PDA

View Full Version : Multi Entry now only good for 90 days is done in EU



James22
26-07-2007, 16:14
The new law from June is if you obtain Multi Entry visa in a EU country it will be stamped as only good for 90 days. So you can stay only 90 days out of each 180 days.

So it means you have to get it in a non EU country or apply and get a new "permanent visa" or is it the provisional or temporary residency временного проживания.


I do not know about that but guess you get it from the immigration office.

Has anyone done this?

Thanks

Digenis Akritas
26-07-2007, 16:55
What on earth? Are you serious? I haven't heard anything about that yet and it's already the end of July. Usually such news as that would have made the rounds already.

Do you have any links, articles, or further information about this?

Judge
26-07-2007, 17:42
I got my multi entry visa this month from an EU country and it says valid for 90 days out of 180.Intel the place where i get my invite from were pretty confused about this,but they still registered me for 6 months.

Digenis Akritas
26-07-2007, 17:51
James22 and Judge, can you confirm which type of visas you were issued?

Are they business (деловая), commercial (коммерческая) or something else altogether? This is quite strange.

Where does it specify this 90-day stipulation? What does it say under the part about when you can enter and leave the country? I'm utterly confused and would like to figure out how this could effect me when I leave for my visa next month.

Thanks.

Judge
26-07-2007, 18:09
Mines a business multi entry visa,on line 14 of my visa where it says ADDITIONAL IMFORMATION it says valid for 90 days out of 190.In my old visas, line 14 was always blank.Intel said that i can leave anytime i want during the 6 months,but when the 6 months are up i have to hand my registration slip back into them,so they can imform the immigration office that i'm leaving.

米乐龙
26-07-2007, 18:21
You may be able to register for 6 months due to everyone not knowing what is going on, however you might find yourself in trouble when you try to exit after those 90 days. It says 90 days out of 180 days which means that you can only be in Russia for 90 days in total every 180 days.

Digenis Akritas
26-07-2007, 18:41
Okay, thanks. A few more questions if you don't mind, just so I better understand the situation before marching down the hall to my HR director tomorrow to have him call FMS for some documentation:

1) How did you find out that this applies only to visas issued in EU countries? Is this an assumption for the time being or was this explained somewhere? I plan to make a quick trip to Kyiv for my next visa and want to know if this could be an issue there as well.

2) Very strange about the additional information following line 14; my visas have never had that field filled out either. What does it say in Russian or English there?

3) Again, you applied for a Multi-entry, one-year business (деловая) visa in an EU country? Is that correct?

Hmm... just another headache to worry about...

Judge
26-07-2007, 18:48
It's the first time line 14 has been filled up on my visa.
Now on line 14 it says this in russian действует 90 дней из каждых 180.

Yeah, i got my visa done in an EU country,Malta.

米乐龙
26-07-2007, 20:13
So it looks like a lot of you will be doing 4 visa runs each year. 4 times the cost too... Anyway, I recommend you all to get your visas in Hong Kong. Great consulate, fast service, no lining up and friendly staff. No HIV test needed, HIV positive people may want take note of this. Best experience I have had getting a Russian visa.

Judge
26-07-2007, 21:13
So it looks like a lot of you will be doing 4 visa runs each year. 4 times the cost too... Anyway, I recommend you all to get your visas in Hong Kong. Great consulate, fast service, no lining up and friendly staff. No HIV test needed, HIV positive people may want take note of this. Best experience I have had getting a Russian visa.


Are you from England?I'm asking because when i went to get my new visa this month in Malta, i handed in my HIV test and they said they don't need it,i asked them if Americans do and they said yes.So maybe it's just english people who don't need a HIV test.
I recommend Malta for visa runs,you are in and out of the embassy in a matter of mins and to get to Malta will be cheaper than going to Hong Kong.

SalTheReturn
26-07-2007, 21:39
thats pretty bad news...thank God there is Pushkin inst for getting ridicolously cheap visa otherwise i would be f...d:inlove::inlove::inlove:
guys, seems like you gotta enter and live in russia through student visas

米乐龙
26-07-2007, 21:59
thats pretty bad news...thank God there is Pushkin inst for getting ridicolously cheap visa otherwise i would be f...d:inlove::inlove::inlove:
guys, seems like you gotta enter and live in russia through student visas

But then you have to get exit visas each time you want to leave Russia.

ezik
26-07-2007, 23:36
The 90/180 days thing has been introduced to eliminate the cases when business visa are used for personal purposes (which is a lot). So, it is quite simple, actually:
- if you are employed by a Russian branch of a company, you will get a working permit, in which case you don't have to leave so often
- if you are here for private reasons, you will have to go for a residence permit
- if you are on that popular business visa, you just have to make sure that you're not in here than 90 days in a 180 days period.

God only knows what our diplomatic representatives have negotiated, but it's like I said. If you are here on private reasons for a longer time, there is no other choice than to go into the Residence Permit procedure with all humiliations coming with it.

Looks like the Russian government has been going through a lot of trouble to facilitate:
- people who work here
- frequent business travellers
- tourists

Those married to a Russian and just finding a normal way to be with their spouse are, as usual, completely ignored.

SalTheReturn
26-07-2007, 23:52
But then you have to get exit visas each time you want to leave Russia.


please rephrase...exit visa?

SalTheReturn
26-07-2007, 23:54
The 90/180 days thing has been introduced to eliminate the cases when business visa are used for personal purposes (which is a lot). So, it is quite simple, actually:
- if you are employed by a Russian branch of a company, you will get a working permit, in which case you don't have to leave so often
- if you are here for private reasons, you will have to go for a residence permit
- if you are on that popular business visa, you just have to make sure that you're not in here than 90 days in a 180 days period.

God only knows what our diplomatic representatives have negotiated, but it's like I said. If you are here on private reasons for a longer time, there is no other choice than to go into the Residence Permit procedure with all humiliations coming with it.

Looks like the Russian government has been going through a lot of trouble to facilitate:
- people who work here
- frequent business travellers
- tourists

Those married to a Russian and just finding a normal way to be with their spouse are, as usual, completely ignored.

the situation of foreigner getting into the country with bizness visa was unbearable and the russian gov has all the rights to introduce stricter rules. Their mistake was to have these rules applied to EU citizens.

米乐龙
27-07-2007, 00:27
please rephrase...exit visa?

I used to have a student visa from Pushkin Institute. I wanted to leave the country for a couple of weeks. The people organising the visas at Pushkin Institute said that if I left Russia without an exit visa (special permission to exit Russia issued by department of immigration) then my student visa would be canceled when exiting Russia. I didn't have enough time to get the exit visa (takes 2 weeks) so I just left on my student visa and it was canceled on my way out. I had to re-enter on another visa, I chose a business visa.

Digenis Akritas
27-07-2007, 00:36
Yep, I had the same experience when I was here on a student visa through Moscow International University. Some friends and I found a cheap 'hot tour' to Egypt and wanted to escape from the harsh Moscow winter on short notice. I was told that it would take at least two weeks for them to make an 'exit visa' for me and that there was not time to go on the tour package that I had already purchased.

I was able to pull a few strings with a bribe in the form of a semi-expensive bottle of whiskey. Went to Egypt and had a blast. That was back in 2003. I assume that this is still how things are done.

James22
27-07-2007, 03:38
Someone said 4 visa a year - no - the visa is good for 1 year but you can only stay for 90 days then would have to leave for 90 days.
If you are an American you can get your visa there or any place else the is not the EU and it will be as it used to be.

I get a business (деловая) so guess I will go to Egypt or another place outside the EU. Just make sure you call any embassy first to make sure that it will be good for the full year.


I think now is you get a resident permit you no longer need and exit permission when you want to leave. That is what IntelExpoService told me. They do not handle those - only my visa for the last 10 years.

I guess I need to contact an agency to see about getting a residency временного проживания.

Has anyone obtained this ? I do not have a wife and I do not work here. Only live here.

Proper Bostonian
27-07-2007, 09:39
I don't get this at all! After reading the posts I checked my visa which I renewed in Paris last month (o.k., I do see this new rule went into effect as of July 1). I'm American & have a 1 yr. ME business visa. I don't even see a line 14 on my visa and no restrictions are indicated. Did I simply luck out by doing my visa 5 days in advance of the new rule?

Strangely enough, when my (Russian) husband went to register me at our apartment, they registered me for the entire year rather than the usual 6 months - 1st time this has ever happened. My husband even questioned them about it & they said not to worry. Has anyone else experienced this?

Andy B
27-07-2007, 09:54
My British colleague got his 1yr visa issued in Malaysia on the 13th July and there are no restrictions shown.

Can highly recommend the Russian Embassy in Kuala Lumpur... Friendly, Helpfull and Efficient!

Halyavshik
27-07-2007, 10:58
The new law from June

Can you provide a source for this information ? Something written ?

米乐龙
27-07-2007, 11:01
Someone said 4 visa a year - no - the visa is good for 1 year but you can only stay for 90 days then would have to leave for 90 days.


Yes, but if you wanted to stay without having to leave for 90 days then you would have to get new visas 4 times per year. Think about it.

Clean32
27-07-2007, 11:08
God only knows what our diplomatic representatives have negotiated, but it's like I said. If you are here on private reasons for a longer time, there is no other choice than to go into the Residence Permit procedure with all humiliations coming with it.

Those married to a Russian and just finding a normal way to be with their spouse are, as usual, completely ignored.

I am a little confused about your comments, humiliations? With a res and i assume you mean a temp res as well.

I actually found the posses quite easy and quick. But before that I was coming backward and forwards on a tourist visa. I found that quite easy as well. But having said that I have never done a business visa.

Clean32
27-07-2007, 11:16
I think now is you get a resident permit you no longer need and exit permission when you want to leave. That is what IntelExpoService told me. They do not handle those - only my visa for the last 10 years.


Has anyone obtained this ? I do not have a wife and I do not work here. Only live here.


As i understand it. You need a exit visa for the temp res, but not the res.
usually you have a temp res for 3 years before you can change it to a res. if you have a Russian wife and children you only have to wait for 1 year.
res visas are for 3 years only I think 3+3+3 etc but after 3 years on a res you can apply for RF citz.
Also a temp res and a res visas are business visas as well, and again I believe that if you are on temp or res the company you work for will not have to get you a work permit.

Please dont hold me to this. If you fined anything different please post it. This seem to change often LOL.

Clean32
27-07-2007, 11:21
Yes, but if you wanted to stay without having to leave for 90 days then you would have to get new visas 4 times per year. Think about it.

I think you have the wrong end of the stick. 90 OUT OF 180 DAYS MAY MEEN 90 DAYS IN RUSSIA 90 DAYS OUT OF RUSSIA.
many countries do this on there tourist visas. but they may differ where say for example in NZ if you are in NZ for 5 days you must then be out for 5 days 20days for 20 days etc. but I think with Russia it is a total of 90 days out of 180. I think, just by going on the above posts

Judge
27-07-2007, 11:29
I think you have the wrong end of the stick. 90 OUT OF 180 DAYS MAY MEEN 90 DAYS IN RUSSIA 90 DAYS OUT OF RUSSIA.
many countries do this on there tourist visas. but they may differ where say for example in NZ if you are in NZ for 5 days you must then be out for 5 days 20days for 20 days etc. but I think with Russia it is a total of 90 days out of 180. I think, just by going on the above posts

You are right, Intel just told me the same thing,90 days in 90 days out.

Digenis Akritas
27-07-2007, 11:36
Can you provide a source for this information ? Something written ?

I found some info and posted it on that other board. I'm just gonna provide a link to that post for convenience sake; I had to break it into four or five posts there due to limitations on the number of characters per post. If anyone wants to get their panties in a bundle because of that, then they are free to repost it here themselves:
New M-e Visa Rules ??? - Red Tape Forums (http://www.redtape.ru/forum/showpost.php?p=74284&postcount=53)

Hope that helps.

Yes, 90 days in Russia, then 90 days out. It affects EU citizens only, it would seem.

米乐龙
27-07-2007, 12:19
I think you have the wrong end of the stick. 90 OUT OF 180 DAYS MAY MEEN 90 DAYS IN RUSSIA 90 DAYS OUT OF RUSSIA.
many countries do this on there tourist visas. but they may differ where say for example in NZ if you are in NZ for 5 days you must then be out for 5 days 20days for 20 days etc. but I think with Russia it is a total of 90 days out of 180. I think, just by going on the above posts

Read my post again and then think about it. If you want to stay in Russia for 12 months of the year then you will need to stay for four 90 day periods. This is impossible on a one year visa since you can only stay in for 90 days and then you must leave for 90 days. So you would have to leave the country every 90 days, get a new visa and then enter immediately again. A better option would be to just get four 3 month biz visas. Understand?

gregs
27-07-2007, 12:28
Fortunately the 90 days in a 180 day period rule does not apply to UK nationals as the UK did not sign the agreement with Russia on visa simplification (and not likely to at the moment). It applies to the European countries; Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Hungary, Greece, Spain, Italy, Cyprus, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxemburg, Malta, the Netherlands, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Germany, Finland, France, Czech Republic, Sweden, Estonia.

For all of the above except the UK nationals the rule applies.

Thanks

Judge
27-07-2007, 12:58
Fortunately the 90 days in a 180 day period rule does not apply to UK nationals as the UK did not sign the agreement with Russia on visa simplification (and not likely to at the moment). It applies to the European countries; Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Hungary, Greece, Spain, Italy, Cyprus, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxemburg, Malta, the Netherlands, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Germany, Finland, France, Czech Republic, Sweden, Estonia.

For all of the above except the UK nationals the rule applies.

Thanks

It does apply for UK nationals,i have it written in my new visa.

Clean32
27-07-2007, 13:27
Read my post again and then think about it. If you want to stay in Russia for 12 months of the year then you will need to stay for four 90 day periods. This is impossible on a one year visa since you can only stay in for 90 days and then you must leave for 90 days. So you would have to leave the country every 90 days, get a new visa and then enter immediately again. A better option would be to just get four 3 month biz visas. Understand?

no i doint get you?
and no you cant

have to leave the country every 90 days, get a new visa and then enter immediately again

Thats the point you cant immediatly enter again you have to stay out of russia for 90days

SalTheReturn
27-07-2007, 13:30
This is the first country ever applying stricter visa rules to EU nationals rather than Yanks. Only Russia could brainstorm something like this.
Disappointed.

SalTheReturn
27-07-2007, 13:32
no i doint get you?
and no you cant


Thats the point you cant immediatly enter again you have to stay out of russia for 90days

Clean is right in there, otherwise it would not be a matter

SalTheReturn
27-07-2007, 13:33
I used to have a student visa from Pushkin Institute. I wanted to leave the country for a couple of weeks. The people organising the visas at Pushkin Institute said that if I left Russia without an exit visa (special permission to exit Russia issued by department of immigration) then my student visa would be canceled when exiting Russia. I didn't have enough time to get the exit visa (takes 2 weeks) so I just left on my student visa and it was canceled on my way out. I had to re-enter on another visa, I chose a business visa.


well if things are this way (given that I always know in advance when i have to leave the country) i would say it seems nothing difficult.

is it costly to get this exit visa?

gregs
27-07-2007, 13:50
It does apply for UK nationals,i have it written in my new visa.

Where did you get your Visa from?

Judge
27-07-2007, 14:11
Where did you get your Visa from?

Malta, but word is if you get your visa made in a country that's not in the EU this rule wont be written in your new visa.Not sure about this because Intel themselves don't know what's really going on.

gregs
27-07-2007, 14:14
You are correct - anyone obtaining a visa from any of the EU countries listed in my last post will have this rule applied. If you get your visa issued in the UK then the rule does not apply. Obviously if you get your visa issued from any non EU (UK excempt) then the rule will also not apply.

ezik
29-07-2007, 22:49
I am a little confused about your comments, humiliations? With a res and i assume you mean a temp res as well.

I actually found the posses quite easy and quick. But before that I was coming backward and forwards on a tourist visa. I found that quite easy as well. But having said that I have never done a business visa.

I actually don't think that being here before on a business visa or not is going to matter. I hope.

So how easy was the process? Can you explain steps, documents, where to go?

Would be highly appreciated! :)

SalTheReturn
30-07-2007, 02:12
You are correct - anyone obtaining a visa from any of the EU countries listed in my last post will have this rule applied. If you get your visa issued in the UK then the rule does not apply. Obviously if you get your visa issued from any non EU (UK excempt) then the rule will also not apply.

why russia is such of a dumb country??? i mean, whats the deal of making stricter rules if then all i have to do is applying trough a non-eu countries...
a cheap getaway to turkey and it is all done, painlessly.

ridicolous intelservice does not know the rules, hope i knew it before since i cited them in an important article about working in russia.

Sumarokov-Elston
31-07-2007, 20:30
You are correct - anyone obtaining a visa from any of the EU countries listed in my last post will have this rule applied. If you get your visa issued in the UK then the rule does not apply. Obviously if you get your visa issued from any non EU (UK excempt) then the rule will also not apply.

I would tend to believe this - can anyone post their experiences? Really annoying for me, as I am a UK citizen and wanted to apply in an EU country (planned on going to Prague next month). The people who were going to handle in it Prague seem to advise that post-1 July, UK citizens are (wrongly) treated like EU citizens by the Prague Consulate:
HIV certificate - actually needed by UK citizens, but the Consulate says no!
Health insurance - NOT needed by UK citizens, but the Consulate says yes!

So now I do not know whether to just apply for a 3-month visa in Prague or for a 12-month visa in some non-EU country or the UK! Annoyingly, the whole of mainland Europe is basically EU now! Advice anyone?

SFOD-Delta
01-08-2007, 16:26
Intruiging !

svelt
01-08-2007, 23:06
as for the best place i always found bonn to be very efficient except you have to taxi it back to town after applying in order to get a receipt from the bank that you paid. other than that 'edinburgh'. i haven't needed to get one there for years but it used to be great. i remember my first time, in 94, and i was left in the room with 2 guns on the table behind this guys desk and a pile of passports with the old 3 page visas. also once knocked on the closed door at dinner time and they let me in to collect there and then. i use madrid now and it is shite but thats that.

koshka85
08-08-2007, 22:38
I just got my visa in Austria, and it doesn't have the 90 day rule stamped in it. I have a 1 year multi-entry, but I think that the difference is that I have sports visa, rather than the usual business visa.

Also, check with the country you're applying in to make sure that you don't need insurance. In Austria at least, even though my passport is American, my residence was Austrian, so I was required to have insurance, becuase the insurance rule is based on your address, not passport. (Of course, the embassy didn't tell me this when I called...) Luckily, even though the rule is that it's necessary to have insurance for the entirety of your visa, 30 days was sufficient!

Bels
10-08-2007, 20:06
I have just got my one year multi entry visa in London. Nothing has changed, and I will have to leave the country and return in six months time. The only thing that has changed is that for getting my visa same day, as a Brit I have to pay 160 where as my other EU members will pay a lot less. Simply because Britain refused to sign an immigration agreement with Russia.

Bels
10-08-2007, 20:19
Fortunately the 90 days in a 180 day period rule does not apply to UK nationals as the UK did not sign the agreement with Russia on visa simplification (and not likely to at the moment). It applies to the European countries; Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Hungary, Greece, Spain, Italy, Cyprus, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxemburg, Malta, the Netherlands, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Germany, Finland, France, Czech Republic, Sweden, Estonia.

For all of the above except the UK nationals the rule applies.

Thanks

Don't forget Demark and Southern Ireland who are the other EU members who also refused to sign the agreement. And may I say they have been very sensible. I would be in a terrible mess if Britain had signed the agreement. I am married and I would have been separated from my wife and children. Absolutely crazy.

Bels
10-08-2007, 20:27
I would like all to avoid another confusion. I don't think it has anything to do with where you get your visa but of what nationality you are. For example if a Brit or. a Southern Irishman, a Dane got his visa in Germany the 90 day rule would not apply to them. But they will pay a lot more for their visa. The cost will be 160 for same day issue.

ezik
15-08-2007, 00:27
Totally confused now. Got the 90 days thing written in my business visa and my friends at the local foreign police gave me a 180 days registration...

tgma
15-08-2007, 10:39
Totally confused now. Got the 90 days thing written in my business visa and my friends at the local foreign police gave me a 180 days registration...

My interpretation of this is that you can come and go as you please for the next 180 days, without re-registering, but you can only spend a total of 90 days in the country.

Whatever the local police might put in your passport, you will have problems trying to cross the border if you spend more than 90 days in Russia.

Judge
15-08-2007, 12:20
Totally confused now. Got the 90 days thing written in my business visa and my friends at the local foreign police gave me a 180 days registration...

Sorry to say but it looks like 90 days in 90 days out for you.You're from Holland and your country signed the new agreement.You could check with the comapny who gave you your invite for more details.

kseniaCH
15-08-2007, 18:39
The new law from June is if you obtain Multi Entry visa in a EU country it will be stamped as only good for 90 days. So you can stay only 90 days out of each 180 days.

So it means you have to get it in a non EU country or apply and get a new "permanent visa" or is it the provisional or temporary residency временного проживания.


I do not know about that but guess you get it from the immigration office.

Has anyone done this?

Thanks

My bf called last week to the russian embassy in France to find out about this new rule and they said that it only works for single/double entry business visa. But not for multi-visa.
I hope thats true, because we are now doing 1Y ME biz visa for him to stay in russia for the next 12 month..

I dont know, probably each country has its own schedule to implement new rules?

Bels
15-08-2007, 18:52
I'm getting a bit confused now. My understanding was it didn't affect those EU members who didn't sign the agreementy , now checking the posts again and checking their nationalities, the complaints are also including a few Brits.

It has to be a mistake from the embassies and they have become confused by their own rules. Hopefully the Brits didn't have to pay the full 160 price for this 90 days. Yes Brits Irish and Norwegians pay more.

Bels
15-08-2007, 22:49
As stated before I am getting a bit confused about these new rule of whether they apply or not. Does it apply to where you get your visa, in an EU country they say on this thread? Let's not forget that the UK is a EU member.

My personal experience. I have recently been to london and got my multi entry visa. I have to leave the country in six months time, simply get out of Russia and come back in again. Possibly Tallin, Estonia I think with no visit to a Russian Embassy. Nothing has changed from my experience. One thing , there was a big notice in the Russsian Embassy in London. PLEASE CHECK YOUR VISA, ESPECIALLY DATES> IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CHECK YOUR VISA BEFORE LEAVING

So no change if you get your visa in London if you are British.

My big question is. Does anyone know if the new visa law applies to where you get your visa, or does it apply to your nationality.

For the moment I believe it applies to nationality, but the Russians are getting confused with their own new laws.

BOY! I hope I get get my temporary residency and avoid this mess next time.

Bels
16-08-2007, 14:36
I believe it's common knowledge that Expat teachers of a native language, ie English, German, French, Spanish, Italian, get business visas with a personal invitation from the school. This is the way to legally work in Riussia. Would this new law now cause problems for their employment. Are their any teachers out their with this new 90 day visa and a personal invitation from their employer?

Teachers do't need work permits just the business visa and their employers invitation.But perhaps the system is about to change.

Thomas78
29-08-2007, 18:22
I am getting confused too. So many people work here permanently with buisness visa, if they had to follow the law strictly they would all have to work half time. This is ridiculous. Is this new law going to be strictly applied or what? I think I read a post somewhere saying that it practice it wasn't really applied, but I can't remember where I saw it. Anyone has some info?

Bels
29-08-2007, 22:00
Click out of this thread and click again in travel and passport. Look at the stickies on top. Also check the website with the Russian Embassy where you get your visa. There is definately something going on. It has only recently happened so we haven't been informed how it has affected others yet. If it all true I dread to think how the employed teachers will be affected.

kazachka
30-08-2007, 14:27
Any Yanks get this new 90 day restriction? I've been told it doesn't affect citizens of countries who did not sign the agreement (Americans,Brits, Danes, Norweigans).PLan B for me just in case is to apply for residency when I get back in October and or switch to a ME SPORTS visa if needed.

Digenis Akritas
30-08-2007, 14:34
Any Yanks get this new 90 day restriction?

The only way Yanks can get it is if the visa/migration consular agent mistakenly does it. Always check your documents for errors before leaving the consulate. If such (or any) mistake has been made, tell them to fix it then and there.


switch to a ME SPORTS visa if needed.
Sports visa? Is there such a thing? Really? Is it just a 'cultural visa' for athletes coming to train or compete? I suppose there'll be a lot of athletes coming over in prep for the 2014 Olympics.

Proper Bostonian
30-08-2007, 14:37
As I previously wrote, I'm a yank and got my new ME visa in Paris - no restrictions, no problems.

kazachka
30-08-2007, 15:23
The only way Yanks can get it is if the visa/migration consular agent mistakenly does it. Always check your documents for errors before leaving the consulate. If such (or any) mistake has been made, tell them to fix it then and there.

This should be fun as I do it by mail in the US each yr:)

Sports visa? Is there such a thing? Really? Is it just a 'cultural visa' for athletes coming to train or compete? I suppose there'll be a lot of athletes coming over in prep for the 2014 Olympics.

Yes- my coach told me about this last month when I expressed concerns about the new visa laws. It's good for a year and it's ME. The US also does this type of visa for foreign athletes coming to train/compete in the States.
Ahhhhh yes, I'm shaprening my snowshoes for the 2014 Olympics:D

Surok
30-08-2007, 15:31
So many people work here permanently with buisness visa, if they had to follow the law strictly they would all have to work half time.

It's not legal to work here permanently on a business multi-entry visa, with, I believe, a few exceptions.

Foreigners working permanently in Russia are required to have a visa and a work permit.

Bels
30-08-2007, 19:41
It's not legal to work here permanently on a business multi-entry visa, with, I believe, a few exceptions.

Foreigners working permanently in Russia are required to have a visa and a work permit.

One of the exceptions: EFL Native teachers, Business visa with an invitation from a licensed school who has permission from the government to issue personal invitations. The schools name must be on the invitation. Bogus or unknown names on the invitation such as from agencie are unacceptible. No work permit is required. Unless they have changed the law again.

WARNING: Only a few schools have this right, check the name on the invitation before you come to the country and start work. Contracts are normally a year or six months at a time. Permanent must surely be Temporary or permanent residential. You will have the flexibility to select and choose employers as you wish. And of course negotiate much higher incomes. You will have more rights as an employee.

Thomas78
31-08-2007, 23:50
Hi
Another practical question: What if you get a buisness multiple entry visa for one year, stay twice 90 days in a row with an interruption in the middle (exit the country for a few days). Then, in theory, you have used all the allowed days on your buisness visa. Then, what happen if you just make a new one, a new one year ME that starts right after, and cancelling the first one. Like, re-doing the whole process every 6 months?

trebor
01-09-2007, 10:08
I spoke to Vadim at Liga Consulting last week and he told me ther same as has been written here. There are three countries that didn't sign the agreement. Britain, Denmark and Ireland. So if you hold a passport for these countries you wont have the 90 day rule on your visa. However, some embassies in Europe still put the rule in for ALL E.U. citizens. Berlin does this.

Bels
01-09-2007, 10:23
Yes. From private messages I received unfortunately some Brits fell into that category. Therefore I personally believe that for the time being Brits should go to London for their visa to avoid the confusion. I went there end of July and I had no problems with my dates.

Thomas78
02-09-2007, 14:31
Hi
Does this rule applies if you make your Buisness visa in Ukraine, in Kiev's russian consulate?
I am French and I have a French passport. If I make a one year ME buisness visa in Kiev, will it have the mention about the 90 days out of 180 ?
Has anyone tried?

Bels
02-09-2007, 14:45
It's supposed to apply to your nationality, not where you get your visa. However reading previous posts and private messages the embassies appear to be confused at the moment

Judge
02-09-2007, 15:56
Hi
Does this rule applies if you make your Buisness visa in Ukraine, in Kiev's russian consulate?
I am French and I have a French passport. If I make a one year ME buisness visa in Kiev, will it have the mention about the 90 days out of 180 ?
Has anyone tried?

I would say yeah, your country signed the new agreement.

bphreal
02-09-2007, 20:50
Just arrived back on an ME visa got in Dublin. No obs on the visa re 90 days.
Probably all lown over

Bels
02-09-2007, 21:18
How many times have I and others got to repeat ourselves :) You are Irish, and like the Brits your country refused to sign the agreement with Russia :)
along with Denmark.

MaltSokol
05-09-2007, 20:35
Hi there,

I'm a Spainish national with a ME business visa (the kommercheskaya one). My invitation was issued on 26th May (before the agreement went into force) and my visa was issued on 15th June (after). The visa says clearly 365 days, while Schengen visas that already had this limitation used to say 90 days.

There are no additional notes on my visa but I paid the new fees though, 35. I still don't know whether the rule applies to me.. In the embassy they repeat like parrots "90 days every 6 months!", but there must be some backdoor that we haven't found yet.
They even told me that the 90-days rule applies for visas issued before June 1st. I just can't believe that.

As we know, there are many people living in Russia with business visa. I want to put the example of the expatriates' wives. While husbands have work visas, the wives stay with business visas. According to the new regulation, wives should apply for Temporary Residence, while the husbands would keep the status of foreign labour force (work visa). Nonsense.

(No sexism on the post. It's just that usually the managers are men and the wives stay with them with business visa).

Best regards,

Alberto

Bels
05-09-2007, 21:19
Hi there,

I'm a Spainish national with a ME business visa (the kommercheskaya one). My invitation was issued on 26th May (before the agreement went into force) and my visa was issued on 15th June (after). The visa says clearly 365 days, while Schengen visas that already had this limitation used to say 90 days.

There are no additional notes on my visa but I paid the new fees though, 35. I still don't know whether the rule applies to me.. In the embassy they repeat like parrots "90 days every 6 months!", but there must be some backdoor that we haven't found yet.
They even told me that the 90-days rule applies for visas issued before June 1st. I just can't believe that.

As we know, there are many people living in Russia with business visa. I want to put the example of the expatriates' wives. While husbands have work visas, the wives stay with business visas. According to the new regulation, wives should apply for Temporary Residence, while the husbands would keep the status of foreign labour force (work visa). Nonsense.

(No sexism on the post. It's just that usually the managers are men and the wives stay with them with business visa).

Best regards,

Alberto

Interesting post. On your first paragraph I would think its obvious. You got your visa before the agreement even though you paid the lower fee. Its obvious you get what your visa states with the old rules. I'm certain you can leave up to a maximum of 180 days if that's what you wish. The inconvenience will come to you on your next visa. I personally would follow what your visa states.

MaltSokol
05-09-2007, 23:40
Thanks for your reply.
Didn't the agreement go into force on June 1st? That'd mean that I got my visa after it began. I've also heard July, but I think it was June.

Bels
06-09-2007, 00:11
I'm not sure, I read the agreement in June without date mentioned and got my visa beginning of July. It's ok for me as I am British and got it in London. However you appear to be lucky and as I said follow what your visa dates state it will probably be different next time. Funny there are Brits who got their visas in other EU countries and they do have the 90 day problem. There is no doubt confusion with the Russian Embassy. Perhaps you should try London for your visa next time and you might still get the old deal.

Len Ganley Stance
06-09-2007, 07:54
I spoke to Vadim at Liga Consulting last week and he told me ther same as has been written here. There are three countries that didn't sign the agreement. Britain, Denmark and Ireland. So if you hold a passport for these countries you wont have the 90 day rule on your visa. However, some embassies in Europe still put the rule in for ALL E.U. citizens. Berlin does this.

It's great being Irish!!!

jl74
06-09-2007, 08:39
It's great being English, Spanish, South American, Canadian:alien:

nativetongue
07-09-2007, 14:49
Strange! I got a one year multi-entry "commercial" visa back in February. I asked if I will have to leave once every 180 days, and in the invitation agency and in the embassy said no. It says 360 days on my visa and nothing else. The agency that made the invitation and then made my one year registration, later again said that I don't have to leave every 180 days. They said that I can stay 360 days non-stop till the end of the visa........

My temp.res. should be ready any day now, so I'm not concerned about the new rule if it doesn't annul previously attained 1 yr. ME commercial visas. I'm just surprised to hear so much about having to leave every six months from before this even "fresher" rule came into play..........

moscowlondon
07-10-2007, 12:14
We have got around this problem by obtaining our multiple entry visas in the UK, Ireland and other non-Schengen EU countries. These visas do not have the limit on them. If you use an agent in the UK, they do not care where you live.

Bels
07-10-2007, 15:12
We have got around this problem by obtaining our multiple entry visas in the UK, Ireland and other non-Schengen EU countries. These visas do not have the limit on them. If you use an agent in the UK, they do not care where you live.

But if you read the London Russian Embassy web-site you will see that they are fully aware that it applies to nationality. Rusemblon.com I think or it might be rusemblon.org

They make it sound an advantage for those who signed the agreement because the visa is much cheaper. However we all know now that it's better to pay the extra.

Bels
07-10-2007, 15:17
Heres the info for London Russian embassy

Russian Consulate (http://www.rusemblon.org/logon_en.htm)

MaltSokol
10-10-2007, 08:48
I got news about the 90 days thing. The limitation is not implemented at the border but at FMS when registering. When I wanted to register, they did till the 90th day of stay (I had 78 days remaining). Not more.
That's why I'm changing to a student visa.

Bels
10-10-2007, 12:04
I got news about the 90 days thing. The limitation is not implemented at the border but at FMS when registering. When I wanted to register, they did till the 90th day of stay (I had 78 days remaining). Not more.
That's why I'm changing to a student visa.

How different is it for a student visa? And I would I would imigine that it all depends on your intentions of being in Russia.

For Brits, Irish and other Nationalities who didn't sign the agreement I would stick to the business visa for the time being, and get your visa from your home country. Unfortunately I fear changes even for us in the near future.

Bels
10-10-2007, 12:11
Strange! I got a one year multi-entry "commercial" visa back in February. I asked if I will have to leave once every 180 days, and in the invitation agency and in the embassy said no. It says 360 days on my visa and nothing else. The agency that made the invitation and then made my one year registration, later again said that I don't have to leave every 180 days. They said that I can stay 360 days non-stop till the end of the visa........

My temp.res. should be ready any day now, so I'm not concerned about the new rule if it doesn't annul previously attained 1 yr. ME commercial visas. I'm just surprised to hear so much about having to leave every six months from before this even "fresher" rule came into play..........

May I suggest that we all mention our nationalities at the beginning to avoid confusion. I can see from your profile that you are American, and the new rules mentioned don't apply to you, although mistakes due to confusion may be made at an embassy that you might register in the EU.

Would like to hear how you get on with your temporary residency as I am also waiting for an answer for my residency any day now. Good luck.

Sumarokov-Elston
10-10-2007, 17:51
I have a British passport and yesterday received my new one-year ME visa without any limitations in Prague.

So they DID know about this (especially as I had asked the travel agent to remind them). But what they did NOT seem to know was the rule that UK citizens do not need travel insurance. Luckily, I had a photocopy of a "polis" from Russia that seemed to be enough for them.

Also, they did not ask for a HIV- certificate.

Bels
10-10-2007, 20:46
I have a British passport and yesterday received my new one-year ME visa without any limitations in Prague.

So they DID know about this (especially as I had asked the travel agent to remind them). But what they did NOT seem to know was the rule that UK citizens do not need travel insurance. Luckily, I had a photocopy of a "polis" from Russia that seemed to be enough for them.

Also, they did not ask for a HIV- certificate.

Good news for you, and it's the way it should be. However from personal posts I have received and posts on here I would still be wary of Brits going to other parts of Europe. There was on for example who got his in France and had the limited 90 day visa.

But hopefully this is a sign that all embassies are now fully aware of the changes. That is, until the next lot of changes. Oh, by the way did you get charged at the higher rate compared to the rest of Europeans. I think its 160 for same day mult-entry visa.

morrowdoug
10-10-2007, 22:38
So, I'm wholly confused:

I'm an American who's about to leave my English teaching job with a company who sponsored my visa, and thus I'll be travelling to Prague in early November to purchase a 1 year ME business visa on an invitation provided by Liga Consulting.

(1) Some posters have stated that the 90-day limitation applies only by nationality (EU), not by where you actually purchase your visa, while other posters have made contrary claims. Does anyone know whether, as an American, I am likely to receive a 90 day restriction should I purchase my visa in Prague?

(2) Another poster mentioned that it is technically illegal to work in Russia on a 1 year ME business visa. Is this true? It seems like every private English instructor I know is here on this visa. Will this cause problems?

(3) How does one go about registering oneself when one returns to Russia, particularly if one is not being sponsored by a specific company, and if one's landlords cannot (will not) register you?

Judge
10-10-2007, 22:44
[QUOTE=morrowdoug;296810]So, I'm wholly confused:



(1) Some posters have stated that the 90-day limitation applies only by nationality (EU), not by where you actually purchase your visa, while other posters have made contrary claims. Does anyone know whether, as an American, I am likely to receive a 90 day restriction should I purchase my visa in Prague?

QUOTE]

If they put the 90 day limitation in your visa,tell them straight away that your country didn't sign the agreement,they should fix it for you there and then.

morrowdoug
10-10-2007, 22:49
Ah, I almost forgot: Has anyone found a website for the Russian Embassy in Prague? Googling in both English and Russian has not gotten me anywhere...

Bels
10-10-2007, 22:52
So, I'm wholly confused:

I'm an American who's about to leave my English teaching job with a company who sponsored my visa, and thus I'll be travelling to Prague in early November to purchase a 1 year ME business visa on an invitation provided by Liga Consulting.

(1) Some posters have stated that the 90-day limitation applies only by nationality (EU), not by where you actually purchase your visa, while other posters have made contrary claims. Does anyone know whether, as an American, I am likely to receive a 90 day restriction should I purchase my visa in Prague?

(2) Another poster mentioned that it is technically illegal to work in Russia on a 1 year ME business visa. Is this true? It seems like every private English instructor I know is here on this visa. Will this cause problems?

(3) How does one go about registering oneself when one returns to Russia, particularly if one is not being sponsored by a specific company, and if one's landlords cannot (will not) register you?

Many points to cover here. I'll go for number 2. As an employed teacher you also need an invitation from the school that employs you. As a private, someone correct me if I'm wrong but you will need to have a residential visa and at the same for all Russian citizens you will need an entrepenuers license.

Perhaps you can work partime with a school who can provide the invitation. And work privately as extra time.

Clean32
10-10-2007, 23:01
ok i doint have much to add to this thread, not having to do visa runs etc etc, but just picking up on the Busness visa and working thing, Bels above post id correct. with the addition that you also need a work Visa AND a work permit. how to get a work permit , well firstly the company that employes you must have all the docs and certs to be able to employ an expat, second it is thay who send you off to get your permit, cant rember where you get it but its the same place russians get there penstions etc and not the OVIR.

Bels
11-10-2007, 18:40
As far as I know a teacher is exempt from needing a work permit. But must have a personal invitation with the schools name on it in order to apply for a business visa.This applies to English native speaking teachers. If the schools name is not on it you are working illegally.

Sumarokov-Elston
13-10-2007, 17:46
But hopefully this is a sign that all embassies are now fully aware of the changes. That is, until the next lot of changes. Oh, by the way did you get charged at the higher rate compared to the rest of Europeans. I think its 160 for same day mult-entry visa.[/QUOTE]

I didn't go for the one-day service, as I was not in a hurry. I ended up paying 4000 Kc, which is almost a hundred quid, took exactly one week. After paying more than the rest of Europeans, I was damned sure going to get the full period!

Sumarokov-Elston
13-10-2007, 17:50
x

kazachka
16-10-2007, 01:35
[QUOTE=morrowdoug;296810]So, I'm wholly confused:



(1) Some posters have stated that the 90-day limitation applies only by nationality (EU), not by where you actually purchase your visa, while other posters have made contrary claims. Does anyone know whether, as an American, I am likely to receive a 90 day restriction should I purchase my visa in Prague?

QUOTE]

If they put the 90 day limitation in your visa,tell them straight away that your country didn't sign the agreement,they should fix it for you there and then.

It SHOULD be by NATIONALITY, but last month Vadim told me ppl were having problems if they appliedin an EU country so go figure. If you can do it by mail in the US there will be no restrictions. I just did this.

animator
16-10-2007, 19:21
Hello everyone

Has anyone taken a risk of travelling on this type of visa after 90 days had run out?
My husband (the Judge) has got his visa in Malta, he is British though and shouldn`t have any limits in his visa.
He went back to Malta to sort this problem out. In the embassy of Russia he was given some papers proving that England hasn`t signed on that with Russia.
But also he`s been told that the law had changed in october, and now it doesn`t matter that England hasn`t signed anything: English still ought to leave after 90 days. the Judge is still thinking of coming to russia in spite of 90 days ran out, which i`m not totally happy about, cos there`s a big chance of being deported (for him). from the other hand i`ve been searching online all day and phoning everywhere to find out about this new law, but i haven`t found anything at all.
Does anyone know anything about this new law??:confused:

Proper Bostonian
16-10-2007, 19:34
Call Vadim at Liga. He will know the laws. 8 499 978-1529

animator
16-10-2007, 19:54
Call Vadim at Liga. He will know the laws. 8 499 978-1529

Thanks, i`ll phone him tomorrow.

Bels
16-10-2007, 20:20
Hello everyone

Has anyone taken a risk of travelling on this type of visa after 90 days had run out?
My husband (the Judge) has got his visa in Malta, he is British though and shouldn`t have any limits in his visa.
He went back to Malta to sort this problem out. In the embassy of Russia he was given some papers proving that England hasn`t signed on that with Russia.
But also he`s been told that the law had changed in october, and now it doesn`t matter that England hasn`t signed anything: English still ought to leave after 90 days. the Judge is still thinking of coming to russia in spite of 90 days ran out, which i`m not totally happy about, cos there`s a big chance of being deported (for him). from the other hand i`ve been searching online all day and phoning everywhere to find out about this new law, but i haven`t found anything at all.
Does anyone know anything about this new law??:confused:

All of these questions have been answered with others experiences and what Liga or the recent posts have answered questions with almost the same words that has been posted here months ago.

What does it state on your husbands visa? Because that's where your answer lies. If what you say is true then I and many other Brits are here illegally. However some Brits have received the wrong visa, the 90 day one due to the fact that embassies made a mistake and didn't realise that Brits were different from the rest of the EU.

I like many others have recommended Liga, however most of these recent posts are word for word of what has been stated well before Liga claims, whilst Liga was still confused. Some these words were mine , due to personal experience.

Where does it state it's no different for Britain even though the did't sign the agreement. I don't have 90 days restriction on my visa.

kazachka
16-10-2007, 21:38
I need to pick up my registration from Liga tomorrow and will ask Vadim if I get the chance. I have many British coworkers and so far, none has had a prob, but the last one I know of did a September visa run. It's also a real drag that you had to go all the way back to Malta to sort it all out.

Bels
16-10-2007, 21:53
I need to pick up my registration from Liga tomorrow and will ask Vadim if I get the chance. I have many British coworkers and so far, none has had a prob, but the last one I know of did a September visa run. It's also a real drag that you had to go all the way back to Malta to sort it all out.

Just a guess. The malta Embassy has got it wrong. Like some other European embassies outside UK has got it wrong for some Brits. It appears that the safest bet for Brits is to get their visas in their own country for the time bein. Ihaven't yet heard o a Brit getting a visa from London and then having a problem.

Oh please surprise me. I've read a few shocks on the information section tody. What with residential holders needing a work permit. I'm still under shock. But no, I cant't believe some of the recent posts recently written.

Clean32
16-10-2007, 21:57
Guest posted the OVIR web site, ( somewhere) its all in there

animator
17-10-2007, 13:43
Just a guess. The malta Embassy has got it wrong.



that what they (the embassy in malta) told us on the fone, but when my husband actually came there to correct his visa they replied that they can`t do that :verymad: most probably wanted a bribe.

only gave shit loads of paperwork (which they love so much) about england not signing anything, which is very risky to travel with...

About the new law:
Ive been to all those OVIR and FMS sites, but it doesnt say anything exact.
And guess what! When i foned migration service (ФМС) to consult they told me that they don`t answer any questions!!!
What the f...

Bels
17-10-2007, 22:08
I would imagine your husband stated that he was British. And that what-ever EU agreements that may have been applied doesn't apply to British, irish or others who didn't sign the agreement?

Still if they didn't want to know the truth, what can you do. The point is that those who got their visas from London, including me had no problems. I thought Malta and Cyprus had close connections with Britain. After all don't they drive on the same side of the road. The correct side.

ezik
18-10-2007, 00:06
My interpretation of this is that you can come and go as you please for the next 180 days, without re-registering, but you can only spend a total of 90 days in the country.

Whatever the local police might put in your passport, you will have problems trying to cross the border if you spend more than 90 days in Russia.

Still very strange that there is no Embassy personnel willing to comment publicly on this. This is, after all, the IDEAL forum to communicate to foreigners living in Russia.

Diplomats are arranging stuff while being in Moscow on a generous package, no-questions-asked-visa/permit, on my and your tax money. Still, the effort to communicate things publicly seems something too hard.

Things are decided by comfortable people, over the heads of the people that really have to deal with the hardship of residing here legally. Obviously, diplomacy is not about caring about nationals who are residing in a country like this. If they would, they wouldn't have agreed to Kafkaian rules.

I'm going to reside here as long as my visa and local authorities (note the combination) allow.

The rules are unclear. And I'm going to hold the representation of my government responsible. With any press coverage if needed. And there will be quite a bit.

Andrewm1962
18-10-2007, 19:05
Hi,
This will be a somewhat long post - I'm American, and I have been in Russia for three years. Prior I had a work visa in Ekaterinburg but I came to Moscow some months ago on a one-year, multi-entry business (commercial) visa obtained in Kiev in April.
I crossed the border into Ukraine last week and was told by the border guards on my return I would only be allowed to stay in Russia three months, despte my visa expiration of 1 April 2008. This was news to me, so I checked your site and found lots of conflicting information.
I asked a friend with who works in a large British firm in Moscow and he forwarded the following information:

Уважаемые Дамы и Господа,

На прошлой неделе Правительство России опубликовало два постановления (№635 и №655), которые вносят уточнения в порядок выдачи виз в РФ.

Главной новостью стало то, что отныне иностранный гражданин, независимо от своей национальности, и к которому применятся визовый режим, сможет находиться в РФ БЕСПРЕРЫВНО или СУММАРНО не более 90 дней в течение каждого периода в 180 дней. Об этом будет делаться соответствующая отметка в визе на русском языке.

Таким образом, привычных годовых виз больше не будет.

Исключение составляют только держатели РАБОЧИХ виз.

И еще одно нововведение, которое касается выдачи российской визы иностранному гражданину, находящимся в гос-ве, не являющимся государством его гражданства (например, гражданин Франции в США). Российские визы для этой категории граждан отныне будут оформляться только при целом ряде условий. Одним из них может быть наличие вида на жительство в стране пребывания, либо будет приниматься во внимание принцип взаимности (когда российский гражданин мог бы обратиться, например, за французской визой, находясь в США, без каких либо дополнительных условий).

С уважением,

ATH business travel solutions

___________________________________________________

Last week the Government of Russia introduced two regulations (#635 and #655), specifying the procedure of visa issue in the RF. The main news is that from now on a foreign person, irrespective of his/her nationality, to whom visa regulations are applied, can stay in the RF CONTINUOUSLY or IN TOTAL not more than 90 days during each period of 180 days. A corresponding note about this will be made in a visa in Russian.

Thus, annual visas in the former meaning do not exist anymore.

An exception is work visas holders.

There is one more note with reference to Russian visa issuing procedure for a foreign person, located in a country, which is not a country of his/her citizenship (e.g. the French in the USA). Russian visas for this category from now on will be drawn up only on several conditions, like a residential permit in a country of residence, or reciprocity principle (when a Russian citizen can apply for a French visa in the USA, without any additional conditions).

I followed up with a call to the U.S. Embassy and a Russian attorney who deals with immigration issues. According to the US Embassy, the new visa rules (90 days in, 90 days out) apply to everybody as of 18 October. I asked if it applied to visas issued before this date and they replied that it did.

The call to the attorney gave somewhat contradictory information - according to his contacts with the Minstry of Foreign Affairs, the new visa rules only apply to visas which have the 90 day restriction written on them, and most certainly not to visas issued before the law came into effect. HOWEVER, as he stated the borders are controlled in effect by FSB and nobody, including FSB, knows how to implement the new rules. In his opinion, my visa, valid until April, and my current registration (also until April) are not subject to the new regulations and I can stay a further six months. This is actually the official position of the ministry of foreign affairs, namely that the rules will only be applied to new visas/registrations. However, as stated, absolutely NOBODY knows what the border guards will do to implement the new regulations, and when he in fact called connections with border controls they themselves had no idea.

Obviously, the best practical solution is to have a work permit/visa, a student visa, or a residency permit. Short of that, as far as I can tell if you are here on an older visa (from before June) the rules should not apply to you.

Also, please remember that as of October the visa rules apply to EVERYBODY REGARDLESS OF NATIONALITY.

svelt
18-10-2007, 19:51
any suggestions for which is the quickest and cheapest city for ME visa application. UK passport. i understand that its minimum 3 day trip now.. all advice appreciated.

Andrewm1962
18-10-2007, 20:51
any suggestions for which is the quickest and cheapest city for ME visa application. UK passport. i understand that its minimum 3 day trip now.. all advice appreciated.

You know, I checked the Russian version of this new law - as far as I can tell, you still can apply for a visa in ANY COUNTRY WHERE YOU CAN LEGALLY RESIDE FOR A PERIOD GREATER THAN 90 DAYS. Technically, I think for EU this means anyplace in the EU, plus Ukraine, etc, although in practice who knows what the embassies will do.
As to prices, I think the visa prices are the same depending on processing time for every nationality, at every embassy. I've always used Kiev and their visa prices are the same as Washington for US passport holders.

Bels
18-10-2007, 21:44
Hi,
This will be a somewhat long post - I'm American, and I have been in Russia for three years. Prior I had a work visa in Ekaterinburg but I came to Moscow some months ago on a one-year, multi-entry business (commercial) visa obtained in Kiev in April.
I crossed the border into Ukraine last week and was told by the border guards on my return I would only be allowed to stay in Russia three months, despte my visa expiration of 1 April 2008. This was news to me, so I checked your site and found lots of conflicting information.
I asked a friend with who works in a large British firm in Moscow and he forwarded the following information:

Уважаемые Дамы и Господа,

На прошлой неделе Правительство России опубликовало два постановления (№635 и №655), которые вносят уточнения в порядок выдачи виз в РФ.

Главной новостью стало то, что отныне иностранный гражданин, независимо от своей национальности, и к которому применятся визовый режим, сможет находиться в РФ БЕСПРЕРЫВНО или СУММАРНО не более 90 дней в течение каждого периода в 180 дней. Об этом будет делаться соответствующая отметка в визе на русском языке.

Таким образом, привычных годовых виз больше не будет.

Исключение составляют только держатели РАБОЧИХ виз.

И еще одно нововведение, которое касается выдачи российской визы иностранному гражданину, находящимся в гос-ве, не являющимся государством его гражданства (например, гражданин Франции в США). Российские визы для этой категории граждан отныне будут оформляться только при целом ряде условий. Одним из них может быть наличие вида на жительство в стране пребывания, либо будет приниматься во внимание принцип взаимности (когда российский гражданин мог бы обратиться, например, за французской визой, находясь в США, без каких либо дополнительных условий).

С уважением,

ATH business travel solutions

___________________________________________________

Last week the Government of Russia introduced two regulations (#635 and #655), specifying the procedure of visa issue in the RF. The main news is that from now on a foreign person, irrespective of his/her nationality, to whom visa regulations are applied, can stay in the RF CONTINUOUSLY or IN TOTAL not more than 90 days during each period of 180 days. A corresponding note about this will be made in a visa in Russian.

Thus, annual visas in the former meaning do not exist anymore.

An exception is work visas holders.

There is one more note with reference to Russian visa issuing procedure for a foreign person, located in a country, which is not a country of his/her citizenship (e.g. the French in the USA). Russian visas for this category from now on will be drawn up only on several conditions, like a residential permit in a country of residence, or reciprocity principle (when a Russian citizen can apply for a French visa in the USA, without any additional conditions).

I followed up with a call to the U.S. Embassy and a Russian attorney who deals with immigration issues. According to the US Embassy, the new visa rules (90 days in, 90 days out) apply to everybody as of 18 October. I asked if it applied to visas issued before this date and they replied that it did.

The call to the attorney gave somewhat contradictory information - according to his contacts with the Minstry of Foreign Affairs, the new visa rules only apply to visas which have the 90 day restriction written on them, and most certainly not to visas issued before the law came into effect. HOWEVER, as he stated the borders are controlled in effect by FSB and nobody, including FSB, knows how to implement the new rules. In his opinion, my visa, valid until April, and my current registration (also until April) are not subject to the new regulations and I can stay a further six months. This is actually the official position of the ministry of foreign affairs, namely that the rules will only be applied to new visas/registrations. However, as stated, absolutely NOBODY knows what the border guards will do to implement the new regulations, and when he in fact called connections with border controls they themselves had no idea.

Obviously, the best practical solution is to have a work permit/visa, a student visa, or a residency permit. Short of that, as far as I can tell if you are here on an older visa (from before June) the rules should not apply to you.

Also, please remember that as of October the visa rules apply to EVERYBODY REGARDLESS OF NATIONALITY.

Thanks. Good post. You've got me thinking and worried. My wife and I are both looking into these matters very seriously. I'm sure there are many other Expats taking this post very seriously.

For me , all I can hope is that my residential visa comes through any day. Because it looks like this government is trying to bust up Russian families.

Andrewm1962
19-10-2007, 01:43
I believe it's common knowledge that Expat teachers of a native language, ie English, German, French, Spanish, Italian, get business visas with a personal invitation from the school. This is the way to legally work in Riussia. Would this new law now cause problems for their employment. Are their any teachers out their with this new 90 day visa and a personal invitation from their employer?

Teachers do't need work permits just the business visa and their employers invitation.But perhaps the system is about to change.


Ah, you know, I think I can answer this one too - according to Vadim at Liga (who I also called), the teacher exemption from the work permit requirement is still valid, meaning if you get a VALID invitation from a VALID school REGISTERED WITH OVIR TO ISSUE INVITATIONS then you can get registration for the length of the visa and do not need to disappear for 90 days in between stays.
The one thing you need to keep in mind is that very few of the language schools are actually registered with OVIR to issue invitations (and, as far as I know, the invitation must come from the school and this school must be listed as your visa sponsor on the visa itself). I have personal experience with this - I worked for a university in Ekaterinburg for two years, quit, and was working at various business schools, universities, etc, afterwards. My work visa expired and one school was more than happy to get me a new visa, but then we ran into OVIR (15,000r registration fee for the school - this was 12/2006, so maybe its changed - plus three months waiting time before they had the right to issue their own invitations).
Perhaps the regulations have changed regarding what the schools need to do to issue invitations, but the work permit exception is still true and, as far as anybody knows now, teachers on valid teaching/business visas are exempt from the 90 days in/90 days out.

kazachka
19-10-2007, 01:57
Yes- it's still true. There are a FEW good schools in Moscow that do this. I don't know about the big 3 as I'd never consider setting foot in any of them. However,I worked with one of the ones legally allowed to invite on WORK visa and it is still the case that you just need the work visa but not the permit.

Bels
19-10-2007, 11:39
Yes- it's still true. There are a FEW good schools in Moscow that do this. I don't know about the big 3 as I'd never consider setting foot in any of them. However,I worked with one of the ones legally allowed to invite on WORK visa and it is still the case that you just need the work visa but not the permit.

I would be grateful if you or other teachers could give us a list of schools that can legally invite. I am sure their are many teachers who would desire to work legally in this country, and don't want to waste their time having appointments with schools who don't. Hopefully these new regulations makes it more difficult for schools to employ illegally with a purchased invitation.

Bels
19-10-2007, 11:43
If it's any help. With my wife and I's investigations I can confirm that the above recent posts are accurate. We came up with the same info.

kazachka
19-10-2007, 16:51
I just got my registration from Liga- says 6 months. As far as when I have to leave (January or April) they could not confirm(GREAT) because I do not have the restriction in my visa. As far as work visas- I called work today and they are in the process of getting set up to do work visas and are hoping to be able to begin inviting next month. Such invites I know take about 1 month to process. This means lots of ppl will have to redo their visas:rules: OK big sigh of relief there.
A more reliable option looks like I'll have to go back to my old job during the daytime (can't AFFORD to quit my current job and I LIKE my current job) where work visas are also possible. OK work visa prob for me appears to be solved- but now I'm really up sh!t creek because I simply CAN'T AFFORD another big expensive trip to America in January for yet ANOTHER ()*(Y&*&^%$#$@@cking VISA RUN!!!! I can't just keep going back to the US several times a year Jesus Christ! The last trip just ran me 4000$ in expenses!:eek::eek::eek:
Work permit- I'm a teacher/governess therefore just need the work VISA.

Bels
19-10-2007, 19:54
The above post is a fine example if we come here to work in order to pay for our visas and travelling expenses. Or for married couples to give everything earned to pay for visas, invitations, travelling and government costs instead it going to a very needy Russian family.

kazachka
19-10-2007, 20:08
My company is very good about paying for the visas it's just the run itself(airfare etc) that if done too often just kills. I returned to work on Monday and was promptly reimbursed for my visa no prob. Even when I lived in Alaska, I only paid for my summer ticket to Moscow and used miles in winter. Anchorage- Moscow is a 2000$ tic.(slightly less in winter) Paying that twice would have just sucked for lack of a better verb at the moment.As far as spouses just trying to live a normal life, I really think there should be some kind of provisions in the law as opposed to kicking one spouse out after 90 days. :rant:Even if you and your other half wanted to resettle in your home country, good luck getting all the BS paperwork filed and completed before YOU have to scoot in 90 days:rant:

Bels
19-10-2007, 20:33
My company is very good about paying for the visas it's just the run itself(airfare etc) that if done too often just kills. I returned to work on Monday and was promptly reimbursed for my visa no prob. Even when I lived in Alaska, I only paid for my summer ticket to Moscow and used miles in winter. Anchorage- Moscow is a 2000$ tic.(slightly less in winter) Paying that twice would have just sucked for lack of a better verb at the moment.As far as spouses just trying to live a normal life, I really think there should be some kind of provisions in the law as opposed to kicking one spouse out after 90 days. :rant:Even if you and your other half wanted to resettle in your home country, good luck getting all the BS paperwork filed and completed before YOU have to scoot in 90 days:rant:

Yes I know the feeling, and now for many others it's got a lot worse. Funny I thought I read news from Putin that he wanted to make it a lot easier for us all in visas. Well he's certainly gave us alot of excitement these past three months. Is there any more to come?

Andrewm1962
19-10-2007, 20:45
I just got my registration from Liga- says 6 months. As far as when I have to leave (January or April) they could not confirm(GREAT) because I do not have the restriction in my visa. As far as work visas- I called work today and they are in the process of getting set up to do work visas and are hoping to be able to begin inviting next month. Such invites I know take about 1 month to process. This means lots of ppl will have to redo their visas:rules: OK big sigh of relief there.
A more reliable option looks like I'll have to go back to my old job during the daytime (can't AFFORD to quit my current job and I LIKE my current job) where work visas are also possible. OK work visa prob for me appears to be solved- but now I'm really up sh!t creek because I simply CAN'T AFFORD another big expensive trip to America in January for yet ANOTHER ()*(Y&*&^%$#$@@cking VISA RUN!!!! I can't just keep going back to the US several times a year Jesus Christ! The last trip just ran me 4000$ in expenses!:eek::eek::eek:
Work permit- I'm a teacher/governess therefore just need the work VISA.

Yeah, well, I'm in the exact same situation. I don't know if I have until January or April. I must change flats the end of November and its pointless if I must leave in January. I brought my dog with me three years ago and he's now so old it will be impossible to bring him back to the US which means putting him to sleep if I have to go. This is the big curse for me. :mad:

I'm an attorney but was teaching for three years here. I came to Moscow to find normal work, and now I must find something absolutely immediately or I'm in trouble. Now I'm sorry I left Ekat as it would've been much easier to get a school to do a work visa (even if me and a few others paid their registration fees with OVIR) than to search one out when I'm new in Moscow.
(Sorry, serious bad mood about this - especially worried about my dog).

I've been thinking about a student visa, in an absolute emergency (I think this exception still is valid also) but even this is F#$%R# up, as my passport expires in August and I want to time a new visa with a new passport, and its impossible to plan if I don't know if I can stay until April or January. Its not like I exactly have people waiting for me in the US, either - last time I was there was two and half years ago.

Sorry for venting...

kazachka
19-10-2007, 20:45
Oh please PLEASE don't tempt fate. I don't know, one would think they'd be ENCOURAGING legal immigration and making it easier given the demographic crisis.

kazachka
19-10-2007, 20:55
[QUOTE=Andrewm1962;300090]Yeah, well, I'm in the exact same situation. I don't know if I have until January or April. I must change flats the end of November and its pointless if I must leave in January. I brought my dog with me three years ago and he's now so old it will be impossible to bring him back to the US which means putting him to sleep if I have to go. This is the big curse for me. :mad:

I'm an attorney but was teaching for three years here. I came to Moscow to find normal work, and now I must find something absolutely immediately or I'm in trouble. Now I'm sorry I left Ekat as it would've been much easier to get a school to do a work visa (even if me and a few others paid their registration fees with OVIR) than to search one out when I'm new in Moscow.
(Sorry, serious bad mood about this - especially worried about my dog).

I've been thinking about a student visa, in an absolute emergency (I think this exception still is valid also) but even this is F#$%R# up, as my passport expires in August and I want to time a new visa with a new passport, and its impossible to plan if I don't know if I can stay until April or January. Its not like I exactly have people waiting for me in the US, either - last time I was there was two and half years ago.

Sorry for venting...[/QUOTY
You have every right to vent! Here's a thought- did you leave your employer in Ekat on good terms? You might try ringing them upand assessing the situation. I know it sucks about the dog, but if you get into a bind, I have a friend that's a vet and may be able to find the pooch a home so as not to have to put him to sleep:( Current job and old job can do me a work visa if for some reason not quickly enough then my coach and I are going to the sportkomitet (maybe as soon as next week) and they do a sports visa. Thankfully, they know me and I've been training with the team coach since 2002.

Andrewm1962
19-10-2007, 21:09
Sorry for venting...[/QUOTY
You have every right to vent! Here's a thought- did you leave your employer in Ekat on good terms? You might try ringing them upand assessing the situation.[/QUOTE]

Well, I was at a university for two years plus... I did not leave there on good terms. I wasn't the only native speaker, and we got stuck in the middle of a turf war between the economics language faculty and the international faculty and different sets of priorities for the EU grant money that was paying our salaries. In theory, we all quit (simultaneously). In reality, we weren't given much choice, and once we were gone the program simply disappeared and the money was used for other things.

I did work for a number of private language schools after that, while still on a valid work visa (I should note that I've never worked illegally in Russia, actually) but to the best of my knowledge none of them are registered with OVIR. I'm certain, actually. As far as I know in Ekaterinburg only the BIG schools, based out of Moscow or internationally, have this registration and even then is at the Moscow office. I never worked for them (without mentioning names) as they did their hiring almost exclusively via Moscow and then were generally oriented towards Brits instead of Americans.

I also taught various classes at four other universities/institutes in Ekaterinburg besides my main employer but as far as I know, at least three of them are also NOT registered with OVIR to do visas.

I'm actually not SO worried about getting a work visa. What I'm worried about is getting one in 90 days, if that's all I have. I'll be seriously f#$#@d on money and existential issues, for one thing - a new flat in Moscow with no guarantee if I'll be able to return to it, a trip to the US to wait for a new passport and then get a new invitation, plus the potential loss of my dog.

If I have six months I presume I can fix the problem. If I have less than three, then its serious trouble. I think we can all agree on this.

The passport issue further complicates it as I don't know if I can replace it here or not without cancelling my current visa (which I don't want to do if I have until April, but would do immediately if I only have 90 days).

I suspect that there will be some creative solution to this problem that appears within a short time. My guess is this bill is aimed at, for example, foreign NGO's and such who rarely have work permits for their employees, religious groups (half of the permanent American population in Ekaterinburg were religious missionaries on business visas for one year), etc, and that once the elections pass some creative solution will appear that eases the situation. I hope, anyway. However, none of this will be much of a help to us if we're all tossed just after New Years.

Andrewm1962
19-10-2007, 21:40
[/QUOTY]
I know it sucks about the dog, but if you get into a bind, I have a friend that's a vet and may be able to find the pooch a home so as not to have to put him to sleep:([/QUOTE]


The dog is between 16 and 17, can't hear, can barely see, and needs morning and evening tablets. He needs a lot of attention now - I couldn't leave him with anybody, as I don't think anybody would do what I do to take care of him (its seriously 2 to 3 hours a day, between feeding, walking, giving medicine, etc) and I'm not even sure if he would eat from anybody except me.
I found him on the street in Los Angeles in March, 1992. I was worried he was too old when we came here - I never expected him to last so long, to be honest. It sounds terrible but he's just old and slow, although now he's ill again.
Could you recommend your friend the vet? I've used two different vets in Moscow and haven't liked either, to be honest, and when things get complicated I run into the limits of my Russian.

Clean32
19-10-2007, 21:58
I happened to bump into my big buxom blond OVIR boss officer today when Gassing up. Havent seen her for about 6 months so she was all chatty etc ( very few res and temp res visas in yaroslavl, 3 in the last 5 years) I asked about this business visa stuff and how I was lucky that she was so efficient and that I now had " thanks to her efficacy and diligence) res visa etc etc. her response is, we ( Russians OVIR) want all husbands to be on res and temp res Visas and not on any others. Thats why Temp res is so much easier to produce nowadays than before when you did it. (sorry Bels you were correct about the $$$ thing) she then when on to explain that the business visa had been abused buy some companies in Moscow etc and that the business visa will become for business people who travel in an out of RF often, a work Visa for people who live and work here, and res and temp res is for families, in fact that the temp res may change into a relationship visa some time.

There you have it, its what I was told, sounds all cool to me really, and quite smart of the RF to do it this way. my opinion



I just got my registration from Liga- says 6 months. As far as when I have to leave (January or April) they could not confirm(GREAT) because I do not have the restriction in my visa. As far as work visas- I called work today and they are in the process of getting set up to do work visas and are hoping to be able to begin inviting next month. Such invites I know take about 1 month to process. This means lots of ppl will have to redo their visas:rules: OK big sigh of relief there.
A more reliable option looks like I'll have to go back to my old job during the daytime (can't AFFORD to quit my current job and I LIKE my current job) where work visas are also possible. OK work visa prob for me appears to be solved- but now I'm really up sh!t creek because I simply CAN'T AFFORD another big expensive trip to America in January for yet ANOTHER ()*(Y&*&^%$#$@@cking VISA RUN!!!! I can't just keep going back to the US several times a year Jesus Christ! The last trip just ran me 4000$ in expenses!:eek::eek::eek:
Work permit- I'm a teacher/governess therefore just need the work VISA.

Bels
19-10-2007, 22:31
I happened to bump into my big buxom blond OVIR boss officer today when Gassing up. Haven’t seen her for about 6 months so she was all chatty etc ( very few res and temp res visas in yaroslavl, 3 in the last 5 years) I asked about this business visa stuff and how I was lucky that she was so efficient and that I now had " thanks to her efficacy and diligence) res visa etc etc. her response is, we ( Russians OVIR) want all husbands to be on res and temp res Visas and not on any others. That’s why Temp res is so much easier to produce nowadays than before when you did it. (sorry Bels you were correct about the $$$ thing) she then when on to explain that the business visa had been abused buy some companies in Moscow etc and that the business visa will become for business people who travel in an out of RF often, a work Visa for people who live and work here, and res and temp res is for families, in fact that the temp res may change into a relationship visa some time.

There you have it, its what I was told, sounds all cool to me really, and quite smart of the RF to do it this way. my opinion

Glad to hear you had an efficient service with this buxom blond and had such an efficient service. I wish I had her services.

But sorry clean32 I'm going to upset you again. It has become more difficult to get a temporary residential visa. There are all the ex-soviets to contend with. They have the priority above us. What with the queueing at various and with the administration being hampered with overwhelming work. The service is slow and the straff are un-helpful and in-efficient.

My wife went to Odentsova today after five months they have stated it is at it's last central point. It shouldn't take long now. If we have a problem by November the 8th we have the right to complain as that is the deadline. We will have to go to another town to complain. I had to stay and teach and be near our baby being looked after by babooshka.

kazachka
19-10-2007, 22:49
That totally sucks. Are you working now? Start with that employer first and just see what they say-yes /no. My boss is finding out ASAP what the scoop is on those of us who don't have the restriction in our visas(yet). :rules: I should have an answer early next week on that(hopefully). Yes- I won't lose sleep if it's an April visa run. That gives the employer plenty of time to do the paperwork. January means we have to get on the stick and NOW!

kazachka
19-10-2007, 23:03
Glad to hear you had an efficient service with this buxom blond and had such an efficient service. I wish I had her services.

But sorry clean32 I'm going to upset you again. It has become more difficult to get a temporary residential visa. There are all the ex-soviets to contend with. They have the priority above us. What with the queueing at various and with the administration being hampered with overwhelming work. The service is slow and the straff are un-helpful and in-efficient.

My wife went to Odentsova today after five months they have stated it is at it's last central point. It shouldn't take long now. If we have a problem by November the 8th we have the right to complain as that is the deadline. We will have to go to another town to complain. I had to stay and teach and be near our baby being looked after by babooshka.

I assume you are applying in the Oblast? I'm going to eventually apply in the Oblast too after the first of the yr. I've been told that although it's slower in the Oblast, that chances of getting accepted are better because fewer ppl apply as opposed to Moscow. Do you feel this is still the case?

Bels
19-10-2007, 23:16
I assume you are applying in the Oblast? I'm going to eventually apply in the Oblast too after the first of the yr. I've been told that although it's slower in the Oblast, that chances of getting accepted are better because fewer ppl apply as opposed to Moscow. Do you feel this is still the case?

I can only hope so. I suspect so, because I have nothing to hide, and have had very good help in the application. They say when you are married and have a family in Russia you have the right.

I'll let you know of the confirmation. Yes I have applied outside main-stream Moscow, in the Western region. However we fear queues are now heavy for ex-soviets due to the employment pressure.

Clean32
19-10-2007, 23:21
Ok i know what you are saying, But there is a diffence of the OVIR making it easyer by reducing the requirements, and demand going up hence creating delays. as to the former cccr cits queing up? i never qued i was always draged to the frount.



Glad to hear you had an efficient service with this buxom blond and had such an efficient service. I wish I had her services.

But sorry clean32 I'm going to upset you again. It has become more difficult to get a temporary residential visa. There are all the ex-soviets to contend with. They have the priority above us. What with the queueing at various and with the administration being hampered with overwhelming work. The service is slow and the straff are un-helpful and in-efficient.

My wife went to Odentsova today after five months they have stated it is at it's last central point. It shouldn't take long now. If we have a problem by November the 8th we have the right to complain as that is the deadline. We will have to go to another town to complain. I had to stay and teach and be near our baby being looked after by babooshka.

Andrewm1962
20-10-2007, 01:57
That totally sucks. Are you working now? Start with that employer first and just see what they say-yes /no. My boss is finding out ASAP what the scoop is on those of us who don't have the restriction in our visas(yet). :rules: I should have an answer early next week on that(hopefully). Yes- I won't lose sleep if it's an April visa run. That gives the employer plenty of time to do the paperwork. January means we have to get on the stick and NOW!

That's the problem - nobody knows the deal on older visas. To be honest, as far as I know its against international law to change the restrictions on duly issued visas on people who were admitted to the country prior to the new laws. It violates every legal concept of 'notice' available, and let's fact it - many agencies don't have a clue right now, almost nobody does. My visa is from April, before any of these laws were passed. I was readmitted before the new laws were passed and given effect.
Of course, this isn't going to stop the problems, but I would guess there will be a lot of them. How many people get their visas, register by mail, don't read Russian, etc, and then will hit the border to discover they've just overstayed their visa by 90 days?! A lot, I'd guess.

Anyway, if I have until April I don't care - I presume I can have a new job, work visa/work permit by then. If I have effectively less than 90 days, its a disaster... and I think this is true for all of us.

Also, I don't think you can compare the bureacracy in Yaroslavl or other smaller cites with Moscow. I know in Ekaterinburg OVIR was simply a five minute affair, and the ladies were more than glad to help with any problem.

Meapyloalay
21-10-2007, 00:43
online4love.com: At Adult Dating- Internet Sex & Swinger Personals Online Community (http://online4love.com), you can find partners for all kinds of action on all levels of commitment because you're among the largest
community of sensual, sexy, open-minded people in the world.

kazachka
21-10-2007, 01:21
AHEM....MODS?!!!!!!! I think the last post is a tad bit offtopic.....

Bels
21-10-2007, 12:52
Yes I think you're right on that one:rules:

I think he or it was making searches and was attracted by clean32 s statement of a big buxom blond.

Mvlzac
21-10-2007, 13:14
I am sorry to tell this, but 80% of the information in this thread is not true, you need to get oficial information from the prime source and not from posts from others posts, you just read a post from some other guy who has not exposed the official source, once the official version is exposed, then you may start acting. Do not get fired, do not kill you dog and do not believe everything is posted in this site, I have find a lot of misinformation and a huge amount of stupidities.

For interacting is ok, but for learning or advicing, it may be even dangerous, nothing has already said about US citizens or Britons or Australians or Argentinians or anyother non european *officialy* and if it has.............POST THE F@kng source.

Meanwhile that is not happening, take it easy, what happens, will happen, worrying or not.... better you start thinking, and I do not know why you are so surprised if in our countries is as hardest or even more for Russians.

kazachka
21-10-2007, 13:22
Um- I went to one of the sources on Friday(Liga) and confirmed the above info.It now applies to all nationalities. There is also an attachment in Russian a few pages back that spells it out pretty clearly. The only thing I'm waiting to hear on and my boss is investigating this as well is how this will affect those of us on visas with no restrictions yet. So the 90/180 day rule is definitely going to happen and apparently sooner rather than later:rules:

Bels
21-10-2007, 13:32
I am sorry to tell this, but 80% of the information in this thread is not true, you need to get oficial information from the prime source and not from posts from others posts, you just read a post from some other guy who has not exposed the official source, once the official version is exposed, then you may start acting. Do not get fired, do not kill you dog and do not believe everything is posted in this site, I have find a lot of misinformation and a huge amount of stupidities.

For interacting is ok, but for learning or advicing, it may be even dangerous, nothing has already said about US citizens or Britons or Australians or Argentinians or anyother non european *officialy* and if it has.............POST THE F@kng source.

Meanwhile that is not happening, take it easy, what happens, will happen, worrying or not.... better you start thinking, and I do not know why you are so surprised if in our countries is as hardest or even more for Russians.


Err sources ! ? All I can say you misunderstand these posts. Yes there is a build up of personal experiences. And wrong statements coming from border police and mistakes being made by officials in Russian foreign embassies. But there is also a build up of facts here

I think you misunderstand us. We are intelligent enough to work out what is an experience and what is fact, and the occasional guess. A lot of us are also looking at back-up for confirmation. Now if you have English speaking source facts. Please post them.

Mvlzac
21-10-2007, 14:04
your subjective experiences are not fact of what is happening, in fact you are messing more and more the information, you even have not a link for the exposed information… here is one...



. :: (http://fmsmoscow.ru)

Mvlzac
21-10-2007, 14:11
that is why you have so much trouble, you even cant see what stands right in front of your noses.

Ignorance and arrogancy is the common line in the expat comments.

Proper Bostonian
21-10-2007, 14:13
Jeez.... What a mess, though nothing new for Russia.

I'm an American, received my ME vis in June in Paris. No restrictions. When my husband registered me he was told by the people at the passport desk to use the end date of my visa (June 2008) for my registration. This was the 1st time this had happened as previously I was always given the usual 6 month registration.

I really don't understand and find it hard to believe (even for Russia), that these new laws will be retroactive. My husband wants a mini get-away to Egypt this week and now I'm nervous I won't be able to get back in despite the unrestricted ME since I have already been here more than 90 days. Even worse would be the possibility f having to stay out for 90 days.

I will call Vadim tomorrow though based on other posts it seems even he isn't quite sure what's going on. I checked the Web sites of the Russian Consulate in DC and the American Embassy here and there is no information about any new rules/restrictions. The most bizarre thing is if you Goggle "new Russian visa rules/restirctions" there are articles everywhere about Russia wanting to ease restrictions (with Europe).

Am totally fed up! (Yes another person venting...)

Mvlzac
21-10-2007, 14:19
NO OFFICIAL DOCUMENT HAS BEEN RELEASED IN RELATION WITH NON EUROPEANS....

Border officers may say anything, then you will be arrested, but noone has been arrested for having a visa without those especification for the EU citzns.

Well if a police man tell me to suck his k@k because he says that the law says that, will I do it? worse, will I POST that now we need to be prepared for sucking?

FIND SOURCES, official and please understand that this site is misunderstanding a lot, even the admnistration from this site has not an area here for advicing you.........

I dont doubt that all of you are capable people, but the things said here are a collection of English communication language ignorance.....

Post Official sources in English or in Russian and move on with your lives.

Bels
21-10-2007, 17:13
Jeez.... What a mess, though nothing new for Russia.

I'm an American, received my ME vis in June in Paris. No restrictions. When my husband registered me he was told by the people at the passport desk to use the end date of my visa (June 2008) for my registration. This was the 1st time this had happened as previously I was always given the usual 6 month registration.

I really don't understand and find it hard to believe (even for Russia), that these new laws will be retroactive. My husband wants a mini get-away to Egypt this week and now I'm nervous I won't be able to get back in despite the unrestricted ME since I have already been here more than 90 days. Even worse would be the possibility f having to stay out for 90 days.

I will call Vadim tomorrow though based on other posts it seems even he isn't quite sure what's going on. I checked the Web sites of the Russian Consulate in DC and the American Embassy here and there is no information about any new rules/restrictions. The most bizarre thing is if you Goggle "new Russian visa rules/restirctions" there are articles everywhere about Russia wanting to ease restrictions (with Europe).

Am totally fed up! (Yes another person venting...)

Sorry I can't work out your problem currently. A visa up to June 2008. Do you have anything mentioning clearly about the 90 days leaving anywhere. If not carry on as usual. As far I can work out, it's your next visa you might have problems with if we are to believe the new laws coming through.

I leave in January after six months as far as I am concerned, unless informed otherwise by my local Russian Embassy in London.

Vadim must be a very busy man at the moment repeating himself.

Judge
21-10-2007, 17:28
Hi,
This will be a somewhat long post - I'm American, and I have been in Russia for three years. Prior I had a work visa in Ekaterinburg but I came to Moscow some months ago on a one-year, multi-entry business (commercial) visa obtained in Kiev in April.
I crossed the border into Ukraine last week and was told by the border guards on my return I would only be allowed to stay in Russia three months, despte my visa expiration of 1 April 2008. This was news to me, so I checked your site and found lots of conflicting information.
I asked a friend with who works in a large British firm in Moscow and he forwarded the following information:

Уважаемые Дамы и Господа,

На прошлой неделе Правительство России опубликовало два постановления (№635 и №655), которые вносят уточнения в порядок выдачи виз в РФ.

Главной новостью стало то, что отныне иностранный гражданин, независимо от своей национальности, и к которому применятся визовый режим, сможет находиться в РФ БЕСПРЕРЫВНО или СУММАРНО не более 90 дней в течение каждого периода в 180 дней. Об этом будет делаться соответствующая отметка в визе на русском языке.

Таким образом, привычных годовых виз больше не будет.

Исключение составляют только держатели РАБОЧИХ виз.

И еще одно нововведение, которое касается выдачи российской визы иностранному гражданину, находящимся в гос-ве, не являющимся государством его гражданства (например, гражданин Франции в США). Российские визы для этой категории граждан отныне будут оформляться только при целом ряде условий. Одним из них может быть наличие вида на жительство в стране пребывания, либо будет приниматься во внимание принцип взаимности (когда российский гражданин мог бы обратиться, например, за французской визой, находясь в США, без каких либо дополнительных условий).

С уважением,

ATH business travel solutions

___________________________________________________

Last week the Government of Russia introduced two regulations (#635 and #655), specifying the procedure of visa issue in the RF. The main news is that from now on a foreign person, irrespective of his/her nationality, to whom visa regulations are applied, can stay in the RF CONTINUOUSLY or IN TOTAL not more than 90 days during each period of 180 days. A corresponding note about this will be made in a visa in Russian.

Thus, annual visas in the former meaning do not exist anymore.

An exception is work visas holders.

There is one more note with reference to Russian visa issuing procedure for a foreign person, located in a country, which is not a country of his/her citizenship (e.g. the French in the USA). Russian visas for this category from now on will be drawn up only on several conditions, like a residential permit in a country of residence, or reciprocity principle (when a Russian citizen can apply for a French visa in the USA, without any additional conditions).

I followed up with a call to the U.S. Embassy and a Russian attorney who deals with immigration issues. According to the US Embassy, the new visa rules (90 days in, 90 days out) apply to everybody as of 18 October. I asked if it applied to visas issued before this date and they replied that it did.

The call to the attorney gave somewhat contradictory information - according to his contacts with the Minstry of Foreign Affairs, the new visa rules only apply to visas which have the 90 day restriction written on them, and most certainly not to visas issued before the law came into effect. HOWEVER, as he stated the borders are controlled in effect by FSB and nobody, including FSB, knows how to implement the new rules. In his opinion, my visa, valid until April, and my current registration (also until April) are not subject to the new regulations and I can stay a further six months. This is actually the official position of the ministry of foreign affairs, namely that the rules will only be applied to new visas/registrations. However, as stated, absolutely NOBODY knows what the border guards will do to implement the new regulations, and when he in fact called connections with border controls they themselves had no idea.

Obviously, the best practical solution is to have a work permit/visa, a student visa, or a residency permit. Short of that, as far as I can tell if you are here on an older visa (from before June) the rules should not apply to you.

Also, please remember that as of October the visa rules apply to EVERYBODY REGARDLESS OF NATIONALITY.

The above is all true, i was told this by a diplomat at the russian embassy,this is the reason why they couldn't lift my old visa and put in a new one..

Bels
21-10-2007, 17:38
But Judge look carefully at the quote on the first paragraph on the here-say of a border guard. This is the particular statement which concerns us about our current visas being changed.

QUOUTE: I crossed the border into Ukraine last week and was told by the border guards on my return I would only be allowed to stay in Russia three months, despte my visa expiration of 1 April 2008.:QUOUTE END

This is the part I can't believe and a lot of us don't want to believe. The here say of a border policeman. What an existing visa of a previous agreement being affected?

Guest
21-10-2007, 17:41
I am a bit surprised that the new rules about the ME visa create so many problems. In fact all these problems come from the fact that most people used the ME visa as a "12 months residence permit", what was not the object of the visa! How many expats were staying here 5, 6, 10 years with this ME visa, just living here - and working illegally often too?

Now the rule makes the things clear: Want live here? Apply for a residence permit! ME visas should be reserved for people who come OFTEN here for SHORT term!

Judge
21-10-2007, 17:50
But Judge look carefully at the quote on the first paragraph on the here-say of a border guard. This is the particular statement which concerns us about our current visas being changed.

QUOUTE: I crossed the border into Ukraine last week and was told by the border guards on my return I would only be allowed to stay in Russia three months, despte my visa expiration of 1 April 2008.:QUOUTE END

This is the part I can't believe and a lot of us don't want to believe. The here say of a border policeman.

This is why i'm not taken the risk on coming back into Russia,i might find a border guard who knows the rules and sends me back out or even worse.

Bels
21-10-2007, 18:06
I am a bit surprised that the new rules about the ME visa create so many problems. In fact all these problems come from the fact that most people used the ME visa as a "12 months residence permit", what was not the object of the visa! How many expats were staying here 5, 6, 10 years with this ME visa, just living here - and working illegally often too?

Now the rule makes the things clear: Want live here? Apply for a residence permit! ME visas should be reserved for people who come OFTEN here for SHORT term!n

Many of us take the business visa in preference to the personal invitation visa while collecting up all the necessary documents and queuing up for our various visits and then waiting for the results of our residency. I'm sure their are many of us who are illegal without the intent of being illegal due to the Russian slow system. Errr but but very fast and regular in writing and passing visa laws. several each month I think.

SalTheReturn
21-10-2007, 19:33
n

Many of us take the business visa in preference to the personal invitation visa while collecting up all the necessary documents and queuing up for our various visits and then waiting for the results of our residency. I'm sure their are many of us who are illegal without the intent of being illegal due to the Russian slow system. Errr but but very fast and regular in writing and passing visa laws. several each month I think.

this make no sense. if russian rules does not allow you to legally stay and work in Russia, you will have to do like many other immigrants/economical migrants when not granted the possibility of staying in the country they want, that is to say move away/relocate somewhere else rather than committing a crime.

it seems to me all this fuss about the russian government making stricter rules it is because both Europe and the US are making life difficult for Russians who wants to travel and work abroad.

Bels
21-10-2007, 19:50
So whole Russian families with babies re-locate somewhere else whilst waiting for their spouses residency?

ridcully
21-10-2007, 19:57
Many of us take the business visa in preference to the personal invitation visa while collecting up all the necessary documents and queuing up for our various visits and then waiting for the results of our residency. I'm sure their are many of us who are illegal without the intent of being illegal due to the Russian slow system. Errr but but very fast and regular in writing and passing visa laws. several each month I think.

I've been reading this (and similar) thread(s) with interest over the last few weeks. I'm a UK citizen, and have visited (from the UK) with increasing regularity over the last five years. My visa runs out at the end of this month, and I'm currently back in the UK waiting for a new invitation, for a m/e business visa valid for a year. I'll be interested to see what the new visa says when I get my passport back from the consulate in London - I'll post to this forum. (Don't expect invite until about 6th Nov, though.)

This article (The Well Online :: Eng :: Special Features :: Coming to Russia :: 07.06.2006 - Hiring Local and Foreign Staff as Contractors and Employees (http://tinyurl.com/yvqwym)) certainly seems to support Bels's contention, (although it was published nearly 18 months ago).


In the past, foreigners would often order a one-year commercial multi-entry/exit visa from a travel service provider and then get a job and work in Russia using that visa. It has always been clear that to do so is illegal, but in the past the rules were not enforced. Now enforcement is increasing and it is getting to the point where this practice could result in the foreigner being deported or denied visa renewals.

Ordering a commercial multi entry/exit visa may be a good way to initially enter and leave Russia during the start-up phase of a business. However, it is illegal and risky for a foreign citizen to assume a position in a Russian business (including the Russian branch or representative office of a foreign company) until having obtained a Russian work permit and work visa, or a residency permit.

Problem is - permits can seemingly take a long time to be issued! :( But maybe Mr Firestone - the lawyer who wrote this article - is just interested in getting as much business as possible. Elsewhere, he says that his firm will manage the whole permit application process (residency, work etc) for you for a cool $6,000! But maybe it's worth that just to avoid the personal hassle? If it's truly awful, I'd consider it, I suppose.

I now want to live in Russia with my new (Russian) g/f, and we're planning to marry some time next year. Once the new visa arrives I'm planning to stay in Russia more than in the UK, renting (with her) a flat. If I have understood things correctly (as expressed by Firestone) I need a residence permit and then to register as an entrepreneur in order to work as a consultant. Does anyone have experience of this? I am terminally confused!!

:confused:

Bels
21-10-2007, 20:04
I've been reading this (and similar) thread(s) with interest over the last few weeks. I'm a UK citizen, and have visited (from the UK) with increasing regularity over the last five years. My visa runs out at the end of this month, and I'm currently back in the UK waiting for a new invitation, for a m/e business visa valid for a year. I'll be interested to see what the new visa says when I get my passport back from the consulate in London - I'll post to this forum. (Don't expect invite until about 6th Nov, though.)

This article (The Well Online :: Eng :: Special Features :: Coming to Russia :: 07.06.2006 - Hiring Local and Foreign Staff as Contractors and Employees (http://tinyurl.com/yvqwym)) certainly seems to support Bels's contention, (although it was published nearly 18 months ago).



Problem is - permits can seemingly take a long time to be issued! :( But maybe Mr Firestone - the lawyer who wrote this article - is just interested in getting as much business as possible. Elsewhere, he says that his firm will manage the whole permit application process (residency, work etc) for you for a cool $6,000! But maybe it's worth that just to avoid the personal hassle? If it's truly awful, I'd consider it, I suppose.

I now want to live in Russia with my new (Russian) g/f, and we're planning to marry some time next year. Once the new visa arrives I'm planning to stay in Russia more than in the UK, renting (with her) a flat. If I have understood things correctly (as expressed by Firestone) I need a residence permit and then to register as an entrepreneur in order to work as a consultant. Does anyone have experience of this? I am terminally confused!!

:confused:

In answer to last paragraph. Yes I have stated it also many times.

You will need the residency, and then your entrepenuers. ERRRRemmm. Straight forward in practice. And I suggest you do it all yourself, with the assistance of your girl friend if you don't know Russian much.

Bels
21-10-2007, 20:06
Entrepenuers licene doent take long and is much eaier than residency.

Rusguest
21-10-2007, 20:17
Here's the official text of the change - Постановление от 4 октября 2007 г. N 635 (http://www.government.ru/government/governmentactivity/rfgovernmentdecisions/archive/2007/10/05/4833186.htm) & here's the old law to which the change have been made Постановление от 9 июня 2003 г. № 335 (http://www.government.ru/government/governmentactivity/rfgovernmentdecisions/archive/2003/06/11/imported-news10322.htm)
Points 3 & 5 the interesting ones:
According to point 3, if you want to want to get your visa in a third country you should have a visa to stay there for more than 90 days.
Point 5 confirms that a person can now stay in Russia only for 90 days out of each 180 day period.
Anyone knows when these changes are supposed to come into effect?
BTW, it seems that there are going to be some changes to tourist vizas too. It seems you no longer need a tourist voucher but a "confirmation for receiving a foreign tourist" (points 25 & 26)

Bels
21-10-2007, 20:32
Here's the official text of the change - Постановление от 4 октября 2007 г. N 635 (http://www.government.ru/government/governmentactivity/rfgovernmentdecisions/archive/2007/10/05/4833186.htm) & here's the old law to which the change have been made Постановление от 9 июня 2003 г. № 335 (http://www.government.ru/government/governmentactivity/rfgovernmentdecisions/archive/2003/06/11/imported-news10322.htm)
Points 3 & 5 the interesting ones:
According to point 3, if you want to want to get your visa in a third country you should have a visa to stay there for more than 90 days.
Point 5 confirms that a person can now stay in Russia only for 90 days out of each 180 day period.
Anyone knows when these changes are supposed to come into effect?
BTW, it seems that there are going to be some changes to tourist vizas too. It seems you no longer need a tourist voucher but a "confirmation for receiving a foreign tourist" (points 25 & 26)

They say the new regulations will come into effect before the end of the year

SalTheReturn
21-10-2007, 20:35
So whole Russian families with babies re-locate somewhere else whilst waiting for their spouses residency?

and why your case should differ from the case of all the immigrants in other countries?
you seem to forget you come from the country, UK, with the highest rejection rate in Europe and where an immigration officer just does not care and do not even let undesired people to leave the plane

yes you should leave, given that you are not allowed to stay legally

Bels
21-10-2007, 20:43
and why your case should differ from the case of all the immigrants in other countries?
you seem to forget you come from the country, UK, with the highest rejection rate in Europe and where an immigration officer just does not care and do not even let undesired people to leave the plane

yes you should leave, given that you are not allowed to stay legally

Looking at the fiance visa for UK it is a lot more efficient. A matter of a few days providing papers are in order.

And also that they are convinced you have somewhere to live and have income to live without claiming state benefit.

kazachka
21-10-2007, 20:53
Entrepenuers licene doent take long and is much eaier than residency.

It may have been answered before but things change every day it seems but during the application process for temp residency, can you still leave provided you have an exit visa? Let's just assume for example that I file for residency after the January holidays and things go slooooooow as molasses and um errr October rolls around and I want to go to the US for the Chicago Marathon? Am I up sh!t creek?

Bels
21-10-2007, 21:02
It may have been answered before but things change every day it seems but during the application process for temp residency, can you still leave provided you have an exit visa? Let's just assume for example that I file for residency after the January holidays and things go slooooooow as molasses and um errr October rolls around and I want to go to the US for the Chicago Marathon? Am I up sh!t creek?

During visa processing I see no problems to leave if you wish. Problem is do you know when your application is going to be accepted. I have heard of no changes. To make certain I would check up with Liga consultants.

Proper Bostonian
22-10-2007, 10:45
I can only speak about my own situation. As previously mentioned, I'm American. Received new ME visa in Paris in June, good through end of June 2008. No restrictions indicated. I spoke with Vadim this morning & was told that I am ok until the expiration of this visa - can come & go as I please and no 90 day limitations.

Of course, it makes me nervous when I read that people are being told about a 90 day restriction by the border guards. Seems they don't know what they're talking about...

I asked Vadim if I'd have a problem with my next visa and his attitude was wait & see because even the authorities don't quite know what's going on now and who knows what will be by next summer.

I also asked him about my registration since the passport desk gave me registration through the expiration of my visa (one year). That, he said, he didn't know. Why they gave me a year instead of 6 months? Who knows. Anyway, I suspect I'll leave before 6 months.

Bels
22-10-2007, 11:05
We appear to be going backwards and forwards here. Even with quotes from Vadim of which I do believe.

First do we have this 90 day restriction for all, or should I say for Brits and Americans?

Will these new laws be enforced on our next visa, Or will it affect all by end of the year for those applying for there next visa.

And of course the question of workers in Russia, I presume they will be on a work visa and no problem if they have a qualified company to work for.

And in regards to teachers. Can anyone confirm that they continue to not need a work permit but must have an invitation from that particular school, with the schools name, and is qualified to issue these invitations. By the way this is an old law, not a new one.

Just need others to clarify this, as others continue to be mixed up.

Bels
22-10-2007, 11:09
Quote from proper Bostonian:I asked Vadim if I'd have a problem with my next visa and his attitude was wait & see because even the authorities don't quite know what's going on now and who knows what will be by next summer.END QUOTE

The above quote got me. Because I thought Vadim knew what was on the way.

Proper Bostonian
22-10-2007, 12:39
If the authorities aren't sure about things, how can Vadim be?

Did you see today's Moscow Times? It's clear that no one really knows what's going on. Two interesting quotes:

"Zubkov's decree also says foreigners might have to obtain the visas in their native countries -- which implies that U.S. and British expatriates could no longer hop on the train to Kiev for a visa run. But representatives of visa agencies and foreign business lobbies were unsure how that rule would be implemented, and some said it might not apply to Westerners.". How is one to understand the law if, "Zubkov's decree also says foreigners MIGHT..." What does might mean?

Also, "It is unclear whether the new rules will affect foreigners with multiple-entry business visas issued before Zubkov's decree."

So, it MIGHT be entirely possible that Vadim's interpretation MIGHT not be correct!

As usual, "Spokespeople for the Foreign Ministry and the Federal Migration Service declined to comment".

BTW Salthe return... Your sarcasm really isn't appreciated.

Bels wrote that the UK's visa system is much more efficient. On that I can't comment, but I can say it's much easier to get a U.S. green card than to get a residency permit here.

Despite the fact that immigrants to the USA are always complaining, my husband had quite an easy time of it. Yes, he did need a med exam for TB (no sexual disease testing) and yes, he did need a doc from the police showing he didn't have a record. So, 2 trips and really no lines since he had a specified appt at the medical place. He was given a sealed envelope to give at US immigration at the airport & approx 6 wks later his green card was mailed to us! AND his passport was stamped that he had the right to work in the USA from the day he entered. He did not have to get a temporary residence permit prior to his permanent residency. Sure, maybe we got lucky in that it took such a short time before receiving a green card and true, before you get the physical card you are not supposed to leave the country, but not a big deal. We were surprised by how easy things were. Of course, we did everything by the book - he wasn't an illegal trying to change his status. Even then, the US often has amnesty periods for illegals.

I know this latter part is off topic, but since this is an expat forum and these new laws concern foreigners, I think Sal should stay out of it unless he has something constructive to say...

Bels
22-10-2007, 21:05
To sum it all up with me and the above. If only we had professionalism in the laws passed and ensure they are enforced by us foreigners being properly informed. The majority of us don't want to break these sensible laws.

Also when laws are passed that we have an accurate and efficient service from all staff for visas, invitations,work permits, and residency. Is it too much to ask.

Oh, and I forgot, ensure that staff are well informed of the new laws coming, and most certainly when they are in force.

Clean32
22-10-2007, 21:08
It may have been answered before but things change every day it seems but during the application process for temp residency, can you still leave provided you have an exit visa? Let's just assume for example that I file for residency after the January holidays and things go slooooooow as molasses and um errr October rolls around and I want to go to the US for the Chicago Marathon? Am I up sh!t creek?

yes you need an exit Visa, it takes about 2 weeks and about 200p if i rember correct.

this visa is not about letting you leave RF, you can leave with out it. just that leaving with out and exit visa meens the prossessing for temp res stops canceld and you can never apply for it again.

Bels
22-10-2007, 21:21
But as stated :) you obviously don't need an exit visa on the application process. But you might just miss out on your application being accepted. DODGY.

And if your visa runs out you have to go anyway no matter. And I just thought of something, so you have to go because your visa ran out of time, and your residency is accepted the next day, will they think you are breaking the rules by not having an exit visa. Or since you are not there to accept it, do they decide you are not interested :yikes:

kazachka
22-10-2007, 21:30
Did either of you guys leave (using exit visa) during the process? Agh when to start when to start when to start......esp since now I'm not sure when my visa runs out. Got ME 1 yr good til 10.10. 08 w/ no 90 day thingie in there. Workplace is going to get me a work visa likely early into next yr so maybe it's best to start once my visa gets switched? Work visas renew w/o having to leave.

Bels
23-10-2007, 19:31
this make no sense. if russian rules does not allow you to legally stay and work in Russia, you will have to do like many other immigrants/economical migrants when not granted the possibility of staying in the country they want, that is to say move away/relocate somewhere else rather than committing a crime.

it seems to me all this fuss about the russian government making stricter rules it is because both Europe and the US are making life difficult for Russians who wants to travel and work abroad.

You really think it's that hard to get in the UK?
Ive got the official statistics right here for, it came along by chance.

By 2016 there will be a 65 million population in Great Britain. By 2051 there will be 77 million.Mainly due to migration inflow. There are 145,000 people a year immigrating to the UK.

Now does Italy have such statistics.

BBC NEWS | UK | UK population 'to hit 65m total' (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7057765.stm)

The country has got so much coming in that it can't cope. It'll end up worse than China. It probably is per square mile.

Maxim
26-10-2007, 11:58
Where you have heard about this exit visa?

I spoke so much with FMS, none of them mentioned this.

On the contrary, my wife applied for temprary residenship 20 days before her visa ended, they said - go out from the country and make a new visa by your own and thats it.

Maxim
26-10-2007, 17:52
You really think it's that hard to get in the UK?
Ive got the official statistics right here for, it came along by chance.AFAIK they refuse 30% of tourist visa requests in Russia.

Bels
26-10-2007, 20:13
AFAIK they refuse 30% of tourist visa requests in Russia.

Here's the information of visas for Russians here. Providing paper work is in order and applications are answered truthfully there shouldn't be a problem.

Visas*British Embassy, Russia (http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1089123735249)

for application forms Application forms and guidanceBritish Embassy, Russia (http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1089124794311)

Maxim
26-10-2007, 20:24
Here's the information of visas for Russians here. Providing paper work is in order and applications are answered truthfully there shouldn't be a problem.It is a problem for tourist companies who complained about visa refuses.

David Craig
27-10-2007, 00:28
Hey Bels, so what's an entreprnuers licence, what do you need to qualify, what do you need to do, and does it negate this new decree...I know nothing......much..Cheers:doh:

Bels
27-10-2007, 20:11
Hey Bels, so what's an entreprnuers licence, what do you need to qualify, what do you need to do, and does it negate this new decree...I know nothing......much..Cheers:doh:

It allows you to be self employed and pay Russian taxes at 6%. You will need to be Russian or have at least a temporary residency visa.

Bels
27-10-2007, 20:19
It is a problem for tourist companies who complained about visa refuses.

My wife was a tour operator for several years specialising in travel for Russians to the UK. She certainly didn't have many rejections herself but she refused many clients. She tells me the major problem was declaring sufficient income. This can be declared cash income. It must be understood that these visas are for six months.

The Embassy web-site states that anyone who honestly wants to come to the UK with good reason as a tourist is not likely to be refused.

I blame un-professional travel agents.

thva
27-10-2007, 23:57
They say the new regulations will come into effect before the end of the year

Can you give us a sense of who says this? Vadim, maybe?

I had thought that the new regulations had already come into effect -
does this mean that those of us (Brit, American, Irish, etc.) whose visas will expire by the end of the year still have a chance to get an additional year grandfathered under the old system? If so, I'm heading to Kiev soon!

Bels
28-10-2007, 00:28
Can you give us a sense of who says this? Vadim, maybe?

I had thought that the new regulations had already come into effect -
does this mean that those of us (Brit, American, Irish, etc.) whose visas will expire by the end of the year still have a chance to get an additional year grandfathered under the old system? If so, I'm heading to Kiev soon!

There's something stating this law of 90 days for all by law, but it's vague as they are talking in general for all, especially ex soviets. There is no direct mention of westerners or for those who didn't sign the EU agreement. It's for all. My wife translating states the law is very vague and she;'s a professional translator. Let's assume that these new laws have come into effect, but our Russian Embassy in London will state "What new laws" they don't know anything about the new laws and they are carrying on as usual.

But to repeat what I have said before. if you have a current visa that doesn't state 90 days restriction I suggest carry on as usual and hope that when you get your next visa that nothing changes. That should go for Brits, Irish and Americans who did not apply in the wrong country.

JohnnyLomo
28-10-2007, 09:50
That should go for Brits, Irish and Americans who did not apply in the wrong country.

I would like to state that though British, I was living in Paris when I applied for my visa and this does not seem to have affected anything, as far as I can tell anyway...

Maxim
28-10-2007, 11:58
My wife was a tour operator for several years specialising in travel for Russians to the UK. I don't know about all agencies.

But what I read that Tourist industry union press officer sad that generally embessy rejects from 25 to 40% of applications. They also told that even if you have 2000 euros income and a lot of shengen visas your trip can be cancelled by official reason "weak connection with the country.

/ : / Travel.Ru (http://www.travel.ru/news/2007/06/08/110466.html)
- / : / Travel.Ru (http://www.travel.ru/news/2007/06/29/111393.html)

As for myself I remember my experience with british embessy: they told they will not give me any visa and invited to the interview. They asked me why I didn't tell them that I have another passport and I was visiting England before with that passport. I answered that I didn't tell them this because I had no other passport. I've got a visa that time :)

Carbo
28-10-2007, 14:18
I'm a little concerned. I came over to Mosocw to be with a girl who I met in holiday in '05 and continued to meet up with after that. I came in October '06 on a 3 month single entry visa and worked for a UK firm as a consultant and did a little private help as an English teacher for the children of some Russian friends.

I continued to renew my 3 month single entry visa, staying in the country for a total of 1 year.

I've recently got a job with a large company that can organize work visas, but I'm still worried on several counts.

First, I thought that the Moscow goverment had suspended applications for work permits pending a decision on what to do about the fact they were on target to exceed their start-of-year allocation of 100,000 work permits? Is this moratorium still in force? What are my prospects of getting a work permit before my current visa runs out in January?

Second, what, exactly, are the medical procedures like for getting a work permit? I was shocked to learn, for example, that even as a UK citizen I may have to be tested for lepracy and TB. Is this true?! And what about other, more general health checks? Do they get you on a treadmill a la gym membership tests? Obviously, I'll do what it necessary, but I'm interested to know what I have to go through. It may sound terribly wussy, but I hate hospitals and med exams, and having been to a Russian state hospital, the prospect doesn't exactly fill me with joy.

Third, how does one go about getting a residence permit? What does one need to do/have to qualify? And how does having a residence permit affect the new laws? Can I, for example, stay for full year if I have one?

All I really want to do is build a life with the girl I love, and now I feel more stable and with a full time job, I really wanted to put an end to the three month baloney and get a full year visa, but this is all freaking me out.

I'm going to call Vadim tomorrow who I've used for my last two visas/registrations, and who is brilliant source of info and is nice enough to offer advice and help off the meter. But, in the meantime, I'd really like some input from expats who have had to personally go through the process. Having read the thread, most seem rather confused, and it seems new to everybody, but perhaps some can offer words of wisdom regarding the residence permit and the work permit.

Bels
28-10-2007, 14:24
I would like to state that though British, I was living in Paris when I applied for my visa and this does not seem to have affected anything, as far as I can tell anyway...

True, but there was another Brit here who stated earlier he had a visa with the 90 day restriction and he got it from Paris.

Obviously the EU embassies are making mistakes, and you should check your visa details before you leave. There has also been some posts here of Brits getting their restricted visas and the officials refusing to recognise the nationality status of a Brit.

Bels
28-10-2007, 14:59
I'm a little concerned. I came over to Mosocw to be with a girl who I met in holiday in '05 and continued to meet up with after that. I came in October '06 on a 3 month single entry visa and worked for a UK firm as a consultant and did a little private help as an English teacher for the children of some Russian friends.

I continued to renew my 3 month single entry visa, staying in the country for a total of 1 year.

I've recently got a job with a large company that can organize work visas, but I'm still worried on several counts.

First, I thought that the Moscow goverment had suspended applications for work permits pending a decision on what to do about the fact they were on target to exceed their start-of-year allocation of 100,000 work permits? Is this moratorium still in force? What are my prospects of getting a work permit before my current visa runs out in January?

Second, what, exactly, are the medical procedures like for getting a work permit? I was shocked to learn, for example, that even as a UK citizen I may have to be tested for lepracy and TB. Is this true?! And what about other, more general health checks? Do they get you on a treadmill a la gym membership tests? Obviously, I'll do what it necessary, but I'm interested to know what I have to go through. It may sound terribly wussy, but I hate hospitals and med exams, and having been to a Russian state hospital, the prospect doesn't exactly fill me with joy.

Third, how does one go about getting a residence permit? What does one need to do/have to qualify? And how does having a residence permit affect the new laws? Can I, for example, stay for full year if I have one?

All I really want to do is build a life with the girl I love, and now I feel more stable and with a full time job, I really wanted to put an end to the three month baloney and get a full year visa, but this is all freaking me out.

I'm going to call Vadim tomorrow who I've used for my last two visas/registrations, and who is brilliant source of info and is nice enough to offer advice and help off the meter. But, in the meantime, I'd really like some input from expats who have had to personally go through the process. Having read the thread, most seem rather confused, and it seems new to everybody, but perhaps some can offer words of wisdom regarding the residence permit and the work permit.

I don't know of many who are confused about residency. But due to recent posts and the Moscow times they are completely baffled over business visas.

Yes , that's the whole point that with a residency you don't need to go in and out of the country. You shouldn't need a work visa, but again due to recent posts I'm not so sure anymore.

It helps a lot if you get married but I would go to OVIR , get your application and check what's required. I would also read all previous threads in residency as they are very useful. I'm sure there are a lot of us tired of repeating ourselves.

Maxim
28-10-2007, 15:19
I hate hospitals and med exams, and having been to a Russian state hospital, the prospect doesn't exactly fill me with joy.Medical tests are rather simple and quick. No need to be afraid.


Third, how does one go about getting a residence permit? What does one need to do/have to qualify? There are two reasons: by quota and without quota. By quota you can try in a next year (this year the quota was finished by july). Without quota only for family reasons (if your wife in Russian or if you were born here).


And how does having a residence permit affect the new laws? Can I, for example, stay for full year if I have one?You can stay full 3 years with no limitations with residence permit. After that you can get permission for 5 years.
It takes around half a year to get it.

Maxim
28-10-2007, 15:23
It helps a lot if you get married but I would go to OVIR , get your application and check what's required. No need to go to OVIR. Here is all the official papers: . (http://fmsmoscow.ru/rvp.php)
It is a little bit outdated: you don't need to prove your finance now.

Bels
28-10-2007, 15:28
Can you give us a sense of who says this? Vadim, maybe?

I had thought that the new regulations had already come into effect -
does this mean that those of us (Brit, American, Irish, etc.) whose visas will expire by the end of the year still have a chance to get an additional year grandfathered under the old system? If so, I'm heading to Kiev soon!

Vadim's agency, it was a lady. My wife phoned in Russian. I suggest having it reconfirming with Vadim. Because I,m getting confused with all these convincing posts and especially The Moscow times. I can't find evidence of changes for us Brits or Americans. Our Russian Embassy in London states no changes that they know about and there is nothing different on their site.

XRM
28-10-2007, 23:06
I'm sure an English translation has been posted of the Oct 4 visa change. Could somebody direct me to it please?

Bels
28-10-2007, 23:14
I'm sure an English translation has been posted of the Oct 4 visa change. Could somebody direct me to it please?

Sorry I can't find it anywhere. Keep an eye on your Russian embassy that you use. Sorry that's the way it is and don't take any notice of the Moscow Times.

Mosray
15-11-2007, 13:57
Hi everyone! I am new to the site and have only just become aware of the changes in the law for Business visas.. I have been in russia now for 10 years using ME-BV's of late I have used this method more for personal use than business as I am married to a Russian Girl (almost 3years now) and we have a 9month old son Daniel too. I am British ansd hold a UK passport, my visa expires tomorrow (16th Nov 07).

I have my new invite (offical) to make a new ME/BV and will go to Prague (arranged all this be fore knowing about the changes).

Can anyone tell me if Prague will issue me the visa (telex sent there) and whether it will have the restrictions applied.. If so would it be better for me to fly over to Dublin and make it there?

I cannot use the UK Embassy as I am not able to provide a letter from employer as I work freelance and from home here in Moscow..

I am also not able to show 3 monthly bank statements so pretty stuck with that option too..If there is away around this issue can someone advise me..

I have read every single post here, and I must say I am confused to say the least.. If anyone can clarify the situation or have any tips I'll be extremely grateful...

Digenis Akritas
15-11-2007, 14:10
Hmm... I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding of the new law is that you can only be issued a visa in your home country OR in a country where you have the right to live for over 90 days.

Not an EU citizen myself, but I'm pretty sure you, as a Brit, can not reside in another EU country (for example, the Czech Republic) for over 90 days. This European Commission site seems to say the same thing (http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/en/citizens/services/eu-guide/studying/index_en.html).

Call the Russian Consulate in Prague RIGHT AWAY and ask them if they will issue you, a Brit, a ME delovaya visa. Some consulates have been slow to adopt the rules and you may luck out. They proably will print the 90/180 day clause on it in any case. That means you have three months to get a work permit figured out.

If you have the option of going to Dublin, do that! You shouldn't have a problem there. You will more than likely need to get a new letter of invitation though, as your invitation specifies the consulate at which you will apply for your visa.

Mosray
15-11-2007, 14:25
Hmm... I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding of the new law is that you can only be issued a visa in your home country OR in a country where you have the right to live for over 90 days.

Not an EU citizen myself, but I'm pretty sure you, as a Brit, can not reside in another EU country (for example, the Czech Republic) for over 90 days. This European Commission site seems to say the same thing (http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/en/citizens/services/eu-guide/studying/index_en.html).

If you have the option of going to Dublin, do that! You shouldn't have a problem there. You will more than likely need to get a new letter of invitation though, as your invitation specifies the consulate at which you will apply for your visa.

Thanks for the info, but my invite permits me to receive a visa in any embassy origional preglashenie issued by the ФМС and regarding my rights to stay in the Czech Repulic as a british citizen and bearer of a British Passport I am able to stay in the CR as long as I have a valid passtort...
Taken from the Czech Embassy website london:

British citizens holding a full British Passport and holders of British passports with one of these sentences: "HOLDER HAS THE RIGHT OF ABODE IN THE UNITED KINGDOM" or "HOLDER IS ENTITLED TO READMISSION TO THE UNITED KINGDOM" typed on one of the pages do not require a Visa to enter the Czech Republic. The passport has to be valid for the entire duration of stay in the Czech Republic''

But thanks for giving me your assistance...

If there is anyone with recent experience (late Oct to date) of the Embassies I have mentioned in my previous post could you please PM me or add a reply as I fly out of Moscow tomorrow morning (16/11/07) thanks inadvance...

Bels
15-11-2007, 21:04
Hmm... I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding of the new law is that you can only be issued a visa in your home country OR in a country where you have the right to live for over 90 days.

Not an EU citizen myself, but I'm pretty sure you, as a Brit, can not reside in another EU country (for example, the Czech Republic) for over 90 days. This European Commission site seems to say the same thing (http://ec.europa.eu/youreurope/nav/en/citizens/services/eu-guide/studying/index_en.html).

Call the Russian Consulate in Prague RIGHT AWAY and ask them if they will issue you, a Brit, a ME delovaya visa. Some consulates have been slow to adopt the rules and you may luck out. They proably will print the 90/180 day clause on it in any case. That means you have three months to get a work permit figured out.

If you have the option of going to Dublin, do that! You shouldn't have a problem there. You will more than likely need to get a new letter of invitation though, as your invitation specifies the consulate at which you will apply for your visa.

I know you stated you aren't a lawyer. But aren't you aware that Britain is a major member of the EU, probably the biggest. All EU members have permanent right of abode and the right to work in EU countries. After all they have a British and EU passport.

SalTheReturn
15-11-2007, 21:18
I know you stated you aren't a lawyer. But aren't you aware that Britain is a major member of the EU, probably the biggest. All EU members have permanent right of abode and the right to work in EU countries. After all they have a British and EU passport.

what means "to abode"?

Bels
15-11-2007, 21:21
Hi everyone! I am new to the site and have only just become aware of the changes in the law for Business visas.. I have been in russia now for 10 years using ME-BV's of late I have used this method more for personal use than business as I am married to a Russian Girl (almost 3years now) and we have a 9month old son Daniel too. I am British ansd hold a UK passport, my visa expires tomorrow (16th Nov 07).

I have my new invite (offical) to make a new ME/BV and will go to Prague (arranged all this be fore knowing about the changes).

Can anyone tell me if Prague will issue me the visa (telex sent there) and whether it will have the restrictions applied.. If so would it be better for me to fly over to Dublin and make it there?

I cannot use the UK Embassy as I am not able to provide a letter from employer as I work freelance and from home here in Moscow..

I am also not able to show 3 monthly bank statements so pretty stuck with that option too..If there is away around this issue can someone advise me..

I have read every single post here, and I must say I am confused to say the least.. If anyone can clarify the situation or have any tips I'll be extremely grateful...

Hopefully you have received a PM from someone experiencing Prague. I have only experienced London.

For the moment, you should receive the normal visa accepted as a Brit. No ninety days in and out for the moment. There has been bad experiences from Brits having 90 restrictions in other EU countries. But we now know that this was due to confusion of the Embassy.

If you do go to Prague you must politely state that you are British and regulations are different for you in comparison to other EU. I think they are aware of it by now and hopefully you will have no problems.

For me, I would prefer to go to Ireland or London just to be 100% certain.

Please inform us all of your experiences.

Bels
15-11-2007, 21:32
what means "to abode"?

Abode: to live in a home. Or in otherwords to live, reside in that particular country.

With no fixed abode: Having no permanent home.

Mosray
15-11-2007, 21:42
Hopefully you have received a PM from someone experiencing Prague. I have only experienced London.

For the moment, you should receive the normal visa accepted as a Brit. No ninety days in and out for the moment. There has been bad experiences from Brits having 90 restrictions in other EU countries. But we now know that this was due to confusion of the Embassy.

If you do go to Prague you must politely state that you are British and regulations are different for you in comparison to other EU. I think they are aware of it by now and hopefully you will have no problems.

For me, I would prefer to go to Ireland or London just to be 100% certain.

Please inform us all of your experiences.

Thank you Bels for your advise on this matter... I will be sure to pass on my experiences when or is that if I return..LOL Oh and if someone has info on Prague there is still time to MP me.....;)

Bels
15-11-2007, 22:03
Thank you Bels for your advise on this matter... I will be sure to pass on my experiences when or is that if I return..LOL Oh and if someone has info on Prague there is still time to MP me.....;)

Have you found the Prague Russian Embassy website. I can't seem to find it. I was hoping for useful info, if they have an English verion on it? Well it's EU isn't it, therefore there should also be English.

Good luck on your travels Mosray, and I hope you all the best for you and your family. I know what your going through. I've been there. But not not Prague :)

Mosray
15-11-2007, 23:25
Have you found the Prague Russian Embassy website. I can't seem to find it. I was hoping for useful info, if they have an English verion on it? Well it's EU isn't it, therefore there should also be English.

Good luck on your travels Mosray, and I hope you all the best for you and your family. I know what your going through. I've been there. But not not Prague :)

I actually did find the site earlier this week... Unfortunately they have an English link, but there is nothing on it, just blank.. So only Russian and Czech.

But basically it translate that you must have a czech resident permit or proof of employment in the Czech Republic.. If you are from another country you must go to the embassy in your counrty of residence..

This is link (http://www.czech.mid.ru/)

Go to second heading on the left hand side on menu: Консульские учреждения в ЧР..

First sub heading: Консульский отдел в Праге (Click)
Then you find address and working hours:
Below in second section you'll see a list of Files/options

Click on first: Информация по визовым вопросам and this will open the details about visas...

The point I made above can be found
But as I say it's in Russian... Hope it helps..

And thanks for you good luck wishes...

Oh one other question while I'm here.... Do you think I should put that I have relatives living in Russia on the application form... I ask as I have alway left that blank to date, as having a ME/BV is the only way to get long stays I have always gone down that route...and I am not sure if this will in any way affect my getting a Business Visa... Any thoughts???