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Gypsy
08-12-2011, 11:23
Can't remember when I was last so happy to see a football result as the vile scum from Old Trafford lost to "mighty" Basel. PMSL.

Brilliant. The multi millionaires with a team costing around £150m trounced by Basel who cost 3s/6d.

And this from arguably the easiest group (as usual) in the competition. Fantastic.

Shame about City though - they had a tough group and no shame in coming behind Bayern and Napoli.

Judge
08-12-2011, 11:43
Yes, I went to sleep with a huge smile on my face...Week started bad with Liverpool losing Monday night,but looks like it's ending on a high note.
Now reading the Sports news,Fergie vs Keane, the smile is still there..Manchester just got busy on a Thursday night..Channel 5 licking their chops..
I was wondering what is the combine total cost of the two Manchester teams , plus wages and what not...It must be one staggering amount.

City had a tough group and was always going to be hard for them, they nearly did it, but Napoli got the result they needed..
Utd on the other hand, they had one of the easiest groups ever seen in the history of the Champs League..


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/15853955.stm

You're right again about Rooney, failed to delivery again when it mattered.

martpark
08-12-2011, 22:52
Yeah, a bitter-sweet night. A lot of Utd fans on Five Live telling Fergie to leave. Ah, how soon they forget. The mystery remains what will happen to them. They are clinging to 1-0 victories and this could be a blow to their self-confidence.
I imagine they'll spend big in Jan.

It was always going to be tough for City in their group and with the lack of experience. Then the league position also applied more pressure. If we win a trophy this year, we'll be content.

Judge
09-12-2011, 00:24
Yeah, a bitter-sweet night. A lot of Utd fans on Five Live telling Fergie to leave. Ah, how soon they forget. The mystery remains what will happen to them. They are clinging to 1-0 victories and this could be a blow to their self-confidence.
I imagine they'll spend big in Jan.

Only fickle fans could be wanting Fergie's head after that shameful defeat.


It was always going to be tough for City in their group and with the lack of experience. Then the league position also applied more pressure. If we win a trophy this year, we'll be content.

Are you sure that the money men at City will be happy with only the League Cup?
I think only the Prem League will justify the amount of money that's been spent on City..If Mancini doesn't delivery this year then his job will be on the line...You must remember that Mancini isn't one of the best five mangers in the world.Mancini only did so-so(won a few Scudettos) at Inter Milan and this was because AC and Juve were sent packing for a few years.

Tony P
09-12-2011, 01:07
While falolloped comftybold on botty at internetty I saw titlelode "Deep joy!"

Then filled with multitude of happy thorkus....

Ahh! Deep Joy. Indeed.

RIP

TolkoRaz
09-12-2011, 01:52
Perhaps we should fatten up the already plump & uselessly overrated, over paid Rooney and have him for Christmas dinner :D

martpark
09-12-2011, 02:01
Only fickle fans could be wanting Fergie's head after that shameful defeat.



Are you sure that the money men at City will be happy with only the League Cup?
I think only the Prem League will justify the amount of money that's been spent on City..If Mancini doesn't delivery this year then his job will be on the line...You must remember that Mancini isn't one of the best five mangers in the world.Mancini only did so-so(won a few Scudettos) at Inter Milan and this was because AC and Juve were sent packing for a few years.

When your top of the league, the League Cup is not really the objective. Mancini said today he'd like to win the Prem and the Europa Cup.... he doesn't have the typical snobbish attitude to it that one sees in the Brit press.

The 'job is on the line' is a cliche from last season. Our owners are quite patient. They got rid of Hughes because he wasn't their choice. Winning a few scuddetti at Inter is a big deal, no matter the circumstances. Look at The Benitez years at inter.

And who are the top five managers? Jose, fergie, ???

Judge
09-12-2011, 12:32
When your top of the league, the League Cup is not really the objective. Mancini said today he'd like to win the Prem and the Europa Cup.... he doesn't have the typical snobbish attitude to it that one sees in the Brit press.

I only mentioned the League Cup, cos you said '' If we win a trophy this year, we'll be content''
A trophy is better than nothing, but if you don't win the league this year then pressure will be greater next year for City to delivery the Premiership. Your owners for now are saying nice things and know that time is needed, but not too much time...
I agree with the sacking of Hughes, the job was too big for him..Mancini on the other hand should do the job, he is a good manger.


The 'job is on the line' is a cliche from last season. Our owners are quite patient.
For now they are, your owners are business men and want results, a return on their investment..Right now it looks like City have the whole package, if the set of players you have now don't win the league this or next year then questions will be asked about the manager.



Winning a few scuddetti at Inter is a big deal, no matter the circumstances. Look at The Benitez years at inter.
Sure it was a big deal Inter didn't win it for years, were more or less robbed year after year..Mancini had money to spend and their two biggest rivals and others were relegated or deducted points, can't remember which.
Benitez was just unlucky, he wasn't allowed to spend and had a injury list that put most of his team out..Also, not very easy to motivate a team that just won everything in one year...Winning 3 titles in a row is hard for anyone to do..
I'm not saying that I don't rate Mancini, he's very good manager and since Liverpool don't have much of a chance to win the league this year, I would like either City or Spurs to win it..


And who are the top five managers? Jose, fergie, ???

In no particular order, More than 5...
Fergie.
Jose.
Wenger.
Guardiola
Capello
Heynckes
Gus
Dalglish :beerbros:
Ancelotti

Gypsy
09-12-2011, 14:19
In no particular order, More than 5...
Fergie.
Jose.
Wenger.
Guardiola
Capello
Heynckes
Gus
Dalglish :beerbros:
Ancelotti

Judge - Benitez was not unlucky at all. It was a bad appointment, wrong man at wrong club. He did well at Valencia with the team he inherited from Hector Cupar; a team full of great players on an upward path - with Santiago Cañizares, Roberto Ayala, Rubén Baraja, David Albelda, Vicente and Pablo Aimar providing the backbone to a formidable side that had reached back-to-back UEFA Champions League finals in 2000 and 2001, losing only on penalties in 2001 to Bayern Munich.

As to the other managers - agree with all except Dalglish. I really don't see what Liverpool fans see in him - apart from being a Liverpool Man.

The rest are unarguable in my opinion - I'd add Hector Cupar to it simply because of that fantastic Valencia team he created - add Mendieta to the list above - the best team in Spain for a few years, and fighting against the money Real Madrid and Barca threw around that says a lot.

Nobbynumbnuts
09-12-2011, 14:44
Judge - Benitez was not unlucky at all. It was a bad appointment, wrong man at wrong club.........

Well, he did win them the Champions League but don't let the facts get in the way of a nice story............;)

Gypsy
10-12-2011, 01:48
Well, he did win them the Champions League but don't let the facts get in the way of a nice story............;)

Another moronic comment - why am I not surprised.

For the record Benitez did not win the Champions League with Inter, that year it was won by Barcelona.

Judge
11-12-2011, 21:58
Judge - Benitez was not unlucky at all. It was a bad appointment, wrong man at wrong club. He did well at Valencia with the team he inherited from Hector Cupar; a team full of great players on an upward path - with Santiago Cañizares, Roberto Ayala, Rubén Baraja, David Albelda, Vicente and Pablo Aimar providing the backbone to a formidable side that had reached back-to-back UEFA Champions League finals in 2000 and 2001, losing only on penalties in 2001 to Bayern Munich.



The rest are unarguable in my opinion - I'd add Hector Cupar to it simply because of that fantastic Valencia team he created - add Mendieta to the list above - the best team in Spain for a few years, and fighting against the money Real Madrid and Barca threw around that says a lot.

Benitez took Valencia one step further and won the Spanish league ,first time in over 30years.Then Benitez did the double, league and UEFA Cup.He did bring in some players like Mista, who was top scorer..But yes, a lot of the work building the team was done by Hector Cupar.

The injury list at Inter didn't help at all..here's a list of players that were out.
Julio Caesar, Zanetti , Maicon(even when Maicon was back, we all know what Bale did to him),Stankovic, Motta , Samuel,Milito,Muntari and Cambiasso, I think even sneijder was out...
Rafa told Moratti ''back me or sack me.Moratti had to cut costs and didn't want to spend so Rafa was out.

Inter fans really took the Rafa, after the cocky controversial Mourinho , they took to Rafa like he was a chubby bear, all calm and softly spoken..But ,results don't lie.Rafa at least won one decent cup, the World Club Cup...
Inter are in 9th place in the league, not doing so well but could be dark horses for the Champs League.



As to the other managers - agree with all except Dalglish. I really don't see what Liverpool fans see in him - apart from being a Liverpool Man.

The King is back on his throne.....
Bringing Dalglish back brought stability to club, this can be seen with the way we play now, players and fans are happpy..The football is doing the talking now, not off field ownership stuff.All we need to do is keep working hard , keep this form and results will come our way,the situation at Liverpool is a lot better than it was last year..It's still work in progress at Liverpool, Dalglish is building a team that will soon be able to challenge once again for the title.

martpark
12-12-2011, 02:15
I only mentioned the League Cup, cos you said '' If we win a trophy this year, we'll be content''

City fans will be content. We haven't won much lately. It's other fans who think they have a divine right to win the league because they used to win it.

A trophy is better than nothing, but if you don't win the league this year then pressure will be greater next year for City to delivery the Premiership. Your owners for now are saying nice things and know that time is needed, but not too much time...
I agree with the sacking of Hughes, the job was too big for him..Mancini on the other hand should do the job, he is a good manger.

For now they are, your owners are business men and want results, a return on their investment..Right now it looks like City have the whole package, if the set of players you have now don't win the league this or next year then questions will be asked about the manager.
Actually, our owners aren't quick profit kinda guys. They want to diversify their oil money, so they chose sports. City are ahead of schedule according to them and that is due to Mancini and good investment.



Sure it was a big deal Inter didn't win it for years, were more or less robbed year after year..Mancini had money to spend and their two biggest rivals and others were relegated or deducted points, can't remember which.
Benitez was just unlucky, he wasn't allowed to spend and had a injury list that put most of his team out..Also, not very easy to motivate a team that just won everything in one year...Winning 3 titles in a row is hard for anyone to do..
I'm not saying that I don't rate Mancini, he's very good manager and since Liverpool don't have much of a chance to win the league this year, I would like either City or Spurs to win it..
I've seen all the teams in the prem and I don't think there's a better team than city out there, so it's ciTy's to lose, IMHO.


In no particular order, More than 5...
Fergie.
Jose.
Wenger.
Guardiola
Capello
Heynckes
Gus
Dalglish :beerbros:
Ancelotti
Fergie, Jose, trappattoni, ancelotti, Capello are proven.

What have you done for me lately catergory:
Guus
Heynckes won about as much as Frank Rijkaard.
Wenger
Dalglish
Sacchi
Scolari
Beckenbauer

Unproven:
Guardiola: his team is more or less Rijkaard's team with the top scorer from italy or Spain thrown in for good measure. All the veteran stars of FCB now were Frank's youth team.
Mancini: still young. Has won something at every club he's managed.
AVB: very young

Van Gaal is a tricky one. Has won a lot but not spoken of highly.

Gypsy
12-12-2011, 02:25
Sorry Judge, the facts just do not support the story about injuries to those players. Injuries were significantly worse after Leonardo took over, and he took them on to finish 2nd.

Under Benitez those players were unavailable for a total of 37 times - ie just under 2.5 per game. Under Leonardo for the first 15 games (Benitez had 15 games in serie A) 54 unavailable, 3.6 per game - and the first time Sneider was unavailable was for Leonardo's 1st game.

Samuel's 1st injury was game 12, only 3 before Benitez was fired. He was a bigger loss to Leonardo.

Any analysis at all shows Leonardo had a worse hand to play with.

Benitez alienated the players with his fixation on weights work in the gym - which was itself responsible for many of the injuries between games 9 and 15. As Sneider pointed out at the time - they are over 30 years old, weights work can only hurt. Players that old cannot safely bulk up - and in any case, why do it? It is this weights work that killed Torres' speed, incidentally.

The World Club Cup? Are you serious? Without looking it up tell me which mighty team they beat?

The European Super Cup vs the winners of the UEFA Cup is a reasonable thing to win, and he lost 2-0 to Athletico Madrid.

He took the Treble Winners and kicked the spirit out of them, whinged about injuries that were not in any way exceptional (apart from the self inflicted ones in the gym) in terms of numbers, and repeated his whining about transfers from Liverpool days.

He did well at Valencia, taking Cupar's team on, but his performance since suggests that was an aberration. He will make a return somewhere and it will be interesting to see what happens. I believe he is incapable of building a team - Liverpool were a worse team after he left than before he came, his buys were a disaster in the most part and he spent an absolute fortune for no return.

Judge
12-12-2011, 22:53
It's other fans who think they have a divine right to win the league because they used to win it.
Yeah well, it's getting close to a quarter of a century for some fans, so you can't blame fans for wanting what was once theirs year in year out..:D



Actually, our owners aren't quick profit kinda guys. They want to diversify their oil money, so they chose sports. City are ahead of schedule according to them and that is due to Mancini and good investment.

What schedule is that? Would be interesting to know..


I've seen all the teams in the prem and I don't think there's a better team than city out there, so it's ciTy's to lose, IMHO.
Not really, if you're in this position come March then it's yours to lose... A drop of points tonight and Man Utd will be right back at you...How City handles the pressure will be interesting, and we haven't had the usual Fergie mind games..



Fergie, Jose, trappattoni, ancelotti, Capello are proven.

What have you done for me lately catergory:
Guus
Heynckes won about as much as Frank Rijkaard.
Wenger
Dalglish
Sacchi
Scolari
Beckenbauer

Unproven:
Guardiola: his team is more or less Rijkaard's team with the top scorer from italy or Spain thrown in for good measure. All the veteran stars of FCB now were Frank's youth team.
Mancini: still young. Has won something at every club he's managed.
AVB: very young

Van Gaal is a tricky one. Has won a lot but not spoken of highly.

Mancini is a puppy compared to many of the above, and to be honest he shouldn't be mentioned in the same thread as Trappattoni,Beckenbauer and Sacchi.

I said before that Mancini is a good manager but will he be a great one? only time will tell.It's easy to be a good manger when you have a war chest of millions to spend...:12035:

Judge
12-12-2011, 23:21
Sorry Judge, the facts just do not support the story about injuries to those players. Injuries were significantly worse after Leonardo took over, and he took them on to finish 2nd.

Under Benitez those players were unavailable for a total of 37 times - ie just under 2.5 per game. Under Leonardo for the first 15 games (Benitez had 15 games in serie A) 54 unavailable, 3.6 per game - and the first time Sneider was unavailable was for Leonardo's 1st game.

Samuel's 1st injury was game 12, only 3 before Benitez was fired. He was a bigger loss to Leonardo.

Any analysis at all shows Leonardo had a worse hand to play with.

Benitez alienated the players with his fixation on weights work in the gym - which was itself responsible for many of the injuries between games 9 and 15. As Sneider pointed out at the time - they are over 30 years old, weights work can only hurt. Players that old cannot safely bulk up - and in any case, why do it? It is this weights work that killed Torres' speed, incidentally.

The World Club Cup? Are you serious? Without looking it up tell me which mighty team they beat?

The European Super Cup vs the winners of the UEFA Cup is a reasonable thing to win, and he lost 2-0 to Athletico Madrid.

He took the Treble Winners and kicked the spirit out of them, whinged about injuries that were not in any way exceptional (apart from the self inflicted ones in the gym) in terms of numbers, and repeated his whining about transfers from Liverpool days.

He did well at Valencia, taking Cupar's team on, but his performance since suggests that was an aberration. He will make a return somewhere and it will be interesting to see what happens. I believe he is incapable of building a team - Liverpool were a worse team after he left than before he came, his buys were a disaster in the most part and he spent an absolute fortune for no return.

A manger needs more than 6 months at a club to prove him ,Moratti didn't back him.I think Rafa was wrong to put Moratti in a corner like that,but if Rafa was told that he would have money to spend then who could blame him.
Injuries, diets or what not..Inter just wasn't for Rafa..



Rafa does have a very good track record at Liverpool and Valencia but when it comes to being able to spend, the money just wasn't there for him.
At Liverpool many times he had to sell to bring in new players, people think that Rafa spent millions but this isn't true.
Check this link out, it shows Rafa's spending at Liverpool.

This will keep you busy for a hour or two:soccer:
http://www.liverpool-kop.com/2010/10/rafa-benitezs-grossnet-spend-figures.html


In the eyes of many Liverpool fans Rafa will be held in high esteem because he won the Champs League for the club and put Liverpool at the top of European football for a few years, ranked 1st by Uefa( I think) and a force and all top teams feared Liverpool again..
Even if it's true that Rafa wasted millions on players(which manger doesn't? maybe Wenger) he made a lot of Liverpool fans happy.

Gypsy
13-12-2011, 10:08
I understand why Liverpool fans like Benitez - he managed to position himself as their man against the two americans. Fair enough. It worked.

But the Times article I posted here in November 2009 shows very clearly that he was lying when he talked about transfers. An independent analysis showed that up to that point only Chelsea had spent more than his Net £122m - ManU benefitted from the mad £80m for Ronaldo which kept their Net spend down.

Benitez in that period spent - Net - £154m more than Wenger who was constrained by the funding of the Emirates.

Have a look at these players and tell me which ones could seriously be considered Liverpool players - I mean proper Liverpool players like Beardsley, Keegan, Dalglish, McDermott etc

Agger, Kuyt, Johnson, Benyoun, Skrtel, Aurelio,I nsua, Garcia Arebeloa, Riera, Crouch, Josemi, Dossena, Keane, Kromkamp, Voronin.

In his first year he spent a Net £41m and 3 years later none of the 8 players he signed were still at the club.

The ream that won the Big Cup he inherited from the idiot frenchman - contained 2 Benitez signings I think.

Benitez is a good tactician but a lousy man manger (according to his No 2 that he takes with him) hence Alonso wanting to leave, and terrible at buying players. Worse than Lord Ferg - and that takes some doing. But he remains popular because Liverpool fans bought the myth about transfers,

If the 2 Americans really did starve him of funds, what was the £200m that they lost in addition to the purchase price, that they claimed in the court case. A sum not disputed by Liverpool incidentally. The accounts show the spends and so do independent reports, and so does a High Court case.

Benitez wasted a fortune.

Judge
13-12-2011, 12:25
I understand why Liverpool fans like Benitez - he managed to position himself as their man against the two americans. Fair enough. It worked.

But the Times article I posted here in November 2009 shows very clearly that he was lying when he talked about transfers. An independent analysis showed that up to that point only Chelsea had spent more than his Net £122m - ManU benefitted from the mad £80m for Ronaldo which kept their Net spend down.

Benitez in that period spent - Net - £154m more than Wenger who was constrained by the funding of the Emirates.

Have a look at these players and tell me which ones could seriously be considered Liverpool players - I mean proper Liverpool players like Beardsley, Keegan, Dalglish, McDermott etc

Agger, Kuyt, Johnson, Benyoun, Skrtel, Aurelio,I nsua, Garcia Arebeloa, Riera, Crouch, Josemi, Dossena, Keane, Kromkamp, Voronin.

In his first year he spent a Net £41m and 3 years later none of the 8 players he signed were still at the club.

The ream that won the Big Cup he inherited from the idiot frenchman - contained 2 Benitez signings I think.

Benitez is a good tactician but a lousy man manger (according to his No 2 that he takes with him) hence Alonso wanting to leave, and terrible at buying players. Worse than Lord Ferg - and that takes some doing. But he remains popular because Liverpool fans bought the myth about transfers,

If the 2 Americans really did starve him of funds, what was the £200m that they lost in addition to the purchase price, that they claimed in the court case. A sum not disputed by Liverpool incidentally. The accounts show the spends and so do independent reports, and so does a High Court case.

Benitez wasted a fortune.

You must take into consideration the money he recouped for the club, not only what he spent on players.In the link I posted this can be seen.
Yes, he bought some bad players,which manger hasn't, can't be right all the time.

Hardly any Liverppol players could be even considered as on the same level as Beardsley, Keegan, Dalglish and McDermott ...I can only think of one player in the team now and that is Gerrard who is fit to be mentioned in the same sentence.


Let's say for arguments sake that Rafa had 300million to spend and didn't recoup much of it back..
For Liverpool he won
UEFA Champions League (1): 2004–05
FA Cup (1): 2005–06
FA Community Shield (1): 2006
UEFA Super Cup (1): 2005

In 2008–09 we were runners up to Man Utd... beating UTD 4-1 and crushing teams like Real Madrid 4-0)..earlier on a Rafa's Liverpool beat teams like Inter Milan at the San Siro and even Barcelona at the Nou Camp..:soccer: Liverpool were dominating Europe, Rafa even took Liverpool to another CL final..
Many teams would love to be able to spend only 300 million and do the above.
The good times were back for many, so if wasting 300 million brings such results then so be it..If Rafa was 100% backed by the owners later on then he would have brought the title back to Anfield.

We can say it was or wasn't Rafa's team that won it... Same can be said with his league wins in Spain.. I don't think people tell Capello(maybe they do) that he owes it all to Sacchi because he won with players that Sacchi brought in.. At the end of the day it's Rafa's name on the BIg Cup for Liverpool.

Judge
13-12-2011, 12:41
Mr Martpark, is the league still yours to lose? Man Utd go top for a few hours if they beat QPR.
I thought last nights game was going to end a draw , looked like Chelsea just wanted it that much more..

Gypsy
13-12-2011, 15:11
Mr Martpark, is the league still yours to lose? Man Utd go top for a few hours if they beat QPR.
I thought last nights game was going to end a draw , looked like Chelsea just wanted it that much more..

True - but Chelsea should have been out of it by half time. they could barely string two passes together first half. And City should have had a penalty too in that 1st half.

martpark
13-12-2011, 18:12
Mr Martpark, is the league still yours to lose? Man Utd go top for a few hours if they beat QPR.
I thought last nights game was going to end a draw , looked like Chelsea just wanted it that much more..

It was like the Liverpool match, their only chance would be to have an extra man and be given a penalty at their own ground. Chelsea were given a penalty and Liverpool, an own goal.

Man Utd away 3pts, tot away 3pts, lpool away 1pt, Chelsea away 0pts. We only have arsenal to play away from home in the second half. Bad news for the rest of the league with our home record and goal difference.

With a 57+mil strike force, 40+mil midfield, will king Kenny make the uefa cup spots and will the Americans be satisfied with that? Liverpool can't score at Anfield and will struggle more than Chelsea have. Time will tell, as Kenny said.

Gypsy
13-12-2011, 18:53
Liverpool will fight the Spuds for 5th place. I think 6th is where they will end up - they simply don't score enough.

City, ManU, TheArse and Chelsea in that order for the CL places.

Newcastle are screwed with the loss of Taylor, Coloccini and Chiote. 12th for them I think.

martpark
13-12-2011, 22:05
Liverpool will fight the Spuds for 5th place. I think 6th is where they will end up - they simply don't score enough.

City, ManU, TheArse and Chelsea in that order for the CL places.

Newcastle are screwed with the loss of Taylor, Coloccini and Chiote. 12th for them I think.

I agree about champs lge spots though anything can happen in the course of the season. Also NUFC will struggle now. Stoke could compete for 6th. Maybe fulham or Norwich as a dark horse. More exciting this year than most.

Gypsy
13-12-2011, 22:14
I agree about champs lge spots though anything can happen in the course of the season. Also NUFC will struggle now. Stoke could compete for 6th. Maybe fulham or Norwich as a dark horse. More exciting this year than most.

Fulham and Norwich? I don't know. The key in the last three months of the season is the depth of your squad. Injuries and suspensions take their toll and those who do well tend to be those with more depth. Fulham don't have the depth and I doubt any promoted side has because they simply have not had the money to compete. I'd love Norwich to do well because I like Lambert, he is bringing the knowledge he gained in germany and he looks a real talent as a manager, but 6th would be huge. It would be as good as the rich boys winning the EPL and as a manager probably a harder job. But I can't see it.

lacrima
13-12-2011, 23:11
Judge - a team full of great players on an upward path - with Santiago Cañizares, Roberto Ayala, Rubén Baraja, David Albelda, Vicente and Pablo Aimar providing the backbone to a formidable side that had reached back-to-back UEFA Champions League finals in 2000 and 2001, losing only on penalties in 2001 to Bayern Munich.


Oh, how could you cut Gaizka Mendieta out of this dream team!

It's due to his skills Valencia beat Atlético Madrid in the Copa del Rey in 1999 and Barcelona in Spanish Supercup a year later.
And the biggest triumph of Valencia - two finals of the UEFA Champions League brought him the "European Midfielder of the Season" award.

Those who fly high, fall hard.

Hector Cuper left the team (Inter didn't gain much with this transfer, IMHO) and Mendieta was sold to Lazio.
And that was the end of all three of them: the coach, the player and the club. :cry:
Sorry, guys, for this bit of fluff and off top, but I'm still mourning over the Valencia I used to love so much!:SwoonLoveSmiley:

Gypsy
13-12-2011, 23:33
Oh, how could you cut Gaizka Mendieta out of this dream team!

It's due to his skills Valencia beat Atlético Madrid in the Copa del Rey in 1999 and Barcelona in Spanish Supercup a year later.
And the biggest triumph of Valencia - two finals of the UEFA Champions League brought him the "European Midfielder of the Season" award.

Those who fly high, fall hard.

Hector Cuper left the team (Inter didn't gain much with this transfer, IMHO) and Mendieta was sold to Lazio.
And that was the end of all three of them: the coach, the player and the club. :cry:
Sorry, guys, for this bit of fluff and off top, but I'm still mourning over the Valencia I used to love so much!:SwoonLoveSmiley:
I left him out because he left before Benitez came. I agree he was part of a dream team - one of my favourite sides ever - they were fantastic, and incredibly unlucky. Hector Cuper was a genius.

It is such a shame what has happened to Valencia - they have to sell their best players every year just to stay in business - and Soldado will go this year - why is he not in the Spanish team by the way? Goals in 2011 - Torres 5, Soldado 39. The highest scoring Spanish player.

martpark
13-12-2011, 23:58
Mancini is a puppy compared to many of the above, and to be honest he shouldn't be mentioned in the same thread as Trappattoni,Beckenbauer and Sacchi.How could you forget them then? If Mancini is a puppy, then Dalglish must be a wee Scottish terrier because he's won about the same. Roberto has won something at 4 different clubs. Also won 17 matches in a row at Inter, a Euro record at the time. Not bad for a know-nothing
NB: It said 'unproven' for a reason but read what you want.


I said before that Mancini is a good manager but will he be a great one? only time will tell.It's easy to be a good manger when you have a war chest of millions to spend..

Yes, Kenny was very thrifty at Blackburn.

martpark
14-12-2011, 00:04
Fulham and Norwich? I don't know. The key in the last three months of the season is the depth of your squad. Injuries and suspensions take their toll and those who do well tend to be those with more depth. Fulham don't have the depth and I doubt any promoted side has because they simply have not had the money to compete. I'd love Norwich to do well because I like Lambert, he is bringing the knowledge he gained in germany and he looks a real talent as a manager, but 6th would be huge. It would be as good as the rich boys winning the EPL and as a manager probably a harder job. But I can't see it.

Both dark horses. Fulham has had some good games recently. Maybe Zamora will be sold in Jan and they'll bring in a new striker. Norwich could surprise with their
with their unknown mob.

Gypsy
14-12-2011, 00:25
Both dark horses. Fulham has had some good games recently. Maybe Zamora will be sold in Jan and they'll bring in a new striker. Norwich could surprise with their
with their unknown mob.

The unknown mob - this is why newly promoted sides often do well up to Xmas. But strength in depth is what matters from February on and I don't think either club has it.

Judge
14-12-2011, 21:14
It was like the Liverpool match, their only chance would be to have an extra man and be given a penalty at their own ground. Chelsea were given a penalty and Liverpool, an own goal.

Man Utd away 3pts, tot away 3pts, lpool away 1pt, Chelsea away 0pts. We only have arsenal to play away from home in the second half. Bad news for the rest of the league with our home record and goal difference.

With a 57+mil strike force, 40+mil midfield, will king Kenny make the uefa cup spots and will the Americans be satisfied with that? Liverpool can't score at Anfield and will struggle more than Chelsea have. Time will tell, as Kenny said.

If it wasn't for a world class save from Hart, Carroll would have got on the scoreboard.Goals will come at Liverpool,to be honest it's a scary thought once the goals start to come....who knows what could be.

Judge
14-12-2011, 21:29
If Mancini is a puppy, then Dalglish must be a wee Scottish terrier because he's won about the same. Roberto has won something at 4 different clubs. Also won 17 matches in a row at Inter, a Euro record at the time. Not bad for a know-nothing
NB: It said 'unproven' for a reason but read what you want.



Yes, Kenny was very thrifty at Blackburn.

A wee Scottish terrier suits Dalglish, biting away at the leaders:D
You see what a good manger can do with lots of money, title for Blackburn..

I didn't forget Trappattoni,Beckenbauer and Sacchi. Traps and Sacchi are both legends at club level,they are up there with Paisley ,Shankly and Clough.
There are enough mangers around who are better than Mancini so no need to mention 3 living legends.

Judge
14-12-2011, 21:31
True - but Chelsea should have been out of it by half time. they could barely string two passes together first half. And City should have had a penalty too in that 1st half.

Yep, City had chances early on to put the game away,but like in all big games if you don't take your chances you will regret it.

Gypsy
14-12-2011, 23:00
Yep, City had chances early on to put the game away,but like in all big games if you don't take your chances you will regret it.
That was one of Shankly's pearls of wisdom - one of many.

He was explaining, to Parkinson I think, one of the reasons why Liverpool were so good and said " The secret is that in any game, even Tranmere (then in old 4th Div) vs Liverpool, Tranmere will have ten minutes when they are on top. It happens in every game. But when you are on top, you must score. That is the secret."