:23
Well, every country has it's morons, but America simply has got more of them :)Observation arrive from looking at the posts on this forum :)
You really should be on Jay Leno. You'd be quite popular.
George Bush doesn't hold a candle to you.

J.D.
30-01-2008, 08:33
I mistake the beginning of the sentence "world"

5 continents, whats wrong with that? pls tell me dude...

Aside from your humorous grammatical mistake of placing your five continents within Europe, you consider North America and South America to be one continent. You go on to say that a continent can include islands and then infer that we should use Italian nomenclature while we are speaking English.
(I suppose a good argument could be made that a lot of us here are not really speaking English.)

Did I forget to mention Antarctica?
Oh well, I'm not the first.

Bels
30-01-2008, 12:10
KG is surely true!!!

once i was asked by a university student if New York was in the UK

that even defeat an american fat-assed girl who told prague was in germany

Perhaps the student got confused with the original York which is in the UK.

When I was teaching at a Summer school in the UK a teacher assumed some of our European techers were Czekoslovakian and Yugoslavian, and were these teachers offnded, yes they were.

Problem is that Geography in countries and nationalities change all the time, especially in unstable parts of the World.

SalTheReturn
30-01-2008, 16:33
Aside from your humorous grammatical mistake of placing your five continents within Europe, you consider North America and South America to be one continent. You go on to say that a continent can include islands and then infer that we should use Italian nomenclature while we are speaking English.
(I suppose a good argument could be made that a lot of us here are not really speaking English.)

Did I forget to mention Antarctica?
Oh well, I'm not the first.

you surely come from one of those schooling system where you may happen to study with people of difference ethnicities and were you have okranik (mispelled) at the entrance of your school

your mum before going to school was telling you "J.D. be careful for gods sake out there is a war!". When getting back home your scars in the face were telling mum only one thing "god, my son has been beaten up again by the Lewisham boys"

your professors were usually hired from god forsaken countries and emigrated in your country just in order to make ends meet

dude, Antartica is not a continent, you may say some people support that idea, but the world dude has 5 continents according to cultured europeans

and really on this I am sure: there is noone consider LatinAmerican a continent

good luck mate, grab a book from time to time

SalTheReturn
30-01-2008, 16:34
Perhaps the student got confused with the original York which is in the UK.

When I was teaching at a Summer school in the UK a teacher assumed some of our European techers were Czekoslovakian and Yugoslavian, and were these teachers offnded, yes they were.

Problem is that Geography in countries and nationalities change all the time, especially in unstable parts of the World.

as unstable as your mind dude!.-)))

Penelope
30-01-2008, 16:51
Le mot continent vient du latin continere pour « tenir ensemble », ou continens terra, les « terres continues ». Au sens propre, ce terme désigne une vaste étendue continue de terre à la surface du globe. Dans son acception commune, la zone continentale inclut également les petites îles à très faible distance des côtes, mais non celles séparées par des bras de mer significatifs (comme la Corse par rapport au "continent" français). D'un point de vue scientifique, les continents incluent également les îles rattachées aux plaques continentales, comme les Îles Britanniques par rapport à l'Eurasie.

Les parties du Monde sont des continents dans un sens élargi. D'une part, toute île fait partie d'une partie du Monde puisque les parties du Monde contiennent toutes les terres émergées, mais les îles ne font pas partie des continents (au sens commun, ou au sens scientifique) puisque leur territoire n'est pas continu avec le reste du continent.

Il n'y a pas de définition unique d'un continent. C'est pourquoi les cultures et les sciences ont des listes différentes de continents. En général, un continent doit être une grande étendue, composée de terre ferme avec des limites géologiques significatives. Bien que certains considèrent qu'il n'y ait que quatre ou cinq continents, on considère habituellement qu'il y en a six ou sept.

Deux des plus grandes oppositions portent sur l'Europe et l'Asie (voir Limites de l'Europe) qui pourraient être unifiées (Eurasie) et sur l'Amérique du Nord et l'Amérique du Sud qui formeraient l'Amérique. Quelques géographes proposent de regrouper l'Europe, l'Asie et l'Afrique en une Eurafrasie.

Le modèle à sept continents est souvent utilisé en Europe de l'Ouest et en Amérique du Nord. Le modèle à six continents (Eurasie) est très utilisé en Amérique du Nord, et est le modèle de choix pour la communauté scientifique. Enfin, le modèle unissant les Amériques est utilisé en Europe de l'Est et en Amérique du Sud.

Le drapeau olympique représente cinq anneaux entrelacés symbolisant les cinq continents unis par l'esprit olympique. L'Amérique n'est ici considérée que comme un unique continent. L'Antarctique n'y est pas compté, car ce continent n'est toujours que temporairement habité.

Les îles sont habituellement considérées comme appartenant au continent dont elles sont le plus proche. Par exemple, les Canaries quoique espagnoles sont rattachées à l'Afrique, les Baléares font partie de l'Europe et les îles du Pacifique appartiennent à l'Océanie.

Les continents sont parfois combinés pour donner des supercontinents ou subdivisés pour des sous-continents.

12683


Source: Continent - Wikipédia

Len Ganley Stance
30-01-2008, 17:02
The French probably consider themselves to be a Continent.

Penelope
30-01-2008, 17:10
Il n'y a pas de définition unique d'un continent. C'est pourquoi les cultures et les sciences ont des listes différentes de continents. En général, un continent doit être une grande étendue, composée de terre ferme avec des limites géologiques significatives. Bien que certains considèrent qu'il n'y ait que quatre ou cinq continents, on considère habituellement qu'il y en a six ou sept.In case you don't read French, the text says:

There is no one definition of a continent. That is why different cultures and sciences have different lists of continents. In general, a continent should be a large mass of land, with distinctive geological limits. Although some consider that there are only four or five continents, it is generally held that there are six or seven.

pjw
30-01-2008, 19:43
It’s OK; in fact, it’s just as funny to Americans to see such amazing ignorance. Moreover, I don’t have to feel guilty about posting this hilarious video: YouTube - Somebody Stole Hitlers Car (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=T8dl4faCpJE)

Unbelievable footage. I can´t get believe they got these guys actually saying all that stuff. It´s know wonder they couldn´t get their act together when they were all like this. Who can confirm if this footage is real? :question:And I can´t believe 2 women can say such things to eachother near the end. :ak:Absolutely mind-boggling to hear A.H.´s real opinion! Very disturbed creature.:11721::11721::11721::11721:

Penelope
30-01-2008, 19:51
Unbelievable footage. I can´t get believe they got these guys actually saying all that stuff. It´s know wonder they couldn´t get their act together when they were all like this. Who can confirm if this footage is real? :question:And I can´t believe 2 women can say such things to eachother near the end. :ak:Absolutely mind-boggling to hear A.H.´s real opinion! Very disturbed creature.:11721::11721::11721::11721:
Uh, those subtitles don't match the dialogue at all. Or were you joking, too?

SalTheReturn
30-01-2008, 20:54
Uh, those subtitles don't match the dialogue at all. Or were you joking, too?

penelope you are starting to impress me...how many languages do you know?:7525:

J.D.
30-01-2008, 21:44
Personally I don't think Eurasia is two continents, but for the sake of communication I bow to the greater convention.
I think the European peninsula being a continent is a political concoction created by some overly cultured Europeans.
At least the Americas have the Panama Canal.

A lot of people from Texas refer to the country of Texas. I suspect that they are not joking.

Penelope
31-01-2008, 11:10
penelope you are starting to impress me...how many languages do you know?:7525:
English (naturally), French, German, Russian and Spanish. I did take Italian for fun when I was studying abroad in Germany, but it was just the beginning level.

Albertina
31-01-2008, 12:49
In case you don't read French, the text says:

Geez, how is that for an arrogance...

Penelope
31-01-2008, 12:53
Now, why is that arrogance, Albertina? How many people participating in this thread read French, do you think? I thought it would have been rude to just leave it unexplained and assume that everyone could read French.

pjw
31-01-2008, 14:00
It’s OK; in fact, it’s just as funny to Americans to see such amazing ignorance. Moreover, I don’t have to feel guilty about posting this hilarious video: YouTube - Somebody Stole Hitlers Car (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=T8dl4faCpJE)

You´re right dude. Priorities. Talking about cars when they shoulda been talking about stopping tanks. Oh well I guess he learnt his lesson the hard way

pjw
31-01-2008, 14:02
English (naturally), French, German, Russian and Spanish. I did take Italian for fun when I was studying abroad in Germany, but it was just the beginning level.

:mml:Whereabouts in Germany? Penelope, I´m in Regensburg, Bavaria. Kind of between Nürnberg and München. What were you doing in Germany?:mml:

Penelope
31-01-2008, 14:45
:mml:Whereabouts in Germany? Penelope, I´m in Regensburg, Bavaria. Kind of between Nürnberg and München. What were you doing in Germany?:mml:
I was in Bonn for one semester, and Oldengburg for two. Just finishing up my German degree.

pjw
31-01-2008, 18:53
I was in Bonn for one semester, and Oldengburg for two. Just finishing up my German degree.

:mml::mml:Respect. Like it when people take the time and have the motivation to learn languages. People who speak more than one language, except for immigrants of course, are few and far between where I originally come from. Oz. Can I ask you some more about Germany in particular as I´m here?
:11721::11721::11721:
1. Why Germany or, more specifically, why did you wanna study German?
2. Did you feel good here, impressions, like the place etc?
3. What things did you enjoy here?
4. Did you find the people friendly, open, warm, make friends easily? Tell us your impression of the Germans. (if you want:D)
:11721::11721::11721:
5. Just off the top of my head Oldenburg is 100 kms south of Bremen and Hamburg, and Bonn is on the Rhine near Koblenz south of the Ruhr, although capital city for a while, quite small and nowadays probably dead. Is my assumption correct? Although as it has a uni it´s probably rocking like Regensburg, where I´ve been now since before 2000.

This sounds like the questions the consular official asks when being drilled applying for a visa. Sorry. I´m just curious:mml::mml:

Penelope
31-01-2008, 19:04
I will answer this tomorrow, OK? I have to run off to the pet food store before they close to get some antibiotics for one of my babies.:wavey:

Penelope
01-02-2008, 12:36
1. Why Germany or, more specifically, why did you wanna study German?My mother's family were immigrants from Germany (via a couple hundred years in Russia :))

2. Did you feel good here, impressions, like the place etc?The first semester, in Bonn, I did not like as much as the year in Oldenburg. I attribute this to having too high expectations the first time, being in classes with other people learning German as a foreign language only--and not getting much face time with actual German students, and German's tendency to open up and be real friendly after about 4 or 5 months--just when it was time for us to return to the U.S.

The second time, in Oldenburg, since I had already earned my PNDS in Bonn, I was in the regular university classes with German students. And since I was there a full year, I got more socializing with them than the first time around.

3. What things did you enjoy here? I certainly did not enjoy the weather! :11721: cloudy and rainy most of the time. But I still had fun. Of course, because it was my first real time away from my parents, I drank quite a bit :11581:and did some stupid stuff. I saw some operas at Beethovenhalle (he was from the Bonn area), bought my first pair of Birkenstocks (the factory is right outside of Bonn), discovered Italian food (besides just spag w/meat sauce), experienced Berlin on strike (Wagner is just not the same without costumes and decorations:5387:), and went techno dancing :1306:and drove my bike home at 5am tipsy. And I learned to swim and got my Seeferdchen certificate :hooray:

4. Did you find the people friendly, open, warm, make friends easily? Tell us your impression of the Germans. As I said earlier, they take a while to open up. It's not that they are unfriendly; It just seems that you begin to be invited to parties and other people's homes after they've known you for a few months.

5.Just off the top of my head Oldenburg is 100 kms south of Bremen and Hamburg, and Bonn is on the Rhine near Koblenz south of the Ruhr, although capital city for a while, quite small and nowadays probably dead. Is my assumption correct? Although as it has a uni it´s probably rocking like Regensburg, where I´ve been now since before 2000.Bonn was still the capital when I was there, although the changeover was happening, and prices were going up in Berlin. People were complaining about the cost of supporting the unification process. It was a quiet town, but had had that reputation for quite a while--they called it a village. There were a lot of gypsies, and it used to make me very angry that the gypsy men would sit around drinking in the park, while the women and children went out and begged. :cussing:

pjw
01-02-2008, 14:16
1. Why Germany or, more specifically, why did you wanna study German?My mother's family were immigrants from Germany (via a couple hundred years in Russia :))
So many people immigrated from Germany to Ukraine, Russia, Romania etc. Some as long ago as 800 years. I would like to find out why. I don´t think they were generally poor as a rule, like refugees, but I don´t know. Maybe they had money and willingness to investigate opportunities in these other countries. Of course, alot also went to the States, South America and even Australia. One thing is for sure, they tended to keep in their groups, retaining cultural traditions and language alive. They didn´t tend to mix. Especially in Romania. I know that for sure. If they had mixed you would probably have lost your personal connection with Germany after 100 years. These German communities in Romania were under pressure after WW2 because they had joined German units and fought against the Russians. Lots of men had to hide for months, otherwise be taken to Russia after the war. The situation of Germans in Ukraine and Russia was however far worse. Those who survived were shipped to Siberia or Kazakstan. That is sadly the natural consequence of being the wrong nationality, in the wrong place, after a bitter war. Nowadays, people who can prove German roots are now allowed a German passports. Often they don´t speak much German.


2. Did you feel good here, impressions, like the place etc?The first semester, in Bonn, I did not like as much as the year in Oldenburg. I attribute this to having too high expectations the first time, being in classes with other people learning German as a foreign language only--and not getting much face time with actual German students, and German's tendency to open up and be real friendly after about 4 or 5 months--just when it was time for us to return to the U.S.
Yes, I know it takes time. In America people say it happens quicker, but the social connection is not as deep. I don´t know about Oz. Maybe pretty quick on the surface, then a big empty centre, that takes ages to fill. A German friend of mine is now in Oz and she said, Oh when can I get friends? I just told her to hang in there. In Germany I found it took time, lotsa patience, but the rewards are somehow great. I can´t judge as I´ve never been to the States to really compare. It´s great for me to have a few friends here now, but it took a long time. I don´t know why Germans feel so closed, even arrogant, at first. It´s a big turn off.


The second time, in Oldenburg, since I had already earned my PNDS in Bonn, I was in the regular university classes with German students. And since I was there a full year, I got more socializing with them than the first time around.
I can understand why a year was better then 6 months for you Penelope. Because 6 months is perhaps the time for the first fruits of friendship to blossom and that´s just when you had to leave


3. What things did you enjoy here? I certainly did not enjoy the weather! :11721: cloudy and rainy most of the time. But I still had fun. Of course, because it was my first real time away from my parents, I drank quite a bit :11581:and did some stupid stuff. I saw some operas at Beethovenhalle (he was from the Bonn area), bought my first pair of Birkenstocks (the factory is right outside of Bonn), discovered Italian food (besides just spag w/meat sauce), experienced Berlin on strike (Wagner is just not the same without costumes and decorations:5387:), and went techno dancing :1306:and drove my bike home at 5am tipsy. And I learned to swim and got my Seeferdchen certificate :hooray:.
Sounds like it was your first experience away from home and you had a great time. That it changed your life. This Seepferdchen certificate translates as Seahorse Certificate. Wow, I´m sure there´s a cute little picture of one smiling. Learning to swim, for those who don´t do it as kids, also respect.:mml:


4. Did you find the people friendly, open, warm, make friends easily? Tell us your impression of the Germans. As I said earlier, they take a while to open up. It's not that they are unfriendly; It just seems that you begin to be invited to parties and other people's homes after they've known you for a few months.
As we said, I don´t know why it takes so long and people here sometimes feel quite cold. Ozzies are generally so damned overnice. Opposite to Germany, so I got a lot more distant, colder and I like my space now. I like life in Germany pretty much, it´s home now. I like it better than Australia. I was just sleeping through life there. Germany´s a bit more interesting and I couldn´t do this job in Oz. And my son´s here, but is almost 11 and in 8 years I think maybe he wants to check out Oz for a while, then I´ve gotta make some serious decisions again. Great.:rolleyes:


5.Just off the top of my head Oldenburg is 100 kms south of Bremen and Hamburg, and Bonn is on the Rhine near Koblenz south of the Ruhr, although capital city for a while, quite small and nowadays probably dead. Is my assumption correct? Although as it has a uni it´s probably rocking like Regensburg, where I´ve been now since before 2000.Bonn was still the capital when I was there, although the changeover was happening, and prices were going up in Berlin. People were complaining about the cost of supporting the unification process. It was a quiet town, but had had that reputation for quite a while--they called it a village. There were a lot of gypsies, and it used to make me very angry that the gypsy men would sit around drinking in the park, while the women and children went out and begged. :cussing:
Sounds like Bonn was smallish, but that was perhaps an advantage over life in one of the bigger or not so nice cities. Oh I don´t know. They are of course rocking too. Size of my town is perfect at 140,000. Where do you live now Penelope? Happy there? Is it home?:rasta:

pjw
01-02-2008, 14:24
Now perhaps let´s get back to the US girl in the video. Is this their general level of world knowledge? E.g. Do people from Kansas really honestly think Canada is a bordering state?
:rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta:

Penelope
01-02-2008, 15:08
I was just discussing this over lunch with a colleague. My cousin married a girl who was on the debate team in school (now, from my time in school, those tend to be the nerdy, smart ones). Anyway a few years ago, I spent Christmas there, just after they got married. She asked me if Russia had a president (this was about one month after Putin had been to Crawford Ranch--about an hour's drive north of where this girl lived). And then she asked me if Alaska had a president. She also thought Canada was part of the U.S.

I would like to think she's unusual, but, sadly, I fear I am wrong.

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 15:30
I was just discussing this over lunch with a colleague. My cousin married a girl who was on the debate team in school (now, from my time in school, those tend to be the nerdy, smart ones). Anyway a few years ago, I spent Christmas there, just after they got married. She asked me if Russia had a president (this was about one month after Putin had been to Crawford Ranch--about an hour's drive north of where this girl lived). And then she asked me if Alaska had a president. She also thought Canada was part of the U.S.

I would like to think she's unusual, but, sadly, I fear I am wrong.

so your cousine too maybe not too smart but if the chick is as hot as the one in the video, well why not?:11033:

Penelope
01-02-2008, 15:44
Sal, Sal, Sal! How could you want to ally yourself to a woman whom you couldn't respect and with whom you could share little but sex? The sex would lose passion in a few years, and then you'd be stuck with a boring doll.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 15:48
I agree with Albertina that this thread is just an excuse to try to tar Americans with a false brush, if I might mix a metaphor. I sat in bars in Buenos Aires and listened to Argentines bitch that we put South America on a different continent with North America. Like we did that to try to offend them. I listened to Slovak people bitch that we don't know about Slovak geography or Slovak history, but they couldn't place Ohio on the US map. Ohio is twice as big as Slovakia.

Some Americans don't know European geography because it is not relevant to their daily lives. It is the same reason Europeans cannot, I wager, place Belize or Ghana or name the capital of Namibia. Europeans know Europe because they live here. You know the states around where you live; we know the states around where we live. The Argentines knew Bolivia from Peru from Uruguay from Chile because they nearby. Can you sketch a map of Argentina from memory and put in the bordering states? They can.

I don't know why others get so much glee about what Americans know or don't know. Frankly, I couldn't care less whether the population of France knows where Indiana is or can place Idaho. What difference does it make? The key is that I know where France is so I can get decent cheese and proper croissants.

Insecure people point out these things to try to reinforce the feeling in their mind that they are somehow more educated or culturally deeper or more complex as a people compared to Americans. I don't believe for one second that you more so, or in any global way "better", but if you sleep better at night thinking it is true, then God bless you while I roll my eyes and let you think what you want.

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 17:33
I agree with Albertina that this thread is just an excuse to try to tar Americans with a false brush, if I might mix a metaphor. I sat in bars in Buenos Aires and listened to Argentines bitch that we put South America on a different continent with North America. Like we did that to try to offend them. I listened to Slovak people bitch that we don't know about Slovak geography or Slovak history, but they couldn't place Ohio on the US map. Ohio is twice as big as Slovakia.

Some Americans don't know European geography because it is not relevant to their daily lives. It is the same reason Europeans cannot, I wager, place Belize or Ghana or name the capital of Namibia. Europeans know Europe because they live here. You know the states around where you live; we know the states around where we live. The Argentines knew Bolivia from Peru from Uruguay from Chile because they nearby. Can you sketch a map of Argentina from memory and put in the bordering states? They can.

I don't know why others get so much glee about what Americans know or don't know. Frankly, I couldn't care less whether the population of France knows where Indiana is or can place Idaho. What difference does it make? The key is that I know where France is so I can get decent cheese and proper croissants.

Insecure people point out these things to try to reinforce the feeling in their mind that they are somehow more educated or culturally deeper or more complex as a people compared to Americans. I don't believe for one second that you more so, or in any global way "better", but if you sleep better at night thinking it is true, then God bless you while I roll my eyes and let you think what you want.

you keep thinking alongside few others that not to be able to locate Finland equals to not to be able to locate Ohio

whilst the first if a nation the second is a country part of nation that everyone is able to locate: USA

europeans are surely more educated than americans, this is a fact mate...why cant you just take it this way?

PS. we know where is Belize, most of us know. what shocking with Yanks and rednecks it is that they even go to university but then dunno a damn thing about geography or other countries...in russia you will hear them phoning mum and saying "I am in Europe!" LOL LOL LOL

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 17:44
Well, Sal, Ohio is only part of a country and Slovakia is a whole country. You have a remarkable grasp of the obvious. But Slovakia not nearly as important Ohio (frankly there are probably more Slovaks there anyway), so I think you should all be better able to place Ohio than Slovakia on a map. Or Ohio instead of Chad or Haiti? We all know Europeans are more educated than Americans? What a crock that is.

But, again, if you sleep better thinking that you are more educated, than sweet dreams. I'd rather have an American education than British teeth.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 18:23
Well, Sal, Ohio is only part of a country and Slovakia is a whole country. You have a remarkable grasp of the obvious. But Slovakia not nearly as important Ohio (frankly there are probably more Slovaks there anyway), so I think you should all be better able to place Ohio than Slovakia on a map. Or Ohio instead of Chad or Haiti? We all know Europeans are more educated than Americans? What a crock that is.

But, again, if you sleep better thinking that you are more educated, than sweet dreams. I'd rather have an American education than British teeth.

My apologies to the Brits, of course. I meant that tongue in cheek... :)

Surfsup37
01-02-2008, 18:52
It is funny that this issue comes up so often. It seems that it is usually Europeans bringing this issue. I guess because they feel ignored? Obviously, Americans then retort back with questions about states and state capitals.

Try this, without any reference material, draw a map of Africa, and then fill in as many countries and capitals as you can. If you can correctly guess 90% of the countries and their capitals, then I believe you can pat yourself on the back. Your knowledge is broad. If not, then I think your knowledge is based on the fact that you live in Europe. :rolleyes:

Oh, and Moscow is considered by most people to be in Europe. That is why it is referred to as "European" Russia as opposed to "Asian" Russia.

elis
01-02-2008, 19:07
what shocking with Yanks and rednecks it is that they even go to university LOL LOL LOL

Okay sorry, this is off thread, but couldn't let it go. Yanks and rednecks? What are they the same thing?

Real rednecks don't go to no universities and are usually extremely proud in their xenophobia, and not having any idea where anything beyond the county they live in is. Also, call 'em rednecks, call 'em whatever you like...every country has their own version.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 19:13
...yeah, Sal, we go to university and then we "dunno" how to spell...

And I wish to clarify once more and for the record that I know lots of Brits with perfectly lovely teeth. My point is that stereotypes are always wrong.

You'll forgive me for running out, Sal, but I must urgently call my mum in Ohio and clarify that I am in Asia.

elis
01-02-2008, 19:40
Okay. Let's call her a poor dumb blonde, or more acurately an ignorant blonde. (For all we know, she could be potentially capable of performing brain surgery--note "potentially.") Don't all countries have them--or their own versions?

As for Americans being the idiots of the world and everyone else is better educated . . . that's a crock! There are educated Americans and uneducated ones. Just like in every other country. For some reason, as pointed out by Kirk10071, people LOVE when they can point at an American and show their stupidity and ignorance. Why that is, I don't know.

Sometimes I get the feeling that Americans just don't mind showing their ignorance. They're the "happy go luckys" of the world. They don't have that ingrained European sense of "saving face."

That being said, the only reason why I have a good knowledge of geography is because I went to Italian public schools. When I returned to the States (as a sophomore in high school) there was no "obligatory" geography class. My step-daughter, who just entered high school in the US doesn't have to take geography. She had a "geography" class in middle school, which they called "social studies," and I'm afraid all she got out of that was the fact that the world was round.

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 19:45
Okay sorry, this is off thread, but couldn't let it go. Yanks and rednecks? What are they the same thing?

Real rednecks don't go to no universities and are usually extremely proud in their xenophobia, and not having any idea where anything beyond the county they live in is. Also, call 'em rednecks, call 'em whatever you like...every country has their own version.

Elis Yanks and rednecks are not the same thing I know this

real rednecks may nowadays live in urban areas and go to uni

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 19:48
...yeah, Sal, we go to university and then we "dunno" how to spell...

And I wish to clarify once more and for the record that I know lots of Brits with perfectly lovely teeth. My point is that stereotypes are always wrong.

You'll forgive me for running out, Sal, but I must urgently call my mum in Ohio and clarify that I am in Asia.

Kirk thats not the point

the point is that you deny the american population being less prepared than the european one

take a subject as geography and we will know more (in fact 40% of americans could not indicate Afghanistan in a map despite declaring war to them LOL LOL), take foreign languages and we will be fluent in 1 or 2 whilst you...(no what you are going to tell me now...dude everyone knows english nowadays!)

take (my favourite to mock at americans) current politics and you will see americans still thinking in Europe we have got communism and that the Balkan war is still on

whats your point mate?

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 19:51
Okay. Let's call her a poor dumb blonde, or more acurately an ignorant blonde. (For all we know, she could be potentially capable of performing brain surgery--note "potentially.") Don't all countries have them--or their own versions?

As for Americans being the idiots of the world and everyone else is better educated . . . that's a crock! There are educated Americans and uneducated ones. Just like in every other country. For some reason, as pointed out by Kirk10071, people LOVE when they can point at an American and show their stupidity and ignorance. Why that is, I don't know.

Sometimes I get the feeling that Americans just don't mind showing their ignorance. They're the "happy go luckys" of the world. They don't have that ingrained European sense of "saving face."

That being said, the only reason why I have a good knowledge of geography is because I went to Italian public schools. When I returned to the States (as a sophomore in high school) there was no "obligatory" geography class. My step-daughter, who just entered high school in the US doesn't have to take geography. She had a "geography" class in middle school, which they called "social studies," and I'm afraid all she got out of that was the fact that the world was round.

i do not care Elis about the diatribe between europeans and americans, but it is a fact that the latter have a "different" degree of culture compared to us

never forget Europe is the continent which first settled university and which shaped world culture

our academic traditions are just too long and established to let others to prevails in terms of culture

Europe boasts the most sophisticated culture worldwide

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 19:52
Sal, Sal, Sal! How could you want to ally yourself to a woman whom you couldn't respect and with whom you could share little but sex? The sex would lose passion in a few years, and then you'd be stuck with a boring doll.

off thread

MissAnnElk
01-02-2008, 19:55
you will see americans still thinking in Europe we have got communism and that the Balkan war is still on

whats your point mate?

When I moved to Slovakia, I had SPANIARDS ask me if I was comfortable with that, given the war there and all.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 20:05
Kirk thats not the point

the point is that you deny the american population being less prepared than the european one

take a subject as geography and we will know more (in fact 40% of americans could not indicate Afghanistan in a map despite declaring war to them LOL LOL), take foreign languages and we will be fluent in 1 or 2 whilst you...(no what you are going to tell me now...dude everyone knows english nowadays!)

take (my favourite to mock at americans) current politics and you will see americans still thinking in Europe we have got communism and that the Balkan war is still on

whats your point mate?

You are right. We are ignorant ****s. We don't know where Africa is. We don't know foreign languages. Moi, par exemple. J'ai du mal á dire quoi que ce soit sauf en anglais. Je souffre chaque fois que je voyage. Entro en un restaurante y no entiendo ni una palabra de lo que leo. A keď musím niečo hovoriť, objednať si čo esť, to je katastrofa!! Никто меня не понимает и чувствую субя польным дураком!. Oui, t'as raison, si seulement les amérlocs pouvait apprendre des langues, viajar un poco en el mundo, учиться чему-то, všetko by bolo lepšie. No quiero nunca mas encontrarme en Kabul preguntandose "¿donde estoy? ¿Donde estoy?" C'est vraiment pénible, eh? Очень смутно.

elis
01-02-2008, 20:17
i do not care Elis about the diatribe between europeans and americans, but it is a fact that the latter have a "different" degree of culture compared to us

never forget Europe is the continent which first settled university and which shaped world culture

our academic traditions are just too long and established to let others to prevails in terms of culture

Europe boasts the most sophisticated culture worldwide

Jeee-sus. Puh...lease!! And the Greeks still think they're the creme de la creme because of Aristotle and Plato....yadda, yadda, yadda.

Whatever.

Why does it always have to be about "someone's better than someone else."

Sure "Europe boasts the most sophisticated culture worldwide" .... IF . . . that's your cup of tea. I'm sure Far Easterners wouldn't agree with you on that. It's all a question of perspective and what your own cultural-background is.

I hate to say it, but you almost sound like a xenophobe yourself. No one's saying that Europe isn't the cradle of western civilization.

Oh No...I see what's happening here...you've lured me into one of your webs of "going off thread" and getting snippy.

Okay. You win. Whatever.

Surfsup37
01-02-2008, 20:24
the point is that you deny the american population being less prepared than the european one

Less prepared for what, Sal? The majority of Americans will never go to Europe. The economies of our larger states are larger than most European countries. I like Europe, but to be honest, Europe is becoming more and more irrelevant. The world's and the US's future is in Asia: India, China, and the rest of the PacRim.

take a subject as geography and we will know more (in fact 40% of americans could not indicate Afghanistan in a map despite declaring war to them LOL LOL), take foreign languages and we will be fluent in 1 or 2 whilst you...(no what you are going to tell me now...dude everyone knows english nowadays!)

I learned German when I was young (living about 7000 or 8000 miles from Germany) you can drive to Germany. The nearest non-english speaking country was about 3000 miles away when I was growing up. The whole scale is different. I don't believe that I even met a non-american until I went to university. I first spoke German to an German ten years after studying the German language. ;)

take (my favourite to mock at americans) current politics and you will see americans still thinking in Europe we have got communism and that the Balkan war is still on

Sorry to remind you Sal, but don't forgot about the Italian Communist Party, they are still around. Oh, and yes NATO has thousands of troops (including Americans) in the Balkans. We are just not shooting at too many people at the moment. Any other questions? ;)

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 21:30
You are right. We are ignorant ****s. We don't know where Africa is. We don't know foreign languages. Moi, par exemple. J'ai du mal á dire quoi que ce soit sauf en anglais. Je souffre chaque fois que je voyage. Entro en un restaurante y no entiendo ni una palabra de lo que leo. A keď musím niečo hovoriť, objednať si čo esť, to je katastrofa!! Никто меня не понимает и чувствую субя польным дураком!. Oui, t'as raison, si seulement les amérlocs pouvait apprendre des langues, viajar un poco en el mundo, учиться чему-то, všetko by bolo lepšie. No quiero nunca mas encontrarme en Kabul preguntandose "¿donde estoy? ¿Donde estoy?" C'est vraiment pénible, eh? Очень смутно.

you take things personally mate and thats wrong dude

in fact let me tell you that i know enough of america and americans to know that there are mainly two classes of them: the ones who have extensively resided abroad and have an active interest about foreign country (ie. you) and the ones who knows a damn crap about the rest of the world

dude, can i really ask a thing? do you really think that europeans are as cultured (or uncultured) like americans? or yours it is just a reaction?

then you would be better go fooling someone else for the following reason:
only in my city there are thousands of them, they all go to uni and yet dude, have no clue about lots of issues

sorry man but i have never met europeans not to be able to locate mexico, or guatemala or whatever. sorry man i have met plenty of educated american denoting no knowledge of the outside world

do not take it personally mate, you are the GoodAmerican and as any of the good ones fled your country asap disguested by the general attitude of your fellow nationals. never forget how strongly you despise americans and how you feel superior because of those couple of lines you have written in foreign languages (one of which is knows by lots of americans)

Sal

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 21:34
Jeee-sus. Puh...lease!! And the Greeks still think they're the creme de la creme because of Aristotle and Plato....yadda, yadda, yadda.

Whatever.

Why does it always have to be about "someone's better than someone else."

Sure "Europe boasts the most sophisticated culture worldwide" .... IF . . . that's your cup of tea. I'm sure Far Easterners wouldn't agree with you on that. It's all a question of perspective and what your own cultural-background is.

I hate to say it, but you almost sound like a xenophobe yourself. No one's saying that Europe isn't the cradle of western civilization.

Oh No...I see what's happening here...you've lured me into one of your webs of "going off thread" and getting snippy.

Okay. You win. Whatever.

Elis thanks for your usual share of uncalled for insults (one of which really hurted me)

I am not saying that Europe is good and the rest of the world is culturally worthless, I am telling you that the average level of culture of, lets say, EU member is surely higher than that displayed by an American

who are we trying to fool in here?

SalTheReturn
01-02-2008, 21:37
the point is that you deny the american population being less prepared than the european one

Less prepared for what, Sal? The majority of Americans will never go to Europe. The economies of our larger states are larger than most European countries. I like Europe, but to be honest, Europe is becoming more and more irrelevant. The world's and the US's future is in Asia: India, China, and the rest of the PacRim.

take a subject as geography and we will know more (in fact 40% of americans could not indicate Afghanistan in a map despite declaring war to them LOL LOL), take foreign languages and we will be fluent in 1 or 2 whilst you...(no what you are going to tell me now...dude everyone knows english nowadays!)

I learned German when I was young (living about 7000 or 8000 miles from Germany) you can drive to Germany. The nearest non-english speaking country was about 3000 miles away when I was growing up. The whole scale is different. I don't believe that I even met a non-american until I went to university. I first spoke German to an German ten years after studying the German language. ;)

take (my favourite to mock at americans) current politics and you will see americans still thinking in Europe we have got communism and that the Balkan war is still on

Sorry to remind you Sal, but don't forgot about the Italian Communist Party, they are still around. Oh, and yes NATO has thousands of troops (including Americans) in the Balkans. We are just not shooting at too many people at the moment. Any other questions? ;)

Europe becoming more irrelevant? are you high on sth dude?
coz, sorry to inform you, we are the only real living superpower

i dont want to play who has got it bigger mate, but dunno how you can come out with such a lie (or maybe they really told you so?) and at the same time tryint to elevate the status of the average americans

ezik
01-02-2008, 21:38
Elis thanks for your usual share of uncalled for insults (one of which really hurted me)

I am not saying that Europe is good and the rest of the world is culturally worthless, I am telling you that the average level of culture of, lets say, EU member is surely higher than that displayed by an American

who are we trying to fool in here?

Well bring on the facts, then.

Average level of culture, who does one define that? What is higher, lower? Definitions, please.

elis
01-02-2008, 21:48
Elis thanks for your usual share of uncalled for insults (one of which really hurted me)

I am not saying that Europe is good and the rest of the world is culturally worthless, I am telling you that the average level of culture of, lets say, EU member is surely higher than that displayed by an American

who are we trying to fool in here?

Yikes! "usual share of uncalled for insults"???? Holy Have-No-Idea-What- You're-Talking-About. Are you mistaking me for someone else? And if I did hurt you--by no means was I trying to. So . . . my apologies. Pace?

About the cultural thing. (And I don't think we're going off thread here...)

MW (standard dictionary used by the American publishing industry) defines "culture" as follows (I have deleted references to growing crops, as I don't think they relate to our discussion):

"2 : the act of developing by education, discipline, social experience : the training or refining of the moral and intellectual faculties
4 a : the state of being cultivated ; especially : the enlightenment and excellence of taste acquired by intellectual and aesthetic training : the intellectual and artistic content of civilization : refinement in manners, taste, thought b : acquaintance with and taste in fine arts, humanities, and broad aspects of science as distinguished from vocational, technical, or professional skill or knowledge
5 a : the total pattern of human behavior and its products embodied in thought, speech, action, and artifacts and dependent upon man's capacity for learning and transmitting knowledge to succeeding generations through the use of tools, language, and systems of abstract thought b : the body of customary beliefs, social forms, and material traits constituting a distinct complex of tradition of a racial, religious, or social group <a nation with many cultures> <Plains Indian culture> c : a complex of typical behavior or standardized social characteristics peculiar to a specific group, occupation or profession, sex, age grade, or social class <youth culture> <middle class culture> d : a recurring assemblage (as of artifacts, house types, methods of burial, and other evidences of a way of life) that differentiates a group of archaeological sites"

By this definition, one really cannot say that any one culture is "above" or "below" another. It's, once again, just a matter of perspective.

What does your Zingarelli say?

elis
01-02-2008, 21:52
Oops. Forgot to point out that the definition says nothing about having to know any geography.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 21:55
You know, Sal, you're right. I don't think Europeans are "more" cultured or "smarter". They are differently cultured. And truth be told, I prefer the European one. I prefer the French who talk about ideas and appreciate good food and good wine over a meal. I prefer the Spanish who just seem to enjoy life. I prefer the Italians who look for beauty in things. I like the Brits, and their civilized discourse. I like German, too. I have the hardest time sitting with Americans who want to talk about sports and money. And I will admit, the reason they don't often know about other places is that they just don't care. And I hate being told by them that Christ is my friend etc. etc.

This does not mean Americans are stupider or that their culture is less valuable. It has served them well. It has made American, at least for a time, a world power and one that was once respected and I hope will be again. It is a country of good people, people. And I don't like it when people make fun of them or think they are stupid because some dumb box doesn't know Europe. I have lived in Asia, South America, Western Europe, and Eastern Europe. I speak four languages fluently other than English and can manage read a newpaper in at least two more. I am not a typical American, but neither is the typical American THAT ignorant.

I DO prefer the European culture over the American one, and I DO prefer it over the Chinese one. But I don't laugh at the Americans or the Chinese. There cultures are just as worthy, and just as deep, just as interesting in their own way. I was watching Japanese porn this morning. The girls squeak and moan like little girls during "it" and God, that is irritating. It doesn't mean that they are less worthy. It just means I have no plans whatsoever to have sex with one. Not better, not worse, just not my cup of tea.

So, yes, Sal, I would probably, truth be told, rather have a beer with you than with most of America. And I try not to take things personally, and I should not have.

Truce, mate?

Bels
01-02-2008, 22:02
Ok Albertina,
If you think so. But I never said one word against Americans. Nobody did. Australians are by far the worst in my opinion. That's why I left.

But a last little whisper in your ear, from Carl Gustav Jung, if you can't laugh at yourself, everybody else will.

Now quoting shrinks is really boring so let's change the subject, shall we?

Brits and Americans have been bashing each other for over a hundred years, look not only here, but other forums, especially those from newspaper forums such as the Times. But look when Britain has a problem with a country, such as Iran and Britain, or Argentina, Britain and the Falklands and look at the posts offering gun-ho support. So bashing and then in times of trouble it's support. We are like brothers to brothers, we bash and we also support each other at the same time. And loh and behold any foreigner who argues between us. Yes, I know for some they will see this as the wrong perspective.

One of the biggest and most popular threads with Americans was in the times forum when Britain had conflict with Iran. The Americans and the Brits were together on this one. Ok some Brits claimed that it was none of your damned business, but hey! we're all different.

elis
01-02-2008, 22:02
You know, Sal, you're right. I don't think Europeans are "more" cultured or "smarter". They are differently cultured. And truth be told, I prefer the European one. I prefer the French who talk about ideas and appreciate good food and good wine over a meal. I prefer the Spanish who just seem to enjoy life. I prefer the Italians who look for beauty in things. I like the Brits, and their civilized discourse. I like German, too. I have the hardest time sitting with Americans who want to talk about sports and money. And I will admit, the reason they don't often know about other places is that they just don't care. And I hate being told by them that Christ is my friend etc. etc.

This does not mean Americans are stupider or that their culture is less valuable. It has served them well. It has made American, at least for a time, a world power and one that was once respected and I hope will be again. It is a country of good people, people. And I don't like it when people make fun of them or think they are stupid because some dumb box doesn't know Europe. I have lived in Asia, South America, Western Europe, and Eastern Europe. I speak four languages fluently other than English and can manage read a newpaper in at least two more. I am not a typical American, but neither is the typical American THAT ignorant.

I DO prefer the European culture over the American one, and I DO prefer it over the Chinese one. But I don't laugh at the Americans or the Chinese. There cultures are just as worthy, and just as deep, just as interesting in their own way. I was watching Japanese porn this morning. The girls squeak and moan like little girls during "it" and God, that is irritating. It doesn't mean that they are less worthy. It just means I have no plans whatsoever to have sex with one. Not better, not worse, just not my cup of tea.

So, yes, Sal, I would probably, truth be told, rather have a beer with you than with most of America. And I try not to take things personally, and I should not have.

Truce, mate?

Couldn't have said it better myself! Although know nothing about the Japanese porn and would prefer to keep it that way. :)

MissAnnElk
01-02-2008, 22:05
Elis thanks for your usual share of uncalled for insults (one of which really hurted me)

Whoa! "usual share of uncalled for insults"?

The woman has been on the forum for about ten minutes. And most of the time she has been making us laugh (if I may speak for the larger group) with her amusing stories of settling in to her new life here in Moscow.

Deep breaths everyone.

kirk10071
01-02-2008, 22:07
Oh, I don't know. You should watch once, just for the cultural experience. I didn't think I would like it, but at first it was interesting. And the more I watched, the more interesting it was. In fact, it got really interesting, at one point....

...but then, suddenly it wasn't interesting anymore and I turned it off.

Bels
01-02-2008, 22:12
Originally Posted by Penelope
Sal, Sal, Sal! How could you want to ally yourself to a woman whom you couldn't respect and with whom you could share little but sex? The sex would lose passion in a few years, and then you'd be stuck with a boring doll.

off thread (stated Sal)

:10479: Sal, she's getting jealous. You're her ally, and stick with it.

:uk::uk::uk:

joners66
02-02-2008, 01:21
In the words of the great Ben kingsley from the film Sexy beast.....
No no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no NO
Europe is NOT a country its an appendage to the Uk where all democracy and most of the basic inventions that have benefited mankind originated from. Just so you little Euro freaks get it into proportion one shitty little college in one shitty little fen town in Cambridgeshire has had 37 Noble prize winners Sort of puts the Euro song competition into proportion doesn't it. So go on now. bang on about inventing brie you tossers......................

SalTheReturn
02-02-2008, 02:21
I was called a xenophobe by Elis.

This is what hurted me.

joners66
02-02-2008, 02:24
I cant believe that!!!!

elis
02-02-2008, 09:10
I was called a xenophobe by Elis.

This is what hurted me.

I didn't call you one. I just said that you sounded like one.

No hard feelings...

jumatre
02-02-2008, 17:00
When I moved to Slovakia, I had SPANIARDS ask me if I was comfortable with that, given the war there and all.

Whow, miss Elk...real spaniards felt concerned about the war in Slovakia? Having 1.000 soldiers in the former Yugoslavia (specially in Bosnia) and reporting nearly everyday about the live conditions of these troups on TV and newspapers in Spain, I wonder that the spaniards believe that a country located near to the former Yugoslavia lives under war conditions (because is Slovakia never was war during the last 60 years, right?)... Additionally I will tell you that countries like Hungary, Czech Republik, Slovakia etc., are the preferred destinations for the middle-class spanish tourist. Are you sure that your spaniards were not coming from Miami Florida? hmmmm...

MissAnnElk
02-02-2008, 17:08
Whow, miss Elk...real spaniards felt concerned about the war in Slovakia? Having 1.000 soldiers in the former Yugoslavia (specially in Bosnia) and reporting nearly everyday about the live conditions of these troups on TV and newspapers in Spain, I wonder that the spaniards believe that a country located near to the former Yugoslavia lives under war conditions (because is Slovakia never was war during the last 60 years, right?)... Additionally I will tell you that countries like Hungary, Czech Republik, Slovakia etc., are the preferred destinations for the middle-class spanish tourist. Are you sure that your spaniards were not coming from Miami Florida? hmmmm...

Nope. I was standing in his apartment in Malaga. He had Czechoslovakia confused with Yugoslavia. I explained and he shrugged and said something about "All that part of the world was sort of vague" to him. He's my friend, but he's not going to win Weakest Link or Jeopardy. The point is that every country has people who pay attention to world events and people who don't.

I didn't see a lot of Spanish tourists in SK. Investors, maybe. But the Spaniards were more likely to go to Prague, Vienna, and Budapest.

SalTheReturn
02-02-2008, 18:28
Whow, miss Elk...real spaniards felt concerned about the war in Slovakia? Having 1.000 soldiers in the former Yugoslavia (specially in Bosnia) and reporting nearly everyday about the live conditions of these troups on TV and newspapers in Spain, I wonder that the spaniards believe that a country located near to the former Yugoslavia lives under war conditions (because is Slovakia never was war during the last 60 years, right?)... Additionally I will tell you that countries like Hungary, Czech Republik, Slovakia etc., are the preferred destinations for the middle-class spanish tourist. Are you sure that your spaniards were not coming from Miami Florida? hmmmm...

i agree with you

i did not even respond MissAnnElk because i meant she chose the word SPaniards to mean those residing in the US

also i think that if she wanted to mean people from Spain she should have used Spanish

all Spanish know there is no war there

Wodin
02-02-2008, 22:14
Sal..Spaniards are the inhabitants of Spain, Spanish is the language they speak. Alternatively, it could be "the Spanish" or "the Spanish people".

MissAnnElk
02-02-2008, 22:19
Sal..Spaniards are the inhabitants of Spain, Spanish is the language they speak. Alternatively, it could be "the Spanish" or "the Spanish people".

That's what I would say, but perhaps in the end it is a question of writing/editorial style? I always said "Argentines" and not "Argentinians." I said "Slovaks" and not "Slovakians." The Brits tend to use the term "ladies" as a polite way to refer to a group of women, where I was taught that "ladies" are aristocratic and we are just "women." But that comes from the 1970s women's movement in the US midwest . . . so context plays a big part.

I will say that if I had meant Spanish speakers in the US, I would have said "Americans."

pjw
03-02-2008, 01:56
Just so you little Euro freaks get it into proportion one shitty little college in one shitty little fen town in Cambridgeshire has had 37 Noble prize winners Sort of puts the Euro song competition into proportion doesn't it. So go on now. bang on about inventing brie you tossers......................

Excuse me please. Eurovision contest fan. But please tell me when a Cambridge University have actually won the Eurovision song contest? Year and name of group please. Because from my sources I see they put in many entries but have never won it. A second and two thirds but no gold medal to date. So your evidence is based on warm air I think.:rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta:

SalTheReturn
03-02-2008, 02:26
Sal..Spaniards are the inhabitants of Spain, Spanish is the language they speak. Alternatively, it could be "the Spanish" or "the Spanish people".

listen dude i am sick of getting the crap from someone whos not even a EU

spaniards is in europe a dispregiative term to name the US immigrants

SalTheReturn
03-02-2008, 02:29
That's what I would say, but perhaps in the end it is a question of writing/editorial style? I always said "Argentines" and not "Argentinians." I said "Slovaks" and not "Slovakians." The Brits tend to use the term "ladies" as a polite way to refer to a group of women, where I was taught that "ladies" are aristocratic and we are just "women." But that comes from the 1970s women's movement in the US midwest . . . so context plays a big part.

I will say that if I had meant Spanish speakers in the US, I would have said "Americans."

i cant depict the difference between Slovaks and Slovakians

in russian they can point the, by using 2 different terms, what/who is etnically russian and who/what belong territorially to russia

the above mentioned difference cannot be given in italian language for instance so that "rossiskaya" will be always translated as "russian", no difference from "russkaja"

pjw
03-02-2008, 02:56
listen dude i am sick of getting the crap from someone whos not even a EU

spaniards is in europe a dispregiative term to name the US immigrants

Hey Sal, burning the midnight oil too dude? Now just hang on a second here cos you lost me. Who´s not EU here? Because (although you took it back) you said in post 59:10475: that Europe is the whole wide world, didn´t you? :groan::groan::groan::groan::groan::groan::groan:

Wodin
03-02-2008, 12:43
listen dude i am sick of getting the crap from someone whos not even a EU

spaniards is in europe a dispregiative term to name the US immigrants

errrm Sal...it's the english language...nothing at all to do with the EU. As to it being a 'dispregiative' term...first time I'm hearing that.

SalTheReturn
03-02-2008, 14:02
errrm Sal...it's the english language...nothing at all to do with the EU. As to it being a 'dispregiative' term...first time I'm hearing that.

coz you arent EU (continental part)

TGP
03-02-2008, 15:37
Wow, what a long thread!

So, what's the final decision and verdict? :10806:

SalTheReturn
03-02-2008, 16:42
Wow, what a long thread!

So, what's the final decision and verdict? :10806:

that the world has 5 continents because this is what EU national are taught by their teachers

MissAnnElk
03-02-2008, 18:38
listen dude i am sick of getting the crap from someone whos not even a EU

spaniards is in europe a dispregiative term to name the US immigrants

"Spaniard" is pejorative? Color me surprised.

kirk10071
03-02-2008, 19:59
errrm Sal...it's the english language...nothing at all to do with the EU. As to it being a 'dispregiative' term...first time I'm hearing that.

Spaniard as perjorative? News to me, too.

SalTheReturn
03-02-2008, 20:04
Guys, I cant be wrong.

MissAnnElk
03-02-2008, 20:11
I didn't say you were wrong, Sal. I said I was surprised.

kirk10071
03-02-2008, 20:24
Guys, I cant be wrong.

Don't worry. We all without exception know you are omniscient, a fact long ago proven scientifically. No one doubts that late at night, in the strip clubs where you chat it up with your sodden mates while the girls ignore you that whole new lexicons of perjorative terms are coined and tossed about. So, if you say that, in your underground world, Spaniard is a nasty word, then it probably is. My point was that it is not a bad world in Ann Elk's (but I am constrained to point out that she dances in only the highest class of strip club).

MissAnnElk
03-02-2008, 20:26
I see I changed my avatar just in time, Kirk.

Penelope
04-02-2008, 12:02
i do not care Elis about the diatribe between europeans and americans, but it is a fact that the latter have a "different" degree of culture compared to us

never forget Europe is the continent which first settled university and which shaped world culture

our academic traditions are just too long and established to let others to prevails in terms of culture

Europe boasts the most sophisticated culture worldwide
Actually Sal, the first university in the world was in Africa, not Europe.

pjw
04-02-2008, 12:52
Actually Sal, the first university in the world was in Africa, not Europe.
:rasta::rasta:
Now we´re talking! I´m reading a book at the moment about the Romans, Penelope. But it also describes what was going on in North Africa at the time. Impressive.
:rasta::rasta:
A question for you Sal, do you know where Cathargo is? Perhaps it´s where the uni was. I gotta read on. Sal, As a punishment task for what you did yesterday.
1. Where is Cathargo?
2. Where is New Cathargo?
3. Name of the legendary Carthagian leader (around 260 BC)?
4. How long did the war between Rome and Cathargo last?
5. Why did the Carthagians invade Spain?
:rasta::rasta::rasta:
Look forward to your comments Sal. If you´re not the big history guy, don´t worry. Or prove me wrong!!!
:rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta:

TD
04-02-2008, 13:31
I´m reading a book at the moment about the Romans

One of the most amazing things I have ever read about Roman history was the Masters of Rome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia series by Colleen McCullough - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia which spans from January 1, 110 BCE through to January 16, 27 BCE.... have read the whole thing three times so far - highly recommended!

Amazon.com: First Man in Rome (Masters of Rome) (9780099462484): Colleen McCullough: Books@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41WX5GQP10L.@@AMEPARAM@@41WX5GQP10L

now back to our regularly scheduled thread

pjw
04-02-2008, 13:44
Hmmmmmmmmm. Colleen McCullough is an interesting Australian author. I´ll have to look at the link you´ve sent TD. If you´ve read it 3 times then it must be good.
:rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta:

pjw
04-02-2008, 13:54
Don't worry. We all without exception know you are omniscient, a fact long ago proven scientifically. No one doubts that late at night, in the strip clubs where you chat it up with your sodden mates while the girls ignore you that whole new lexicons of perjorative terms are coined and tossed about. So, if you say that, in your underground world, Spaniard is a nasty word, then it probably is. My point was that it is not a bad world in Ann Elk's (but I am constrained to point out that she dances in only the highest class of strip club).

Hey MissAnnElk. In the famous words of Mr David Bowie: "Let´s dance!"

:rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta::rasta:

pjw
06-02-2008, 18:02
:10301::10301:
Surprising to hear that most people on the forum believe that Europe is a country, with it´s own flag, currency, capital city, freedom of movement, and a common identity.:10301::10301:
:10301::10301:
I guess if enough people say it, then it must be the truth.:10301::10301:
:10301::10301::10301:

Penelope
06-02-2008, 18:16
Who is "most people"? I think I read most of the thread, and I don't recall that... :mooooh:

pjw
06-02-2008, 18:38
Who is "most people"? I think I read most of the thread, and I don't recall that... :mooooh:

:question:

:question::question: Ok then so it seems like there may be a bit of contention, disagreement and contrasting opinions here. I´ll just check through the thread again quickly first:question::question:

:question::question: Please bear with me, Penelope, I´m just gonna watch the blond student again and see what she said first. She´s not as dumb as she really seems, is she?:question::question:

:question:

pjw
06-02-2008, 19:50
:evilgrin:
:evilgrin::evilgrin:

It is absolutely frightening that Europe now has a government which nobody voted for! That´s fine if all the individual reps are ok. So let´s dream on. Cos they´re not.

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Potentially evil reckless monsters abusing power. A nasty scenario when they change the constitution and have us all living as characters in an Orwellian novel. Terrified!:evilgrin:

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Wodin
06-02-2008, 20:06
:evilgrin:
:evilgrin::evilgrin:

It is absolutely frightening that Europe now has a government which nobody voted for! That´s fine if all the individual reps are ok. So let´s dream on. Cos they´re not.

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Potentially evil reckless monsters abusing power. A nasty scenario when they change the constitution and have us all living as characters in an Orwellian novel. Terrified!:evilgrin:

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Europe does not have a government. Not as far as we are concerned anyway. There's a bunch of Commissioners appointed by each state (presumably by the government in power who, in theory represents the will of the majority of the people) and a consultative assembly which is elected directly by the citizens of the EU.

pjw
06-02-2008, 20:14
:vader::vader::vader::vader:

Propaganda and lies. They have limitless power and a truly unknown mission. Look at the way all these little countries want to join. Don´t trust what they tell you Wodin.:vader::vader::vader:

:vader::vader::vader::vader:

pjw
06-02-2008, 20:38
:trooper::trooper::trooper::trooper:

Does anybody know anything about the new European smart chipcard with electronically encoded information? Everything from dialled numbers on telephone to who you voted for in the last election. Alot of people are against it, will do anything to stop it, but most people don´t even know it´s coming as soon as end of 2009.:trooper::trooper::trooper:

:trooper::trooper::trooper::trooper: