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polly
02-09-2004, 12:04
What is the reasoning behind the "rule" that parents are not supposed to go to ZAGS with the couple? Is there a superstition or something? Some other tradition? So far the answer i've been given is "because."
Just curious.

sfjohns67
02-09-2004, 12:06
Never heard of that one, Pols, my mom-in-law was with us all the way. In fact, I'd take the opposite to be true - tradition is that one or the other parent makes the first toast to the couple after the ceremony.

Maybe your in-laws don't want to sit in ZAGS No. 4 and wait the 3-4 hours it'll take y'all to make it through the line? ;)

Oh yeah, lemme know if they still try to sell you "marriage insurance" - what a HOOT that was!

polly
02-09-2004, 12:09
marriage insurance? lol! can the husband collect if his wife hits him with a pan or something?
no, we didn't get offered that one. yet. =)

natlee
02-09-2004, 12:51
Wish it was a tradition, there will be way too many parents in our case (stepparents included) - IF we drag them along!

natlee
02-09-2004, 12:54
Oh and my reason for not wanting them there is pretty simple - don't want to be kissing with them staring at us! Well, AND that if my parents are there, HIS parents should be there and my grandparents will then get upset they weren't invited there etc. etc.

polly
02-09-2004, 12:58
personal situations aside, it's just that i've heard (and now been told) that it's not "принято" for parents to attend the ZAGS ceremony.
so i don't get why.
my parents are coming anyway. i thought it would be nice if the mother in law came, too.
it was my general impression that for the most part, you only invite the closest of your closest to zags, including your witnesses, and then everyone goes to the reception.

sevan
02-09-2004, 13:01
I will be marrying a Russian soon and my mother will be accompanying us to ZAGS. We didn't really want anyone at the crappy ZAGS ceremony, but my mother just wouldn't understand our attitude towards it if she didn't see it with her own eyes.

You don't have to invite anyone to ZAGS if you don't want. I would put the emphasis on the reception anyway....just my opinion....

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:02
You don't need witnesses anymore, from what I've heard, but you can have 'em if you want. Well if you guys are close scr*w the "не принято" and go ahead.

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:06
Sevan,

Agree 100%. However, I was told that especially since it's a crappy ceremony, it may not be much fun to go through just the two of us. Still, I don't really want anyone there - would be nice to have some time to ourselves before the reception.

polly
02-09-2004, 13:06
ok i'm going to spill more beans. fiance was insisting that it's not prinyato yadda yadda and that he wanted HER to meet us at the reception with the karavai, which we have decided to do. i said, why can't she come to zags, skip the picture-taking and go straight to the reception site and meet us there with teh karavai? i think that makes sense.
but all this wedding planning is making us stressed out and evil, horrible people and so we just finished that discussion of with the slamming of doors.
my parents (two sets of divorcees) will not understand why fiance's mom is not there. especially if the only "grounds" ihave for that is "because." =\
well there you go. i see ways to work aroudn this, and the other half has chosen to fight this battle for whatever reason.

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:11
Originally posted by polly
all this wedding planning is making us stressed out and evil, horrible people and so we just finished that discussion of with the slamming of doors.


Tell me about it!

Ned Kelly
02-09-2004, 13:16
when my cousin got married in simferopol there were about 30 of us at the zags event...it was hard not to laugh at the woman conducting the ceremony (the speech was preposterous) - in fact some couldn't hold themselves.

the bride and groom also had trouble keeping a straight face too and it made it fun for all.

Sleepy
02-09-2004, 13:18
As somewhat a foreigner (born and raised in the US of Russian immigrants) I really want the whole Russian thing with the throwing of glasses, karavai, Russian car (Zil or Chaika,) taking pictures on Red Square etc.

My 100% born and bred Muscovite fiancee says that this is too "touristy" and wants a Lincoln stretch limo and to throw away all Russian traditions besides the ZAGS thing.

Our families are divorced and re-married on both sides so we are combing through seating arrangement options to find something that won't leave any hard feelings between guests.

We've also been fighting... I've had a few socks thrown at me and storming out of the room :)

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:33
I don't want the Russian stuff either, though I have never seen any of it with my own eyes (been to one wedding only), and have only heard about karavai etc. from friends. I have people come to my wedding who hate the whole wedding (reception) concept and think of it as a show-off, tasteless, "фу", etc. I kinda want to show them it can be tasteful and fun. I'd leave some of the traditional stuff, but refuse to do vykup nevesty 'n all that weird stuff.

polly
02-09-2004, 13:40
i'm also anti-vykup. we've been sorta picking and choosing among russian and american traditions...

ife
02-09-2004, 13:44
My parents came to ZAGS but my Russian in-laws were waiting for us at the reception venue...
We had a great day: Zil, Red Square etc. About 30 people were at the ZAGS with us.
We had close friends doing all the compering/translating at the reception as well, so it was really relaxed.
Just enjoy yourselves - everyone will be best friends after a few shots of vodka. Of course, as in Scotland a wedding is not really a wedding without a fight... :)

Sleepy
02-09-2004, 13:48
Can anyone elaborate on Russian/American wedding traditions?

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:49
Originally posted by polly
i'm also anti-vykup. we've been sorta picking and choosing among russian and american traditions...

What are the American traditions? My fiance hasn't mentioned any. :-(

natlee
02-09-2004, 13:50
Oops guess that question has already come up.

ife
02-09-2004, 13:51
Polly, the vykup part is great...if you're not the groom! I had a couple of vodkas with my brother-in-law-to-be and we sailed through it - even had to start giving money away because we managed everything... :)

polly
02-09-2004, 13:57
as far as american traditions are concerned... let's see what i can remember. there's the part where the father gives the bride away. the first dance, and then the dad cuts in. the cutting of the cake and feeding each other (think we can skip that one)... throwing the bouquet and the groom gets to remove the bride's garter with his teeth and then throw it out to the guys in the crowd. then there's a million toasts before that. what else? throwing rice maybe. having a wedding party with a maid of honor, bridesmaids and best man.

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:05
Originally posted by polly
throwing the bouquet and the groom gets to remove the bride's garter with his teeth and then throw it out to the guys in the crowd

This one must be international. We'll do that, only he won't remove it with his teeth, but rather get it from my purse (if I am going to have one). Removing it with teeth sounds fun but kinda.. not for the guests to see. :shame:

polly
02-09-2004, 14:07
now natlee, explain this one to me. i thought this must be only american because when i visited some wedding salons in town, not one of them had garters. (the wedding salons i went to in the US all had garter selections).
i kind of like the purse option better!
and... what is the russian word for garter?

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:10
Подвязка, and they have 'em everywhere but they're all so ugly! With beads 'n flowers 'n stuff. I will find out the names of stores we saw 'em at.

Sleepy
02-09-2004, 14:13
I like the idea of taking it off her leg more!

They sell garters at most wedding salons here.

Called a podvyazka. Found a store with a large (20+) selection. They cost about 400-500 rubles. I'll get you the address later. Somewhere on Staraya Basmanaya between Baumanskaya and Krasnoye Vorota.

plastique
02-09-2004, 14:16
polly..you forgot the "something old, something new, somethng borrowed , something blue"...other traditions depend on the church....lighting of the unity candle, the standard march music, the bitter family drunk getting into a fight (well, that one is pretty universal), 10 year olds tasting thier first sip of alcohol...

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:17
Yup, been at that one. 20+selection sounds a bit exaggerated though and they sure didn't have the color I wanted. And they looked cheap only I heard they all do. :-( Come to think of it, this was the best selection I saw.

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:21
Originally posted by plastique
polly..you forgot the "something old, something new, somethng borrowed , something blue"

Oh yeah, that. I really wanted to do that one but can't think of anything blue, borrowed or old to take. A blue garter seemed like an option, only if I actually have to wear it it will look dreadful with the dress. But then I can put it on a minute before it has to be thrown wherever. ;)

polly
02-09-2004, 14:24
well for borrowed you can always get someone to lend you a nice piece of jewelry for the day. that can often combine with the "old" requirement. i aws trying to get away with saying that the dress is new, but no one's buying it ;)

Fa-Q!
02-09-2004, 14:34
No parents, aunts, uncles (basically the older generation) attended the ZAGS part of my wedding. I'm not sure of the real reason, but, at least in my particular situation, know that my in-laws, aunts, uncles, etc... were quite busy preparing things for the reception and were probably glad that it's not a tradition for them to attend. So much work went into our wedding that, in the video taken of the ceremony, my mother in law looked pretty worn-out.

The vykup thing is a must! I did it and it was great. I was pretty nervous, because all of the Russian wedding traditions I experienced for the first time at my own wedding.

Generally, I think that you can change/add/eliminate any traditions that you want. After all, it's your wedding.

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:34
Yup considered jewelry, only I will have to see what my mom has to offer first. Would rather not wear any than spoil the look. As for new, would underwear work? ;) Or shoes? Or.. look? ;)

natlee
02-09-2004, 14:35
Originally posted by Fa-Q!
Generally, I think that you can change/add/eliminate any traditions that you want. After all, it's your wedding.

My thoughts exactly.

plastique
02-09-2004, 14:41
new blue underwear....old blue underwear...old blue hanky borrowed from a new friend....

Ida
02-09-2004, 15:34
Originally posted by polly
What is the reasoning behind the "rule" that parents are not supposed to go to ZAGS with the couple? Is there a superstition or something? So far the answer i've been given is "because."I attended about thirty weddings in Russia and parents were always there. Never heard of this "rule"

sfjohns67
02-09-2004, 15:36
Originally posted by plastique
new blue underwear....old blue underwear...old blue hanky borrowed from a new friend.... ...bright blue bruise on your thigh from....:D

Ledka
02-09-2004, 16:45
it's not forbidden for parents to go the cerenemony at all.
It's mean that your future hubby is so stubborn.

But at the same time you r lucky that you are not marrying a moslem man. My ex-fiance was arab. Fortunately or unfortunately we didn't last together till this happy day of our wedding, enjoyed only the engagment. But in their culture parents are EVERYWHERE, almost in bed.
I was so disgusted about it.

natlee
02-09-2004, 16:48
But in their culture parents are EVERYWHERE, almost in bed.
I was so disgusted about it.

Jeez. I am sure you were! Who wouldn't be.

koba65
03-09-2004, 02:08
Originally posted by polly
personal situations aside, it's just that i've heard (and now been told) that it's not "принято" for parents to attend the ZAGS ceremony.
so i don't get why.
my parents are coming anyway. i thought it would be nice if the mother in law came, too.
it was my general impression that for the most part, you only invite the closest of your closest to zags, including your witnesses, and then everyone goes to the reception.

I've never heard that. I've only been to one Russian wedding but the families of both sides were there - mothers, fathers, grandparents, cousins, sisters, brothers, kids, etc.

Leda
03-09-2004, 09:53
PARENTS IN ZAGS - in the old times (before the October coup)there was a tradition in Russia that the parents could not attend the church wedding (to be in the church during the ceremony) in order not to be able to "impose" their will on the couple's decision to marry. Those days all weddings were registered by the Russian church.

Nowadays this is not observed, and parents can attend the church ceremony as well, the priests won't mind.

So you can brign whoever you want to ZAGS. There is no superstition or rules regarding the parents in the ZAGS. :)

RedCosmonaut
03-09-2004, 11:29
Fascinating topic guys......my Soozhenaya Kasmicheskaya fiancee is of course Russian. What the hell is ZAGS?!! What strange Russianess have I got to look forward to?! All advice gratefully received !!!

Blaked
03-09-2004, 11:34
Well even in the US, you have to go to the courthouse to get the marriage certificate. It's considered an afterthought, although some people actually think of it as being the wedding. There was this great NYC Metro-TV program where they interviewed some of these people that dressed up in wedding clothes to go to the 'cote-house.' My friend Raoul got married in such a way and nobody really knew if it was for citizenship or not.