PDA

View Full Version : Obama Birth Certificate and Other Conspiracies



MissAnnElk
06-12-2008, 18:41
Why the stories about Obama's birth certificate will never die | Salon News (http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/12/05/birth_certificate/)

Kvartiraokhotnik
06-12-2008, 18:54
Sorry, but couldnt give a monkeys....

I'm more worried about who finances him.....same person who financed Al Qaeda not too long ago. His birth certificate is a distraction.

elis
06-12-2008, 19:24
The more data you present a person, the more they doubt it ... Once you're committed, especially behaviorally committed or financially committed, the more impossible it becomes to change your mind."

Any inconvenient facts are irrelevant. People who believe in a conspiracy theory "develop a selective perception, their mind refuses to accept contrary evidence," Chip Berlet, a senior analyst with Political Research Associates who studies such theories, says. "As soon as you criticize a conspiracy theory, you become part of the conspiracy."

Evan Harrington, a social psychologist who is an associate professor at the Chicago School of Professional Psychology, agrees. "One of the tendencies of the conspiracy notion, the whole appeal, is that a lot of the information the believer has is secret or special," Harrington says. "The real evidence is out there, [and] you can give them all this evidence, but they'll have convenient ways to discredit [it]."

Whatever can't be ignored can be twisted to fit into the narrative; every new disclosure of something that should, by rights, end the controversy only opens up new questions, identifies new plotters.

Nuff said. :bowdown:

Maybe I'll go post this quote on a couple other threads. Nah. That would just make me part of the conspiracy. Oh. Wait. I already am.:mooooh:

Kvartiraokhotnik
06-12-2008, 20:16
The more data you present a person, the more they doubt it ... Once you're committed, especially behaviorally committed or financially committed, the more impossible it becomes to change your mind."

Any inconvenient facts are irrelevant. People who believe in a conspiracy theory "develop a selective perception, their mind refuses to accept contrary evidence," Chip Berlet, a senior analyst with Political Research Associates who studies such theories, says. "As soon as you criticize a conspiracy theory, you become part of the conspiracy."

Evan Harrington, a social psychologist who is an associate professor at the Chicago School of Professional Psychology, agrees. "One of the tendencies of the conspiracy notion, the whole appeal, is that a lot of the information the believer has is secret or special," Harrington says. "The real evidence is out there, [and] you can give them all this evidence, but they'll have convenient ways to discredit [it]."

Whatever can't be ignored can be twisted to fit into the narrative; every new disclosure of something that should, by rights, end the controversy only opens up new questions, identifies new plotters.

Nuff said. :bowdown:

Maybe I'll go post this quote on a couple other threads. Nah. That would just make me part of the conspiracy. Oh. Wait. I already am.:mooooh:


The official version that the 911 commission came up with is a conspiracy theory. So, i'm perfectly prepared to accept the above is true, if you're prepared to say that it holds true for those that believe in the Obama Bin Laden fairy tale.

It is, after all, a muslim conspiracy carried out by a bogey man, in a cave, with a laptop...

yeah....right!

Scrat335
07-12-2008, 00:59
I write all of the stuff like this birth certificate conspiracy off to propaganda campaigns.

Specific points like this are merely part of a larger effort in genral to change public perception.

Gypsy
07-12-2008, 01:32
The more data you present a person, the more they doubt it ... Once you're committed, especially behaviorally committed or financially committed, the more impossible it becomes to change your mind."

Any inconvenient facts are irrelevant. People who believe in a conspiracy theory "develop a selective perception, their mind refuses to accept contrary evidence," Chip Berlet, a senior analyst with Political Research Associates who studies such theories, says. "As soon as you criticize a conspiracy theory, you become part of the conspiracy."

Evan Harrington, a social psychologist who is an associate professor at the Chicago School of Professional Psychology, agrees. "One of the tendencies of the conspiracy notion, the whole appeal, is that a lot of the information the believer has is secret or special," Harrington says. "The real evidence is out there, [and] you can give them all this evidence, but they'll have convenient ways to discredit [it]."

Whatever can't be ignored can be twisted to fit into the narrative; every new disclosure of something that should, by rights, end the controversy only opens up new questions, identifies new plotters.Nuff said. :bowdown:

Maybe I'll go post this quote on a couple other threads. Nah. That would just make me part of the conspiracy. Oh. Wait. I already am.:mooooh:
Exactly.
In addition the psychological profile of those most addicted to conspiracy theories is as follows.

Conspiracy Theorists

Social inadequates and failures unable to come to terms with the reality that their failure is their own responsibility, who then look for a scapegoat. Some turn to religion and hide behind “God’s Will”, Some invest their belief in conspiracy theories. Everything must be someone else’s fault. And they see it everywhere. After all, they would be successful had it not been for the conspiracy against them.

Characterised by a fixation with the internet as a source of information, they lack the critical abilities to separate the nonsense from the truth, and grasp at bite-size chunks of supposed ‘information’ without ever understanding the subject they then pontificate about.

Unable to grasp that their theories are often contradictory, and that they become a source of ridicule, they churn out increasingly bizarre theories, easily disproved to anyone with a modicum of intelligence, but the act of proving their fantasies false is taken as more proof of the validity of the original conspiracy.

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 06:46
Exactly.

Characterised by a fixation with the internet as a source of information, they lack the critical abilities to separate the nonsense from the truth, and grasp at bite-size chunks of supposed ‘information’ without ever understanding the subject they then pontificate about.

Unable to grasp that their theories are often contradictory, and that they become a source of ridicule, they churn out increasingly bizarre theories, easily disproved to anyone with a modicum of intelligence, but the act of proving their fantasies false is taken as more proof of the validity of the original conspiracy.

...equals your explanation of Christianity.

Wodin
07-12-2008, 08:05
...equals your explanation of Christianity.

Well....isn't christianity, as all other religions really, just another massive conspiracy theory?

The big spirit in the sky creates a man and a woman using clay and puts them into a garden and then kicks them out coz they eat an apple. Spirit follows that up by destroying two cities with fire & brimstone and downing every living thing (except two of each species) coz they didn't listen to it. Moving on in time...any number of whackos come along (you may have heard of two...a guy called christ and another called mohammed...there were many more) saying that you had better do this and better not do that or else.....

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 08:44
...a guy called christ...

The part of the post which referred to Christianity directly.

Maybe you should see some of the big-time dodges Gypsy makes and read over some of the other threads -- not only on the subject of Christianity.

The point I was making is that Gypsy suffers from the same contorted thinking he derides others for having -- on other topics though.

As far as explaining the joke of New Testament conspiracy theories and how none of them is plausible, that has already been done, and Gypsy had nothing to say to defend his conspiracy theories about the origin of Christianity -- other than point to crimes committed hundreds of years after Christianity was founded on "turn the other cheek" and "love your neighbor as yourself."

Ignoring the plain evidence of first and second century evangelism, which in that time was not a function of state in any regard (more often persecuted), he made nebulous claims and expresses outrage at his Christian conspiracy theories he has as of yet failed to define.

Then in our own day, he ignores the fact that "conspiracy to commit a crime" in modern law most often carries a higher sentence than individual crimes for deterrent -- also because "conspiracy" in law is considered the most dangerous and effective method of carrying out any crime as crimes planned by groups are more likely to succeed and cause more damage than crimes committed by individuals at random.

The mere fact that more than one plane was hijacked confirms legally that the indictable crimes on 911 include "conspiracy to commit a crime."

I feel that the greatest conspiracy theorists are the ones who believe that some terrorists in caves in Afghanistan masterminded and funded the 911 attacks all by themselves and that somehow this was linked to WMDs in Iraq.

Here is a declassified conspiracy from the US Joint Chiefs of Staff to conduct false-flag terrorism against US citizens as pretext for military action in Cuba called Operation Northwoods: http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/northwoods.pdf


Quote from link: "Bamford himself writes that Operation Northwoods “may be the most corrupt plan ever created by the U.S. government.”
Pentagon Proposed Pretexts for Cuba Invasion in 1962 (http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/)

Now tell me again about that mastermind conspirator, the meek, afflicted, imprisoned, and martyred Apostle Paul...

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 08:54
I write all of the stuff like this birth certificate conspiracy off to propaganda campaigns.

Specific points like this are merely part of a larger effort in genral to change public perception.

There is no excuse for any presidential candiate to have this much doubt surrounding his birthplace.

I had to have my birth-certificate to get into the Army, and a copy would not be accepted. It had to be a real birth certificate. I also had to have a birth-certificate or DD214 to get my last driver's license -- no exceptions. Honestly, I was a bit offended, but there is the big immigration issue.

Obama has no excuse for this controversy, and I would like to see the Supreme Court take the case against him. This is ridiculous.

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 09:10
"WND was told the official reason for denial of access to Obama's birth certificate would be authority granted pursuant to Section 338-18 of the Hawaii Revised Statutes, a provision the anonymous source claimed was designed to prevent identity theft." Obama's birth certificate sealed by Hawaii governor (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=79174)


Barack Obama needs to worry about someone stealing his identity? :/

I'll bet his old rival Alan Keyes would post his birth certificate.

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 09:15
SnarkyBytes » Hawaii Birth Certificate - 1963 (http://snarkybytes.com/?p=521)
This guy posted his 1963 Hawaii birth certificate which does say "Certificate of Live Birth" but looks a lot different than Obama's. :/

Reverend
07-12-2008, 09:20
There is no excuse for any presidential candiate to have this much doubt surrounding his birthplace.

I had to have my birth-certificate to get into the Army, and a copy would not be accepted. It had to be a real birth certificate. I also had to have a birth-certificate or DD214 to get my last driver's license -- no exceptions. Honestly, I was a bit offended, but there is the big immigration issue.

Obama has no excuse for this controversy, and I would like to see the Supreme Court take the case against him. This is ridiculous. Sigh! Don't you have any positive ideas to spend your mental energy on? I think the longer one lives in Russia the more likely a person is to imagine conspiracies. It is a country where so much was conspiracy but that doesn't mean it applies equally to other countries.

McCain has questionable birth qualifications, himself. And it wasn't just a caveman with a laptop in Afghanistan who planned 911 any more than it was a couple of radicals in Spain who blew up the trains or in London, either. The Saudis have more resources than most any other country and they were certainly involved. And it wasn't the Israelis or the US Government. To suggest this is beyond conspiracy and into paranoia.

Confucius, Gandhi, Abraham Lincoln, Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin, Mohammed, Jesus. They all changed the world in major ways. I don't think one of them had a laptop and I wouldn't be surprised if Mohammed and Jesus lives in caves at some point.

Anthropologist Margaret Mead said, "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 09:29
Anthropologist Margaret Mead said, "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.


But that would be a conspiracy.

AstroNoodle
07-12-2008, 09:48
And it wasn't the Israelis or the US Government. To suggest this is beyond conspiracy and into paranoia.

Pentagon Proposed Pretexts for Cuba Invasion in 1962 (http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/)

What would you call being forced to accept the CONGRESSIONAL MEDAL OF HONOR IN SECRET?
YouTube- Israeli attack on USS Liberty (US Navy ship)
"I want that GD ship going to the bottom. No help. Recall the wings." -- President Johnson

...and I knew about this a long time before I heard about Alex Jones. He just has a good documentary account of the USS Liberty incident on video. This account is great journalism.

And what about the time when Pat Buchanan's journalism saved an innocent man from the death penalty in Israel for allegations of being Ivan the Terrible? He was a Detroit auto worker named Demjanjuk and as a direct result of Buchanan's journalism, the man was PROVEN innocent.

A lot of people had egg on their faces after that, including media, and they never forgave Pat -- and that is presumably the crowd that labeled him an anti-semite, which is not true. They just got beat and would rather have put an innocent man to death.
You may not have been addressing me directly, but if anyone thinks I am in paranoia, he doesn't know who he is talking to. When the Egyptians are on one side and the Red Sea on the other, I already know what happens to me. Been there.

Kvartiraokhotnik
07-12-2008, 10:31
Sigh! Don't you have any positive ideas to spend your mental energy on? I think the longer one lives in Russia the more likely a person is to imagine conspiracies. It is a country where so much was conspiracy but that doesn't mean it applies equally to other countries.

McCain has questionable birth qualifications, himself. And it wasn't just a caveman with a laptop in Afghanistan who planned 911 any more than it was a couple of radicals in Spain who blew up the trains or in London, either. The Saudis have more resources than most any other country and they were certainly involved. And it wasn't the Israelis or the US Government. To suggest this is beyond conspiracy and into paranoia.

Confucius, Gandhi, Abraham Lincoln, Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin, Mohammed, Jesus. They all changed the world in major ways. I don't think one of them had a laptop and I wouldn't be surprised if Mohammed and Jesus lives in caves at some point.

Anthropologist Margaret Mead said, "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.

Thanks reverend. And what EVIDENCE do you have that the SAUDI CONSPIRACY THEORY, holds more water than any other.

I repeat (i dont think Gypsy understands) THE OFFICIAL THEORY IS A CONCPIRACY THEORY!!!!!!! SO WE ARE ALL CONSPIRACY THEORISTS!!!!!! EVEN THE 911 COMMISSION ARE A BUNCH OF CONSPIRACY NUTTERS!

xSnoofovich
07-12-2008, 17:24
Surely there has to be some legitimacy to the claim if the Supreme Court is considering the case?

Besides, the Salon piece is a typically misleading disinformation piece to cast the cloud of doubt on people with weak and impressionable minds that are prone to make snap, irrational emotionally based judegements, such as Gypsy, who will inevitably gobble the stories up, and blame the right for spitting their "lies" and "hate", while in reality, the lawsuit has been brought forth by Phillip Berg, who is a dedicated Hillary supporter.

Washington Times - Lawsuit questions Obama's eligibility for office (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/aug/28/lawsuit-questions-obamas-eligibility-for-office/)


The document produced by Obama is not an official birth certificate, he produced a certificate of live birth, or as one website puts it - It was a laser-printed “abstract” from a database.


From the Hawaiin dept of health -
Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country.

Hawai‘i State Department of Health (http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/vital-records/index.html)

Gypsy
07-12-2008, 17:34
Surely there has to be some legitimacy to the claim if the Supreme Court is considering the case?

Besides, the Salon piece is a typically misleading disinformation piece to cast the cloud of doubt on people with weak and impressionable minds that are prone to make snap, irrational emotionally based judegements, such as Gypsy, who will inevitably gobble the stories up, and blame the right for spitting their "lies" and "hate", while in reality, the lawsuit has been brought forth by Phillip Berg, who is a dedicated Hillary supporter.

Washington Times - Lawsuit questions Obama's eligibility for office (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/aug/28/lawsuit-questions-obamas-eligibility-for-office/)


The document produced by Obama is not an official birth certificate, he produced a certificate of live birth, or as one website puts it - It was a laser-printed “abstract” from a database.


From the Hawaiin dept of health -
Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country.

Hawai‘i State Department of Health (http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/vital-records/index.html)
Wonderful.

You will save me the trouble of actually reading or posting.

Thank you so much, you really are too kind.

Gypsy
07-12-2008, 17:39
Thanks reverend. And what EVIDENCE do you have that the SAUDI CONSPIRACY THEORY, holds more water than any other.

I repeat (i dont think Gypsy understands) THE OFFICIAL THEORY IS A CONCPIRACY THEORY!!!!!!! SO WE ARE ALL CONSPIRACY THEORISTS!!!!!! EVEN THE 911 COMMISSION ARE A BUNCH OF CONSPIRACY NUTTERS!
Ok. Use of capital letters does not make a lie true.

Use of pink type does not make a lie true.

The people who hijacked the planes and flew them into the Twin Towers were Saudis.

There, that fact on its own is one more fact than supports your ridiculous fairy-tale.

MissAnnElk
07-12-2008, 18:01
The fringe movement to keep Barack Obama from becoming president. - By David Weigel - Slate Magazine (http://www.slate.com/id/2206033/)

Kvartiraokhotnik
07-12-2008, 18:06
Ok. Use of capital letters does not make a lie true.

Use of pink type does not make a lie true.

The people who hijacked the planes and flew them into the Twin Towers were Saudis.

There, that fact on its own is one more fact than supports your ridiculous fairy-tale.

You mean those Saudi ''conspirators'', who were miraculously found to be still alive after the attack :))))

Its alright though...cos they found one of their passports in the ruins, afterwards. So its definitely these guys!

You make me chuckle Gypsy. Cheers!

Laughter is the spice of life

Gypsy
07-12-2008, 18:22
You mean those Saudi ''conspirators'', who were miraculously found to be still alive after the attack :)))) Your fantastic conspiracy theory has been published by you many times. It would help us if you were consistent about what you claim happened because it does tend to change. However we have answered every point many times over. The thing you fail to understand is that when your argument has been destroyed - as by the Popular Mechanics articles - you need to come up with more, you cannot just keep repeating the same discredited stories, as you do above.

You make an assertion, I prove it to be a lie. You cannot just repeat it and ask me for more evidence. You must come up with something new.

You see, it's like a game of chess; you move your bishop, I take it. You don't get to move the bishop again.

Sidney Bliss
07-12-2008, 18:30
This may prove useful, farty: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess

Kvartiraokhotnik
07-12-2008, 21:58
Your fantastic conspiracy theory has been published by you many times. It would help us if you were consistent about what you claim happened because it does tend to change. However we have answered every point many times over. The thing you fail to understand is that when your argument has been destroyed - as by the Popular Mechanics articles - you need to come up with more, you cannot just keep repeating the same discredited stories, as you do above.

You make an assertion, I prove it to be a lie. You cannot just repeat it and ask me for more evidence. You must come up with something new.

You see, it's like a game of chess; you move your bishop, I take it. You don't get to move the bishop again.

I dont claim to know the actual version of events. One thing im certain of is that the official version is too contradictory to be anything close to the truth. I simply have questions and want a reinvestigation. I've mentioned many of the questions on this site before. I dont think its necessary to go through them again is it?

You talk the talk, but can you walk the walk???
Where do you want a game of chess??? You or Sidney, come and have a go if you think you're hard enough!

Kvartiraokhotnik
07-12-2008, 22:00
This may prove useful, farty: Chess - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess)

5 mins, no increment. Blitz.

A nice bit o chess to sort the wheat from the chaff

fenrir
07-12-2008, 22:21
You mean those Saudi ''conspirators'', who were miraculously found to be still alive after the attack :))))

Its alright though...cos they found one of their passports in the ruins, afterwards. So its definitely these guys!

You make me chuckle Gypsy. Cheers!

Laughter is the spice of life

If they are alive, then why don't they show up on BBC or CNN and show the world the official version is all ----?

Kvartiraokhotnik
07-12-2008, 22:50
If they are alive, then why don't they show up on BBC or CNN and show the world the official version is all ----?

They havent showed up at BBC headquarters, but they have showed up on their website

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Hijack 'suspects' alive and well (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1559151.stm)

pjw
08-12-2008, 00:14
Exactly.
In addition the psychological profile of those most addicted to conspiracy theories is as follows.

Conspiracy Theorists

Social inadequates and failures unable to come to terms with the reality that their failure is their own responsibility, who then look for a scapegoat. Some turn to religion and hide behind “God’s Will”, Some invest their belief in conspiracy theories. Everything must be someone else’s fault. And they see it everywhere. After all, they would be successful had it not been for the conspiracy against them.

Characterised by a fixation with the internet as a source of information, they lack the critical abilities to separate the nonsense from the truth, and grasp at bite-size chunks of supposed ‘information’ without ever understanding the subject they then pontificate about.

Unable to grasp that their theories are often contradictory, and that they become a source of ridicule, they churn out increasingly bizarre theories, easily disproved to anyone with a modicum of intelligence, but the act of proving their fantasies false is taken as more proof of the validity of the original conspiracy.

Hey Gypsy.
I was surprised by this post. Because I didn't see you as someone who'd be putting people in boxes so quickly and so prematurely. It's too simple. You can do better than this :)

xSnoofovich
08-12-2008, 02:59
The fringe movement to keep Barack Obama from becoming president. - By David Weigel - Slate Magazine (http://www.slate.com/id/2206033/)

Again, another piece of disinformation that uses sleight of hand. This article uses several different techniques in order to skew the opinion of the reader, cast a cloud of doubt, and ultimately dismiss the issue.


The "Sandwhich" technique-

Place nonimportant information towards the beginning and the end and bury key information in the middle.

The "Set the tone" technique-Present information that seems ludicrous, fantastic, and shocking. Use distorted, but basically correct information to assure the reader that the author is credible, and to lead the reader to a predetermined conclusion.

The "Misdirection" technique-

Use non-credible, disruptable, shady/dodgy characters, or people that idealogically are diametrically opposed to the reader to prove that they should not be taken seriously, and therefore, the entire issue should not be taken seriously.


The "Crease" technique-

Assumes the reader won't read pass the crease, so, put key (dis)information in the first few paragraphs.

Reality-

Philip J. Berg is a former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and a Hillary Clinton supporter, which more than likely means that he is a Demorcrat.

From another website-

Mr. Berg is one of a faction of Clinton supporters who haven't heeded the party's call for unity, filing the suit just days before the opening of the Democratic National Convention, which will nominate Mr. Obama as the party's presidential candidate.


From another website -

At this point, Supreme Court Justice David Souter’s Clerk informed Philip J. Berg, the lawyer who brought the case against Obama, that his petition for an injunction to stay the November 4th election was denied, but the Clerk also required the defendants to respond to the Writ of Certiorari (which requires the concurrence of four Justices) by December 1. At that time, Mr. Obama must present to the Court an authentic birth certificate, after which Mr. Berg will respond.

If Obama fails to do that, it is sure to inspire the skepticism of the Justices, who are unaccustomed to being defied. They will have to decide what to do about a president-elect who refuses to prove his natural-born citizenship.

The Issue-

Mr. Obama put an electronic photo of a birth certification on his "Fight the Smears" Web site, a document that his critics have found unconvincing. The raised seal and authoritative signature needed to validate the document cannot be seen on the scan. The Obama campaign was unwilling to release the original document to the court when Mr. Berg filed suit in August, choosing instead to argue against Mr. Berg's standing.


The State of Hawaii has refused to release copies of Mr. Obama's birth certificate, because Department of Health officials say the privacy statutes of the state prevent them from doing so to anyone who does not have a "direct and tangible interest" in the record as prescribed in the state statute.

Russian Lad
08-12-2008, 03:23
THE OFFICIAL THEORY IS A CONCPIRACY THEORY!!!!!!! SO WE ARE ALL CONSPIRACY THEORISTS!!!!!! EVEN THE 911 COMMISSION ARE A BUNCH OF CONSPIRACY NUTTERS!


Exactly true. Wonder why they do not see it. But I have my own explanation, though it would take a lot of time. But the movie Matrix-I and Equilibrium are to start with. Orwell's book 1984 as well. That's from Equilibrium, a nice quote and, besides, we are almost there:
"In the first years of the 21st century, a third World War broke out. Those of us who survived knew mankind could never survive a fourth; that our own volatile natures could simply no longer be risked. So we have created a new arm of the law: The Grammaton Cleric, whose sole task it is to seek out and eradicate the true source of man's inhumanity to man - his ability to feel".

AstroNoodle
08-12-2008, 08:13
Obama And Clinton Not Eligible? - Public Advocate of the United States, Eugene Delgaudio, President (http://publicadvocateusa.org/news/article.php?article=4172)

"In the opinion of Public Advocate, if you can not prove you were born in the United States, you should not be in any federal elective office requiring it. That kind of narrows it down to only one office requiring it. That's the Presidency. So, Mr. Obama has managed to run for the one office that the Supreme Court must bar him from holding if he can not prove he is an American citizen to their satisfaction.

Nothing but a certification from the Supreme Court can allow Mr. Obama to take the oath of office.

In lay terms, if the Court were to certify and the litigants were not satisfied, they would have to appeal to the United Nation's next we would imagine. Either way this is not a light topic for the country as a whole.

Hillary Clinton Can Not Be Secretary Of State?

At the same time, the constitution seems to be at odds with Hilary Clinton for different reasons.

No one doubts her being a citizen. But pay raises for yourself is a legal barrier.

Questions are being raised about Hillary Clinton’s eligibility to serve as secretary of state. That is because of something known as the Emoluments Clause in the U.S. Constitution. Emoluments are salaries. Article 1, Section 6 says:

"No senator or representative shall, during the time for which he was elected, be appointed to any civil office under the authority of the United States, which shall have been created, or the emoluments whereof shall have been increased during such time."

Emolument is a salary or payment for service.

Cabinet salaries have increased by $4,700/year during Senator Hillary Clinton’s term. And the rule applies even if she did not vote on those raises. In the past, presidents have gotten around the provision by requesting that appointees' salaries be lowered to the pre-raise levels, but there's no word still how the Obama administration will deal with the issue.

Previous presidents have skirted the constitution on this same topic. And they were wrong no matter what political party they were in. America can not ignore the constitution when it is about to start a new government or when it is conducting routine affairs.

A pattern of ignoring simple prohibitions must be avoided if possible."

MissAnnElk
08-12-2008, 08:57
Reality-

Philip J. Berg is a former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and a Hillary Clinton supporter, which more than likely means that he is a Demorcrat

Oh, you don't even have to go that far. It was from Slate and I posted it = Liberal Bias.

Gypsy
08-12-2008, 09:20
Oh, you don't even have to go that far. It was from Slate and I posted it = Liberal Bias.
Miss Ann? I am shocked.

I hate to ask this on open forum; but, are you a L... I can barely make myself say it; a Liberal?

MissAnnElk
08-12-2008, 09:21
Miss Ann? I am shocked.

I hate to ask this on open forum; but, are you a L... I can barely make myself say it; a Liberal?

Card carrying. Bleeding heart.

Gypsy
08-12-2008, 09:22
Exactly true. Wonder why they do not see it. But I have my own explanation, though it would take a lot of time. But the movie Matrix-I and Equilibrium are to start with. Orwell's book 1984 as well. That's from Equilibrium, a nice quote and, besides, we are almost there:
"In the first years of the 21st century, a third World War broke out. Those of us who survived knew mankind could never survive a fourth; that our own volatile natures could simply no longer be risked. So we have created a new arm of the law: The Grammaton Cleric, whose sole task it is to seek out and eradicate the true source of man's inhumanity to man - his ability to feel".
Quoting from science fiction to support your viewnow.

That explains a lot.

AstroNoodle
08-12-2008, 09:23
"Obama said in that interview that he had bummed a cigarette a couple of times during the campaign. "But I figure, seeing as I'm running for president, I need to cut myself a little slack," he said.
My Way News - Obama pledges not to smoke in White House (http://apnews.myway.com/article/20081207/D94U0Q4O0.html) -- it keeps getting better

http://www.angrywhiteboy.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/02/windowslivewritersmokeemifyougotem-12634obama-smoking2.png --- OH NO!!!

xSnoofovich
08-12-2008, 10:54
Oh, you don't even have to go that far. It was from Slate and I posted it = Liberal Bias.

I don't necessarily think this has anything to do with liberal bias, but I would say that it has to do with how the facts are presented.

The "professional poker player" case is interesting,

It seems to be that -


In Donofrio’s argument, both parents have to be U.S. citizens for their offspring to be considered a “natural born citizen.” Obama’s father was not an American citizen at the time and never attempted to become one. Interestingly enough, Obama’s British citizenship is something that the Obama campaign readily admitted. This was posted on his website during the campaign:

“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4, 1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.‘s children. Since Sen. Obama has neither renounced his U.S. citizenship nor sworn an oath of allegiance to Kenya, his Kenyan citizenship automatically expired on Aug. 4, 1982.” - FactCheck.org as quoted on Obama’s website

FactCheck.org: Does Barack Obama have Kenyan citizenship? (http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html)

It seems that they left this info out on the Slate piece.